Jimmy Garoppolo, QB, Los Angeles Rams

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:
You seem to rely mainly on stats and quotes from the media. I'll continue to rely on a combination of stats + what I see with my own eyes in watching the game closely, especially Garoppolo in watching him closely since he joined the league as a Patriot up until the game this past Sunday. Adding to that, I'll also include what I've heard about Garoppolo from what I consider "football people", i.e., former coaches, players, etc., who have been there, done that, and provide credible insight.

I like what I've seen from Garoppolo, the progress he's made and continues to make, from his early days in this league up until now. I also really like the foundation/coaching he has under him. Did he have a great game Sunday? No, not at all, but he wasn't terrible - I thought he was so-so (he & the team were half a Qtr. away from a SB win Sunday - yes, you have to finish).

I, along with many fellow long-time Niners fans, have a pretty high standard at QB having watched closely Montana and then Young. That said, you immediately keep reality in mind in knowing most QBs coming through aren't anywhere near the level of a Montana or Young - unfortunately, we've seen this proven too much in watching this team during the recent down years.

Not saying Garoppolo will be as good as those guys - not comparing him to them, especially at this early stage of his career - but after 29 total NFL games as a starting NFL QB, I clearly continue to see the overall QB talent, competitiveness, & big picture with him in getting better & better, especially in working with Shanahan. Count me as one who's extremely glad he's leading this team next year and beyond. No one can be 100% right, 100% sure at this point. But just providing context & perspective re: my point of view on him from being a long-time fan of this team and the game of football.

Since your thinking and mine are nowhere near being in the same ballpark, we'll leave it as agree to completely disagree.

Nothing you said here i disagree with tbh, so we can agree.. I don't think anything I've necessarily posted argues the points you made in the above..

To be as transparent and responsive as I can be, ill respond to you paragraph by paragraph.

Your 1st paragraph - I don't know what you are hearing from these guys since you didn't post it, However I assume they must be saying things differently than the stats and media heads I have posted.

Your 2nd paragraph - Agreed, he has made great progress. I recall looking over to my family and even saying, if we had week 1 Jimmy G compared to week 16 Jimmy G we wouldn't stand a chance.

Your 3rd paragraph - Most definitly, while it is hard to find players like Mahomes, Brady, Brees, Big Ben etc, they are out there, and just because it is hard to find them, doesn't necessarily mean you settle, you continue to look while using the best QB available which is jimmy G.

Your 4th paragraph - I agree. He hasn't had even 2 full seasons of starts, but he has had 7 years in this league, is 28 years old, got to learn behind arguably the best head coach of all time and the best QB of all time for 4 years... I am definitely not saying "he can't improve" but exactly how much can he truly improve? How much ceiling does jimmy really have left? I can see him shoring up faulty mistakes like the meme from the SB with his eyes closed throwing the interception. Those things can be coached. To me he simply doesn't have the raw skill to perform at a level where he will elevate his team. He reminds me of a player who simply needs everything around him to be perfect in order to succeed at a high level that the NFL demands.

Originally posted by S41MAN:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Funny, seems like the D choking was the reason we lost. Garoppolo got them a 10 pt lead with 8 mins left.

Why are only 1 of every 10 football fans smart enough to remember that Garoppolo has made as many career starts as Josh Allen? Hes not a finished product. Shanahan should have called all plays to Kittle and Mostert in the 4th. Dont get in a position where you need your QB to drop a dime right over the deep coverage to a WR.

Defense choked, but most were expecting us to score than 20 points to win that game anyway. You do realize the dude that just beat us was a second year kid right? I don't want to hear that "lack of experience" BS when Jimmy is missing the easiest reads and stuff he was hitting all season. He simply choked the fourth quarter. It doesn't take away his other performances, but it's a fact.

Guys like Kittle were wide the f**k open, watch Baldinger's clips on it, tired of hearing guys weren't open. Even on the play to Sanders, Bourne was wide open over the middle of the field and Jimmy chose to go deep.

I just don't understand how people think Jimmy is some top tier or deserves less blame that Shanahan while simultaneously thinking Shanahan should just keep the ball out of hands and not trust him to do simple s**t. They were blitzing the f**k out of us, which Jimmy has killed all season and which means guys are going to be open. That's what teams mean when they say make Jimmy beat you, make them throw.

There's no doubt Jimmy played a mediocre game at best. He definitely missed some reads that you just can't miss and made some decisions you simply can't make if you expect to beat a team like the Chiefs. But he's not the first good QB to mess up in a big game:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000628679/article/ten-worst-playoff-performances-by-qbs-in-the-modern-era

And as much as sticking to the running game in the playoffs was the right strategic approach for those games, I think it hurt Garappolo— he just never found a rhythm in the superbowl, probably because he hadn't played many meaningful minutes since the win vs the Seahawks in late December. You could say a professional simply needs to rise to the occasion, but he's human. And I also think the talk in the media about Shanahan not trusting him probably got into his head as well.

He's a relatively inexperienced QB who came up small in his first big moment. It's definitely disappointing, but I think he's still got a very bright future ahead of him. We've just got to continue to ease him in.

And what other choice do we really have? Of all the QBs in the league I can only think of a few who I'd rather have— Mahomes, Jackson, maybe Watson. And right now only 1 of them has a superbowl ring and the other 2 flopped in the playoffs. And besides, we're not getting any of them and the draft is a crap shoot. So like it or not, Jimmy's our guy for at least the next year or two. And I for one think he can still be great, so cut the guy some slack.

Originally posted by genus49:
It was BS because in a game where apparently the refs were going to let people play that call shouldn't get made.

It was also a lot less egregious than what Rudolph did in OT vs the Saints - no call on that one.

No consistency and calls very one sided.

I was talking to someone about it as well, about how the call didn't exactly reflect the game that was being called... However we can't use a missed call in one game to justify a correct call in another, the two just don't go hand in hand. Completely different situations/games/referees.

That said, its simply just one of those things that sometimes it gets called, and other times it doesn't. I was pissed at the time about the call, but after a few days and like I said watching it again, he made pretty much two push offs and was called for the second one. It also wasn't a deal breaker to the game since we followed up by taking a 10 point lead afterwards. It was a call in a game just like any other and it was a textbook call, ok to be upset about it, hard to disagree with it.

Also, look where Kittle lined up on the play, TBH the play should've never even happened if we want to dive deeper into the should haves and shouldn't haves.

Some of these posters are reminding me that our QB situation is a lot better than most in the league. Aside from the elites and great QBs, Jimmy is a good QB who finally has a full season under his belt coming off an injury. If we do stick with jimmy i think we can still return to the SB, just depends on our teams health next season.

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

I like it - what I want to hear from a starting QB, especially after a tough SB game. Looking forward to seeing him & the team grow & improve from an excellent 2019-20 season & the SB experience!

Hear hear.

Originally posted by SBorBust:

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:
You seem to rely mainly on stats and quotes from the media. I'll continue to rely on a combination of stats + what I see with my own eyes in watching the game closely, especially Garoppolo in watching him closely since he joined the league as a Patriot up until the game this past Sunday. Adding to that, I'll also include what I've heard about Garoppolo from what I consider "football people", i.e., former coaches, players, etc., who have been there, done that, and provide credible insight.

I like what I've seen from Garoppolo, the progress he's made and continues to make, from his early days in this league up until now. I also really like the foundation/coaching he has under him. Did he have a great game Sunday? No, not at all, but he wasn't terrible - I thought he was so-so (he & the team were half a Qtr. away from a SB win Sunday - yes, you have to finish).

I, along with many fellow long-time Niners fans, have a pretty high standard at QB having watched closely Montana and then Young. That said, you immediately keep reality in mind in knowing most QBs coming through aren't anywhere near the level of a Montana or Young - unfortunately, we've seen this proven too much in watching this team during the recent down years.

Not saying Garoppolo will be as good as those guys - not comparing him to them, especially at this early stage of his career - but after 29 total NFL games as a starting NFL QB, I clearly continue to see the overall QB talent, competitiveness, & big picture with him in getting better & better, especially in working with Shanahan. Count me as one who's extremely glad he's leading this team next year and beyond. No one can be 100% right, 100% sure at this point. But just providing context & perspective re: my point of view on him from being a long-time fan of this team and the game of football.

Since your thinking and mine are nowhere near being in the same ballpark, we'll leave it as agree to completely disagree.

Nothing you said here i disagree with tbh, so we can agree.. I don't think anything I've necessarily posted argues the points you made in the above..

To be as transparent and responsive as I can be, ill respond to you paragraph by paragraph.

Your 1st paragraph - I don't know what you are hearing from these guys since you didn't post it, However I assume they must be saying things differently than the stats and media heads I have posted.

Your 2nd paragraph - Agreed, he has made great progress. I recall looking over to my family and even saying, if we had week 1 Jimmy G compared to week 16 Jimmy G we wouldn't stand a chance.

Your 3rd paragraph - Most definitly, while it is hard to find players like Mahomes, Brady, Brees, Big Ben etc, they are out there, and just because it is hard to find them, doesn't necessarily mean you settle, you continue to look while using the best QB available which is jimmy G.

Your 4th paragraph - I agree. He hasn't had even 2 full seasons of starts, but he has had 7 years in this league, is 28 years old, got to learn behind arguably the best head coach of all time and the best QB of all time for 4 years... I am definitely not saying "he can't improve" but exactly how much can he truly improve? How much ceiling does jimmy really have left? I can see him shoring up faulty mistakes like the meme from the SB with his eyes closed throwing the interception. Those things can be coached. To me he simply doesn't have the raw skill to perform at a level where he will elevate his team. He reminds me of a player who simply needs everything around him to be perfect in order to succeed at a high level that the NFL demands.

I will post once more on this and then moving on. First, though, I appreciate you taking the time to post this most recent response.

Going back and referring to my previous post, above, and in reading your reply here, I'll say it again we'll agree to completely disagree on Garoppolo and his potential & his future in leading this team - especially your last two sentences in bold. I believe he's the guy, I believe he has elevated this team in the past and will continue to do that more going forward, and I feel he's only going to get better and better.

Originally posted by Eduardo75:
I'm kinda wondering where that old Bob McKitrick style of O-Line coaching has gone. When he was there, you didn't see a lot of batted balls, from Montana or Young, both pretty similar heights to Jimmy, cause he taught the O-lineman to bury their helmets into the D-Lineman's groin area when they sensed them dropping back to bat a ball. Brings the arms down real quick.

Bob McKitrick was a big proponent of cut blocking, which is now seen as dirty and is illegal now.

Originally posted by SkyZer0:

I'll say what I said yesterday again: No QB besides Russell Wilson did more with worse pass protection than Jimmy Garoppolo this season. The "he isn't mobile" narrative just isn't correct. And the numbers also verify that the 49ers need to block better, esp on the interior https://t.co/oCV6c0KgZ4

— David Lombardi (@LombardiHimself) February 5, 2020

Yep, he covered foe bad line play for a long time.

Originally posted by SBorBust:

Nothing you said here i disagree with tbh, so we can agree.. I don't think anything I've necessarily posted argues the points you made in the above..

To be as transparent and responsive as I can be, ill respond to you paragraph by paragraph.

Your 1st paragraph - I don't know what you are hearing from these guys since you didn't post it, However I assume they must be saying things differently than the stats and media heads I have posted.

Your 2nd paragraph - Agreed, he has made great progress. I recall looking over to my family and even saying, if we had week 1 Jimmy G compared to week 16 Jimmy G we wouldn't stand a chance.

Your 3rd paragraph - Most definitly, while it is hard to find players like Mahomes, Brady, Brees, Big Ben etc, they are out there, and just because it is hard to find them, doesn't necessarily mean you settle, you continue to look while using the best QB available which is jimmy G.

Your 4th paragraph - I agree. He hasn't had even 2 full seasons of starts, but he has had 7 years in this league, is 28 years old, got to learn behind arguably the best head coach of all time and the best QB of all time for 4 years... I am definitely not saying "he can't improve" but exactly how much can he truly improve? How much ceiling does jimmy really have left? I can see him shoring up faulty mistakes like the meme from the SB with his eyes closed throwing the interception. Those things can be coached. To me he simply doesn't have the raw skill to perform at a level where he will elevate his team. He reminds me of a player who simply needs everything around him to be perfect in order to succeed at a high level that the NFL demands.

Emotions are a powerful thing, thats why I wont judge you to harshly on your opinion.

Jimmy may not be a superstar talent, but he is top 10 and definitely capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl victory.

He missed some throws and open WRs, so what. You cant just discount his lack of playing experience, lack of game time within shanahans scheme.

He makes one or two more easy throws, and we're the ones lifting the trophy.

Your requirements for a QB are exaggerated and flat out wrong.

How can you judge a person for what he is or isnt before his whole story is written?

We lost. Can we move on? Jimmy is here to stay, canning a QB for one game when he was statistically the best QB we've had in decades is stupid and will not happen. Get him better interior linemen and another weapon or two and finish what we started this year. Time for the offense to carry the defense. We will lose some key players but that doesnt mean we cant add more and have the offense be the anchor this year

Originally posted by Stanley:
Emotions are a powerful thing, thats why I wont judge you to harshly on your opinion.

Jimmy may not be a superstar talent, but he is top 10 and definitely capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl victory.

He missed some throws and open WRs, so what. You cant just discount his lack of playing experience, lack of game time within shanahans scheme.

He makes one or two more easy throws, and we're the ones lifting the trophy.

Your requirements for a QB are exaggerated and flat out wrong.

How can you judge a person for what he is or isnt before his whole story is written?

I don't think my requirements are exaggerated or wrong. If jimmy G played any real part in getting us to the superbowl in the first place (starting from the vikings game), and then he played how he played Sunday, I wouldn't be thinking this way. The fact of the matter is, our defense and running attack is mainly what got us to the show in the first place. Jimmy G only needed to complete the ball 6 times for 77 yards against green bay. Imagine knowing your going into an NFC championship game understanding your team is so good around you, you only need to complete 6 passes in order to win?

I'm not sure what you mean by how can you judge someone before their whole story is written? Are we not supposed to judge bad WR's and let them play till they are 35 because their story isn't full written yet and "could get" better. I see what you are trying to say though but it simply doesn't go hand in hand. Hes been in the league for 7 years, 4 of those learning behind brady and belicheck. After almost 30 starts and 7 years in the NFL you would see serious potential and raw talent seeping through him, and not the product we were given in the post-season.

I dont think my requirements are high either, I think others are too low. Someone argued with me recently about how good Jimmy G was in the washington redskins game in his "final 6minute drive" to seal the game. I pointed out how Jimmy G was required to throw only one pass, and that pass was to kittle. The rest of the plays were all runs, yet this person was crediting that sealing game winning drive to Jimmy G... I don't have rose colored glasses on and won't pretend to. I think too many people are hanging on to Jimmy G's performance against New Orleans as the "see he can carry a team" game.

Jimmy G's 1st posteason with the 49ers ( 7 years, 25 starts)
219 yards 1 TD 2 INT rating 69.2
77 yards 0 TD 0 INT rating 104.7
131 Yards 1 TD 1 INT rating 74.7

Alex Smith 1st postseason with the 49ers ( 7 years, 70 starts)
299 yards 3 TD 0 INT 103.2 Rating
196 Yards 2 TD 0 INT 97.6 Rating

Colin Kaepernick 1st postseason with the 49ers (2 years, 8 starts)
263 Yards 2 TD 1 INT 91,2 Rating
233 Yards 1 TD 1 INT 127.7 Rating
302 Yards 1 TD 1 INT 91.7 Rating

One guy isn't even playing in the NFL anymore and we let go, and another whom we let go and has bounced from team to team played/performed better in their first post-season performances than Jimmy G has/had. It didn't get any better for Colin as the years progressed in terms of post-season production and I sincerely doubt it will get better for Jimmy G. Only time will tell.

Originally posted by SoCold:

Uh. Look at the gif. He's throwing the ball to the numbers, right to the 30 on the field. smdh

When I first read your idea he wasn't targeting Kittle I thought you were nuts. But now that I looked I believe you are right.

Originally posted by SBorBust:

Originally posted by Stanley:
Emotions are a powerful thing, thats why I wont judge you to harshly on your opinion.

Jimmy may not be a superstar talent, but he is top 10 and definitely capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl victory.

He missed some throws and open WRs, so what. You cant just discount his lack of playing experience, lack of game time within shanahans scheme.

He makes one or two more easy throws, and we're the ones lifting the trophy.

Your requirements for a QB are exaggerated and flat out wrong.

How can you judge a person for what he is or isnt before his whole story is written?

I don't think my requirements are exaggerated or wrong. If jimmy G played any real part in getting us to the superbowl in the first place (starting from the vikings game), and then he played how he played Sunday, I wouldn't be thinking this way. The fact of the matter is, our defense and running attack is mainly what got us to the show in the first place. Jimmy G only needed to complete the ball 6 times for 77 yards against green bay. Imagine knowing your going into an NFC championship game understanding your team is so good around you, you only need to complete 6 passes in order to win?

I'm not sure what you mean by how can you judge someone before their whole story is written? Are we not supposed to judge bad WR's and let them play till they are 35 because their story isn't full written yet and "could get" better. I see what you are trying to say though but it simply doesn't go hand in hand. Hes been in the league for 7 years, 4 of those learning behind brady and belicheck. After almost 30 starts and 7 years in the NFL you would see serious potential and raw talent seeping through him, and not the product we were given in the post-season.

I dont think my requirements are high either, I think others are too low. Someone argued with me recently about how good Jimmy G was in the washington redskins game in his "final 6minute drive" to seal the game. I pointed out how Jimmy G was required to throw only one pass, and that pass was to kittle. The rest of the plays were all runs, yet this person was crediting that sealing game winning drive to Jimmy G... I don't have rose colored glasses on and won't pretend to. I think too many people are hanging on to Jimmy G's performance against New Orleans as the "see he can carry a team" game.

Jimmy G's 1st posteason with the 49ers ( 7 years, 25 starts)
219 yards 1 TD 2 INT rating 69.2
77 yards 0 TD 0 INT rating 104.7
131 Yards 1 TD 1 INT rating 74.7

Alex Smith 1st postseason with the 49ers ( 7 years, 70 starts)
299 yards 3 TD 0 INT 103.2 Rating
196 Yards 2 TD 0 INT 97.6 Rating

Colin Kaepernick 1st postseason with the 49ers (2 years, 8 starts)
263 Yards 2 TD 1 INT 91,2 Rating
233 Yards 1 TD 1 INT 127.7 Rating
302 Yards 1 TD 1 INT 91.7 Rating

One guy isn't even playing in the NFL anymore and we let go, and another whom we let go and has bounced from team to team played/performed better in their first post-season performances than Jimmy G has/had. It didn't get any better for Colin as the years progressed in terms of post-season production and I sincerely doubt it will get better for Jimmy G. Only time will tell.

Those comparisons are useless. Totally different teams. Our OL with Alex and Kap were the best in the game during that 3 year stretch.

And Alex's Giants game outside of a couple of plays to Davis were constant 3 and outs.

Jimmy hardly had to throw the ball during our first two playoff games but when he did he made them count outside of the pick to Kendricks. SB our OL didn't play well and Jimmy wasn't able to make up for it.

Originally posted by genus49:
Those comparisons are useless. Totally different teams. Our OL with Alex and Kap were the best in the game during that 3 year stretch.

And Alex's Giants game outside of a couple of plays to Davis were constant 3 and outs.

Jimmy hardly had to throw the ball during our first two playoff games but when he did he made them count outside of the pick to Kendricks. SB our OL didn't play well and Jimmy wasn't able to make up for it.

Useless because the teams are/were different? Well then I suppose we better never compare quarterbacks to one another throughout the NFL since each and every quarterback plays on a separate team than one another so the comparisons can never be made again...

Originally posted by genus49:
Those comparisons are useless. Totally different teams. Our OL with Alex and Kap were the best in the game during that 3 year stretch.

And Alex's Giants game outside of a couple of plays to Davis were constant 3 and outs.

Jimmy hardly had to throw the ball during our first two playoff games but when he did he made them count outside of the pick to Kendricks. SB our OL didn't play well and Jimmy wasn't able to make up for it.

After jimmy's interception in the 1st half of the viking's game he was asked to throw the ball a total of 6 times, completing only 3 of them. Our only touchdown of the second half came from 9 straight runs and zero passes.

In retrospect, Jimmy G, in half a game with the vikings, and an entire game with the packers completed a total of 9 passes.... let that sink in for just a second..