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Ray McDonald wants to be a starter, why the hell shouldn't he be?

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Wow... great bump. That was a lot of fun to read through again, and hilarious to read some of the opinions that just burnt to a crisp.

Yup. Soooo glad they got rid of Franklin.
Originally posted by NinerPrideinNJ:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Wow... great bump. That was a lot of fun to read through again, and hilarious to read some of the opinions that just burnt to a crisp.

Yup. Soooo glad they got rid of Franklin.

... and we could be saying the same thing next year or the next about Goldson. Maybe.. maybe not. Glad I don't have to make that call.. cuz no way am I paying him 8 mil per with a hefty SB.
  • AmpLee
  • Hall of Fame
  • Posts: 16,917
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

lawlz
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

lawlz
double lawlz
Ray Mac was slowed by a nagging injury the majority of the season, and still played at a high level

Now with a healthy Ray Mac and RJF sharing snaps, our D-Line will be strong and get a good push and free up our LB's to make plays
Originally posted by WookieOftheYear:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

lawlz
double lawlz

Triple lawlz!
Originally posted by PA49ersfan:
Originally posted by WookieOftheYear:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

lawlz
double lawlz

Triple lawlz!

wow talk about being wrong...
  • Chief
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Originally posted by Rizvi49er:
wow talk about being wrong...


I'm not trying to be an a*****e but isn't Maddog usually very opinionated and often very wrong?
This is a great bump. It's so cool to go back and read your original assessments/opinions esp. when you were right; right along with so many other fans.

This is just more proof that this argument is fallible and it's important to do your own research and draw your own conclusions: "Are you a coach? I think not...I'll trust the coaches more than I'll trust you...a fan!"

Trust on brother...trust on.

PS: Sometimes coaches are TOO close to the situation and their lack of objectivity can hurt a team. And from a FO perspective, sometimes coaches are forced to play inferior or under-performing players b/c of $ or draft position, fan pressure, etc. In short, draw your own conclusions...if you do your homework, more often than not, you'll be right and this is a perfect example of this. Thanks for bumping!

And to our CURRENT coaching staff and FO...thank YOU for doing your own homework and drawing your own conclusions! We've still got some concerns about you and skepticism but I'm sure you wouldn't have it any other way...either way...we're very happy with the direction were are heading (and for what we've accomplished already).
[ Edited by NCommand on Jun 28, 2012 at 12:50 PM ]
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Nothing wrong with that attitude, but the real concern is how he will hold up at DE in a 3-4 on running downs. that's why he seemed to play more on passing downs. I just think he's in the wrong scheme. But the coaching staff isn't gonna have time to decide if he's starting with this shortened off season. Him Soap, and Smith doesn't make for a good run stopping 3-4 d line imo. Can't be mad at a guy b/c he just wants to play. I'd like to keep him.

I'd have a problem if that wasn't his attitude. A player should always be hungry for the next tier. The knocks on him is against the run and his health. a 3-4 DE isn't a primary pass rusher...he's a space eater. he opens things up for the LBs. I wonder if Ray wouldn't do better on a 4-3 team. That said, I hope we keep him.

The bolded isn't always the case. It depends on the scheme as to how each DL is utilized. All roles are not the same on each 3-4 scheme. Unless Ray is much stronger on initial contact than he was, we would be left with all three of our DL as 1-gappers. Maybe that can work in today's NFL. Last year, we had Justin and Aubrayo doing more 1-gapping while Sop was more of our space-eating plugger. I am not sure if things would work well if all 3 DL are 1-gapping. Maybe Sopo would then be more of the plugger inside while both DEs 1-gap.

Defense gave a variety of looks..but it all seemed to work out very well.
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Nothing wrong with that attitude, but the real concern is how he will hold up at DE in a 3-4 on running downs. that's why he seemed to play more on passing downs. I just think he's in the wrong scheme. But the coaching staff isn't gonna have time to decide if he's starting with this shortened off season. Him Soap, and Smith doesn't make for a good run stopping 3-4 d line imo. Can't be mad at a guy b/c he just wants to play. I'd like to keep him.

I'd have a problem if that wasn't his attitude. A player should always be hungry for the next tier. The knocks on him is against the run and his health. a 3-4 DE isn't a primary pass rusher...he's a space eater. he opens things up for the LBs. I wonder if Ray wouldn't do better on a 4-3 team. That said, I hope we keep him.

The bolded isn't always the case. It depends on the scheme as to how each DL is utilized. All roles are not the same on each 3-4 scheme. Unless Ray is much stronger on initial contact than he was, we would be left with all three of our DL as 1-gappers. Maybe that can work in today's NFL. Last year, we had Justin and Aubrayo doing more 1-gapping while Sop was more of our space-eating plugger. I am not sure if things would work well if all 3 DL are 1-gapping. Maybe Sopo would then be more of the plugger inside while both DEs 1-gap.

Defense gave a variety of looks..but it all seemed to work out very well.

Oh, I agree. I was actually surprised as I re-watched these games and noted that Sopoaga was often... not 1-gapping, but playing 2-gap. We definitely mixed things up a bit from the expected. With a full offseason, Fangio can really get creative!
Originally posted by PA49ersfan:
Originally posted by WookieOftheYear:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

lawlz
double lawlz

Triple lawlz!

More hogwash from a self proclaimed expert.

Anyone could see his burst and explosiveness was there. The injuries are what hurt him.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

Really bad post!
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by PA49ersfan:
Originally posted by WookieOftheYear:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Crazy talk has overrun the board.

Do we honestly want a 6'3", 290 pounder starting on the strong side of the line in our 3-4 defense? A guy who has major problems with his knees in the past, and is best suited as a situational tackle when the team lines up in the 4-3 on passing downs. Zero sacks.

The bottom line is that he is a maxed-out, backup 4-3 undertackle, not a starter on the strongside in a 3-4 defense.

lawlz
double lawlz

Triple lawlz!

More hogwash from a self proclaimed expert.

Anyone could see his burst and explosiveness was there. The injuries are what hurt him.

Damn straight. I've whiffed on a few prognostications, as we all have, in my day. But I was spot on here. Glad McDonald's playmaking ability back then wasn't a mirage.
I can't believe I was defending Lawson....