There are 177 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

Week 12: Thoughts after rewatching the game...

Fine post as usual.

Everybody showed up and played well.

Other than the interception, Kap's only real BAD pass was to Moss in the Red Zone. Props to Moss for preventing an interception.

I'v also been an Alex supporter and still like him. That said, Kap seems to be the real deal. I'm VERY impressed with his poise in the pocket and his ball placement, I hope he stays the starter.

I've been saying for some time now that we need to get a better DLine rotation. How much longer Justin can play almost every snap of every game and be as effective. I think he stepped up his game the last 2 weeks. Ray Mac also played better than in previous games.

Brooks is playing some very solid football.

Manningham is impressive. I hope we utilize him a lot more.

Baalke/JH look like geniuses in lieu of our recent injuries.

That was the fastest I've seen Whitner run - it was like he was shot out of a cannon.

What did you think of Carlos Rogers' game?
excellent post as always marv. my 4 cents

1)dont think the wrs are used to the heat on the ball and getting it in traffic. since alex rarely threw into coverage which requires velocity, they will drop a little more til tehey get used to it.
2)that throw to delaine was awesome, you could see on the replay that vernon was open on the short square in but delaine was open on the longer route. i just kept thinking in my mind alex would have either thrown to vernon or checked down, where as kap throws the longer pass. and man does that boy put it in a tight window.
3)ball placement is excellent - in stride, correct inside/outside throw, and just hits them in the body
4)special teams is worrying me a lot
  • dj43
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 20,155
Nice post Marvin. I too am very much on the fence over Kaepernick. Yes, he had some nice plays and good moves, however, he first played a Bears team that played vanilla defense all night and made it very easy for him to make the reads. Yesterday, he played the worst defense in the league yet only put up 2 TDs. He was clearly confused by the stunts and coverages Spaguolo and the Saints threw at him. His audible adjustments, especially on running plays were not very effective. What he added in passing, was subtracted in the run game. On balance, his performance against the Saints yesterday was below average in comparison to what other QBs have put up in previous games this year. In reflection, these two games were a good starting point for CK. The Bears played the same alignment play after play which made it easy for him. The Saints, though they gave him a lot of looks, just are not good enough to present a top level challenge. In looking at the closing schedule, however, there are not any playoff caliber defenses left. Consequently, if Harbaugh chooses to continue with him, this may be a good time for him to learn. Having Alex on the bench to help him learn the reads will help also. We shall see.

WR: I have been an outspoken critic of our WRs all season long. However, in fairness, they have improved with more time in the system. Crabtree is much improved over last year and yesterday he made a great catch on a 3rd down that was the kind of play he made in college. Still, he is easy to take out of the game with a strong DB. Again, this was the Saints, the worst passing defense in the league. They should not be able to shut down a #1 receiver that easily. Manningham is developing some chemistry but again, running a 3rd dow route 1 yard short of the line of gain is unforgivable for a 4th year receiver. Moss is still invisible except for the threat (hope?) that he draws coverage to free others. The truth is, as was shown by how easily Crabs was shut down, Moss is not as much of a threat as everyone hoped. His best contribution seems to be tutelage of others...perhaps. Ginn has not even been a shadow on offense. Williams going down takes away some firepower but hopefully we now will get to see what Jenkins can bring. With 2/3 of the season to learn what the pro game looks like, a #1 draft pick should be able to contribute now.

Yes, yesterday was a nice win by the defense. OTOH, despite all the raving about Kaepernick's athleticism and strong arm, and the 375 yards of offense, this was the SAINTS DEFENSE, the worst in the league, a defense that had given up an average of 454 yards of offense per game. Opponents AVERAGED 5 yards per rushing attempt (49ers 4.6) and 8.5 yards per pass (49ers 5.0). Compared to what previous opponents had done against the Saints, yesterday was BELOW AVERAGE offensively. I lay some of that to an improved effort by the Saints against a team that handed them a bitter defeat last year, however, a large part also falls to the fact the 49ers had a very inexperienced QB who was not able to deal with some fairly standard stunts and blitz packages and coverages that the Saints used.

Overall, a win is a win. Still, as I watched the Giants destroy Aaron Rodgers and the Packers last night, the team that beat the Saints yesterday appears to be by no means ready to take on the World Champs.
CK looks like a man among boys out there. In situations where Alex Smith clearly would have yielded a sack, CK simply avoids losses like you or I would brush off a pesky bug. He almost seems annoyed when he gets chased, and almost always makes a defensive lineman look foolish. This is perhaps the part of his game that I like the best. In terms of flat out speed, CK and Alex might be tied. But in terms of pocket awareness and quickness? CK always seems to be one step ahead of the lumbering lineman trying in a vain attempt to chase him down. It's almost like it's so unfair that CK should be playing with one arm tied behind his back.

This team has drafted amazingly well during the past couple of years. I'm interested in seeing what this year's draft crop can do, because it finally looks like they're about to get some long-awaited chances for field action.
Originally posted by dj43:
Still, as I watched the Giants destroy Aaron Rodgers and the Packers last night, the team that beat the Saints yesterday appears to be by no means ready to take on the World Champs.

As much as I hate to do it, I have to agree with this sentiment. When the Giants are on? They are scary good.

DJ -- the one advantage we might have is CK's escape skills against that rush. I think we've seen just a glimmer of what CK7 can do on a football field.
Originally posted by billbird2111:
CK looks like a man among boys out there. In situations where Alex Smith clearly would have yielded a sack, CK simply avoids losses like you or I would brush off a pesky bug. He almost seems annoyed when he gets chased, and almost always makes a defensive lineman look foolish. This is perhaps the part of his game that I like the best. In terms of flat out speed, CK and Alex might be tied. But in terms of pocket awareness and quickness? CK always seems to be one step ahead of the lumbering lineman trying in a vain attempt to chase him down. It's almost like it's so unfair that CK should be playing with one arm tied behind his back.

This team has drafted amazingly well during the past couple of years. I'm interested in seeing what this year's draft crop can do, because it finally looks like they're about to get some long-awaited chances for field action.

I fully agree with this his pocket awareness and escapability is on another level compared to Alex.
Originally posted by dj43:
Nice post Marvin. I too am very much on the fence over Kaepernick. Yes, he had some nice plays and good moves, however, he first played a Bears team that played vanilla defense all night and made it very easy for him to make the reads. Yesterday, he played the worst defense in the league yet only put up 2 TDs. He was clearly confused by the stunts and coverages Spaguolo and the Saints threw at him. His audible adjustments, especially on running plays were not very effective. What he added in passing, was subtracted in the run game. On balance, his performance against the Saints yesterday was below average in comparison to what other QBs have put up in previous games this year. In reflection, these two games were a good starting point for CK. The Bears played the same alignment play after play which made it easy for him. The Saints, though they gave him a lot of looks, just are not good enough to present a top level challenge. In looking at the closing schedule, however, there are not any playoff caliber defenses left. Consequently, if Harbaugh chooses to continue with him, this may be a good time for him to learn. Having Alex on the bench to help him learn the reads will help also. We shall see.

WR: I have been an outspoken critic of our WRs all season long. However, in fairness, they have improved with more time in the system. Crabtree is much improved over last year and yesterday he made a great catch on a 3rd down that was the kind of play he made in college. Still, he is easy to take out of the game with a strong DB. Again, this was the Saints, the worst passing defense in the league. They should not be able to shut down a #1 receiver that easily. Manningham is developing some chemistry but again, running a 3rd dow route 1 yard short of the line of gain is unforgivable for a 4th year receiver. Moss is still invisible except for the threat (hope?) that he draws coverage to free others. The truth is, as was shown by how easily Crabs was shut down, Moss is not as much of a threat as everyone hoped. His best contribution seems to be tutelage of others...perhaps. Ginn has not even been a shadow on offense. Williams going down takes away some firepower but hopefully we now will get to see what Jenkins can bring. With 2/3 of the season to learn what the pro game looks like, a #1 draft pick should be able to contribute now.

Yes, yesterday was a nice win by the defense. OTOH, despite all the raving about Kaepernick's athleticism and strong arm, and the 375 yards of offense, this was the SAINTS DEFENSE, the worst in the league, a defense that had given up an average of 454 yards of offense per game. Opponents AVERAGED 5 yards per rushing attempt (49ers 4.6) and 8.5 yards per pass (49ers 5.0). Compared to what previous opponents had done against the Saints, yesterday was BELOW AVERAGE offensively. I lay some of that to an improved effort by the Saints against a team that handed them a bitter defeat last year, however, a large part also falls to the fact the 49ers had a very inexperienced QB who was not able to deal with some fairly standard stunts and blitz packages and coverages that the Saints used.

Overall, a win is a win. Still, as I watched the Giants destroy Aaron Rodgers and the Packers last night, the team that beat the Saints yesterday appears to be by no means ready to take on the World Champs.

Can we look at the Saints defense objectively????

Yes, they suck but they had been playing well in the past 5-6 games. The Saints in the Superdome is never an easy task.
  • Chico
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,129
Originally posted by niner4life21:
Can we look at the Saints defense objectively????

Yes, they suck but they had been playing well in the past 5-6 games. The Saints in the Superdome is never an easy task.

Correct! They have won their last 5 out of 6 and are improving on defense. Spagnola (however spelled) took the Giants to the SB and won with his defense! And they didn't look like the 32nd rank defense yesterday. Give Kap credit for shredding and only getting better. We should have had a couple more offensive TD's yesterday.
Originally posted by OKC49erFan:
As always, excellent post Marvin.

I don't like getting involved in the ongoing QB debate, too much hipocracy all around.
CK is more elusive in the pocket, and he keeps his eyes downfield. I think it is those two things that set him apart. It helps that he can get the ball downfield in a hurry.
Alex is a conservative QB, and he found a way to be successful playing that way. Two QBs that have found success in the system. One more exciting but perhaps risky. The other less exciting but safe and methodical (possibly better TOP). An interesting situation.
I believe CK will win out. Big play ability like his is too much to keep on the sidelines.
Good parsing OKC.

Kaepernick's ability with longer passes is a better fit for a team that can run. It will keep defenses from stacking the box. His long-passing should more than outweigh his apparent lack of ability with shorter, touch passes (he's better at touch in long passes like the one to KW in the Bears game). But he should improve upon it in a West Coast Offense.
Originally posted by dj43:
Nice post Marvin. I too am very much on the fence over Kaepernick. Yes, he had some nice plays and good moves, however, he first played a Bears team that played vanilla defense all night and made it very easy for him to make the reads. Yesterday, he played the worst defense in the league yet only put up 2 TDs. He was clearly confused by the stunts and coverages Spaguolo and the Saints threw at him. His audible adjustments, especially on running plays were not very effective. What he added in passing, was subtracted in the run game. On balance, his performance against the Saints yesterday was below average in comparison to what other QBs have put up in previous games this year. In reflection, these two games were a good starting point for CK. The Bears played the same alignment play after play which made it easy for him. The Saints, though they gave him a lot of looks, just are not good enough to present a top level challenge. In looking at the closing schedule, however, there are not any playoff caliber defenses left. Consequently, if Harbaugh chooses to continue with him, this may be a good time for him to learn. Having Alex on the bench to help him learn the reads will help also. We shall see.

WR: I have been an outspoken critic of our WRs all season long. However, in fairness, they have improved with more time in the system. Crabtree is much improved over last year and yesterday he made a great catch on a 3rd down that was the kind of play he made in college. Still, he is easy to take out of the game with a strong DB. Again, this was the Saints, the worst passing defense in the league. They should not be able to shut down a #1 receiver that easily. Manningham is developing some chemistry but again, running a 3rd dow route 1 yard short of the line of gain is unforgivable for a 4th year receiver. Moss is still invisible except for the threat (hope?) that he draws coverage to free others. The truth is, as was shown by how easily Crabs was shut down, Moss is not as much of a threat as everyone hoped. His best contribution seems to be tutelage of others...perhaps. Ginn has not even been a shadow on offense. Williams going down takes away some firepower but hopefully we now will get to see what Jenkins can bring. With 2/3 of the season to learn what the pro game looks like, a #1 draft pick should be able to contribute now.

Yes, yesterday was a nice win by the defense. OTOH, despite all the raving about Kaepernick's athleticism and strong arm, and the 375 yards of offense, this was the SAINTS DEFENSE, the worst in the league, a defense that had given up an average of 454 yards of offense per game. Opponents AVERAGED 5 yards per rushing attempt (49ers 4.6) and 8.5 yards per pass (49ers 5.0). Compared to what previous opponents had done against the Saints, yesterday was BELOW AVERAGE offensively. I lay some of that to an improved effort by the Saints against a team that handed them a bitter defeat last year, however, a large part also falls to the fact the 49ers had a very inexperienced QB who was not able to deal with some fairly standard stunts and blitz packages and coverages that the Saints used.

Overall, a win is a win. Still, as I watched the Giants destroy Aaron Rodgers and the Packers last night, the team that beat the Saints yesterday appears to be by no means ready to take on the World Champs.

Gonna have to disagree with you here on Kaep. He played far better than his stats would indicate. There were at least 2 dropped passes (the third would have been for little gain for Gore) that were for significant yards and would have extended drives. Kaep put the ball where it needed to be and the reciever dropped it (Crab, Vernon). In addition there were holding calls that wipped out a 14 yard gain to Vernon on 3rd down and a 36 yard gain that would have taken the ball to the 14. It's not just the yard here that we are talking about. If the receivers make those catches and those holding calls aren't made, The Niners score alot more points because those drives are extended. On those holding calls in particular...those 10 yard penalties KILLED the drives. Just as an example, if you add just the drops to his stats and eliminate the holding calls He would have been 21-27 for WELL over 300 yards. That doesn't even take into account further yards or TDs (or, to be fair, INTs) he may have had had he gotten the first downs those plays would have resulted in.

Every QB has receivers drop the ball sometimes, so you can't do as I did above and say this is what SHOULD have happened. I'm just saying that your assessment of Kaep is a bit too harsh. He was putting the ball on the target. He wasn't confused. He played very, very well.
Good accurate post as usual Marvin.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
They were 6 of 13 on 3rd down, but I get your point.

Kaepernick was 6 of 8 on third downs though for 99 yards. Plus he had a 15 yard scramble on one third down.
[ Edited by nannite on Nov 26, 2012 at 10:46 AM ]
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 24,259
i love alex but my daughter who is a huge alex fan and is smarter than most guys, told me there were many many times that ck avoided the pass rush and made plays in the same order that garcia used to. she said that is a big plus for ck and something we maybe do not see from alex. i love alex but i am not dumb and blind. ok I am sure its been discussed and i hate to bring up negative after such a big win but i am really really worried about these penalities we make. we make them on offense to kill drives, we make them on defense to extend drives for the foe. I do not think the refs are picking on us and I understand we over came them and won so alls well that ends well,,,,,, but this is a very very frustrating part of the game for me. now far be it for me to over react but am i worried about nothing??
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 24,259
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by billbird2111:
CK looks like a man among boys out there. In situations where Alex Smith clearly would have yielded a sack, CK simply avoids losses like you or I would brush off a pesky bug. He almost seems annoyed when he gets chased, and almost always makes a defensive lineman look foolish. This is perhaps the part of his game that I like the best. In terms of flat out speed, CK and Alex might be tied. But in terms of pocket awareness and quickness? CK always seems to be one step ahead of the lumbering lineman trying in a vain attempt to chase him down. It's almost like it's so unfair that CK should be playing with one arm tied behind his back.

This team has drafted amazingly well during the past couple of years. I'm interested in seeing what this year's draft crop can do, because it finally looks like they're about to get some long-awaited chances for field action.

I fully agree with this his pocket awareness and escapability is on another level compared to Alex.
i could not see this untill good posters like you and my nfl smart daughter pointed it out. thank you and this is huge. it just takes me a while to catch up. mainly cuz i know nothing about the x's and o's of the game.. i am to lazy to sift through things but I really hope people are still not trying to dilute what ck has done in the last 3 weeks,, for the last 3 weeks people like me, who like him but are wary,,, throw out challenge after challenge and the kid responds!!
My favorite thing about Kaep, he stated postgame I believe that people often put his physical ability over his mental game, meaning he's primarily great b/c of his ability to run and air it out, while his decision-making goes unnoticed, which is obviously untrue.

The fact that he STATED this in an interview and proved that he does make smart decisions while escaping the penetration just makes his game that much more fun to watch. The guy is a stud and has shown up in two back-to-back big games, can't wait to see what happens when we meet Tom Brady


Or when...




Tom Brady meets Colin Kaepernick!