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Week 7: Thoughts after rewatching the game...

  • fryet
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,863
Originally posted by tejada49:
Was at game, and what was apparent compare to Television was how open WR where at times and he would check down right away and seeing WR putting their hands up with frustration. That where the fans including my self where with why Alex was not even looking down field? I get that his gun shy from all those INT's from last week, but man I feel for WR frustration

We need to stop demanding that Smith throw the ball down field. That isn't his strength. There is a very good chance that the throw will not be completed, and then we are at 2nd and 10, and then you start thinking, hmmm, do I want to call a run play - we will probably still be 3rd and 6. Let's call pass again. So you call pass, and he throws another long ball that is incomplete (or throws it away to avoid a sack), and now you are third and 10, and you are forced to pass.

But if Smith does short completions, then you may be at 2nd and 6, and will be inclined to run it. And then you are in third and short, and can choose to run again if you want. But that one long shot play puts you into 2nd and 10 or 3rd and long, and now you are taking the ball out of the hands of your running backs.

Embrace the short passing game. It is what Smith is good at, and it is a perfect compliment to our outstanding running game. We just have to throw deep occasionally to keep the defenses honest. But if we try and do it too much, then we get an ineffective offense like we had for 6 quarters.
I just rewatched the game myself and I saw some very good coverage by Seattle.

Our team is good at taking what the other team gives us. They were willing to give us the "check downs" and Alex Smith took advantage. Did he miss some opportunities down field? from what i saw, he only missed 3 or 4 open receivers.
But we are f**king amazing at taking what they give us, we kept pounding the football. I have noticed that our offense (regardless of the stigma we have) does not go 3 and OUT very often which is a result of taking what the defense gives us and moving the ball steadily and with minimal risk

the score didn't' reflect our dominance. We ran for 170+ on the league leading rush defenders (70 yards a game average prior). We held them to under 250 yards! The interception by smith in the redzone was unacceptable

Back to our #1 rated defense
IN OUR LAST FOUR GAMES WE HAVE ALLOWED ONE (YES ONE!!) TOUCHDOWN WHEN THE OTHER TEAM DIDN"T START INSIDE OUR 40 YARD LINE. Including 3 games with no touchdowns regardless of field position.

When i was rewatching the game I was paying careful attention to the receivers, and it was weird that almost every route was past the 1st down marker, or 10 yards down field. When you do that the defenders can give you a cushion and its hard for the receivers to get open. I don't want to get into to much detail about the passing game.... but I give it a C+ b/c of Smith's INT

We could have utilized Vernon Davis more (even if they were taking him away, that doesn't excuse 0 completions)
We need to throw more screens (someone else said that and its 100% true)- the only screen i remember this season got us a first down
We need to figure out how to score TD's in the redzone ... I think we need shotgun formations to give Smith time and to spread the defense out when we do run from the gun


/rant
  • titan
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,665
I'm not worried about our D giving up back2back 100 yds. If Alex Smith could've sustained some kind of Offense other that 3 and outs Lynch would be under 100 yds!
#4 is easy Marvin. Team are sticking with the run because they have to. That is the only chance they have at beating us. But what I thinker''re doing better at than last year is the overall yards allowed. We are pretty good on D for those who don't know.
Everyone's breaking down the INT play in practically every thread on this board, yet no one is talking about the dropped pass by Moss in around the 4-5 yard line....
Originally posted by captveg:
Everyone's breaking down the INT play in practically every thread on this board, yet no one is talking about the dropped pass by Moss in around the 4-5 yard line....

Smith's fault
Originally posted by captveg:
Everyone's breaking down the INT play in practically every thread on this board, yet no one is talking about the dropped pass by Moss in around the 4-5 yard line....

you mean the blatant PI? or the fact that Smith Missed Moss in the back of the endzone wide open?
Originally posted by captveg:
Everyone's breaking down the INT play in practically every thread on this board, yet no one is talking about the dropped pass by Moss in around the 4-5 yard line....

I did mention it. It was clear Pass Interference.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Oct 19, 2012 at 4:10 PM ]
  • Jcool
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 13,667
Originally posted by captveg:
Everyone's breaking down the INT play in practically every thread on this board, yet no one is talking about the dropped pass by Moss in around the 4-5 yard line....

The one his own player got in the way of, so really didn't see it well, and got Interfered with?
Just saw some highlights and wanted to add that on two of the Seahawks drops, Goldson would have destroyed the receiver. On Turbin's wheel route and 81's quick slant (baldwin?) Goldson was one or two steps out and I don't think the receivers wanted to make those catches at all. Definitely saw him out of the corner of their eyes and wanted no part of it.
Originally posted by 49erfaithful49:
Originally posted by captveg:
Everyone's breaking down the INT play in practically every thread on this board, yet no one is talking about the dropped pass by Moss in around the 4-5 yard line....

you mean the blatant PI? or the fact that Smith Missed Moss in the back of the endzone wide open?

Yep, blatant PI. My point is this: Smith put it right where he needed to. He saw Moss, he threw it, officials let Sea DB get away with PI. (Having the FB distract Moss didn't help, either).

If he actually SEES Moss he can/will throw it to him. He didn't see Moss when he was open in the end zone until he would have had to throw through series line-of-scrimmage traffic. So he continued with the play left, and made the mistake of trying to force it in when the opportunity had passed. But if he throws it at the time he sees Moss (which was later than everyone thinks based on him going through reads) it's probably also tipped/INT.
[ Edited by captveg on Oct 19, 2012 at 4:15 PM ]
I just want to post what Maiocco said about the supposed DBs completely taking out Alex Smith's ability to throw ANY significant passes over 10 yards:

The New York Giants took Davis out of the picture last week. And the Seahawks did the same Thursday night with their coverages.

If Smith sees double coverage -- or just tight single coverage -- on anyone, he is going to look to go elsewhere with the football. That was part of Michael Crabtree's frustration after the 49ers' loss in the NFC championship game to the New York Giants.

It's easy to fault the play-calling as vanilla, but you can be sure that few of those short throws that Smith made Thursday were No. 1 on the progression. I don't believe the coaching staff ties Smith's hands, as much as Smith chooses to be cautious based on his own decision-making after the snap of the ball.

On the touchdown drive, it's difficult to fault Smith. He checked down five times to underneath targets. Those pass plays gained 15, 11, 12, 10 and 12 yards.

According to Pro Football Focus, on pass attempts of 10-plus yards downfield, Smith completed only 2 of 6 for 32 yards with one interception. (Randy Moss, the intended target on the interception, was a little more than 10 yards from the line of scrimmage as he ran the back line of the end zone.)

Seattle's physical play from their cornerbacks is the perfect defense for the 49ers' passing game. If Smith sees a receiver being held up against press coverage, he's likely going to immediately look elsewhere.

There is no reason the 49ers should not have been able to make some plays in the passing game with the amount of time the 49ers' offensive line supplied for Smith on Thursday. Smith was sacked twice for minus-2 yards, but the offensive line was not responsible for any sacks or quarterback hits, according to PFF.

Davis is an important part of the 49ers' offense. He's the one pass target that scares teams. Teams want to the 49ers to look elsewhere. And regardless of what defenses are doing to Davis, Smith has to find a way to give him chances.

On Thursday, Davis was not targeted on any pass attempts.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/49ers-Mailbag-Smith-makes-it-too-easy-fo?blockID=790941&feedID=5936

I will always root for any QB of this team because I always want the team to win. However, if we expect to win the SB without a historically great defense and a overwhelmingly potent running game that's downright unstoppable regardless of any brings (think Baltimore Ravens/Chicago Bears), this team will not be able to stay with the next level/elite competition in this league.

If I'm opposing OCs, I spread the 49ers out, attack their CBs try to score quickly and get the 49ers behind. Sellout to stop the run and just play tight man on the WRs - for Alex not to throw, just dare him to throw over 10 yards - do what Minnesota did and play everything short; tackle immediately and double cover short routes. Force the passing game to beat you deep.
[ Edited by NinerGM on Oct 19, 2012 at 4:28 PM ]
Originally posted by NinerGM:
I just want to post what Maiocco said about the supposed DBs completely taking out Alex Smith's ability to throw ANY significant passes over 10 yards:

The New York Giants took Davis out of the picture last week. And the Seahawks did the same Thursday night with their coverages.

If Smith sees double coverage -- or just tight single coverage -- on anyone, he is going to look to go elsewhere with the football. That was part of Michael Crabtree's frustration after the 49ers' loss in the NFC championship game to the New York Giants.

It's easy to fault the play-calling as vanilla, but you can be sure that few of those short throws that Smith made Thursday were No. 1 on the progression. I don't believe the coaching staff ties Smith's hands, as much as Smith chooses to be cautious based on his own decision-making after the snap of the ball.

On the touchdown drive, it's difficult to fault Smith. He checked down five times to underneath targets. Those pass plays gained 15, 11, 12, 10 and 12 yards.

According to Pro Football Focus, on pass attempts of 10-plus yards downfield, Smith completed only 2 of 6 for 32 yards with one interception. (Randy Moss, the intended target on the interception, was a little more than 10 yards from the line of scrimmage as he ran the back line of the end zone.)

Seattle's physical play from their cornerbacks is the perfect defense for the 49ers' passing game. If Smith sees a receiver being held up against press coverage, he's likely going to immediately look elsewhere.

There is no reason the 49ers should not have been able to make some plays in the passing game with the amount of time the 49ers' offensive line supplied for Smith on Thursday. Smith was sacked twice for minus-2 yards, but the offensive line was not responsible for any sacks or quarterback hits, according to PFF.

Davis is an important part of the 49ers' offense. He's the one pass target that scares teams. Teams want to the 49ers to look elsewhere. And regardless of what defenses are doing to Davis, Smith has to find a way to give him chances.

On Thursday, Davis was not targeted on any pass attempts.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/49ers-Mailbag-Smith-makes-it-too-easy-fo?blockID=790941&feedID=5936

I will always root for any QB of this team because I always want the team to win. However, if we expect to win the SB without a historically great defense and a overwhelmingly potent running game that's downright unstoppable regardless of any brings (think Baltimore Ravens/Chicago Bears), this team will not be able to stay with the next level/elite competition in this league.

If I'm opposing OCs, I spread the 49ers out, attack their CBs try to score quickly and get the 49ers behind. Sellout to stop the run and just play tight man on the WRs - for Alex not to throw, just dare him to throw over 10 yards - do what Minnesota did and play everything short; tackle immediately and double cover short routes. Force the passing game to beat you deep.

Well...what you're missing here is that no other team in the NFL is built to do what Seattle did last night. They have a 6'3" corner and a 6'4" corner who can both cover very well, a fantastic free Safety and a good strong safety. Those HUGE, physical corners jam and HOLD the WRs and keep them out of their routes and disrupt timing. How do you think they shut down the Packers (before "the play") and beat the Patriots?

It's nice to say "just blanket the WRs and sell out against the run", but every team in the NFL would do that in every game if they could. Trouble is, very few teams can actually do that. There is a reason the Seahawks D was ranked so high.

Tom Brady said that they "forced you to pass" by playing 1 deep safety and devoting the extra defender to the run. Then their corners shut down your WRs leaving nowhere to go with the ball. They're LBs were vacating the middle to double the passing game which is what left Frank Gore WIDE OPEN underneath.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Oct 19, 2012 at 4:38 PM ]
Originally posted by NinerGM:
I just want to post what Maiocco said about the supposed DBs completely taking out Alex Smith's ability to throw ANY significant passes over 10 yards:

The New York Giants took Davis out of the picture last week. And the Seahawks did the same Thursday night with their coverages.

If Smith sees double coverage -- or just tight single coverage -- on anyone, he is going to look to go elsewhere with the football. That was part of Michael Crabtree's frustration after the 49ers' loss in the NFC championship game to the New York Giants.

It's easy to fault the play-calling as vanilla, but you can be sure that few of those short throws that Smith made Thursday were No. 1 on the progression. I don't believe the coaching staff ties Smith's hands, as much as Smith chooses to be cautious based on his own decision-making after the snap of the ball.

On the touchdown drive, it's difficult to fault Smith. He checked down five times to underneath targets. Those pass plays gained 15, 11, 12, 10 and 12 yards.

According to Pro Football Focus, on pass attempts of 10-plus yards downfield, Smith completed only 2 of 6 for 32 yards with one interception. (Randy Moss, the intended target on the interception, was a little more than 10 yards from the line of scrimmage as he ran the back line of the end zone.)

Seattle's physical play from their cornerbacks is the perfect defense for the 49ers' passing game. If Smith sees a receiver being held up against press coverage, he's likely going to immediately look elsewhere.

There is no reason the 49ers should not have been able to make some plays in the passing game with the amount of time the 49ers' offensive line supplied for Smith on Thursday. Smith was sacked twice for minus-2 yards, but the offensive line was not responsible for any sacks or quarterback hits, according to PFF.

Davis is an important part of the 49ers' offense. He's the one pass target that scares teams. Teams want to the 49ers to look elsewhere. And regardless of what defenses are doing to Davis, Smith has to find a way to give him chances.

On Thursday, Davis was not targeted on any pass attempts.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/49ers-Mailbag-Smith-makes-it-too-easy-fo?blockID=790941&feedID=5936

I will always root for any QB of this team because I always want the team to win. However, if we expect to win the SB without a historically great defense and a overwhelmingly potent running game that's downright unstoppable regardless of any brings (think Baltimore Ravens/Chicago Bears), this team will not be able to stay with the next level/elite competition in this league.

If I'm opposing OCs, I spread the 49ers out, attack their CBs try to score quickly and get the 49ers behind. Sellout to stop the run and just play tight man on the WRs - for Alex not to throw, just dare him to throw over 10 yards - do what Minnesota did and play everything short; tackle immediately and double cover short routes. Force the passing game to beat you deep.

Good post

Even MM calls it like he sees it.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Well...what you're missing here is that no other team in the NFL is built to do what Seattle did last night. They have a 6'3" corner and a 6'4" corner who can both cover very well, a fantastic free Safety and a good strong safety. Those HUGE, physical corners jam and HOLD the WRs and keep them out of their routes and disrupt timing. How do you think they shut down the Packers (before "the play") and beat the Patriots?

It's nice to say "just blanket the WRs and sell out against the run", but every team in the NFL would do that in every game if they could. Trouble is, very few teams can actually do that. There is a reason the Seahawks D was ranked so high.

Tom Brady said that they "forced you to pass" by playing 1 deep safety and devoting the extra defender to the run. Then their corners shut down your WRs leaving nowhere to go with the ball. They're LBs were vacating the middle to double the passing game which is what left Frank Gore WIDE OPEN underneath.

Tom Brady put 395 yards up on those giant corners