ESPN - 49ers can succeed in Play Offs without great QB

Originally posted by NinerNation:
the ravens did it in 2000 with dilfer and a top defense

And Smith is much better than Dilfer.

Originally posted by Memphis9er:

Originally posted by NinerNation:
the ravens did it in 2000 with dilfer and a top defense

And Smith is much better than Dilfer.

and our defense is much better than the 2000 ravens






























jk

Originally posted by Memphis9er:

Originally posted by NinerNation:
the ravens did it in 2000 with dilfer and a top defense

And Smith is much better than Dilfer.

Davis, Walker, Gore, Hunter, Crabtree, Braylon ...I would say we have better weapons too

Originally posted by Jcool:

Originally posted by verb1der:
The 85 bears did it, I see similarities got damnit!

"god dammit"

Gott is German...didn't check to see where verb is living now but...

Originally posted by Baugh_Area:
It's a good thing we don't have to find out!

I see what you did there.

The Patriots did it with Brady. Everyone thinks that Brady was elite from the beginning, but he wasn't. The first Superbowl, he was alot like Alex now. As long as Alex keeps making the big plays, and can improve every week in some aspects there is no reason that he can't lead them deep in the playoffs. I would actually say that Alex is better than Brady was for that first superbowl win, though obviously Brady has progressed and is now much better.

Haven't checked the stats (what's new), but I thought I remember the Raven's D being a turnover machine. It seemed like their D could score at any moment. I dont have the same feeling about our D yet as good as it is. Who knows by the end of the season though. We still need an Ed Reed.

Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
Brad Johnson

Eli Manning

Plenty of super bowl winners with a great defense and a QB who simply doesn't make mistakes.

I don't think you can compare Eli to Alex. Brad is a fair comparison, so is Trent Dilfer. Who was the Bear's QB when they went recently? Can't remember, but since he's not a household name, that probably means he's a fair comparison too.

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
Brad Johnson

Eli Manning

Plenty of super bowl winners with a great defense and a QB who simply doesn't make mistakes.

I don't think you can compare Eli to Alex. Brad is a fair comparison, so is Trent Dilfer. Who was the Bear's QB when they went recently? Can't remember, but since he's not a household name, that probably means he's a fair comparison too.

Rex Grossman. Alex has always been better than Rex Grossman.

Eli has not really been very good. He's gotten better the last few years, and he usually puts up 3,000+ yards and 20 TD's, but he also throws a ton of picks. The Super Bowl year he threw 20 ints. Last year he threw 25. However, he does have the same career int % than Smith, and for his career has completed only 58% of his passes, roughly the same as Smith, and they have similar YPA numbers, especially if you discount Smith's 2007, which was pathetic due mostly to a torn shoulder.

So, absolutely you can compare Eli to Smith. they are similar in many key statistics, and both have improved every year they've been in the league. I think most people would take Eli without a second thought if given the choice, but in the end he's a second tier quarterback.

The term "great" is cloudy and way over-worked. I use it sparingly. Roders is excellent BUT greatness comes over time. PManning is a great QB for 10years of very high quality performace.

The SBowl can be won w/ a good, solid QB and NOT w/an average or below average QB. Alex will have to keep improving and we'll get there. Accuracy is his area to improve upon and he has done very well in reducing the back-breaking turn-overs.

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
Brad Johnson

Eli Manning

Plenty of super bowl winners with a great defense and a QB who simply doesn't make mistakes.

I don't think you can compare Eli to Alex. Brad is a fair comparison, so is Trent Dilfer. Who was the Bear's QB when they went recently? Can't remember, but since he's not a household name, that probably means he's a fair comparison too.

Rex Grossman. Alex has always been better than Rex Grossman.

Eli has not really been very good. He's gotten better the last few years, and he usually puts up 3,000+ yards and 20 TD's, but he also throws a ton of picks. The Super Bowl year he threw 20 ints. Last year he threw 25. However, he does have the same career int % than Smith, and for his career has completed only 58% of his passes, roughly the same as Smith, and they have similar YPA numbers, especially if you discount Smith's 2007, which was pathetic due mostly to a torn shoulder.

So, absolutely you can compare Eli to Smith. they are similar in many key statistics, and both have improved every year they've been in the league. I think most people would take Eli without a second thought if given the choice, but in the end he's a second tier quarterback.

Fair enough, but you also need to compare W-L ratio and passing yards. I think the comparison becomes very different at that point....

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
Brad Johnson

Eli Manning

Plenty of super bowl winners with a great defense and a QB who simply doesn't make mistakes.

I don't think you can compare Eli to Alex. Brad is a fair comparison, so is Trent Dilfer. Who was the Bear's QB when they went recently? Can't remember, but since he's not a household name, that probably means he's a fair comparison too.

Rex Grossman. Alex has always been better than Rex Grossman.

Eli has not really been very good. He's gotten better the last few years, and he usually puts up 3,000+ yards and 20 TD's, but he also throws a ton of picks. The Super Bowl year he threw 20 ints. Last year he threw 25. However, he does have the same career int % than Smith, and for his career has completed only 58% of his passes, roughly the same as Smith, and they have similar YPA numbers, especially if you discount Smith's 2007, which was pathetic due mostly to a torn shoulder.

So, absolutely you can compare Eli to Smith. they are similar in many key statistics, and both have improved every year they've been in the league. I think most people would take Eli without a second thought if given the choice, but in the end he's a second tier quarterback.

Fair enough, but you also need to compare W-L ratio and passing yards. I think the comparison becomes very different at that point....

yeah, i said "many key statistics." Eli certainly throws for a lot more yards, and a lot more TDs, and has won a lot more games, which is why i think most people would take him over Alex. However, since coming back from the shoulder injury, Smith's YPG is close to Eli's career average--221 for Eli, around 215 for Alex in 09 and 10, and Alex's TD % is around what Eli's was pre-Super Bowl. Since the Super Bowl, Eli has gotten much better in a lot of categories, except INT's, which is what really keeps him from being elite, IMO. Eli has improved a lot the last three years and is still second tier. Alex has improved at a similar pace and is still third tier, but the results of this season might change that.

Wins, obviously, being a team effort, and the fact that Eli has played in nearly twice as many games as Smith, I didn't see much point in discussing--though wins do certainly fall on a QB, fairly or not. However, just food for thought: Eli has engineered 15 4th QTR comebacks and 18 game winning drives in 112 games, including 3 and 4 this year, respectively, and Smith has engineered 7 and 9 in 61 games, including 3 and 3 this year.

Originally posted by fryet:
The point of Sando's article isn't that you need a perfect defense to win, it is that strong passing teams often lose to the more balanced team with an average QB. From the article:

Peyton Manning's Colts and Tom Brady's Patriots lost to a New York Jets team that has generally sought to run the ball, play strong defense and minimize the impact of its quarterback. Mark Sanchez was mediocre against the Colts and good against the Patriots. When the Jets finally lost to Pittsburgh in the championship round, Sanchez finished the game with 233 yards, two touchdowns and a 102.2 NFL passer rating. The Steelers held a 166-70 edge in rushing and scored with a fumble return, helping them win despite no touchdowns, two interceptions and a 35.5 passer rating from Ben Roethlisberger.

Very good post, exactly. I really don't like all these posts about playoffs though, we need to be humble and work hard. We almost lost those games in Philly, Detroit. We could easily be 4-3 right now.

Every team we are going to play is an NFL team. Even the Lambs or the Turds could possibly beat us if they get lucky. The Redskins are better than their record, they play in a division that has some of the biggest budgets in the NFL. Mike Shanahan is not an idiot, he learned a lot of what he knows right here. Even if his owner is a b*****d and he is being crazy by putting his unproven son in charge of playcalling, he is no Steve Spurrier running up the score against community colleges and thinking he is some kind of genius.

At the same time, you'll notice John and Jim Harbaugh, while respecting the hell out of each other, don't hire each other and make it some sort of insider family thing. So there is some deep dysfunction in Washington, and if we are on our game we should win.

Originally posted by HessianDud:
Rex Grossman. Alex has always been better than Rex Grossman.

Eli has not really been very good. He's gotten better the last few years, and he usually puts up 3,000+ yards and 20 TD's, but he also throws a ton of picks. The Super Bowl year he threw 20 ints. Last year he threw 25. However, he does have the same career int % than Smith, and for his career has completed only 58% of his passes, roughly the same as Smith, and they have similar YPA numbers, especially if you discount Smith's 2007, which was pathetic due mostly to a torn shoulder.

So, absolutely you can compare Eli to Smith. they are similar in many key statistics, and both have improved every year they've been in the league. I think most people would take Eli without a second thought if given the choice, but in the end he's a second tier quarterback.

I agree that Grossman sucks more than Alex, but I wouldn't say Alex has "always" been better than him.

Eli is a good QB(not great). What do you mean by "a ton of picks"? I think a better gauge is TD/INT ratio, and Eli has a 169-118 and Smith has a 60-55. He also has a higher career pass completion %. Eli has been able to do this while throwing many more deep passes than Alex Smith. And, we all know that deep passes have a much lower % of completion than short passes do.

Eli and Alex also have completely different skill-sets. Eli has a strong arm, good accuracy, low scrambling ability, and at times makes poor decisions. Alex has a average arm, average accuracy (at best), great scrambling ability, and good decision making.

I guess you can compare the two, but I don't think it is a good comparison. You are comparing a Super Bowl MVP with a QB that has never made the playoffs. I think, that sentence explains it all.

Originally posted by 8to80:

Originally posted by HessianDud:
Rex Grossman. Alex has always been better than Rex Grossman.

Eli has not really been very good. He's gotten better the last few years, and he usually puts up 3,000+ yards and 20 TD's, but he also throws a ton of picks. The Super Bowl year he threw 20 ints. Last year he threw 25. However, he does have the same career int % than Smith, and for his career has completed only 58% of his passes, roughly the same as Smith, and they have similar YPA numbers, especially if you discount Smith's 2007, which was pathetic due mostly to a torn shoulder.

So, absolutely you can compare Eli to Smith. they are similar in many key statistics, and both have improved every year they've been in the league. I think most people would take Eli without a second thought if given the choice, but in the end he's a second tier quarterback.

I agree that Grossman sucks more than Alex, but I wouldn't say Alex has "always" been better than him.

Eli is a good QB(not great). What do you mean by "a ton of picks"? I think a better gauge is TD/INT ratio, and Eli has a 169-118 and Smith has a 60-55. He also has a higher career pass completion %. Eli has been able to do this while throwing many more deep passes than Alex Smith. And, we all know that deep passes have a much lower % of completion than short passes do.

Eli and Alex also have completely different skill-sets. Eli has a strong arm, good accuracy, low scrambling ability, and at times makes poor decisions. Alex has a average arm, average accuracy (at best), great scrambling ability, and good decision making.

I guess you can compare the two, but I don't think it is a good comparison. You are comparing a Super Bowl MVP with a QB that has never made the playoffs. I think, that sentence explains it all.

^^ his career stats do not support that. I would say average on both. Agree with everything else. What he is above average at is being a student of the game (which of course is meaningless if not translated to on the field resuls) and being a model team player. Right now (and not the prior 6 years), he is also above average at not making dumb mistakes, but that is at the expense of being below average in passing yards and big plays.