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QB position up for competition next year?

Originally posted by fister30:
(f)x=Alex(run+5yardout-throwaway)+defense/2

or

PEYTON!!!

honestly how many times has he done that this year?
  • dj43
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 20,155
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Not enough. The coaches too busy game planning, traveling from week to with different opponents. No, I don't see it as significant as a full camp.

I don't know. Seems pretty careless to draft a raw player early in the 2nd round, a QB even, and not invest time into grounding his fundamentals so he's more ready for next year.

It is true that coaches do not have time to spend on fundamentals during the season. That is why the off-season and TC is so important. Geep Chryst likely spent some time with him along the way but we are now learning the Chryst was a big part of the weekly game plan as well. He was the guy who called QB9, the rollout that Alex scored on against NO.

I expect to see CK get a lot of run in TC next summer if for no other reason than in case Alex is injured. It would have been a disaster had he been forced into playing this season.
Originally posted by susweel:
Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.


Your sure it's not a strength of Smith? Maybe it was the lack of quality Wide Receivers, coupled with a shortened training camp?
  • mike
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,827
Originally posted by eastie:
Originally posted by susweel:
Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.


Your sure it's not a strength of Smith? Maybe it was the lack of quality Wide Receivers, coupled with a shortened training camp?
They'd be quality receivers if they had hands on their feet.
Originally posted by mike:
Originally posted by eastie:
Originally posted by susweel:
Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.


Your sure it's not a strength of Smith? Maybe it was the lack of quality Wide Receivers, coupled with a shortened training camp?
They'd be quality receivers if they had hands on their feet.

solution?

Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by vaden:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by Shaj:
Our conservative offense is a function of the QB's capabilities. Our QB play is also therefore not a function of our conservative offense. The test is really simple: If we had Brees, Rodgers, or Manning, would our offense still be conservative? Not a chance in hell. We'd have a wide open offense and we would have gone to the SB with roller skates on. The conclusion is fairly obvious.

our conservative offense is a function of the head coaches philosophy. Ever watch a Stanford game? (i know the answer).
ive beens aying this forever

they will ignore this and say that same ting again in a different thread

Exactly. Dilfer was trying to explain the same thing to Colin Cowherd on his radio show earlier this week, and how the combination of Harbaugh's style and our limited personnel has led to disaster on 3rd downs.




Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.

I agree. I don't dont get this whole conservative offense is what Harbaugh is about. I was at the Stanford vs V Tech game. He ran the ball and threw quite a few times. I see a balanced offense, not a conservative. Whatever works he will do. Sorry you don't have a QB with Heismann hopes with a conservative offense. Conservative would be what Nick Saban at Alabama does.

If we ever get a star QB who ever it is, I would bet the Condo(dont own a house lol) that our offense would not look like how it is with Smith is in.

I think it would look the same, but that QB would be making the plays Alex Smith passed up [pun intended].

Meh. I see a balanced attack with Stanford. Of course they run the ball, but they do air it out also. I just think it depends who they play. But I definitely agree Smith is timid and wont try to make the big play unless its clearly open. You know how when VD has the LB beat by like 5 steps? lol

this is a horrible argument. Smith made countless throws this season in tight coverage. Stop making things up to support weak arguments. I can't believe how the rats have come back onto the ship after a pretty peaceful regular season.
[ Edited by dtcomposer on Jan 26, 2012 at 10:37 PM ]
  • mike
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,827
Originally posted by dtcomposer:
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by vaden:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by Shaj:
Our conservative offense is a function of the QB's capabilities. Our QB play is also therefore not a function of our conservative offense. The test is really simple: If we had Brees, Rodgers, or Manning, would our offense still be conservative? Not a chance in hell. We'd have a wide open offense and we would have gone to the SB with roller skates on. The conclusion is fairly obvious.

our conservative offense is a function of the head coaches philosophy. Ever watch a Stanford game? (i know the answer).
ive beens aying this forever

they will ignore this and say that same ting again in a different thread

Exactly. Dilfer was trying to explain the same thing to Colin Cowherd on his radio show earlier this week, and how the combination of Harbaugh's style and our limited personnel has led to disaster on 3rd downs.




Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.

I agree. I don't dont get this whole conservative offense is what Harbaugh is about. I was at the Stanford vs V Tech game. He ran the ball and threw quite a few times. I see a balanced offense, not a conservative. Whatever works he will do. Sorry you don't have a QB with Heismann hopes with a conservative offense. Conservative would be what Nick Saban at Alabama does.

If we ever get a star QB who ever it is, I would bet the Condo(dont own a house lol) that our offense would not look like how it is with Smith is in.

I think it would look the same, but that QB would be making the plays Alex Smith passed up [pun intended].

Meh. I see a balanced attack with Stanford. Of course they run the ball, but they do air it out also. I just think it depends who they play. But I definitely agree Smith is timid and wont try to make the big play unless its clearly open. You know how when VD has the LB beat by like 5 steps? lol

this is a horrible argument. Smith made countless throws this season in tight coverage. Stop making things up to support weak arguments. I can't believe how the rats have come back onto the ship after a pretty peaceful regular season.
I can only remember a few times, one being the game winning throw to vernon against the saints, where he really looked comfortable winging the ball into tight coverage. It might have also been that he knew it was "vernon or no one" and so he's not having to do multiple reads while worrying about potentially having pressure and having to run out of the pocket or throw the ball away.

Only time will tell whether his lack of success with throwing to crabtree and other WRs especially in that last game of the season was because of the injuries at the position, lack of chemistry, lack of training camp, whatever. Or if he's just not great at throwing guys open. Watch a brady or a rodgers confidently force balls into tight spots and then compare that to the lobs alex throws most of the time.

He has done some great things for us this season, but I also can't just overlook stats like 1 for 13 on third downs, only a couple throws to wide receivers, all the 3 and outs...It's still a lot of winning "despite" Alex much of the time, and you can't get all the turnovers and great field advantages all of the time.
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by vaden:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by Shaj:
Our conservative offense is a function of the QB's capabilities. Our QB play is also therefore not a function of our conservative offense. The test is really simple: If we had Brees, Rodgers, or Manning, would our offense still be conservative? Not a chance in hell. We'd have a wide open offense and we would have gone to the SB with roller skates on. The conclusion is fairly obvious.

our conservative offense is a function of the head coaches philosophy. Ever watch a Stanford game? (i know the answer).
ive beens aying this forever

they will ignore this and say that same ting again in a different thread

Exactly. Dilfer was trying to explain the same thing to Colin Cowherd on his radio show earlier this week, and how the combination of Harbaugh's style and our limited personnel has led to disaster on 3rd downs.




Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.

I agree. I don't dont get this whole conservative offense is what Harbaugh is about. I was at the Stanford vs V Tech game. He ran the ball and threw quite a few times. I see a balanced offense, not a conservative. Whatever works he will do. Sorry you don't have a QB with Heismann hopes with a conservative offense. Conservative would be what Nick Saban at Alabama does.

If we ever get a star QB who ever it is, I would bet the Condo(dont own a house lol) that our offense would not look like how it is with Smith is in.

I think it would look the same, but that QB would be making the plays Alex Smith passed up [pun intended].

Meh. I see a balanced attack with Stanford. Of course they run the ball, but they do air it out also. I just think it depends who they play. But I definitely agree Smith is timid and wont try to make the big play unless its clearly open. You know how when VD has the LB beat by like 5 steps? lol

Right, like that last drive against the Chargers. Davis wide open twice. Oh wait.
If the niners do go after Peyton they would have to get another legitimate WR to go alongside Crabs, Morgan and Davis/Walker. Player X, those three and Kyle Williams would make a decent WR corp. Most people don't want to think about this right now but Williams is explosive after the catch and he has good hands.

I can't imagine what Gore/Hunter would do if teams had to play pass first against our running game.
Originally posted by mike:
Originally posted by dtcomposer:
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by 305Niner:
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by vaden:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by Shaj:
Our conservative offense is a function of the QB's capabilities. Our QB play is also therefore not a function of our conservative offense. The test is really simple: If we had Brees, Rodgers, or Manning, would our offense still be conservative? Not a chance in hell. We'd have a wide open offense and we would have gone to the SB with roller skates on. The conclusion is fairly obvious.

our conservative offense is a function of the head coaches philosophy. Ever watch a Stanford game? (i know the answer).
ive beens aying this forever

they will ignore this and say that same ting again in a different thread

Exactly. Dilfer was trying to explain the same thing to Colin Cowherd on his radio show earlier this week, and how the combination of Harbaugh's style and our limited personnel has led to disaster on 3rd downs.




Harbaugh did not run a conservative offense at USD. He uses his players to their strengths and clearly having an aggressive offense is not a strength of Smith.

I agree. I don't dont get this whole conservative offense is what Harbaugh is about. I was at the Stanford vs V Tech game. He ran the ball and threw quite a few times. I see a balanced offense, not a conservative. Whatever works he will do. Sorry you don't have a QB with Heismann hopes with a conservative offense. Conservative would be what Nick Saban at Alabama does.

If we ever get a star QB who ever it is, I would bet the Condo(dont own a house lol) that our offense would not look like how it is with Smith is in.

I think it would look the same, but that QB would be making the plays Alex Smith passed up [pun intended].

Meh. I see a balanced attack with Stanford. Of course they run the ball, but they do air it out also. I just think it depends who they play. But I definitely agree Smith is timid and wont try to make the big play unless its clearly open. You know how when VD has the LB beat by like 5 steps? lol

this is a horrible argument. Smith made countless throws this season in tight coverage. Stop making things up to support weak arguments. I can't believe how the rats have come back onto the ship after a pretty peaceful regular season.
I can only remember a few times, one being the game winning throw to vernon against the saints, where he really looked comfortable winging the ball into tight coverage. It might have also been that he knew it was "vernon or no one" and so he's not having to do multiple reads while worrying about potentially having pressure and having to run out of the pocket or throw the ball away.

Only time will tell whether his lack of success with throwing to crabtree and other WRs especially in that last game of the season was because of the injuries at the position, lack of chemistry, lack of training camp, whatever. Or if he's just not great at throwing guys open. Watch a brady or a rodgers confidently force balls into tight spots and then compare that to the lobs alex throws most of the time.

He has done some great things for us this season, but I also can't just overlook stats like 1 for 13 on third downs, only a couple throws to wide receivers, all the 3 and outs...It's still a lot of winning "despite" Alex much of the time, and you can't get all the turnovers and great field advantages all of the time.

I saw exactly what you saw regarding throwing in tight coverage. The biggest one against the Saints. The word "countless" used to describe how many times he had did this is a gross exaggeration. Its not surprising coming from the people who love Alex instead of taking a logical look at his play.

Our defense is what keeps us in the games. Any other team would get beat quite easily if they had our rate of 3rd conversion and redzone flops. But its the WR and play calling. Alex Smith never does anything wrong in the eyes of these people.

I have an idea. How about at least trying to see what our WR's to look like with a new QB before writing them off?
Originally posted by fister30:
If the niners do go after Peyton they would have to get another legitimate WR to go alongside Crabs, Morgan and Davis/Walker. Player X, those three and Kyle Williams would make a decent WR corp. Most people don't want to think about this right now but Williams is explosive after the catch and he has good hands.

I can't imagine what Gore/Hunter would do if teams had to play pass first against our running game.

I dont think its a smart move to go after Peyton. The neck injury is serious. We were one game away from the superbowl this year. All we need is to sign everybody on defense and get a QB that is not scared to make the play on a consistent basis. We quite honestly DONT need Peyton. We really dont. People to this day really do not understand how tough this defense is.

We can add another WR definitely for depth. I like Malcom Floyd in the draft if we could get him. Not too crazy about breaking the bank for a FA WR. It would be better to try to upgrade the QB position for insurance if Kaep's development is slow.
Originally posted by dtcomposer:
I can't believe how the rats have come back onto the ship after a pretty peaceful regular season.

Most of it is just to keep a spark going through the offseason.

If people can't rip on Alex, then the WZ essentially becomes a graveyard. It's the lifeblood.
Alex is not the most naturally gifted QB. His confidence and progress seems to grow slowly and incrementally. But the good news is, he is a workaholic committed to getting better. It is reasonable to expect that he'll be a little bit better next year than he was this year. This year we saw him finally using his legs more effectively to pick up some first downs and to get out of collapsing pockets. I agree that the next item he needs to get better at is "throwing receivers open". I think you saw some attempts at this earlier in the year with Braylon Edwards before he was hurt. And having Kaepernick developing behind him, probably a more gifted and raw athlete, is going to keep Smith from backsliding and getting complacent. Whether it's Smith or Kaepernick, we win. I think spending a boatload on Manning would be foolish. Spend it instead on better WRs and spend an entire offseason working with them.
^ I think his confidence in himself is fine. He just needs to believe in the receivers around him. Any hesitation or reluctance is not really about his reading the coverage or whether he can fit the ball in. The hesitation/reluctance is in believing whether the target will make the strong play on the ball.

Give him quality receivers and he'll show The Gunslinger.