Rep the Red & Gold: Shop 49ers Gear →

There are 309 users in the forums

2014 Team Needs - Updates

Shop Find 49ers gear online
Originally posted by NCommand:
WR Stevie Johnson - 6'2" 210 and runs a 4.45 (Revis & Dick-Shaker) for a conditional 4th/3rd round pick in 2015. 3 straight seasons of 1,000. Cap numbers are $3.925M(14), $6.025M(15), and $6.125M(16).

Our most expensive WR makes $6M. To put this into perspective, Harvin will count $12.5M against the Hawks cap next year.

Wow!

This was so unexpected, and so great. In so many different ways!

What a weekend this is turning out to be!
[ Edited by oldninerdude on May 9, 2014 at 1:04 PM ]
Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Originally posted by NCommand:
WR Stevie Johnson - 6'2" 210 and runs a 4.45 (Revis & Dick-Shaker) for a conditional 4th/3rd round pick in 2015. 3 straight seasons of 1,000. Cap numbers are $3.925M(14), $6.025M(15), and $6.125M(16).

Our most expensive WR makes $6M. To put this into perspective, Harvin will count $12.5M against the Hawks cap next year.

Wow!

This was so unexpected, and so great. In so many different ways!

What a weekend this is turning out to be!

Harvin ($12.9M in 2015) counts more than Boldin, Crabtree and Johnson combined AND all three guys are 1,000 receivers and pro bowlers. Now THAT is how you manage your cap!
[ Edited by NCommand on May 9, 2014 at 1:15 PM ]
NC, that is actually laughable.

Ok, that said, here's a question for team needs/updates. Does anyone out there think that if kap were to go down, gabbert could move in and takeover our O? Basically, I assume he would be just handing off and NOT throwing passes, since that is NOT his forte. Really, does anyone actually think we can move from kap to gabbert seamlessly and not just fall off a cliff? It must be that the F.O thinks this is doable, that gabbert could actually help us win the games with Non-elite teams. But winning a game against an elite seems just out of the question, at least to me. GAbbert is a stop gap measure at present, and I thot we might grab a Qb earlier, but trent didn't think the quality was there so he didn't. Any Qb we draft from here on out is NOT going to take over for kap if injured and help us make a run. In fact of any Qb out there, I would just guess gabbert would be the LEAST likely to help out. Any thots?

Based on this, our OL better dam well take care of kap or an injury to him virtually ends any hope of post season.
[ Edited by pasodoc9er on May 10, 2014 at 12:24 PM ]
Originally posted by NCommand:
WR Stevie Johnson - 6'2" 210 and runs a 4.45 (Revis & Dick-Shaker) for a conditional 4th/3rd round pick in 2015. 3 straight seasons of 1,000. Cap numbers are $3.925M(14), $6.025M(15), and $6.125M(16).

Our most expensive WR makes $6M. To put this into perspective, Harvin will count $12.5M against the Hawks cap next year.

Who will be the first with a custom Johnson jersey with the name plate "dick-shaker"
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
NC, that is actually laughable.

Ok, that said, here's a question for team needs/updates. Does anyone out there think that if kap were to go down, gabbert could move in and takeover our O? Basically, I assume he would be just handing off and NOT throwing passes, since that is NOT his forte. Really, does anyone actually think we can move from kap to gabbert seamlessly and not just fall off a cliff? It must be that the F.O thinks this is doable, that gabbert could actually help us win the games with Non-elite teams. But winning a game against an elite seems just out of the question, at least to me. GAbbert is a stop gap measure at present, and I thot we might grab a Qb earlier, but trent didn't think the quality was there so he didn't. Any Qb we draft from here on out is NOT going to take over for kap if injured and help us make a run. In fact of any Qb out there, I would just guess gabbert would be the LEAST likely to help out. Any thots?

Based on this, our OL better dam well take care of kap or an injury to him virtually ends any hope of post season.

any SB contender is finished if their QB goes down, I think the only situation where you would have a backup capable enough would be us two years ago when Kap took over from Alex, otherwise it's just not financially possible to have a starter quality backup
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
NC, that is actually laughable.

Ok, that said, here's a question for team needs/updates. Does anyone out there think that if kap were to go down, gabbert could move in and takeover our O? Basically, I assume he would be just handing off and NOT throwing passes, since that is NOT his forte. Really, does anyone actually think we can move from kap to gabbert seamlessly and not just fall off a cliff? It must be that the F.O thinks this is doable, that gabbert could actually help us win the games with Non-elite teams. But winning a game against an elite seems just out of the question, at least to me. GAbbert is a stop gap measure at present, and I thot we might grab a Qb earlier, but trent didn't think the quality was there so he didn't. Any Qb we draft from here on out is NOT going to take over for kap if injured and help us make a run. In fact of any Qb out there, I would just guess gabbert would be the LEAST likely to help out. Any thots?

Based on this, our OL better dam well take care of kap or an injury to him virtually ends any hope of post season.

I think that the front office probably had a pretty high grade on gabbert in the 2011 draft. This trade just smells like a harbaugh driven transaction. I'm sure they see a lot of his struggles being directly a result of the talent base on the Jax team. I think jim really likes the talent gabbert has and thinks he can fix him. I sometimes disagree with the nature of harbaugh's offense, namely the lack of a true WCO passing game, but I never question his ability to develop qbs he likes. Let's hope we don't have to find out, but I think harbaugh like gabbert.
Am I the only one here that thinks we should address a pure NT?
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Am I the only one here that thinks we should address a pure NT?

probably
Originally posted by Allx9er:
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Am I the only one here that thinks we should address a pure NT?

probably

Lol! Yeah I figured we had a pretty hard time stopping Lynch last year...maybe a little beef would be nice...
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Lol! Yeah I figured we had a pretty hard time stopping Lynch last year...maybe a little beef would be nice...

we've always had problems with zone blocking schemes, I have no idea why...I don't think its a matter of needing more size though
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Originally posted by Allx9er:
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Am I the only one here that thinks we should address a pure NT?

probably

Lol! Yeah I figured we had a pretty hard time stopping Lynch last year...maybe a little beef would be nice...

Daniel McCullers seems to be the best left.
Originally posted by AB81Rules:
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Originally posted by Allx9er:
Originally posted by ManBearPig:
Am I the only one here that thinks we should address a pure NT?

probably

Lol! Yeah I figured we had a pretty hard time stopping Lynch last year...maybe a little beef would be nice...

Daniel McCullers seems to be the best left.

And he's gone.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Gains/Moves:
WR Stevie Johnson - 6'2" 210 and runs a 4.45 (Revis & Dick-Shaker) for a conditional 4th/3rd round pick in 2015. 3 straight seasons of 1,000. Cap numbers are $3.925M ('14), $6.025M ('15), and $6.125M ('16).

2014 Draft:
Jimmie Ward S/CB
Carlos Hyde RB
Marcus Martin C
Chris Borland ILB
Brandon Thomas OT (PUP)
Bruce Ellington WR
Dontae Johnson CB
Aaron Lynch OLB/DE
Keith Reaser CB (PUP)
Kenneth Acker CB
Caled Ramsey DE
Trey Milliard FB (PUP)

UDFA's:
Kory Faulkner QB
Shayne Skov ILB
Morgan Breslin OLB
L.J. McCray S
Asante Cleveland TE
Dillon Farrell C
Fou Fonoti OT
Read more at http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/nfl-draft/178469-top-udfa-signings-tracker/

Team Needs: (Order of Tier Importance: Top Tier, Second Tier & Third Tier)
Trending on NinerTalk - Top 5 Needs: H/W/S = Ideal Height/Weight/Speed; Would need to forfeit picks for Justin Gilbert & Mike Evans.
#1 CB/Dynamic Returner
(Justin Gilbert @ #12 = H/W/S + Returner or Jeff Fuller/Jason Verrett)
#2 WR/Dynamic Returner (2) (Size: X - Mike Evans @ #16 or Donte Moncrief @ #66 = H/W/S or Y - Brandin Cooks @ #37 = Returner + S)
#3 S (Calvin Pryor, Hasean Clinton-Dix or Jimmie Ward from picks #27 - #33)
#4 ILB (Shayne Skov in the 2nd round (#56 or #61) or from the 3rd round on, Yawin Smallwood, Chris Borland, Andrew Jackson or Telvin Smith)
#5 C (Marcus Martin @ pick #71)

Top Tier: No particular order within Tiers...
#1 CB/Dynamic Returner - This is especially true if he has dynamic return abilities (someone like CB Justin Gilbert who's 6'0" with elite speed AND return abilities). We have Tramaine Brock, Chris Culliver, Eric Wright, Perrish Cox, Chris Cooper, Darryl Morris and Dax Swanson (dark horse). Brown and Rogers chose to end their careers in the Black Hole (where Niners go to die). Culliver is a question mark coming off the injury and potential legal issues and distractions and Darryl Morris and Eric Wright barely saw the field last year. Cox was a late add but played very well for us on the fly during the playoffs. We will probably go a top blue-chip CB here and let him compete right away for the #2 or slowly develop him along in the nickle/dime or slot esp. if he has return abilities. Ideally, Culliver regains form and he and Brock light up the NFL with Morris quickly developing as a great slot CB with a top-tier rookie developing as the #4 to push both Brock and Culliver and Wright and Cox in the future. Don't expect to see another Marcus Cooper this go-round though. Trading up for Justin Gilbert here makes sense as well given he's 6'0" and a dynamic returner with 4.37 speed but this draft is deep in CB's so we have options. Also, it appears we'll be shifting to a more balanced press and off-coverage scheme (something we couldn't do with Brown and Rogers as starters). So pay attention to the CB's in this draft who can be very physical, strong and aggressive up at the LOS and who can also be smart enough, quick, etc. to play in off-coverage schemes.
#2 WR/Dynamic Returner - Here we have X = Michael Crabtree/Jon Baldwin --- Y = Quinton Patton/Brandon Lloyd --- Z = Anquan Boldin. Manningham went home to NY. This is an area where most feel we need a dynamic speedster to stretch the field and we would probably consider the 1st pick in round 1 to find him (note: the FO has tried to acquire Sanders and Jackson in FA, etc. for this reason). However, we've had "speedsters" in Ginn, Moore, Moss and even Lockette and never once choose to use them as deep threats used to stretch the defense (i.e. actually throw to them on deep balls). They were merely used as "decoy" deep threats to get guys such as VD and Crabtree space underneath. Boldin signed a 2-year deal. I'm guessing we go with a receiver in this bigger-body range to step in for Crabtree/Boldin next year (Crabtree) and 2 years down the road (Boldin) at the X & Z positions; someone like Donte Moncrief. Baldwin also restructured and is in this same body-mold and isn't as poor as people think. Our leading receiver averages about 4-5 catches a game right now anyhow so a big-body possession and run-blocker is essential to our offense. A speedster WR (esp. one with dynamic return abilities) will most likely be brought in after the first round IMHO esp. given how deep the draft is. Trading up for Mike Evans here may be a real option since he fits our style perfectly. Either way, we probably need 2 very different types of WR's here.
#3 S - There it is: Antoine Bethea and Eric Reid together. We just restructured Craig Dahl as some insurance and C.J. Spillman is an excellent ST player (as is Dahl). I have a feeling we'll spend a top pick for S this year to be groomed behind Bethea and he'll be more of the mold of a FS with tremendous football IQ, range and coverage ability (ala Reid last year). They need a quality back-up here with tremendous upside as Reid had 2 concussions last year and we desperately need coverage ability on the back end esp. come playoff time. The signing of Bethea means we have flexibility. Add a top S this year...or next. And now it affords us the option to draft a CB or WR who doubles as a dynamic returner! But since this draft is deep at both CB & WR, do we go S with the first pick (i.e. Calvin Pryor, Hasean Clinton-Dix or Jimmie Ward)?
#4 ILB - We currently have Patrick Willis and Michael Wilhoite as starters with Nick Moody backing up; while NaVorro Bowman is way ahead of schedule, we won't rush him back from injury. I'm unsure if the team plans to continue to develop Darius Fleming inside (his original position was as an OLB). That said, Wilhoite played well for us and don't be surprised if we go the late FA route again d/t experience needed here should either he or Willis go down at some point; someone like Larry Grant. I have a feeling the team only likes Moody as a ST ace and we'll go for a higher ILB this year in the draft as well (now and for the future). They want an upgrade here.
#8 FB - We currently have a healing Bruce Miller. Last year I was screaming for FB Jason Scheplar to make the team...then was happy when we at least brought in Owen Marecic. In the end, we let both go and Miller got hurt and our running game (and partial receiving game) tanked esp. in the playoffs. I doubt the FO makes that same mistake again! We could get a top notch FB much later in the draft and we also have FB Alex Debniak coming back from I.R. from last year who the FO was high on.
#5 C - Right now, our OL QB is Jonathan Goodwin but he's not expected to be back even as a backup/insurance. Daniel Kilgore and Joe Looney have been training all year for a shot to start here (Looney, mostly at G) so don't be surprised if we make a run at the best C in the draft or even bring in another via FA like we did with Goodwin. We could get a top notch C much later in the draft (3rd and 4th round); maybe someone from Stanford.
Second Tier:
#6 DE - Currently, we have Justin Smith, Ray McDonald and then Demarcus Dobbs, Tony Jerod-Eddie, Tank Carradine and Lawrence Okoye. Quinton Dial can also play DE. On the surface, this looks stacked here. But, Justin is much older now and slowing down, McDonald is oft-injured and Carradine and Dial are huge question marks coming off their I.R. years. TJE and Dobbs had very nice years and Okoye may end up being a surprise BUT we need top-notch "quality" talent here and health here as these 3 DL are critical to our front 7 play. It would not surprise me if the FO saw this as a primary Top Tier pick. And isn't this the ideal spot to take another IR-filler, red-shirt developmental pick by Baalke? Tomsula can hold the fort down with 1 or 2 big injuries here as proven in the past and this group and depth is solid/stout/experienced already.
#9 OG - With Mike Iupati and Alex Boone, we're more than solid here when healthy. That said, Iupati had an injury-riddled season and may command high $ come FA. With a down year, this is the year to either sign him LT or consider replacing him now. We also have Joe Looney who's been training for a year as well and Adam Snyder can also play there if needed (if he sticks with us). I would not be surprised if someone like Ryan Seymour surprises as well. We need some inside pass protection here badly.
Third Tier:
#7 QB
- With Colin Kaepernick and Colt McCoy's departure, no doubt, we needed another QB, so they went out and nabbed QB Blaine Gabbert. Well done FO. That said, we could still use another QB in the mold of CK himself. We lost a potential good one in B.J. Daniels this past year to Seattle who sees a lot of similarities to Wilson already. My guess is we'll draft for added competition.
#10 OT - We have Joe Staley, Anthony Davis and Adam Snyder but Luke Marquardt will be back from I.R. and from all the reports, this dude is huge and has zero body fat. He should also be hungry as well. And as expected, the FO brought in a veteran OT in Jonathan Martin to compete with Snyder and Marquardt as well. Well done FO!
#11 RB - We have Frank Gore, Marcus Lattimore, Kendall Hunter, LaMichael James and Jewel Hampton. Jewel is my dark horse if Lattimore doesn't hit the ground running. He flashes to me and after another year in our system, don't be surprised to see him shine; we love to develop these UDFA's over time (Brock, Boone, Williams, etc.). This unit is stacked but Baalke loves competition and he'll probably bring in another rookie here for down-the-line thinking.
#13 TE - We have the best in Vernon Davis and the coaches love how much Vance McDonald could handle in his first year. He is expected to get more involved in the passing game next year. So that leaves Garrett Celek who is familiar with our system and is decent at both blocking and catching. Perhaps the coaches want to give the H-back (Delanie Walker role) a try again but I doubt it as we had both MarQueis Gray and Chris Harper last year and let both walk. That said, there are talks of Derek Carrier being ideal for this role and we heard good things about him late last year.
#12 NT - With Glenn Dorsey and Ian Williams back healthy, and with the ability of Dial developing here more as well, we may go the route of another 2-gap plugger like Lamar Divens to develop on the PS (like Williams).
#14 OLB - With Aldon Smith, Ahmad Brooks, Dan Skuta and Corey Lemonier on tap. we're top-notch here but you can never have too many pass rushers, right? Darius Fleming now has experience at OLB and ILB but we'll draft some competition here and try and develop him ala Cam Johnson.
#15 PK - Phil Dawson is old and his inability to kick out of the back of the EZ cost us dearly in the playoffs. And P Andy Lee had an off-year by his standards and we may need to consider late-round picks for the two that are best-in-the-country here. LS Kevin McDermott was my unpopular choice over the legend Brian Jennings last year but it turned out to be the right move. Good call Baalke/Coaches!

Well ladies and gents, it's time to review our long-standing team needs and how they were met (if met) this off season.

The draft for me can be summed up like this for me: After the Ellington pick, "It's sort of a drop-the-mic, walk-off (the stage) for Trent Baalke" ~ Trent Dilfer

First, let's look at the NT trends and see how we did overall.

Trending on NinerTalk - Top 5 Needs: H/W/S = Ideal Height/Weight/Speed; Would need to forfeit picks for Justin Gilbert & Mike Evans.
#1 CB/Dynamic Returner (Justin Gilbert @ #12 = H/W/S + Returner or Jeff Fuller/Jason Verrett)
#2 WR/Dynamic Returner (2) (Size: X - Mike Evans @ #16 or Donte Moncrief @ #66 = H/W/S or Y - Brandin Cooks @ #37 = Returner + S)
#3 S (Calvin Pryor, Hasean Clinton-Dix or Jimmie Ward from picks #27 - #33)
#4 ILB (Shayne Skov in the 2nd round (#56 or #61) or from the 3rd round on, Yawin Smallwood, Chris Borland, Andrew Jackson or Telvin Smith)
#5 C (Marcus Martin @ pick #71)

Fantastic job by NT. First off, every single player identified in #1 and #2 went way earlier than originally projected in Mike Evans, Justin Gilbert, Fuller, Verrett, Beckham, Clinton-Dix, Pryor, etc. Even Kelvin Benjamin went right before us at #29. So IMHO, that quickly transformed our draft to BPA and "value." With the draft so deep and equally talented between the 2nd and 6th rounds, we had many directions we could go. So as a result, we ended up getting Ellington, our slot WR and dynamic returner, the best S/DB for our needs in Jimmie Ward, basically the 2nd best ILB in Chris Borland and Shayne Skov for free and the best C in the draft in Marcus Martin. As for CB, we nabbed Jimmie Ward who will play nickle, slot and block punts and eventually, will be groomed into starting next to Reid. Outstanding! Well done NT, well done!

Now, let's look at how we did with the full needs:

Needs: (Order of Tier Importance: Top Tier, Second Tier & Third Tier)
Top Tier: No particular order within the tiers...
#1 CB/Dynamic Returner - The dynamic returner came way via Ellington in the WR role and also, Devon Wiley (NFL experience) and L.J. McCray (UDFA) seems to be the most productive rookie we have. We have our starters set in Brock/Culliver plus have NFL (or our defensive playbook) experience in Wright, Cox, Cook, Morris, Swanson, etc. So we picked later and got great developmental talent in Dontae Johnson, Keith Reaser (PUP) & Kenneth Acker. This means we now have 5 press CB's in Brock, Culliver, Cook, Wright & Johnson who can also play off in our more exotic coverage schemes and most, including the S positons, can also bring the blitz effectively as well. Expect to see some single-high S as well. This is going to be the youngest, fastest, most athletic and most versatile and dynamic playmaking secondary we've had here in the HarBaalke tenure. It will be fun to watch this group get better and better and better.
#2 WR/Dynamic Returner - Here we have X = Michael Crabtree/Jon Baldwin --- Y = Stevie Johnson/Bruce Ellington/QuintonPatton/Brandon Lloyd --- Z = Anquan Boldin. What more needs to be said here?
#3 S - We esentaily drafted Jimmie Ward S/CB & L.J. McCray (UDFA) to fill the nickle, slot, block punts and eventually fill in at FS next to Reid (SS) in the very near future. No rush though with Bethea starting there. Fantastic pick and job well done by the FO of understanding our true needs. The Nickle/Slot is a 12th starter for us.
#4 ILB - This isn't even fair. Even with Bowman out, Wilhoite is a stud and Moody has been training all off season with CK in that hybrid-LB/S role and then we add Chris Borland ILB & Shayne Skov (UDFA - for free). It's safe to say we have a ton of depth here now and ALL are ST studs.
#8 FB - I b!tched and moaned all last year that we needed a pure FB to backup Miller and sadly, I was right. Did the FO learn? Hell yeah it did. It nabbed the best in Trey Milliard (PUP). He can take his time and be groomed into a key backup and ST stud as well as that swiss-army knife we love so much here.
#5 C - So we upgrade with Daniel Kilgore and then we also end up with the best C in the draft in Marcus Martin. That's just not even fair! Plus we also brought in Dillon Farrell as an UDFA.

Second Tier:
#6 DE/OLB - As if Lemonier and Skuta aren't already great and then we go ahead and add Aaron Lynch & Morgan Breslin (UDFA). And as if Carradine, Dial, TJE, Okoye and Dobbs weren't enough, we add Caled Ramsey to the mix. Wow! Bring the heat boys...we can now rotate like Seattle did last year and play more aggressive and physically in the back end.
#9 OG - Obviously we love versatile linemen and Marcus Martin can play both C & G. Then we added Jonathan Martin in FA as well who can play out at OT or inside at G. But we're not done. We also added Brandon Thomas (PUP) & Fou Fonoti (UDFA) for the future and both can play OT or inside at G as well.
Third Tier:
#7 QB - No big splash here but we have Gabbert as the #2 and we brought in a #3 in Kory Faulkner (UDFA) to compete with Bethel-Thompson.
#10 OT - See #9 OG.
#11 RB - Now THIS isn't even fair. As if Gore, Lattimore, Hunter, James, and Hampton weren't enough, we nabbed the best RB in the draft (esp. for our offense) in Carlos Hyde.
#13 TE - We already have Davis, McDonald, Celek and an H-Back in Carrier so let's add an UDFA in Asante Cleveland and see if he pans out.
#12 NT - This is only 1 of 2 needs not addressed, I would prefer a wide-bodied 2-gap NT but with Dorsey, Williams and Dial, we should be fine.
#15 PK - This is only 1 of 2 needs not addressed. Usually we bring in competition here but so far, not this time. Andy and Phil are safe.
[ Edited by NCommand on May 12, 2014 at 2:18 PM ]
Still missing: big redzone target.

Is it gonna be Baldwin, or Osgood, or MacDonald?

Still a team need. IMHO.
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 60,541
Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Still missing: big redzone target.

Is it gonna be Baldwin, or Osgood, or MacDonald?

Still a team need. IMHO.

we also need someone who can call a good play in the redzone which gives the team a chance. oh well we can always depend on gore and ck to change plays in the huddle to ones which actually work... but in regards to the original question,, the only thing i can think of is a decent third string qb. if that is all that keeps me up at nights , that is not bad
Open Menu Search Share 49ersWebzone