Colin Kaepernick Thread

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Whatever you say. We didn't have a perrenially good team when Kap took over... It was all Kap. Too bad when we don't have an All Pro team, he plays like sh!t.

And I've already explained to you, my "assumption" is based on logic. I'm not going to keep explaining it simply because you do not understand logic based hypothesis.

No your assumption is NOT based on logic, it is based on your OPINION. I am giving you a logical assumption based on FACT i.e. Kapernick DID actually do those things.

You are expressing an unproved proposition which you believe to be true, in mathematical logic this is called a conjecture. I am presenting you with an actual real, demonstrably proven fact.

You may wish to reconsider bold statements regarding logic based hypothesis.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Huh. Same can be said about Kap. What a surprise.

Really? Was our defense playing at a top 5 level during the playoff run that Kap carried us to the SB?

so for 3 games they didnt play at a top 5 level....out of how many since he's started?

Originally posted by jedediahyork:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Huh. Same can be said about Kap. What a surprise.

Really? Was our defense playing at a top 5 level during the playoff run that Kap carried us to the SB?

You mean the one that held the Flacons to ZERO points in the second half? Or the Packers to 10 points in the second half? Even better, held the pack to 17 points in the last 3 quarters of that game.

I swear, this argument is the dumbest you guys use. It's not like the bottom feeder teams are in the playoffs. They're the best teams with the best offenses in the NFL, and they're usually on a roll by the time the playoffs hit.

I wonder how the defense played getting Kap to the playoffs in the first place? Or would you like to continue ignoring that because you're so blinded by Kap's naked magazine covers?

The offense in 2012 with Kap averaged 28.8 points per game. Under Alex it averaged 23.6 points per game.

As I noted, the defense conceded an average of 28.5 points per game in the last 6 games (including the play-offs).

Therefore I think it is likely that Alex would not have got the team to the Superbowl.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Huh. Same can be said about Kap. What a surprise.

Really? Was our defense playing at a top 5 level during the playoff run that Kap carried us to the SB?

Jed is clearly comfortable making up things to support his fallacious arguments. Kap has won many of games against playoff teams, both in the regular season and in the playoffs.... Moreover, a lot of his wins came on the road (Panthers, ATL, Pats, GB, almost SEA in their prime). Also, with the exception of ATL, Kap was a near one man show because our running game collapsed.)

Originally posted by LVJay:
When texting too much gets out of hand and / or when getting benched forces you to sit there looking dumb with thumb up your ass

He needs to shave or he'll keep getting detained at the airport if you know what I mean...

Originally posted by Buchy:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Whatever you say. We didn't have a perrenially good team when Kap took over... It was all Kap. Too bad when we don't have an All Pro team, he plays like sh!t.

And I've already explained to you, my "assumption" is based on logic. I'm not going to keep explaining it simply because you do not understand logic based hypothesis.

No your assumption is NOT based on logic, it is based on your OPINION. I am giving you a logical assumption based on FACT i.e. Kapernick DID actually do those things.

You are expressing an unproved proposition which you believe to be true, in mathematical logic this is called a conjecture. I am presenting you with an actual real, demonstrably proven fact.

You may wish to reconsider bold statements regarding logic based hypothesis.

That's nice, you're restating fact. That's not logic. That history.

Logic is a line of reasoning based on all the available evidence. In this case, could Gabbert be just as good or better than Kap with the 2012 49ers.

A logical argument, in it's simplest terms is:

if (something), then (something).

In this case, if Gabbert played better than Kap with bad personnel, then Gabbert will play better than Kap with good personnel.

It's simple deductive reasoning.

Basing your argument on Kap's history vs Gabbert's history is inherently fallacious because the circumstances were different. Kap had a perennially good football team filled with Pro Bowlers, and Gabbert had the horrible Jaguars.

My OPINION is I don't care who the QB is, as long as we're winning. If that is Kap, Gabbert, some FA, or some rookie, I don't care.

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Huh. Same can be said about Kap. What a surprise.

Really? Was our defense playing at a top 5 level during the playoff run that Kap carried us to the SB?

Jed is clearly comfortable making up things to support his fallacious arguments. Kap has won many of games against playoff teams, both in the regular season and in the playoffs.... Moreover, a lot of his wins came on the road (Panthers, ATL, Pats, GB, almost SEA in their prime). Also, with the exception of ATL, Kap was a near one man show because our running game collapsed.)

LMAO. "Collapsed."

Frank Gore had 120 yards, 1 TD, and 50 rec yards vs the Packers. 90 yards and 2 TDs vs the Falcons. LaMichael James had 50 yards and a TD in those 2 games.

Crabtree had 120 yards and 2 TDs against the Pack. VD had 100 yards and a TD against the Falcons.

Guess you must have missed those parts. "One man show."

I get that people are either in Kaeps corner or not. I look at his play and it keeps going down hill. Some on here keep making excuses for that, but he hasn't gotten better, he has gotten worse. Yes he has shown he can have a couple of flashes of stellar moments, but the body of his work indicates that those were the exception rather than the rule. There are some who don't like him for his off field persona. I, personally, wouldn't care if he was secretly working as hit man for a drug cartel, as long he didn't get caught and get the team in trouble. I only care about how he is playing now, and how he has played consistently over the course of his time here.

There are times in every athletes career when thinks just aren't working for them. There are times in every organization where a particular athlete is not put into the position to maximize their potential, for whatever reason. My personal belief is that he isn't gong to get better here.

He hasn't shown the ability to bring his game up, even though some say there is potential for that. His numbers went down three years straight under Harbaugh. He struggled mightily this year. Next year will bring another system into place. He hasn't shown that he has the ability to master a system he has been in for years now, let alone go into a new system and learn it in one off season . The money save on his cap hit if we let him go is not insignificant, but not as inflated as some are posting, and that money could be better spent somewhere else. A new HC is probably going to draft a new QB. Gabbert isn't our long term answer, but neither is Kaepernick.

Time to let it go.

He was on the sidelines basically alone, uninterested on sunday. What was that about?

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Huh. Same can be said about Kap. What a surprise.

Really? Was our defense playing at a top 5 level during the playoff run that Kap carried us to the SB?

so for 3 games they didnt play at a top 5 level....out of how many since he's started?

Refer to one of my earlier posts. In the last 6 games (including last 3 regular season games and 3 play-off wins) the defense allowed 28.5 points per game. In the 7 regular season games only they conceded an average of 20 points per game (this includes the last 3 from the Pats to end of regular season).

For the first 4 games of Kap as starter the defence was conceding an average of 14.25 points per game. In the play-offs they conceded 27.33 points per game.

So once Justin and Aldon got injured vs the Pats, there was a real drop off on the defensive side which got worse during the play-offs by circa 13ppg - almost two TDs a game differential.

Originally posted by Buchy:
Refer to one of my earlier posts. In the last 6 games (including last 3 regular season games and 3 play-off wins) the defense allowed 28.5 points per game. In the 7 regular season games only they conceded an average of 20 points per game (this includes the last 3 from the Pats to end of regular season).

For the first 4 games of Kap as starter the defence was conceding an average of 14.25 points per game. In the play-offs they conceded 27.33 points per game.

So once Justin and Aldon got injured vs the Pats, there was a real drop off on the defensive side which got worse during the play-offs by circa 13ppg - almost two TDs a game differential.

I mean, the theory that Kaep was carried especially in the 1st playoffs is downright ridiculous. The D didn't play up to their regular season level. If they did, we would have won a SB. Kaep actually raised his game that 1st playoff season. But detractors will always dismiss this because it doesn't fit the narrative. No team has ever won a Super Bowl with the amount of points the D gave up. But, that's Kaep's fault!

You presented cold hard facts that will be casually dismissed.

Originally posted by Buchy:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by jedediahyork:
Huh. Same can be said about Kap. What a surprise.

Really? Was our defense playing at a top 5 level during the playoff run that Kap carried us to the SB?

so for 3 games they didnt play at a top 5 level....out of how many since he's started?

Refer to one of my earlier posts. In the last 6 games (including last 3 regular season games and 3 play-off wins) the defense allowed 28.5 points per game. In the 7 regular season games only they conceded an average of 20 points per game (this includes the last 3 from the Pats to end of regular season).

For the first 4 games of Kap as starter the defence was conceding an average of 14.25 points per game. In the play-offs they conceded 27.33 points per game.

So once Justin and Aldon got injured vs the Pats, there was a real drop off on the defensive side which got worse during the play-offs by circa 13ppg - almost two TDs a game differential.

You do realize that harbs and co ran the D ragged with no substitutions right? After months of going non stop they will start to break down. That's not a hit on anybody but Harbs, a point many fail to remember.

Originally posted by Blindfury:

Originally posted by Buchy:
Refer to one of my earlier posts. In the last 6 games (including last 3 regular season games and 3 play-off wins) the defense allowed 28.5 points per game. In the 7 regular season games only they conceded an average of 20 points per game (this includes the last 3 from the Pats to end of regular season).

For the first 4 games of Kap as starter the defence was conceding an average of 14.25 points per game. In the play-offs they conceded 27.33 points per game.

So once Justin and Aldon got injured vs the Pats, there was a real drop off on the defensive side which got worse during the play-offs by circa 13ppg - almost two TDs a game differential.

I mean, the theory that Kaep was carried especially in the 1st playoffs is downright ridiculous. The D didn't play up to their regular season level. If they did, we would have won a SB. Kaep actually raised his game that 1st playoff season. But detractors will always dismiss this because it doesn't fit the narrative. No team has ever won a Super Bowl with the amount of points the D gave up. But, that's Kaep's fault!

You presented cold hard facts that will be casually dismissed.

The D held on enough. Without that ST TD we have enough points to win.

Originally posted by mojave45:
I get that people are either in Kaeps corner or not. I look at his play and it keeps going down hill. Some on here keep making excuses for that, but he hasn't gotten better, he has gotten worse. Yes he has shown he can have a couple of flashes of stellar moments, but the body of his work indicates that those were the exception rather than the rule. There are some who don't like him for his off field persona. I, personally, wouldn't care if he was secretly working as hit man for a drug cartel, as long he didn't get caught and get the team in trouble. I only care about how he is playing now, and how he has played consistently over the course of his time here.

There are times in every athletes career when thinks just aren't working for them. There are times in every organization where a particular athlete is not put into the position to maximize their potential, for whatever reason. My personal belief is that he isn't gong to get better here.

He hasn't shown the ability to bring his game up, even though some say there is potential for that. His numbers went down three years straight under Harbaugh. He struggled mightily this year. Next year will bring another system into place. He hasn't shown that he has the ability to master a system he has been in for years now, let alone go into a new system and learn it in one off season . The money save on his cap hit if we let him go is not insignificant, but not as inflated as some are posting, and that money could be better spent somewhere else. A new HC is probably going to draft a new QB. Gabbert isn't our long term answer, but neither is Kaepernick.

Time to let it go.

I have a question for you. Who on offense since Kaep got there improved? Name a player.

Has Kaep had a #1 receiver in his career, ever? Has he ever played in a decent passing offense? Has he ever played in an offense that maximized his strengths? Cam has, Wilson has, why not Kaep?

As far as mastering a system. What system are you talking about? What was Harbaugh and Roman's system? He seemed to have done quite well in it when he needed to. The numbers were hardly gaudy because he played under a massively conservative coach who would just run the ball even in blowouts. Not to mention the mess of having plays called by 3 different people. Criticism of Kaep is fair, but I feel context very often never figures into it.

"He got worse every year". Everything around him got worse. Or was the expectation that he would get better with no #1 receiver, aging RB, TE that can't catch and will likely be out of football next year, and Boldin whom he made a 1000 yard receiver...still not a #1.

Compare that to all of his peers. What do they have? Stafford, Cutler, Tannehill, Ryan, Dalton all with superior pieces around them while playing mediocre football. Btu hey LOOK like QBs, though .

Originally posted by jreff22:
The D held on enough. Without that ST TD we have enough points to win.

And an LMJ fumble in the redzone on top of that was a killer. So, I'm unsure what the criticism of Kaep was in that SB. It's silly and everyone I watched that game with marvelled at how well Kaep played and talked about our D and the refs letting us down.