why do we want a 5'9 cb with the 30 pick

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Verrett is a good corner, but I don't agree with drafting slot corners in the 1st round. He would pose match-up problems for us in a negative way when facing larger receivers. No matter what kind of coverage he has on a guy like Fitzgerald, Michael Floyd, Austin Pettis, or other receivers 6-3 and above, they will always technically be not just "open" but "VERY open" due to the size matchup -- all a good QB needs to do is take advantage.

I hope no one tries to comment on Tarell Brown (5-10 1/2) was covering Calvin Johnson because 1) He split time between him and Culliver taking on Megatron, and 2) We did that AND played bracket coverage on him to prevent big plays due to the obvious matchup issue with a 5-10 Brown on a 6-5 receiver.

Here's the other side of that argument, who are you going to put on guys like Percy Harvin to defend them? Because of how many snaps the slot corner plays in this defense, you need someone who can lock that position down, better than Rogers did. If you remember the 2011 NFC Championship Game, the Giants were able to consistently go to Victor Cruz for big play after big play. Having someone who can help stop guys like that is absolutely essential and I don't see anyone in the draft who moves his hips as well as Verrett, who has both short area quickness(best 10 yard split at the Combine of any position) and the ability to keep up with the deep speed vertical threats or recover ground quickly.


Sitting in the late 1st, I'd say that Verrett is the best talent available when it comes to CB, particularly if Gilbert, Dennard and Fuller are all gone. In terms of drafting a CB to strictly play on the outside, you have an almost endless collection of bigger, more physical types of CB's that can be had in latter rounds. Breeland, McGill, Jean-Baptiste, Desir, Aikens...etc...etc..


Then you have your late round guys like Shaq Richardson but as far as slot corners go, I see Verrett and Joyner as the best and Verrett possesses better overall athleticism than Joyner.

It's one thing to be a "slot corner" and another thing entirely to be a slot corner with Pro Bowl potential. I see Verrett as the type of guy who can lock down Harvin, Austin, Wes Welker, Randall Cobb and other faster/slot type guys that the 49ers will face this season, rack up turnovers and be a major credit to this defense. The way people talk about him reminds me of the Russell Wilson discussions from a couple seasons ago.

"Man, if this guy was just a few inches taller, he'd be a Top 10 pick for sure." If a guy is that talented that a couple inches would make him come flying off the board tout suite, then I feel like he's a steal in the late 1st pretty much.




As far as bigger receivers go, draft someone like Desir, teach him to hold the s**t out of Calvin Johnson the way Seattle does and call it a day.

I understand the other side of the coin, and don't get me wrong, like I said, I like Verrett. I just have a different philosophy on the kind of guys I'd personally pick in round one. Of course, I'm not the one drafting though so that doesn't matter really.

Frankly, I wouldn't put it past Baalke to do it -- especially considering the next few teams after could be looking at taking a CB. I wouldn't hate the pick, but it wouldn't be my "ideal" or favorite, that's for sure.

Wait up. None of us have any clue whose going to be the best players in this draft. A lot people didn't like the Honey Badger's height so they passed on him and look what happened. We don't need to draft a star, we just need a good football player who fits into our system. Varrett might be that guy, he might not be, but you don't know anymore than the rest of us.

Originally posted by 15crabtree:
that is one of the issue i have with the niner's coaching staff ,maybe if we started putting rookies in , in game experience , we would know what we have ,did you forget about morris

Well, if you don't produce or show in practice and preseason, highly unlikely you will during the regular season. If you say, well some are better game players than practice or preseason games-well that may be true, but very rare. If you were a mediocre team no problem, but because the niners are a Championship/SB contending team, you are willing to risk the playoffs to give a guy a try? Not saying morris can't get there like brock, but maybe the coaches just don't feel he is ready. We will see. Either way you need CB stability as how long is he signed for?

Originally posted by DeUh:
Not true.

Matthews 6´3" vertical 35.5"

Verrett 5´9" vertical 39"

Standing next to each other Matthews still jumps 2.5" higher.

Its only 2.5" , plus its not just jumping higher, its when you jump. even if a Mathews jumps earlier, if its on his fingerstips and he is just bringing it down while the corner is still going up, he will kock the ball out. This what Varret does very well, while a Goldson likes to pop the wide receiver Varret is fighting for the ball, to dislodge it. If there is a concern is his durability issue cause he is not shy about hitting either.

Originally posted by VPofCarnage:
I've read up on this many times before. Like every year. I'm not saying that Green didn't run some version of a 4.15 in the 40. What I'm saying is that by today's standards, he didn't run anywhere near that time. So it's an irrelevant time to compare to modern, electronically-timed 40's. The two can't be compared because the methods of timing them were completely different.

So it's useless to say Bo Jackson ran a 4.12 if in the same sentence you're going to say Dri Archer ran a 4.26. And Archer is easily the faster of the two.

Usain Bolt MIGHT be able to come to Indianapolis and run a 4.15 by combine standards, surface, start method, etc. But even HE would have a hard time doing that.

Totally off subject, but you are right in that Bolt would have a hard time, but for different reasons. 100 meters is longer than 100 yards, and even though and 40 yards is a different than 100 meter, most of these sprinters gears are different in the two ever so slightly but yet enough, the 100m sprinters don't get to their gears until after the fifty m point.

Originally posted by buck:
Tyrann Mathieu
5' 9", 186 lbs.

40---4.50
Bench---4
VJ--- 34"
BJ---117"
SS--4.14
3-C---6.97

Jason Verrett
5' 9 1/2" 189lbs.

40--4.38
Bench---19
VJ---39"
BJ---127"
SS---4.00
3---C 6.67

The one quality they both have is that they are tenacious, but yes Verret has better measurables than Tyranne.

Originally posted by WildBill:
The one quality they both have is that they are tenacious, but yes Verret has better measurables than Tyranne.

Mathieu-Better against the run, Verrett, much more of a technician in coverage.

We need to target two corners. One for the outside (Fuller) and another one for the slot (Varrett).

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

Originally posted by DeUh:
Not true.

Matthews 6�3" vertical 35.5"

Verrett 5�9" vertical 39"

Standing next to each other Matthews still jumps 2.5" higher.

I think you mean to say Matthews still reaches 2.5" higher even though Verrett jumps higher. This isn't entirely true anyways because Matthews has much longer arms than Verrett so while there is 6" of difference in their height, there is likely an 8" gap in their standing reach and Matthews probably reaches 4" higher. In pads the gap is probably greater.

I'd always take an inch of height or arm length over an inch of vertical jump because players rarely jump close to their max standing vertical jump on the fields in pads.

This. Thanks for putting it the right way !

Originally posted by WildBill:
Its only 2.5" , plus its not just jumping higher, its when you jump. even if a Mathews jumps earlier, if its on his fingerstips and he is just bringing it down while the corner is still going up, he will kock the ball out. This what Varret does very well, while a Goldson likes to pop the wide receiver Varret is fighting for the ball, to dislodge it. If there is a concern is his durability issue cause he is not shy about hitting either.

If you read the whole thread you would see that it was not a diss against Verrett.

It was a respond to Phoenix49ers statement "with a 39" vertical, he can get up higher than a much taller guy like Jordan Matthews" which sounds like he has no idea how the vertical is done and is not true !

Originally posted by DeUh:

This. Thanks for putting it the right way !


If you read the whole thread you would see that it was not a diss against Verrett.

It was a respond to Phoenix49ers statement "with a 39" vertical, he can get up higher than a much taller guy like Jordan Matthews" which sounds like he has no idea how the vertical is done and is not true !

If you watch his games, you will see very few occasions where a team successfully threw the ball over the top of him, if the defensive back is playing the ball and not the receiver which Verrett does a great job of, with that sort of leaping ability he can knock the ball away from pretty much anyone short of Megatron.

I dont get the obsession with size on these forums... if a guy can play he can play. Verrett would add as much value to this team as a guy like Fuller, just in different ways. In our division there is Floyd and Fitz, but also Harvin, Austin, and Ellington, guys who can take it the distance in one touch.

The easiest answer is we need both types and probably will load up heavy on DBs this draft. I trust Baalkes track record with DBs, so with that position he can draft whoever the F he wants when he wants.

Can Verret turn and make a play on a ball in the air? To me that's the quality that seperates hum drum corners from the standouts. Does he have the body control and inuition to turn and defend a ball in the air while running with his assignment.

If yes, who cares if he's a shrimp.

I'm still trying to figure out how Verrett did 19 reps.
That's insane and should put to rest his size and durability concerns.

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
Can Verret turn and make a play on a ball in the air? To me that's the quality that seperates hum drum corners from the standouts. Does he have the body control and inuition to turn and defend a ball in the air while running with his assignment.

If yes, who cares if he's a shrimp.

Watch his drills from the Combine, other than a couple slip-up's, he is incredibly fluid, watch how he shuffles his hips moving laterally, making it look almost effortless.

Originally posted by WildBill:
The one quality they both have is that they are tenacious, but yes Verret has better measurables than Tyranne.

Will a guy with these numbers really be around #30?