There are 113 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

49ers interested in trading for Revis (link provided)

  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 25,189
Originally posted by NCommand:
Not likely but perhaps, as much as 3 changes (both S's spots and CB or slot CB):
Brown - very good CB. His issue was technique IMHO. He's got the skill set and will but our scheme didn't favor his style and he has a tendency to play the receiver AFTER the ball is caught. He could have doubled his INT's last year had he kept an eye in the backfield. He doesn't press, jam and allows big cushions and free/clean releases esp. on 3rd and shorts (5 and under, yet he lines up 10+ yards off). To me, there is a scheme/coaching issue here. Remember las year when Rogers would come off a route and undercut another for almost all of his INT's? He didn't do that ONCE last year and to me, that is a poor scheme as well. Vanilla.
Culliver - trouble tracking. Love his speed/range/physicality. Would be more ideal for FS keeping everything in front of him and can match up better in the RZ (huge weakness for us). The question with him is the same as I have with Goldson. Do either have brains?

We'll have to see what we have in Robinson, Cox and perhaps McBath. Then onto second tier FA and the draft!
the words "second tier free agents" i think is exactly the route the team takes and i would be ok with that. find another walt harris.. that being said if he does get cut from philly today, they may look at the price tag of asomugha.... maybe
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Xavier Rhodes, a corner out of Florida State might be available with one of their first two picks. He's 6'2", ran about a 4.4 40, and has over a 40" vertical leap (!?). There is also Desmond Trufant, at 6'0" and a similar 40 time. Both are very physical, very fast and tall for corners. If they are able to get Rhodes and one of the top defensive ends or defensive tackles with their first two picks, I don't care what happens in the rest of the draft. It will be a success.

Sounds great. Culliver/Rogers are 6' and Brown is 5'10". Culliver is MUCH more physical than Rogers though and plays harder (maybe too hard), IMHO. I feel good with Brown. He's consistently very good. But I would love to have a taller SS and CB who can match up against the teams who have killed us with taller, more physical TE's and WR's. These teams killed us and killed us even more in the playoffs. If the refs are going to allow physical CB's in Seattle, don't be surprised if we start to go that route as well (esp. in this division).

I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Xavier Rhodes, a corner out of Florida State might be available with one of their first two picks. He's 6'2", ran about a 4.4 40, and has over a 40" vertical leap (!?). There is also Desmond Trufant, at 6'0" and a similar 40 time. Both are very physical, very fast and tall for corners. If they are able to get Rhodes and one of the top defensive ends or defensive tackles with their first two picks, I don't care what happens in the rest of the draft. It will be a success.

Sounds great. Culliver/Rogers are 6' and Brown is 5'10". Culliver is MUCH more physical than Rogers though and plays harder (maybe too hard), IMHO. I feel good with Brown. He's consistently very good. But I would love to have a taller SS and CB who can match up against the teams who have killed us with taller, more physical TE's and WR's. These teams killed us and killed us even more in the playoffs. If the refs are going to allow physical CB's in Seattle, don't be surprised if we start to go that route as well (esp. in this division).

I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.

Seconded. I think our best bet is to bring in a rookie to eventually replace Whitner but to keep Whitner on the squad for locker room reasons.
Originally posted by GameOver:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Xavier Rhodes, a corner out of Florida State might be available with one of their first two picks. He's 6'2", ran about a 4.4 40, and has over a 40" vertical leap (!?). There is also Desmond Trufant, at 6'0" and a similar 40 time. Both are very physical, very fast and tall for corners. If they are able to get Rhodes and one of the top defensive ends or defensive tackles with their first two picks, I don't care what happens in the rest of the draft. It will be a success.

Sounds great. Culliver/Rogers are 6' and Brown is 5'10". Culliver is MUCH more physical than Rogers though and plays harder (maybe too hard), IMHO. I feel good with Brown. He's consistently very good. But I would love to have a taller SS and CB who can match up against the teams who have killed us with taller, more physical TE's and WR's. These teams killed us and killed us even more in the playoffs. If the refs are going to allow physical CB's in Seattle, don't be surprised if we start to go that route as well (esp. in this division).

I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.

Seconded. I think our best bet is to bring in a rookie to eventually replace Whitner but to keep Whitner on the squad for locker room reasons.

I'm on board with you both actually. Ideally, I wanted Whitner and Rogers cut and Goldson to resign but moved to SS and Culliver to stay at CB or move to FS (better for him) to compete with Robinson/Draft Pick.

Our weakness in the secondary is a short SS (Whitner) who is horrendous in the RZ/EZ and Goldson is matched up elsewhere else and usually isn't in the middle of the field. So scheme/matchups are huge issues as well. I would have rather had Goldson's height and physicality up tight at the LOS on the bigger TE's and WR's who play in the slot in the RZ. Hence Whitner = gave up 8 TD's. We have short CB's who play off and give clean releases to bigger, taller, faster WR's.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GameOver:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Xavier Rhodes, a corner out of Florida State might be available with one of their first two picks. He's 6'2", ran about a 4.4 40, and has over a 40" vertical leap (!?). There is also Desmond Trufant, at 6'0" and a similar 40 time. Both are very physical, very fast and tall for corners. If they are able to get Rhodes and one of the top defensive ends or defensive tackles with their first two picks, I don't care what happens in the rest of the draft. It will be a success.

Sounds great. Culliver/Rogers are 6' and Brown is 5'10". Culliver is MUCH more physical than Rogers though and plays harder (maybe too hard), IMHO. I feel good with Brown. He's consistently very good. But I would love to have a taller SS and CB who can match up against the teams who have killed us with taller, more physical TE's and WR's. These teams killed us and killed us even more in the playoffs. If the refs are going to allow physical CB's in Seattle, don't be surprised if we start to go that route as well (esp. in this division).

I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.

Seconded. I think our best bet is to bring in a rookie to eventually replace Whitner but to keep Whitner on the squad for locker room reasons.

I'm on board with you both actually. Ideally, I wanted Whitner and Rogers cut and Goldson to resign but moved to SS and Culliver to stay at CB or move to FS (better for him) to compete with Robinson/Draft Pick.

Our weakness in the secondary is a short SS (Whitner) who is horrendous in the RZ/EZ and Goldson is matched up elsewhere else and usually isn't in the middle of the field. So scheme/matchups are huge issues as well. I would have rather had Goldson's height and physicality up tight at the LOS on the bigger TE's and WR's who play in the slot in the RZ. Hence Whitner = gave up 8 TD's. We have short CB's who play off and give clean releases to bigger, taller, faster WR's.

Ideally, we can somehow trade Whitner (no one will take him, not even for a 7th I'm sure) and sign Goldson, move Goldson to SS and draft a FS to start next to him. Unfortunately, I don't think we're losing Whitner or signing Goldson so it will be an interesting offseason.
The problem with our secondary this past season was both Safeties were great hitters but not so great in coverage and we lack a true legit #1 CB.

We're letting Goldson walk basically because we need a Safety that has coverage skills and one that's the enforcer/thumper. Ideally we would keep Goldson and pair him up with a rookie whose strong in coverage but unfortunately it's Goldson due for the pay day and not Whitner.

Our CBs are all filled with #2 type guys. Brown is a good CB but he's just overmatched when it comes to the elite WR especially the tall ones and he's far better suited as a #2 and the same can be said Cully and to a lesser extent Rodgers as they all would be good against #2-3 WR.

We need CB help but only if it's a guy that's a legit #1 type of CB. Which is the only reason you entertain the thought of trying to get Revis since he would be that #1 corner you can trust and you can use your double teams on other guys.

Just signing a FA CB or drafting one is only going to really matter if they are better than Brown.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GameOver:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Xavier Rhodes, a corner out of Florida State might be available with one of their first two picks. He's 6'2", ran about a 4.4 40, and has over a 40" vertical leap (!?). There is also Desmond Trufant, at 6'0" and a similar 40 time. Both are very physical, very fast and tall for corners. If they are able to get Rhodes and one of the top defensive ends or defensive tackles with their first two picks, I don't care what happens in the rest of the draft. It will be a success.

Sounds great. Culliver/Rogers are 6' and Brown is 5'10". Culliver is MUCH more physical than Rogers though and plays harder (maybe too hard), IMHO. I feel good with Brown. He's consistently very good. But I would love to have a taller SS and CB who can match up against the teams who have killed us with taller, more physical TE's and WR's. These teams killed us and killed us even more in the playoffs. If the refs are going to allow physical CB's in Seattle, don't be surprised if we start to go that route as well (esp. in this division).

I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.

Seconded. I think our best bet is to bring in a rookie to eventually replace Whitner but to keep Whitner on the squad for locker room reasons.

I'm on board with you both actually. Ideally, I wanted Whitner and Rogers cut and Goldson to resign but moved to SS and Culliver to stay at CB or move to FS (better for him) to compete with Robinson/Draft Pick.

Our weakness in the secondary is a short SS (Whitner) who is horrendous in the RZ/EZ and Goldson is matched up elsewhere else and usually isn't in the middle of the field. So scheme/matchups are huge issues as well. I would have rather had Goldson's height and physicality up tight at the LOS on the bigger TE's and WR's who play in the slot in the RZ. Hence Whitner = gave up 8 TD's. We have short CB's who play off and give clean releases to bigger, taller, faster WR's.

I agree. Ideally, Culliver will show that he has the ability to be a ball hawk at FS and retain Goldson. This would make them literally interchangable. The only problem is that Goldson would be slotted as a "SS" and he may be getting paid too high for that slot.

Why I think Culliver would make a good FS aside from the fact that he has played that position in college: dude is our best DB at breaking on routes, especially the outs and curls. He is also always fighting and even when a deep ball is thrown. I think he has all the tools to be a ballhawk FS.

Then we can move Rogers to full time CB and draft a nickel back and to develop but acquire a FA nickel back as they come cheap and it is easier to find one under the radar.
Originally posted by Joecool:
I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.
I guess I don't understand why you're so sure of that. Earl Thomas did fine stepping in his first year. So did Eric Berry. And, the Niners secondary was top three in '81 with a rookie and a second-year guy who had never started at the safety positions. Plus, I think people are blaming Whitner for at least one mistake that was actually Culliver's in the SB. On the Jones TD, Whitner's assignment was to double up on Boldin. You can see him breaking for Boldin. Culliver's assignment was to not let Jones get behind him. He not only let him get behind him, but then when the ball was grossly under-thrown, Culliver failed to find it in the air. That play was all Culliver.

I agree that coverage is Whitner's weak point, but I don't agree that one of the fast cover safeties available in the draft can't cover receivers his first year in the league because I've seen rookies do it.
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I can't agree with you here, N. Whitner is the weakest coverage DB that we have and BAL heavily exploited it. Having a rookie and Whitner at the Safety position is bad news for us as they will both be weak in coverage in 2013.
I guess I don't understand why you're so sure of that. Earl Thomas did fine stepping in his first year. So did Eric Berry. And, the Niners secondary was top three in '81 with a rookie and a second-year guy who had never started at the safety positions. Plus, I think people are blaming Whitner for at least one mistake that was actually Culliver's in the SB. On the Jones TD, Whitner's assignment was to double up on Boldin. You can see him breaking for Boldin. Culliver's assignment was to not let Jones get behind him. He not only let him get behind him, but then when the ball was grossly under-thrown, Culliver failed to find it in the air. That play was all Culliver.

I agree that coverage is Whitner's weak point, but I don't agree that one of the fast cover safeties available in the draft can't cover receivers his first year in the league because I've seen rookies do it.

Oh for sure...if we can find that type of FS in the draft, then we are set. But the problem is that those players did make mistakes their first year. Whitner also makes mistakes in coverage. That's a double dose. I do believe in learning while they play but the other spot should be a more reliable player than is Whitner.
With the Revis spec apparently over, is it back to Smith?
Originally posted by Joecool:
Oh for sure...if we can find that type of FS in the draft, then we are set. But the problem is that those players did make mistakes their first year. Whitner also makes mistakes in coverage. That's a double dose. I do believe in learning while they play but the other spot should be a more reliable player than is Whitner.

Well, you're right about that of course. FS is the most mental position in the defensive backfield after all. There are a couple very good cover guys at the position in the draft who could possibly make up for mistakes with speed. I just don't think they're going to be able to retain Goldson, so I'm hoping for somebody real good to come out of the draft because they're going to have to start spending their money on offense.
Whitner calls the defensive plays, I believe. I agree that I'd like one vet @ the S position...just bummed it won't be Goldson at SS.
DO NOT WANT
Baalke is smart, too many risks with Revis contract and his knee. You can't even franchise(clause in his contract that prevents it for those who don't know) him after the season so most likely it's a rental. Don't want to hear the 94 Deion comparison, it only took cash to get him and he was healthy.
why is this in Niner Talk?

is he a Niner?