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Smith, Tolzien thread. Yet again

For some reason the edit feature is not working correctly for me.

I do give credit for Alex's red zone production. That's something Colin needs to improve upon. As for the difficulty of throws, one QB has a lower percentage but attempts more throws off balance or while being hit or into a 2-inch margin of error window whereas another one mostly makes the throw if the "shot play" has worked and the receiver is open by a yard or so. Yes, Alex has made a few tight throws here and there but most of his throws have not been difficult.

Even take a look at that TD to Vernon in the GB game. The result of the throw appeared to be a tight throw but if you look at Vernon right out of his break, there was no one within 2 yards of him. The throw was late but it was to a wide open target. These are the throws Alex attempts more whereas the true top 10 QB's attempt throws that are initially covered.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by rk1642:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by blm7754:
I am shocked at all the chatter I have seen recently about Alex Smith's value. Many folks don't think he is worth more than a late round draft pick. Others think he is overpaid at $8M. Still others have the audacity to think that he should accept a pay cut and stay a 49er backup.

What the f**k does this poor guy have to do to prove his worth? Over his last 30 or so starts he is statistically one of the best QBs in the league. You can't deny his efficiency, decision making, ability to read a defense, and accuracy. At least half the teams in the NFL would have won more games this year with Smith at QB than they did with the bums they currently have. He is also young. Just at the beginning of the prime playing years of his career.

People want to say that he sucks without the genius Harbaugh.... as if he was a puppet. True, Harbaugh may have given Smith the instruction he needed to get his career on track. But that doesn't mean that Smith can't take those lessons learned with him.

Smiths ability and age make him easily worth a 2nd round pick for any team in need of a QB. If he hits FA, I guarantee he will get a better deal than the one he has now.

I would only agree with 2 of the 4 items on your list. Efficiency mainly depends on what the maximum potential of that play actually is. I don't think he's very efficient at maximizing a play. The accuracy thing, well, let's just he gets the ball there but there are constraints that come into play in terms of how open is the receiver that is a direct result in the difficulty of the throw.

His stats do not necessary translate into on-field production.

efficiency: No
decision making: Yes
ability to read a defense: Yes
accuracy: No


Accuracy: No? So a 70% completion rate doesn't equal accurate enough for you. Bet its your eye test right?

Difficulty of throw couldn't possibly have any affect on that, right? Stats don't always translate which is why he is on the bench. A team that has WRs get wide open More times than not would thrive with Alex. He's also not a very WR friendly QB so the team must have top middle of the field targets.

W-L Record
Alex Smith 6-2
Colin Kaepernick 5-2-1

Completion Percentage
Alex Smith 70.2%
Colin Kaepernick 62.4%

Average Yards per Game
Alex Smith: 207
Colin Kaepernick: 215

Both had the same receivers to work with. Since you're insinuating that Smith only makes easy passes while Kaepernick is launching bombs downfield. Why bother with the difficult passes when you can just make easy completions since both yield pretty much the same result.
Originally posted by drakan:
W-L Record
Alex Smith 6-2
Colin Kaepernick 5-2-1

Completion Percentage
Alex Smith 70.2%
Colin Kaepernick 62.4%

Average Yards per Game
Alex Smith: 207
Colin Kaepernick: 215

Both had the same receivers to work with. Since you're insinuating that Smith only makes easy passes while Kaepernick is launching bombs downfield. Why bother with the difficult passes when you can just make easy completions since both yield pretty much the same result.

They don't yield the same results. Smith's game has been inconsistent game to game. His game has also vastly dropped off when he's played better defenses. Like I said, the stats will not show why Colin is more dangerous to a top ranked defense. Top ranked defenses have eaten Alex alive more often...but in the past it was blamed on the WR's. It's because he won't make that downfield throw to an NFL open receiver. Versus the better defenses, all you're going to get is tight windows.

And then this comes all back to the "he's limited" conclusion. He can pretty up all the stats for you, but his on-field play is limited.
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Good luck wherever you end up, Alex. Wherever that is, I will likely have a second team to strongly support.

( at least you got well paid for the backstabbings, bro! )


+1
Will AS show up during the coin toss..as all captains do ?

Has AS given up secrets to his buddy Aaron Rogers like the other rat that was on this team ?
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by drakan:
W-L Record
Alex Smith 6-2
Colin Kaepernick 5-2-1

Completion Percentage
Alex Smith 70.2%
Colin Kaepernick 62.4%

Average Yards per Game
Alex Smith: 207
Colin Kaepernick: 215

Both had the same receivers to work with. Since you're insinuating that Smith only makes easy passes while Kaepernick is launching bombs downfield. Why bother with the difficult passes when you can just make easy completions since both yield pretty much the same result.

They don't yield the same results. Smith's game has been inconsistent game to game. His game has also vastly dropped off when he's played better defenses. Like I said, the stats will not show why Colin is more dangerous to a top ranked defense. Top ranked defenses have eaten Alex alive more often...but in the past it was blamed on the WR's. It's because he won't make that downfield throw to an NFL open receiver. Versus the better defenses, all you're going to get is tight windows.

And then this comes all back to the "he's limited" conclusion. He can pretty up all the stats for you, but his on-field play is limited.

so basically your rebuttal is that Smith doesn't pass your eye test.
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Will AS show up during the coin toss..as all captains do ?

Has AS given up secrets to his buddy Aaron Rogers like the other rat that was on this team ?
Wow, that is so NOT Alex Smith that it makes me wonder if you've ever read anything about him. Say what you want about Alex Smith. Pick his performances apart as much as you want or analyze the way he plays. But, Alex Smith has character off the scale.
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Will AS show up during the coin toss..as all captains do ?

Has AS given up secrets to his buddy Aaron Rogers like the other rat that was on this team ?
Wow, that is so NOT Alex Smith that it makes me wonder if you've ever read anything about him. Say what you want about Alex Smith. Pick his performances apart as much as you want or analyze the way he plays. But, Alex Smith has character off the scale.

lol. AS and I used to be roommates ! jk

but i've been reading and watching this guy live/TV all of his 9er career.

I was just writting how crazy would that be ? ...not saying it happened..but, it's always the guy you least expect (its just my movie imagination)
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
lol. AS and I used to be roommates ! jk

but i've been reading and watching this guy live/TV all of his 9er career.

I was just writting how crazy would that be ? ...not saying it happened..but, it's always the guy you least expect (its just my movie imagination)

I was pretty sure you weren't entirely serious about that. I just like to use any opportunity to praise Alex Smith's character.
Unbelievable.
Originally posted by drakan:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by drakan:
W-L Record
Alex Smith 6-2
Colin Kaepernick 5-2-1

Completion Percentage
Alex Smith 70.2%
Colin Kaepernick 62.4%

Average Yards per Game
Alex Smith: 207
Colin Kaepernick: 215

Both had the same receivers to work with. Since you're insinuating that Smith only makes easy passes while Kaepernick is launching bombs downfield. Why bother with the difficult passes when you can just make easy completions since both yield pretty much the same result.

They don't yield the same results. Smith's game has been inconsistent game to game. His game has also vastly dropped off when he's played better defenses. Like I said, the stats will not show why Colin is more dangerous to a top ranked defense. Top ranked defenses have eaten Alex alive more often...but in the past it was blamed on the WR's. It's because he won't make that downfield throw to an NFL open receiver. Versus the better defenses, all you're going to get is tight windows.

And then this comes all back to the "he's limited" conclusion. He can pretty up all the stats for you, but his on-field play is limited.

so basically your rebuttal is that Smith doesn't pass your eye test.

Not just mine. Like I said, we will see how much he commands in trade or free agency if we let him go. Smart coaches don't bench a top 10 QB, especially one that isn't old. Unless Harbaugh is an idiot.

Don't forget, the game to game stats show Alex as inconsistent.
[ Edited by Joecool on Jan 11, 2013 at 2:50 PM ]
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by drakan:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by drakan:
W-L Record
Alex Smith 6-2
Colin Kaepernick 5-2-1

Completion Percentage
Alex Smith 70.2%
Colin Kaepernick 62.4%

Average Yards per Game
Alex Smith: 207
Colin Kaepernick: 215

Both had the same receivers to work with. Since you're insinuating that Smith only makes easy passes while Kaepernick is launching bombs downfield. Why bother with the difficult passes when you can just make easy completions since both yield pretty much the same result.

They don't yield the same results. Smith's game has been inconsistent game to game. His game has also vastly dropped off when he's played better defenses. Like I said, the stats will not show why Colin is more dangerous to a top ranked defense. Top ranked defenses have eaten Alex alive more often...but in the past it was blamed on the WR's. It's because he won't make that downfield throw to an NFL open receiver. Versus the better defenses, all you're going to get is tight windows.

And then this comes all back to the "he's limited" conclusion. He can pretty up all the stats for you, but his on-field play is limited.

so basically your rebuttal is that Smith doesn't pass your eye test.

Not just mine. Like I said, we will see how much he commands in trade or free agency if we let him go. Smart coaches don't bench a top 10 QB, especially one that isn't old. Unless Harbaugh is an idiot.

everyone agrees that Harbaugh took a huge gamble benching Smith. Will his gamble pay off? We'll find out tomorrow night.
Originally posted by Allx9er:
Unbelievable.

Can you be more... specific? What's unbelievable?
Alex Smith someday will be the most sought after head coach like Sean Payton. Payton was never the poster child for good qb play but what he lacks in skills, he makes up for it with his brains. The way he conducted Camp Alex last year was a sign that his true calling is coaching. The way he mentored Kaep even when his starting job was on the line was pure class. But as a qb, he'll never be that sexy pick because of his tendency to play it safe most of the time.
[ Edited by Grifter420 on Jan 11, 2013 at 3:00 PM ]
Originally posted by Grifter420:
Alex Smith someday will be the most sought after head coach like Sean Payton. Payton was never the poster child for good qb play but what he lacks in skills, he makes up for it with his brains. The way he conducted Camp Alex last year was a sign that his true calling is coaching. The way he mentored Kaep even when his starting job was on the line was pure class. But as a qb, he'll never be that sexy pick because of his tendency to play it safe most of the time.

He may possibly make a well-rounded coach. Dude would mix Pistol, Spread and WCO. He will make sure he is in the NFC West to give Harbaugh nightmares.

Nevermind, I take that back. He's Coordinator material but he's not head coach material. Head coach requires making tough executive decisions and being the bad guy. That is not Alex Smith. He will be like Norv Turner.
[ Edited by Joecool on Jan 11, 2013 at 4:03 PM ]
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