Would you be ok with an OG in the first?

Originally posted by strickac:

100% disagree with him being the best player in the draft. Maybe I can justify an OT being the top overall player, maybe.... but never a G.

Agreed. Elite guards come up in free agency for a reason. They are extremely easy to find.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

I meant in terms of talent, not draft ranking. I think he's #1, in fact outside of MadDog you can't find any respected draft analyst that thinks he's lower than 4th best in the class.

He is more talented than Saquon Barkley?? No chance.

Originally posted by strickac:

That's the key... at his position. A guard is a guard. There's a reason a FB or Center won't ever get drafted early.

I acknowledge that guards are more important than they used to be and it's reflected in their salaries. However, some coaches can work with lesser-rated players and find similar success, particularly in a ZBS.

Most inside zone and power schemes want maulers at guard and Nelson can be that guy. Kyle prioritizes mobility and he can find that later in the draft or FA (Cooper).

Nelson is a solid, stud prospect. He's just not at a premier position to be consider the top overall guy IMO.

FB? LOL...OK, now that is one label I can get behind esp. because the numbers prove every year they are getting less and less utilized.

Yeah, that was just a value example. Outside of FQB, I just don't subscribe to devaluing other positions much esp. for positions that will get you 1,000 snaps a year for 5 years.

Naturally, some positions are much harder to find which is why QB's and ER's will always be at the top every year pushing down the other positions but it doesn't mean other positions are devalued or that they don't hold massive value esp. within certain schemes. This is why players like Nelson and Vea will go top 15. If nobody needed a QB or ER, those positions would go to the top of the board for many teams.

I actually think its harder to find stellar G's that excel in PP and in both inside and outside zone vs. power G's like Iupati. That's a pretty unique skill set and you need a G with very strong football IQ and amazing athleticism and technicians.

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Agreed. Elite guards come up in free agency for a reason. They are extremely easy to find.

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

He is more talented than Saquon Barkley?? No chance.

That would be a fun topic.

Is Barkley a better RB in his class than Nelson at G or Darnold at QB or Chubb at ER...this is how big boards are built.

Originally posted by NCommand:

The "positional value" stance is pretty outdated esp. these days when premier G's are getting as much money as LT's. In this day and age of how much easier it is to find interior DL pass rushers, moving your top ER's over to face RT's and stunting inside, for pass protection alone, G's are key. Throw in the balance of inside and outside zone skill sets, they are even more important.

This isn't Harbaugh's offense with Mike Iupati doing one of two things...pushing straight ahead or pulling over through the RG hole.

Andrew Norwell was a very rare case in that he was an all pro the year he hit FA. Typically teams lock down players like that before hitting the market. They had no choice but to let him test the market, and naturally, he got $13.1M per.

In terms of pay now, it's LT, premier G (not far behind), C and then RT. Given the dearth of OL coming into the league, I have little doubt Kyle would adapt to today's NFL and value G as much as any position esp. after watching all three of his QB's taking big shots right up the gut.

And we're not talking about just another G that still needs a couple years of development. We're talking about the best player at his position by a mile and probably in the draft.

The fact that Nelson would be BPA at #9...AND at a massive position of need just makes this a no-brainer pick exactly like DeForest Buckner.

Every year there are stud All Pro guards available in free agency.

As for Norwell, he was an UDFA by Carolina. There is no need to take a guard in the top 10 or even top 20 IMO. They are extremely easy to find.

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Every year there are stud All Pro guards available in free agency.

As for Norwell, he was an UDFA by Carolina. There is no need to take a guard in the top 10 or even top 20 IMO. They are extremely easy to find.

Just like LT's. They aren't free because they are undervalued. They are free because teams can't afford to pay $12-15M.

And when they DO hit the market, they get paid accordingly.

Silly.

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

I meant in terms of talent, not draft ranking. I think he's #1, in fact outside of MadDog you can't find any respected draft analyst that thinks he's lower than 4th best in the class.

He is more talented than Saquon Barkley?? No chance.

I absolutely love Saquon Barkley, but yes I think Nelson is better.

Funny thing is most people don't want Barkley either! BPA be damned! Give me an Edge rusher!!!!!

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Agreed. Elite guards come up in free agency for a reason. They are extremely easy to find.

Exactly if there so easy to find why did ours suck ass last year.

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Originally posted by 49erBigMac:

I meant in terms of talent, not draft ranking. I think he's #1, in fact outside of MadDog you can't find any respected draft analyst that thinks he's lower than 4th best in the class.

He is more talented than Saquon Barkley?? No chance.

I absolutely love Saquon Barkley, but yes I think Nelson is better.

Funny thing is most people don't want Barkley either! BPA be damned! Give me an Edge rusher!!!!!

Guess I'm in the minority because with a Top 10 pick you want a guy that has a chance of being All Pro more often than not and possibly HOF consideration down the road and those two guys with the best chance are Barkley and Nelson. I'd be super stoked with either.

Guy is as close to a sure thing as possible and the next 8-10 years of all-pro play is very likely. If he's there, you don't even think about it unless Barkley or Chubb are on the board still

Originally posted by Oilcan:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by SteveYoung:
Agreed. Elite guards come up in free agency for a reason. They are extremely easy to find.

Exactly if there so easy to find why did ours suck ass last year.

Easy if you can shell out 13-15 million a year, without it hurting your chances to fill other needs

Originally posted by NCommand:

I actually think its harder to find stellar G's that excel in PP and in both inside and outside zone vs. power G's like Iupati. That's a pretty unique skill set and you need a G with very strong football IQ and amazing athleticism and technicians.

I agree, but these guy typically fall because they're lacking in the power department, which is what most teams are looking for. Maulers are usually the ones that get drafted early.

Originally posted by SteveYoung:

Originally posted by flynhayn15:

That's like saying since his dad had such a bad experience with haynesworth and the fact that he didn't attempt to sign Suh, means he will let Deforest Buckner walk when his contract is up.

And maybe the reason that Shanahan didn't sign guards this year was because they didn't fit his scheme like Nelson would.

Quinton Nelson
Height: 6'5"
Weight: 325LBS.
BENCH PRESS: 35 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 26.5 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 105.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 7.65 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.62 SEC

Andrew norwell
Height: 6' 6
Weight: 315 LBS
Bench Reps: 22
Vertical Jump: 28 INCH
Broad Jump: 105 INCH
3-Cone Drill: 8.09
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.93


Weston Richburg
HT: 6'3"
WT: 298LBS.
BENCH PRESS: 25 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 25.5 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 106.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 7.93 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.63 SEC

Alex Mack
Height: 6'4
Weight: 311
Bench Press: 20 REPS
Vertical Jump: 28 1/2 INCH
Broad Jump: 106 INCH
3-Cone Drill: 7.31 SEC
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.75 SEC


"Everyone thinks we like small guards, I just like people who can move. If you're 400 pounds and can move, I'd rather have that guy than the 300-pound guy who can move the same. The problem is that most really heavy guys can't move."

-Kyle Shanahan

Last time I checked we gave 5 million to a guard.

Huh?

Originally posted by Oilcan:

Exactly if there so easy to find why did ours suck ass last year.

They didn't.

Our QB play sucked before Garrapolo started.

It's the same reasoning why most of you blamed the Oline when Kaepernick was running around in circles in the pocket taking sacks.

NE never invests in the Oline. Neither does GB. Why is that??