Brother Harbaugh is just as ignorant as Jim

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

I get killed for my opinions here, but here's yet another one that's played out in my favor. I always told you guys RG3 shredding his knee and the 49ers roster sinking to the bottom overnight did not mean the RO was figured out. I mean we statistically ran the greatest playoff offense of all time because we went RO heavy in the playoffs (https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2017/postseason-qb-drive-stats-and-dvoa), so it was pretty damn obvious that that offense gives defenses fits.

Now I do agree that the Ravens have to worry about injury, but at least they're not letting it scare them like we did with our dual threat QB. Lamar running around gives them the best chance to win, so they gotta live with the fact that he can get injured. Playing him to his strengths is the best thing they can do for his confidence/development. If he gets injured so be it, it's still better then ruining his career by trying to make him be something he is not at this time in his career.

What is there to figure out about the read option? If a team runs it extensively then you just start hitting the QB on every play until they get are knocked out of the game or the coaching staff cries uncle. There is no mystery behind it which is why nobody runs a ton of it for long. Its a changeup that you can throw out there to give a defense something else to think about but you don't want to center your offense around it.


If I'm a defensive coordinator, I'll accept being gashed a few times while hitting the QB hard at each opportunity to force the opposing staff to do a costs/benefits analysis on picking up yards vs keeping their quarterback out of the blue tent.



A team might be cool with their QB taking a hit like this from time to time to pick up some good yardage but what do you do when your QB starts to get hit like this every game?







Roman is bringing Jackson along slowly but at some point they'll start making the transition to having him be more of a pocket passer, especially when it comes time to talk extension because no team wants to a QB big money and see them hit play after play.

Originally posted by English:
Well, he played well against NE but he is going to have to learn to protect himself on some of those runs or he is going to become yet another mobile qb with a short shelf life.

Cam Newton.

If anyone was going to survive, it would have been Cam. He is bigger and stronger than just about any other QB and yet his career may be finished already.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:

Originally posted by English:
Well, he played well against NE but he is going to have to learn to protect himself on some of those runs or he is going to become yet another mobile qb with a short shelf life.

Exactly. Just a matter of time. You wonder if its a genetic weakness of the harbaughs. Thought John was the smart one.

You guys are talking like it's 1998. You can't hit anyone in football anymore and size means nothing, it's all about understanding angles. Getting a direct shot on L. Jackson is about as easy as getting a direct shot on Barry Sanders.

The league protects these guys more then ever at this point.

Passing up on Jackson was a huge mistake for many of the QB needy teams at the time. I always thought this kid would be special.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:

Originally posted by English:
Well, he played well against NE but he is going to have to learn to protect himself on some of those runs or he is going to become yet another mobile qb with a short shelf life.

Exactly. Just a matter of time. You wonder if its a genetic weakness of the harbaughs. Thought John was the smart one.

I'll take John.

Longevity for one thing. His teams have played a variety of systems but still manage to stay in the hunt.

Second, the fact Jackson is a better passer now than Kaepernick was after three years with Jim.

The big test now comes to see if they can pass the ball well enough come playoff time.

Murray will likely have a long career much like Wilson. They both slide to protect themselves and avoid the big hit. Jackson will be a marvel in the league for a couple years much like Kaep and then disappear around year four since he runs with even more RB like aggression than Kaep. If you run like an RB you will have the shelf life of an RB.

they are going to run that kid into the ground. He runs way too much. Way more elusive than other running QBs but he is going to take alot of shots and it will wear him down.

I think they lose Greg Roman. I know he doesnt have alot of fans here but dude knows how to utilize running QBs. My guess is that a team who wants to draft Jalen Hurts will hire Greg Roman as the HC and utilize him just like Lamar.

Seems like the issue a lot have with Lamar has gone from "hE sHoUlD pLaY wR LOLZ" to "he won't last long." Maybe he can't play into his late 30s-40s like the Rivers/Rodgers/Brady/Brees crop, but I'd take 7-10 years of Lamar doing what he's doing. They're going to win a title in the next few years if they avoid serious injuries.

Originally posted by kelson49er:
Seems like the issue a lot have with Lamar has gone from "hE sHoUlD pLaY wR LOLZ" to "he won't last long." Maybe he can't play into his late 30s-40s like the Rivers/Rodgers/Brady/Brees crop, but I'd take 7-10 years of Lamar doing what he's doing. They're going to win a title in the next few years if they avoid serious injuries.

i think the window is super small. They need to capitalize either this year or next year. They should go all in next year. Lamar isnt making big money so invest in a big time receiver to complement Hollywood Brown and buy some elite pass rushers

Originally posted by JustinNiner:

they are going to run that kid into the ground. He runs way too much. Way more elusive than other running QBs but he is going to take alot of shots and it will wear him down.

I think they lose Greg Roman. I know he doesnt have alot of fans here but dude knows how to utilize running QBs. My guess is that a team who wants to draft Jalen Hurts will hire Greg Roman as the HC and utilize him just like Lamar.

Neither Harbaugh nor Roman are dumb. They are letting Jackson do his thing but over time they will have him be more and more of a pocket passer, especially once he is up for an extension. Just as we're seeing Wilson become more of a pocket passer, I think the same will come into effect with Jackson.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
No gimmick offense or running QB has won a SB yet. I don't call Wilson a running QB because he doesn't look to run; he scrambles to get away from pressure. We see more running QB's now because that's what the colleges are turning out and with them a lack of pass blocking O linemen. Until one of these running QB's or gimmick offenses shows it can win a SB and win consistently the WCO will still be the gold standard.

lol,...you dont consider guys like Russell Wilson or Steve Young running QBs because THEY WON A SB. That's pretty much it. You want to block the concept of this whole running concept out of your head. Someone like Vick needed to run in order to throw,...where as guys like them (and Deshaun Watson) DONT,...and therein lies the conundrum you find yourself in when you want to lump all "running QBs" you so choose to call that altogether. They can use the pass to setup the run if they so wish,...which can be effective against ANY defense.

You can get injured being mobile,...just as you can being immobile. And just to keep these immobile QBs around, the NFL has gone to great lengths to where you can barely breathe on a QB these days without a flag or a fine. They've done all they can to support the same cause you have.

But the reality of the matter is mobile QBs are like self-checkouts. Hate them all you wish,...but there is a clear trend towards them and they are here to stay, especially with less emphasis on every-down backs.

It's possible to run the read option and still protect yourself as a QB, as well as protecting the ball. I think Kap did it well. Sliding...running out of bounds early...throwing the ball away. I don't remember Jim asking Roman to have Kap running on designed plays as much as Cam and Lamar are asked to do. I see them taking more hits than what Kap used to take.

I think the difference between what Roman is doing with the Ravens, compared to when he was here, is that Older Bro Harbs is more aggressive than Jim.

as years went by, I think a few of us were pointing it out that although Roman was driving us crazy...it was actually Jim behind everything. Behind, trying to run out the clock as soon as we went up 10+ points in the second half....not pushing the ball down field.

Dear Buddha, if the Niners make it to the Super Bowl please let it be against the Ravens so we can exact sweet revenge.
And folks already saying we're gonna loose the game in Baltimore. Shame.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
Exactly. Just a matter of time. You wonder if its a genetic weakness of the harbaughs. Thought John was the smart one.

They said that about Rustled Wilsons. The thing about a guy like Jackson is that he's perfectly happy to sit in the pocket and wait for someone to come open. He's improved leaps and bounds as a passer and only continues to get better.

How many designed runs does carroll call for wilson a game? zero. How many read options? zero. Any more carries than 4-5 per game and the qb will not have a career longer than 3 years.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
How many designed runs does carroll call for wilson a game? zero. How many read options? zero. Any more carries than 4-5 per game and the qb will not have a career longer than 3 years.

Next year is Lamar Jackson's last year then. Was a pleasure seeing him play!! RIP Lamar!

Originally posted by Afrikan:

as years went by, I think a few of us were pointing it out that although Roman was driving us crazy...it was actually Jim behind everything. Behind, trying to run out the clock as soon as we went up 10+ points in the second half....not pushing the ball down field.

That number grew as time went on. Jim Bo Harbaugh was maddeningly conservative at a time the league was flying away from that "3 yards and a cloud of dust" style.