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Could Alex produce big numbers in a pass happy offense?

Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
What he do in Utah?

Played against college players.

lol, brilliant!

How did Tim Tebow do in college? (get my point?)
I think he could but he would make mistakes and look kinda like romo does when he tries to throw for over 300 but a few more years under jh and improving his skills and confidence yes he could.and with are offensive line being one of the best in the nfl. Yeah sure why not..do I want to hell no..... that's not us we beat teams up ...controle the ball and win..... I'm good with the way jh is leading this team.
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
What he do in Utah?

Played against college players.

lol, brilliant!

How did Tim Tebow do in college? (get my point?)

There is no logic in this argument.
Have been talking about Alex on 95.7 for a while now. Now they are talking about seeing QB's around the league throwing receivers open...basically, throwing it to covered receivers but placing the ball properly. Difficult to evaluate our receivers because they are not getting this opportunity. Basically, Alex is not making these throws and it is helping us but at the same time, it is hurting us.
If Alex is a rookie this year? I say yes in the right system and the right coaching and players. Lets not forget how damaged Alex is after playing with some of the worst coaching and players in niner history. I think that's why Alex is so sketchy when it comes to pocket presence and trusting his WR's, just my opinion though.
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
What he do in Utah?

Played against college players.

lol, brilliant!

How did Tim Tebow do in college? (get my point?)

I get a portion of your point, but this is a big can of worms I'm afraid to open.
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Have been talking about Alex on 95.7 for a while now. Now they are talking about seeing QB's around the league throwing receivers open...basically, throwing it to covered receivers but placing the ball properly. Difficult to evaluate our receivers because they are not getting this opportunity. Basically, Alex is not making these throws and it is helping us but at the same time, it is hurting us.

Originally posted by Joecool:
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.

We are not a team that takes risk and low percentage throws downfield unless it's there to take and Smith is sure that he can beat the safety uncontested. A couple I remember was early in the Seattle game with mixed results to Williams, none connected. Glad we didn't try to do that for the rest of the game but actually ran the ball. In the Cards game we had enough success throwing the underneath, even though there were looks downfield by Smith that was covered. We are a safe passing team. Some of us just have to deal with that. I don't want us to be safe all the time either but that's what most coaches want. And I'm pretty sure that's what Smith is executing out of the passing offense. So far...
[ Edited by qnnhan7 on Nov 7, 2012 at 11:33 AM ]
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by 80sbaby24:
Originally posted by verb1der:
What he do in Utah?

Played against college players.

lol, brilliant!

How did Tim Tebow do in college? (get my point?)

There is no logic in this argument.

How is there no logic in my argument. The original question is could Alex produce in a pass happy offense.....to which someone responded with a one liner about his time in college. Yet, you are saying there is no logic in MY argument? LOL. OK dude.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.

i hope alex continues to do what he did with crabs last week. i dont remember the last time smith threw a jump ball for a receiver in coverage. we have huge receivers for that very reason. moss is huge and he can jump, crabtree the same, VD the same, delanie can jump and drop passes. use these guys!
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Have been talking about Alex on 95.7 for a while now. Now they are talking about seeing QB's around the league throwing receivers open...basically, throwing it to covered receivers but placing the ball properly. Difficult to evaluate our receivers because they are not getting this opportunity. Basically, Alex is not making these throws and it is helping us but at the same time, it is hurting us.

Originally posted by Joecool:
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.

We are not a team that takes risk and low percentage throws downfield unless it's there to take and Smith is sure that he can beat the safety uncontested. A couple I remember was early in the Seattle game with mixed results to Williams, none connected. Glad we didn't try to do that for the rest of the game but actually ran the ball. In the Cards game we had enough success throwing the underneath, even though there were looks downfield by Smith that was covered. We are a safe passing team. Some of us just have to deal with that. I don't want us to be safe all the time either but that's what most coaches want. And I'm pretty sure that's what Smith is executing out of the passing offense. So far...

Speaking of the ARIZONA game. I think it was with 6:55 left in the 1st, the 49ers ran a play that we have been wanting called on the zone ever since we acquired Moss. It got one player wide open deep and Smith was staring right at the FS or one of the two deep routes.

He checked down.

The play had Moss at Flanker (weak side WR). Vernon was Strong Side TE.
Defensive Presnap Look: Single Safety cheating over showing over the top coverage doubling Moss).
On Alex's drop, Moss heads straight up field and FS immediately moves to help leaving the middle of the field to the right sideline blank. Vernon pushes the Defensive End and runs upfield right into the blank area and veers top a 7 route. He was being single covered by a player who was initially only about 5 yards off of him. He quickly got a step on that player and had nothing but open field to the deep right (WIIIIDE OOOOPEN)!!!

Now Smith hops a couple of times after he hits the top of his drop and is still staring in the direction of the FS that's over Moss. Then he quickly checks it to Gore on a swing pass.

This was a blatant mis-read by Smith. He should have read single safety and Vernon being open on the 7. Since the FS immediately moved to Moss, that should have been automatic progression check to see if Vernon was released, which he was. Smith had great protection. He could have even pump-faked to Moss and quickly threw it up to Vernon. Would have been a possible TD.

If the FS had stayed to still be in reach for the right sideline, he can still pump fake to Vernon and launch one deep to Moss who would be one-on-one.


This is not SAFE play. This is a play that was an easy completion but what was lost was an equally easy big play.
[ Edited by Joecool on Nov 7, 2012 at 11:46 AM ]
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.

i hope alex continues to do what he did with crabs last week. i dont remember the last time smith threw a jump ball for a receiver in coverage. we have huge receivers for that very reason. moss is huge and he can jump, crabtree the same, VD the same, delanie can jump and drop passes. use these guys!

I don't consider that TD throw a jump ball. If the DB isn't looking or his feet are not in similar position as the WR's feet, then the WR and QB have the advantage. Now if the DB is sort of stride for stride or also looking back at the QB and it is obvious no other DB is close enough to help, THEN you can throw up what is a called a jump ball knowing that the WR is the better prepared player to come down with the ball.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Have been talking about Alex on 95.7 for a while now. Now they are talking about seeing QB's around the league throwing receivers open...basically, throwing it to covered receivers but placing the ball properly. Difficult to evaluate our receivers because they are not getting this opportunity. Basically, Alex is not making these throws and it is helping us but at the same time, it is hurting us.

Originally posted by Joecool:
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.

We are not a team that takes risk and low percentage throws downfield unless it's there to take and Smith is sure that he can beat the safety uncontested. A couple I remember was early in the Seattle game with mixed results to Williams, none connected. Glad we didn't try to do that for the rest of the game but actually ran the ball. In the Cards game we had enough success throwing the underneath, even though there were looks downfield by Smith that was covered. We are a safe passing team. Some of us just have to deal with that. I don't want us to be safe all the time either but that's what most coaches want. And I'm pretty sure that's what Smith is executing out of the passing offense. So far...

Speaking of the ARIZONA game. I think it was with 6:55 left in the 1st, the 49ers ran a play that we have been wanting called on the zone ever since we acquired Moss. It got one player wide open deep and Smith was staring right at the FS or one of the two deep routes.

He checked down.

The play had Moss at Flanker (weak side WR). Vernon was Strong Side TE.
Defensive Presnap Look: Single Safety cheating over showing over the top coverage doubling Moss).
On Alex's drop, Moss heads straight up field and FS immediately moves to help leaving the middle of the field to the right sideline blank. Vernon pushes the Defensive End and runs upfield right into the blank area and veers top a 7 route. He was being single covered by a player who was initially only about 5 yards off of him. He quickly got a step on that player and had nothing but open field to the deep right (WIIIIDE OOOOPEN)!!!

Now Smith hops a couple of times after he hits the top of his drop and is still staring in the direction of the FS that's over Moss. Then he quickly checks it to Gore on a swing pass.

This was a blatant mis-read by Smith. He should have read single safety and Vernon being open on the 7. Since the FS immediately moved to Moss, that should have been automatic progression check to see if Vernon was released, which he was. Smith had great protection. He could have even pump-faked to Moss and quickly threw it up to Vernon. Would have been a possible TD.

If the FS had stayed to still be in reach for the right sideline, he can still pump fake to Vernon and launch one deep to Moss who would be one-on-one.


This is not SAFE play. This is a play that was an easy completion but what was lost was an equally easy big play.

What's the result of the play...
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Have been talking about Alex on 95.7 for a while now. Now they are talking about seeing QB's around the league throwing receivers open...basically, throwing it to covered receivers but placing the ball properly. Difficult to evaluate our receivers because they are not getting this opportunity. Basically, Alex is not making these throws and it is helping us but at the same time, it is hurting us.

Originally posted by Joecool:
Now they are saying Mario Manningham caught a TD in all of their playoff games, especially mentioning the amazing catch in the Superbowl. He said what did Eli do, he threw it to him and gave him a chance. This was after a text from a fan saying if he's watched the other QB's and that they don't produce much better. Then the talk show guy said it's more about the big throws that are made and giving their guys chances.

We are not a team that takes risk and low percentage throws downfield unless it's there to take and Smith is sure that he can beat the safety uncontested. A couple I remember was early in the Seattle game with mixed results to Williams, none connected. Glad we didn't try to do that for the rest of the game but actually ran the ball. In the Cards game we had enough success throwing the underneath, even though there were looks downfield by Smith that was covered. We are a safe passing team. Some of us just have to deal with that. I don't want us to be safe all the time either but that's what most coaches want. And I'm pretty sure that's what Smith is executing out of the passing offense. So far...

Speaking of the ARIZONA game. I think it was with 6:55 left in the 1st, the 49ers ran a play that we have been wanting called on the zone ever since we acquired Moss. It got one player wide open deep and Smith was staring right at the FS or one of the two deep routes.

He checked down.

The play had Moss at Flanker (weak side WR). Vernon was Strong Side TE.
Defensive Presnap Look: Single Safety cheating over showing over the top coverage doubling Moss).
On Alex's drop, Moss heads straight up field and FS immediately moves to help leaving the middle of the field to the right sideline blank. Vernon pushes the Defensive End and runs upfield right into the blank area and veers top a 7 route. He was being single covered by a player who was initially only about 5 yards off of him. He quickly got a step on that player and had nothing but open field to the deep right (WIIIIDE OOOOPEN)!!!

Now Smith hops a couple of times after he hits the top of his drop and is still staring in the direction of the FS that's over Moss. Then he quickly checks it to Gore on a swing pass.

This was a blatant mis-read by Smith. He should have read single safety and Vernon being open on the 7. Since the FS immediately moved to Moss, that should have been automatic progression check to see if Vernon was released, which he was. Smith had great protection. He could have even pump-faked to Moss and quickly threw it up to Vernon. Would have been a possible TD.

If the FS had stayed to still be in reach for the right sideline, he can still pump fake to Vernon and launch one deep to Moss who would be one-on-one.


This is not SAFE play. This is a play that was an easy completion but what was lost was an equally easy big play.

What's the result of the play...

I think it was a swing pass to Gore for 8 or 10 yards. I'm not entirely positive on the time of the play and if it was a FG result or TD resulted drive. However, it still passes up the opportunity to score a TD on one play.

I seriously think opponents see these things and laugh saying that Alex won't throw it so we are going to crowd all the areas he is comfortable with. That's what the better defenses do. No defense can cover all parts of the field but they can leave open the parts that are not seen as strengths or primary throwing areas of the offense.
If pass happy means 4-5 wide, run and gun, spread, etc. etc., then I say yes.

If it means 70/30 pass to run ratio in a traditional offense, I'm not so sure. Likely no.
...