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Un-Phoenix 49ers Mock Draft

Originally posted by eonblue:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
No Phillip Thomas....Blasphemy!

I don't see it with Phillip Thomas. I watched his bowl game, senior bowl, boise st(2012), and Tulsa(2012). I wasn't impressed like most people are. I was reading about him and apparently he had a really good 2011 but his production has dropped off. What games would you suggest because I'm trying to crack the FS riddle?

I watched his entire career. I was born and raised in Fresno. IMO he is ready right now for the NFL. He was coached by Tim Mcdonald, and is extremely intelegent, and a great kid who is a student of the game with great work ethic.

He didnt play in 2011. He was injured, badly i might add. Despite the leg injury e returned in 2012 and had a damn good season. 8 INT, 3 TD, 4 FF, 82 T, 12 TFL

Hes got good size, athleticism and instincts. He is good in the box, in man, and in zone coverages. He was asked to do everything at Fresno State and acceled at it all. He is a phisical hitter, has good hands, and good vertical, and has great closeing speed, and range. Good lateral movment and fluid hips. When he gets the ball in his hands he is a threat.

His biggest knock is that he is very instincual. This is one of his biggest upsides, and also a downside. Its a double edged sword for him, as sometimes he trusts his instincts a bit to much and gives up some technique and fundamentals as a result and this has been generally when he gets beat. Gambleing on play action, or double moves. He also takes poor angles on open feild tackles sometimes. He seemed to stuggle more against high powered versitile run teams where he was asked to do alot and be in alot of places at once Also keep in mind, that fresno state front 7 wasnt doing him many favors..

Heres a couple good videos.

Oregon game is a good example of his positives and negatives. He had a poor first half. Great second half. One of the underrated plays in this game is the play where he rushes the QB, is totally out of the play, then down field there is a fumble and he is able to recover the fumble because he never gives up and has a non stop motor.
https

Mic up SB practice. Shows the kids character and work ethic
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IMO the farthest he falls is to the redskins at 52.
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by fan49:
id rather go macdonald in 2nd and go cb in 3rd just me. I like the idea of shoring up the wr core

To be honest, very little impresses me about McDonald beyond him being the son of Tim, the more I see of him, the more stiff and unflexible he looks. He's currently rated in the mid to late 3rd round for good reason. In terms of coverage abilities, he's better than Taylor Mays but he struggles to change direction, gets caught out of position a lot. He's a hard, heavy duty hitter, but looks to be in the mold of Whitner where he'll get picked on if you put him out alone in coverage. After Mays, Rachal and others, I'm about ready to say f**k it, no more USC players, like....ever.


Take a look at JJ Wilcox from Georgia Southern if you haven't before. He's pretty raw, has only played safety for a year, was a WR/RB before that but in that one season, he turned a lot of heads. He's a guy who likes to hit and is very good in man-to-man coverage, especially for a strong safety. He utilizes his experience as a WR the same way Sherman does, predicting where routes will go, understanding what receivers and offenses are trying to do in a given situation....shows great field awareness. I'd draft him, unleash him on special teams and continue to develop him further to be an eventual starter. He seems like the high-ceiling type of player that Baalke loves.


Mike Mayock......I said MIKE MAYOCK(somewhere NinerJohn is lurking )..........is quite fond of him.


"215-pound safety with corner feet," Mayock described. "I think he's an immediate starter in the NFL, he can help you on special teams. This is a guy that I've really enjoyed watching." A running back/slot receiver his first three seasons at Georgia Southern, Wilcox moved to strong safety as a senior and was a first-team all-league pick by the Southern Conference coaches. He also brings to the table kickoff return value.

What he did in one year was impressive. His transition as natural, hich leads me to beleive his ceiling is really high.
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
What he did in one year was impressive. His transition as natural, hich leads me to beleive his ceiling is really high.

This.....its like tight-ends that were former basketball players. Now we're all looking for defensive backs that were former receivers.


But that Wilcox can play at a high-level after only one year playing safety, incredibly impressive, I've seen him ranked anywhere from the mid 2nd to the late 3rd. I feel like any team that ends up acquiring him will be pretty happy. He's the anti-Whitner in terms of his coverage abilities when it comes to the strong safety position.

The 49ers have so many options in this draft, I wouldn't be upset to see them acquire two high potential safeties, a combo of Thomas and Wilcox or Rambo and Wilcox....etc, lots of safety talent.
[ Edited by Phoenix49ers on Mar 2, 2013 at 12:03 AM ]
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
What he did in one year was impressive. His transition as natural, hich leads me to beleive his ceiling is really high.

This.....its like tight-ends that were former basketball players. Now we're all looking for defensive backs that were former receivers.


But that Wilcox can play at a high-level after only one year playing safety, incredibly impressive, I've seen him ranked anywhere from the mid 2nd to the late 3rd. I feel like any team that ends up acquiring him will be pretty happy. He's the anti-Whitner in terms of his coverage abilities when it comes to the strong safety position.

The 49ers have so many options in this draft, I wouldn't be upset to see them acquire two high potential safeties, a combo of Thomas and Wilcox or Rambo and Wilcox....etc, lots of safety talent.

What are your thoughts on Amerson?

Im torn. Is he the 2011 Amerson, or the 2012 amerson? He has huge boom or bust qualitys, but he is the type of guy if you hit, you hit bigtime.

My favorite CB is Alford of course, but i have to admit, Amerson intrigues me as well.
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
What are your thoughts on Amerson?

Im torn. Is he the 2011 Amerson, or the 2012 amerson? He has huge boom or bust qualitys, but he is the type of guy if you hit, you hit bigtime.

My favorite CB is Alford of course, but i have to admit, Amerson intrigues me as well.

Well, I think you're okay in regards to Alford. I totally see Amerson as a safety at the next level. He's got the size and athleticism and has some experience as a safety in the past. As a corner, he got absolutely lit up at times because his change of direction wasn't very fluid, his hips look kind of stiff to me and he doesn't really have the ability to turn on a dime. He really lacks recovery speed,if he can press a guy and be very physical with him, he does great, but if the receiver gets a step on him...watch out. It wouldn't be unprecedented for him to stay at cornerback but I do feel that he's much better suited as a ballhawking free safety. He's great at getting interceptions and always being aware of where the ball is at any given moment.
[ Edited by Phoenix49ers on Mar 2, 2013 at 12:15 AM ]
Interesting mock, like the first two picks that would make us one hell of a team to watch next year.


Think the D-Line would need more help than a late 3rd round pick and Seymour. If we went that way on first 2 picks I'd tray nd trade up 2b and get ourselves a Big D-Line beast
I can't say that I like Plan B better than Plan A, but Plan B is damn good. I agree that when it comes to replacing Justin Smith, the only player that will be available is Datone Jones. If he is gone AND the top tier nose tackles are gone as well (Hankins and company), I am DEFINITELY sold on Tavon Austin. Our #1 needs are on the defensive line, but if the best guys at the position are gone, the smart thing is go BPA. In this case, the picks make our offense more explosive than it already is, which would help our defense out because teams would be trying to keep up with all the points that we'd put on the board. Drafting a receiver like Da'Rick Rogers provides some balance as our offense should still be able to grind it out and have long, clock eating drives which will allow the defense to rest.

I hope we aren't so deadset on a defensive line player that we will take anyone (reaching). Also, with the Falcons releasing John Abraham, that makes one more team ahead of us that could be drafting a defensive end.

This offseason also addresses some of the defenses needs and at least gets a solid rotation of defensive line guys. Adding Tavon Austin and Rogers brings up an interesting question. Can you really double team anyone on this offense?
Is Austin really a deep threat though????
I would go balistic if we picked WR's 1-2 in this draft. That is probably the most UN-REALISTIC mock I have ever seen.

For the first time in year we have a QB who can get the ball to his receivers. Kaepernick's arm and the system we play in will make our receivers better.

Plus, our #2 WR is our 5th option behind the run game, Michael Crabtree, Vernon Davis and Delanie Walker.

Mario Manningham is a great #2 if he comes back 100% which he should. Kyle Williams looked fantastic as a slot WR and we have AJ Jenkins to prove himself. We will most likely draft one WR, probably in the 3rd, because Manningham and Williams are free agents after the season.

Games are won and lost in the trenches and our secondary is a mess. Those are the reason's why we lost the Super Bowl, not the lack of receivers.
[ Edited by SteveYoung on Mar 2, 2013 at 7:07 AM ]
Originally posted by Norwalks_Best:
NO WAY we draft 2 WR's

I love it. Picking Austin and Rogers will hopefully light a fire under Jenkins. Can you imagine having a WR corp on par with the Pack??? (Jennings, Jones, Cobb, Nelson). Can you imagine bringing Dick Sherman to tears twice a year?
[ Edited by fortyninerglory on Mar 2, 2013 at 7:58 AM ]
I get where your going, and it could happen. I would never draft like this. I hope with there first 3 or 4 pick they go def. CB and DL. that is what they need the most then later in the draft. pick up someone like a Marquess Wilson and Robert Woods. I think they should draft 2 WR just not with the first 2 picks. Plus if Dashon Goldson want 8 to 9 mil a year to play I think he will be getting it from another team. With all the 3 and 4 WR set they will be seeing, I think the FS need to be able to cover a WR more then coming up for the big Hit. He will still need to hit just not as much.
More I think of it the more I love it. Except

Do you not think trading 2b and moving up to get Rodgers then at 2a pick up a NT or DE would have been the better move?

That way our first 3 picks can contribute from the get go?
Originally posted by SteveYoung:
I would go balistic if we picked WR's 1-2 in this draft. That is probably the most UN-REALISTIC mock I have ever seen.

For the first time in year we have a QB who can get the ball to his receivers. Kaepernick's arm and the system we play in will make our receivers better.

Plus, our #2 WR is our 5th option behind the run game, Michael Crabtree, Vernon Davis and Delanie Walker.

Mario Manningham is a great #2 if he comes back 100% which he should. Kyle Williams looked fantastic as a slot WR and we have AJ Jenkins to prove himself. We will most likely draft one WR, probably in the 3rd, because Manningham and Williams are free agents after the season.

Games are won and lost in the trenches and our secondary is a mess. Those are the reason's why we lost the Super Bowl, not the lack of receivers.
You have to remember the premise behind this draft. The top 3-4 DEs are gone. After the Shariff Floyds, Sheldon Richardson's etc, there is Datone Jones. If he goes, that leaves us with Kawann Short. Good player, but at 31/34? Who would do more for our team, Austin or Short? I admit, I wouldn't have gone back to receiver so soon. If the value wasn't there at NT, then I would've address cornerback or safety where there will be plenty of players available.

Games are won in the trenches, but we shouldn't begin drafting big bodies for the sake of having big bodies. Moves like that will get you a Kentwan Balmer (a clear need at the time, but not BPA) and passing on better talent.

I like Mario Manningham and want him on the team longterm, but how are you so certain he comes back 100%? Tavon Austin at 31 and a bigger, more physical receiver (round 3 or 4) isn't a bad consolation prize if we cannot get a good 3-4 DE with either of our first two picks. The pickup of a player like Austin takes the ability of a team to simply double team Crabtree and Vernon Davis. Things would be opened up for AJ Jenkins (either as a #2 or #3) and Kyle Williams.

I disagree about the lack of receivers in our loss of the Super Bowl. In spite of the terrible performance our defense turned in for a half (they get most of the blame for the loss), we had a chance to win at the end. Unfortuntely, we had no other threat at receiver besides Michael Crabtree. Randy Moss didn't exactly have a GOAT performance in the Super Bowl.
Originally posted by SFL49ER:
Is Austin really a deep threat though????

Not sure if serious, the guy isn't just quick, but also fast as hell, football fast, any defense would be nervous with him out on the field.
Originally posted by SteveYoung:
I would go balistic if we picked WR's 1-2 in this draft. That is probably the most UN-REALISTIC mock I have ever seen.

For the first time in year we have a QB who can get the ball to his receivers. Kaepernick's arm and the system we play in will make our receivers better.

What receivers? The fact that the 49ers have had to bring in guys off the street in two consecutive seasons for the playoffs isn't a sign to you? 49ers, when they needed it most, had Crabtree, and that was it. Receiver is a huge need, especially if you don't have the value at DL or CB that some are expecting.



Plus, our #2 WR is our 5th option behind the run game, Michael Crabtree, Vernon Davis and Delanie Walker.

What #2 option? Manningham caught plenty of passes when he was healthy, and he's not even that great of a receiver. The 49ers haven't thrown the ball much to their #2 WR in previous years because they really haven't had one. Josh Morgan was having himself a decent season last year as well until he got injured. The 49ers need more depth at WR, period, and if you have two top quality players available, you take them instead of reaching for someone that you consider a "need."
'

Mario Manningham is a great #2 if he comes back 100% which he should. Kyle Williams looked fantastic as a slot WR and we have AJ Jenkins to prove himself. We will most likely draft one WR, probably in the 3rd, because Manningham and Williams are free agents after the season.

No he isn't and no he didn't. Manningham is a so-so WR, a good #3 to have around, but not a gamebreaker. Kyle Williams is nothing special, on any other team he's the #6 WR or not even on the roster. Additionally, both of them are coming off of major, severe injuries and there's no telling how they will perform. When it comes down to healthy WR's for next year, the 49ers have Michael Crabtree, AJ Jenkins, Vince Papale and Ricardo Lockette. Does that sound like depth to you?

Do you think the Seahawks are sitting there going "Oh no, Mario Manningham might come back, now we're doomed!" Houston has been trying the "load up with scrubs" approach for years and it hasn't helped them to date. They've wasted the better years of Andre Johnson, failing to put someone opposite him that defenses would truly respect. I don't want to see the 49ers make that same mistake with Crabtree. You can't just constantly put out other team's trash or random late-rounders and hope that it will solve the problem.





Games are won and lost in the trenches and our secondary is a mess. Those are the reason's why we lost the Super Bowl, not the lack of receivers.

The 49ers had the ball inside the 10 yard line, had 1st down, the Ravens loaded up to stop the run and they DARED....DARED the 49ers to pass the ball on them and they couldn't it. Bottomline, you stop Crabtree and VD, this offense is screwed. The only other viable target currently, Walker, drops the ball 30% of the time.

The secondary was just fine until Justin Smith got injured. I don't see the secondary as a problem other than Whitner needing to be upgraded, but they won't be cutting him this year and this mock has Shawn Williams to develop behind him. Otherwise, Brown is a very good CB, Culliver is developing, had some great moments, had some bad moments.



What amazes me when people are about the need for "secondary and DL" help is that any rookie the 49ers draft is going to be a backup at best. They'll play on special teams, they'll rotate in here or there, but you really won't see much of them. You add two impact WR's who can actually learn a playbook and just based on this team's lack of talent at that position, they'll get out on the field and they'll make plays.
[ Edited by Phoenix49ers on Mar 2, 2013 at 11:12 AM ]