Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
No, It hasn't. We have no idea if there was any negotiating before the shoulder surgery news broke. That is what ended any and all talk about a trade though. There were rumors and 3rd party chatter from guys like Florio but nothing made public by anyone in charge. Now that the surgery has thrown a wrench into their original plans, it is in their best interest to not cut Jimmy before he clears a medical exam or else they owe him something like $7.5 million.

It would be dumb to not sign Deebo this year. You don't let a guy like that hit free agency where some desparate team can drive up the cost and make it impossible to keep him. We need that Jimmy money in order to make sure that doesn't happen. WE NEED ALL OF IT. A trade at this point is highly unlikely. Who do you value more, Jimmy or Deebo? A better question. Who do you think Kyle and Lynch value more?

Keeping Jimmy and re-signing Deebo isn't the zero-sum game you're presenting here.

Regardless, even if what you presented was an accurate reflection of reality, I would rather have a functional QB next season than sign Deebo to a long term extension early. If Trey comes to camp and shows he's close to Jimmy, or has surpassed him, this is a non issue. It's a big question mark though and a huge blindspot for many of the superfans discussing this.

Early? Its pretty typical for teams to re sign their players before the start of their contract season. I am sure they could franchise tag him but that could upset the relationship. Deebo is more valuable to this offense than Jimmy. Again, I will post this quote just in case you missed it.

"That's why we looked into trading Jimmy, because we obviously believe Trey can be the starter and we're ready to do that" Shanahan said. "

If that doesn't give you confidence that they are confident in Trey being ready, than I am not sure what will. Oh, them naming a starter. Kyle refused to name a starter last season also. He figured since Jimmy was receiving all of the 1st team reps that it should have been quite obvious. With the statements Kyle has made about Trey and actively shopping Jimmy should make it quite obvious who they project being the starter this season.

Originally posted by BamaNiner:

Originally posted by RackofRibs49:
So Trey is established at

1) Going through progressions

2) Moving safeties and linebackers with his eyes

3) Throwing with anticipation

4) Looking downfield to make plays

5) Composure under pressure

6) Making difficult throws

Yet he's not even named the starter because he has to earn it against a practice squad guy not an actual vet that he would ACTUALLY have to earn it from...

Lol this place. 10 quarters.

Yeah Trey does literally none of that consistently. He's jittery in the pocket. Panicks if his first read isnt there. He doesn't layer throws or throw guys open. The success he has had has largely come from Kyle scheming guys wide open.
The most successful part of his game, running, has already shown it won't transfer to the nfl. He has yet to beat a linebacker to the edge and he got stones by multiple safeties. I'm on record as saying this will be one of the biggest draft screw ups of all time.
I think the Niners would've won a super bowl this year had they taken Parsons or Slater and drafted anyone else but Aaron banks in round two. They were that close but chose to draft for the future instead of bolstering a roster that was ready now

He's shown that consistently. He was a rookie and got off to slow starts, but once he got in a rhythm he was able to put drives together.

And he isn't jittery in the pocket. I'd like to see footage of him panicking. You could look at the Houston game where he didn't throw to either a wide open Deebo and Kittle running slants because he was spooked by a linebacker (something Jimmy still fails to recognize), where he then moves out the pocket looking down field & finding Aiyuk for a 10 yard 1st down completion.

Next quarter, when running that same play, he immediately recognizes the coverage and hits Deebo for a 15 yard gain. That shows how his talent overcame his inexperience, and also how he improved as time went on.

You can make any assertion you want, but its not credible if it contradicts scouts and well informed fans analysis and isn't supported by footage.

8/14 102 yards 2 tds in back to back drives. Yeah, that's inconsistent. Oh wait, it doesn't count, it's only preseason.

https://youtu.be/g8d_al7MQpk

16-23 249 yards 2 tds 1 int 8 carries 31 yards

https://youtu.be/g8d_al7MQpk

Doesn't count it's the Texans, nevermind that the safety Justin Reid who made great plays to stuff Lance on designed runs, signed w/ the Chiefs for 3 years and $31 million.

And the team isn't winning a SB with Jimmy no matter how much talent you surround him with. He can't make all the throws, Trey can and has.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Early? Its pretty typical for teams to re sign their players before the start of their contract season. I am sure they could franchise tag him but that could upset the relationship. Deebo is more valuable to this offense than Jimmy. Again, I will post this quote just in case you missed it.

"That's why we looked into trading Jimmy, because we obviously believe Trey can be the starter and we're ready to do that" Shanahan said. "

If that doesn't give you confidence that they are confident in Trey being ready, than I am not sure what will. Oh, them naming a starter. Kyle refused to name a starter last season also. He figured since Jimmy was receiving all of the 1st team reps that it should have been quite obvious. With the statements Kyle has made about Trey and actively shopping Jimmy should make it quite obvious who they project being the starter this season.

I saw the quote the other times you posted it and I saw the interview. It doesn't mean all that much to me and I think there's more wiggle room in that statement than you're acknowledging.

Originally posted by SinceXVI:

Originally posted by BamaNiner:

Originally posted by RackofRibs49:
So Trey is established at

1) Going through progressions

2) Moving safeties and linebackers with his eyes

3) Throwing with anticipation

4) Looking downfield to make plays

5) Composure under pressure

6) Making difficult throws

Yet he's not even named the starter because he has to earn it against a practice squad guy not an actual vet that he would ACTUALLY have to earn it from...

Lol this place. 10 quarters.

Yeah Trey does literally none of that consistently. He's jittery in the pocket. Panicks if his first read isnt there. He doesn't layer throws or throw guys open. The success he has had has largely come from Kyle scheming guys wide open.
The most successful part of his game, running, has already shown it won't transfer to the nfl. He has yet to beat a linebacker to the edge and he got stones by multiple safeties. I'm on record as saying this will be one of the biggest draft screw ups of all time.
I think the Niners would've won a super bowl this year had they taken Parsons or Slater and drafted anyone else but Aaron banks in round two. They were that close but chose to draft for the future instead of bolstering a roster that was ready now

He's shown that consistently. He was a rookie and got off to slow starts, but once he got in a rhythm he was able to put drives together.

And he isn't jittery in the pocket. I'd like to see footage of him panicking. You could look at the Houston game where he didn't throw to either a wide open Deebo and Kittle running slants because he was spooked by a linebacker (something Jimmy still fails to recognize), where he then moves out the pocket looking down field & finding Aiyuk for a 10 yard 1st down completion.

Next quarter, when running that same play, he immediately recognizes the coverage and hits Deebo for a 15 yard game. That shows how his talent overcame his inexperience, and also how he improved as time went on.

You can make any assertion you want, but its not credible if it contradicts scouts and well informed fans analysis and isn't supported by footage.

8/14 102 yards 2 tds in back to back drives. Yeah, that's inconsistent. Oh wait, it doesn't count, it's only preseason.

https://youtu.be/g8d_al7MQpk

16-23 249 yards 2 tds 1 int 8 carries 31 yards

https://youtu.be/g8d_al7MQpk

Doesn't count it's the Texans, nevermind that the safety Justin Reid who made great plays to stuff Lance on designed runs, signed w/ the Chiefs for 3 years and $31 million.

And the team isn't winning an SB with Jimmy no matter how much talent you surround him with. He can't make all the throws, Trey can and has.

Originally posted by BamaNiner:
Yeah Trey does literally none of that consistently. He's jittery in the pocket. Panicks if his first read isnt there. He doesn't layer throws or throw guys open. The success he has had has largely come from Kyle scheming guys wide open.
The most successful part of his game, running, has already shown it won't transfer to the nfl. He has yet to beat a linebacker to the edge and he got stones by multiple safeties. I'm on record as saying this will be one of the biggest draft screw ups of all time.
I think the Niners would've won a super bowl this year had they taken Parsons or Slater and drafted anyone else but Aaron banks in round two. They were that close but chose to draft for the future instead of bolstering a roster that was ready now

You would be wrong. Jimmy had plenty of opportunities in the title game to make plays and he didn't.

Originally posted by NotAFinga42:
If the only 2 choices are keeping Jimmy at $27 million or cutting him, he's cut.

100% agree. I just can't imagine those will be the only two possibilities. I am no fan of JG, but that lack of value / interest would shock me considerably.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
You would be wrong. Jimmy had plenty of opportunities in the title game to make plays and he didn't.

He could be wrong in that they might not have won the Super Bowl.

Where he isn't wrong is you didn't get any real impact from your 1st, 2nd, or 3rd, round picks in the draft in a Super Bowl contending year and according to 49ers brass, they were completely ok with that as far as that really valuable 1st pick is concerned. That's troubling to some of us.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Early? Its pretty typical for teams to re sign their players before the start of their contract season. I am sure they could franchise tag him but that could upset the relationship. Deebo is more valuable to this offense than Jimmy. Again, I will post this quote just in case you missed it.

"That's why we looked into trading Jimmy, because we obviously believe Trey can be the starter and we're ready to do that" Shanahan said. "

If that doesn't give you confidence that they are confident in Trey being ready, than I am not sure what will. Oh, them naming a starter. Kyle refused to name a starter last season also. He figured since Jimmy was receiving all of the 1st team reps that it should have been quite obvious. With the statements Kyle has made about Trey and actively shopping Jimmy should make it quite obvious who they project being the starter this season.

I saw the quote the other times you posted it and I saw the interview. It doesn't mean all that much to me and I think there's more wiggle room in that statement than you're acknowledging.

How do you interpret that statement than? Wiggle room doesn't really add anything to the discussion.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
How do you interpret that statement than? Wiggle room doesn't really add anything to the discussion.

I interpret it as they want Trey to become the starter. That they believe he can take the necessary steps in the offseason to be trusted with the job.

Whether he will or not remains to be seen.

Successfully trading Jimmy G wouldn't have closed the book on next year's starter either, in my opinion. I hope, had they successfully traded him, that they would have targeted a high quality backup. Rolling into the season with Trey Lance as your starter and Sudfeld as your backup (not factoring a draft pick) would be very risky. That may very well be where we end up, but we'll probably get to look at Trey Lance in camp first, which makes it a lot less of an unknown.

The last time we saw the team was in the NFC championship game. They chose to play a broken Jimmy G over Trey Lance. That's the 2nd biggest stage in the sport. I don't know what all you think has changed for Lance and Jimmy in the last 2 months to believe the very same coaching staff is 100 percent confident in Lance's ability to lead this team now.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
He could be wrong in that they might not have won the Super Bowl.

Where he isn't wrong is you didn't get any real impact from your 1st, 2nd, or 3rd, round picks in the draft in a Super Bowl contending year and according to 49ers brass, they were completely ok with that as far as that really valuable 1st pick is concerned. That's troubling to some of us.

Whereas it's troubling to some of us is that the goal apparently is build an elite team while being fine with just ok qb play.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Whereas it's troubling to some of us is that the goal apparently is build an elite team while being fine with just ok qb play.

That's troubling to me as well, and clearly the organization has attempted to address it. That's probably why they were connected to Rodgers, Brady, Watson, and Stafford.

You can't force it though when it isn't there. They drafted a QB with next to no experience at an elite QB price in draft capital. A boom or bust project that the team acknowledged likely won't be ready to be that upgrade in the first year of his career while the team is in win now mode. And here we are in year two with almost the exact same questions going forward.

It is in fact possible they made the situation worse.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by YACBros85:
How do you interpret that statement than? Wiggle room doesn't really add anything to the discussion.

I interpret it as they want Trey to become the starter. That they believe he can take the necessary steps in the offseason to be trusted with the job.

Whether he will or not remains to be seen.

Successfully trading Jimmy G wouldn't have closed the book on next year's starter either, in my opinion. I hope, had they successfully traded him, that they would have targeted a high quality backup. Rolling into the season with Trey Lance as your starter and Sudfeld as your backup (not factoring a draft pick) would be very risky. That may very well be where we end up, but we'll probably get to look at Trey Lance in camp first, which makes it a lot less of an unknown.

The last time we saw the team was in the NFC championship game. They chose to play a broken Jimmy G over Trey Lance. That's the 2nd biggest stage in the sport. I don't know what all you think has changed for Lance and Jimmy in the last 2 months to believe the very same coaching staff is 100 percent confident in Lance's ability to lead this team now.

Finally, I get a good story out of you. I see where you are coming from now.

You do know there is a difference between starting week 1 with very little experience and starting in the playoffs with very little experience? Just because Trey wasn't ready to put this team on his shoulders to start the playoffs with 10 quarters of experience on his belt doesn't mean he isn't going to be ready to start day 1 this season. Trey will get all the 1st team reps in OTA's and possibly training camp before Jimmy will even be ready to compete. Couple that in with the fact that Jimmy is known for poor off season practices and slow starts to begin the season. You would have to believe that Kyle is just going to hand the job over to Jimmy again this season without earning it.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Whereas it's troubling to some of us is that the goal apparently is build an elite team while being fine with just ok qb play.

That's troubling to me as well, and clearly the organization has attempted to address it. That's probably why they were connected to Rodgers, Brady, Watson, and Stafford.

You can't force it though when it isn't there. They drafted a QB with next to no experience at an elite QB price in draft capital. A boom or bust project that the team acknowledged likely won't be ready to be that upgrade in the first year of his career while the team is in win now mode. And here we are in year two with almost the exact same questions going forward.

It is in fact possible they made the situation worse.

We are on the same page. I felt they forced things ever since the trade up. I had complete trust in the FO and Kyle until then.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
That's troubling to me as well, and clearly the organization has attempted to address it. That's probably why they were connected to Rodgers, Brady, Watson, and Stafford.

You can't force it though when it isn't there. They drafted a QB with next to no experience at an elite QB price in draft capital. A boom or bust project that the team acknowledged likely won't be ready to be that upgrade in the first year of his career while the team is in win now mode. And here we are in year two with almost the exact same questions going forward.

It is in fact possible they made the situation worse.

The only thing that made it worse is playing Jimmy in the playoffs and him getting more hurt. Should've just played Trey the rest of the way. But what's done is done.

If they can develop Trey into an elite level QB they will be in win now mode for the better part of a decade. That's the decision they made once Stafford was off the table and Watson had issues.

The only real question is can we get anything back for Jimmy. He's not gonna be on this team in September nor should he.

Originally posted by YACBros85:
Finally, I get a good story out of you. I see where you are coming from now.

You do know there is a difference between starting week 1 with very little experience and starting in the playoffs with very little experience? Just because Trey wasn't ready to put this team on his shoulders to start the playoffs with 10 quarters of experience on his belt doesn't mean he isn't going to be ready to start day 1 this season. Trey will get all the 1st team reps in OTA's and possibly training camp before Jimmy will even be ready to compete. Couple that in with the fact that Jimmy is known for poor off season practices and slow starts to begin the season. You would have to believe that Kyle is just going to hand the job over to Jimmy again this season without earning it.

I don't disagree with any of this. I'm just not assuming that Trey Lance is going to come in, leave no doubt, and take the job. Not based on what I've actually seen.

He still should be treated as the starter going into camp. Get all the reps he can. It should be his job to lose. If it's even close it should be his. I just won't be surprised if he isn't still ready. I won't blame him either, as I've said a few times earlier in this thread. If the team was in transition, or in the midst of a rebuild, I'd say throw caution to the wind. Obviously that isn't the case. One of my biggest issues here (and it should be obvious by now) is the timing of this pick with the state of the team. It's already a failure to me given we burned a very real shot at adding to a team that was right on the doorstep this past year. You don't get those chances back.

There's nuance here.

It was bad for the team to not get an immediate upgrade at the position given what we paid and given where the team is.
It's bad for Trey Lance that we might not be able to get him the reps he needs without possibly sacrificing the teams goals (as would have been the case last year)
Jimmy G is a sub average starting QB.
Jimmy G may still be the best option we have for next season.