Receivers need to attack the ball!

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Why don't our receivers "attack" the ball?

How can you attack a ball, when the "ball" is running out of bounds on third down when the team is down 23 - 3?
The ball has to be THROWN first, then it can be "attacked". It absolutely cannot be attacked, if it is not thrown first. This is why I am much more concerned with the "not throwing the ball" part of the equation, before we discuss things that may or may not occur after that first critical event.

Did you think you were in the Alex Smith thread?

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Why don't our receivers "attack" the ball?

How can you attack a ball, when the "ball" is running out of bounds on third down when the team is down 23 - 3?
The ball has to be THROWN first, then it can be "attacked". It absolutely cannot be attacked, if it is not thrown first. This is why I am much more concerned with the "not throwing the ball" part of the equation, before we discuss things that may or may not occur after that first critical event.

Did you think you were in the Alex Smith thread?

In the Alex Smith thread, they are talking about his "bad game" with the interceptions. I could care less about interceptions.
I have to use this thread as an opportunity to be cynical.

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by 49erswillbeback:
If I made a thread that focused on why Alex Smith threw such a bad ball to Delaine Walker and why he threw so many INT's in the Giants game that thread would be locked in a second. So why isn't this thread not locked already? So much Alex love in this forum it's pathetic.

The point of THIS thread is to discuss whether or not the 49er receivers can be expected to reliably work hard to catch the ball at its highest point, come back hard to the ball on curls and the like. What is your opinion on that?

My opinion is that the the receivers are doing the best job they can do with the ball that is presented to them. I thought that was obvious to everyone without making a thread to cover Alex Smith's bad throws which is what this thread was created to do.

First few words of this thread "Something I noticed during the game. The Delanie Walker INT could have been avoided had Delanie attacked the ball instead of waiting for it to land in his hands." Really? Alex threw a bad ball and now a thread is being made to cover up all his bad balls? WOW!

Goodnight!

I think the premise of this thread is absolutely right on.... and have for a while. Manning made a lot of passes that if you take away the effort from the receiver to make the catch would have been viewed as poor - but he knows there is a much better chance that his guys are going to go get and come down with the ball or at the very least try to break up an INT than there is that the DB will come away with it. I would really like to see a "jump ball" stat comparing us to other teams... we suck at that.

I think our unwillingness to go deep a lot is a combination of Smith not being extremely accurate deep and our WR not being aggressive enough to make plays on balls that aren't thrown perferct.

I will say the K.Williams long catch two weeks ago on the deep ball thrown behind him was a rare time when our receiver made a play. I don't care if the ball was purposely thrown "back shoulder" or just poorly thrown... IF our WR would go get that ball like that more often I think the 9ers would be more willing and more sucessful throwing deep.

Originally posted by 49erswillbeback:
My opinion is that the the receivers are doing the best job they can do with the ball that is presented to them. I thought that was obvious to everyone without making a thread to cover Alex Smith's bad throws which is what this thread was created to do.

No I beleive this thread was actually made for the purpose of pointing out the receivers could do more regardless who the qb is. A receivers job isnt to just go after the perfectly thrown catches, its to go after the ball and get it. If all a receiver had to do was only catch the perfect passes then it wouldn't be too hard for anyone to get a contract in the NFL.

Originally posted by Pick6:
I think the premise of this thread is absolutely right on.... and have for a while. Manning made a lot of passes that if you take away the effort from the receiver to make the catch would have been viewed as poor - but he knows there is a much better chance that his guys are going to go get and come down with the ball or at the very least try to break up an INT than there is that the DB will come away with it. I would really like to see a "jump ball" stat comparing us to other teams... we suck at that.

I think our unwillingness to go deep a lot is a combination of Smith not being extremely accurate deep and our WR not being aggressive enough to make plays on balls that aren't thrown perferct.

I will say the K.Williams long catch two weeks ago on the deep ball thrown behind him was a rare time when our receiver made a play. I don't care if the ball was purposely thrown "back shoulder" or just poorly thrown... IF our WR would go get that ball like that more often I think the 9ers would be more willing and more sucessful throwing deep.

It was perfectly thrown. When the ball is perfectly placed like that, it makes it a million times more easy for a receiver to make a big play. It all starts with the throw. That particular throw was perfect, and surprise surprise, the receiver makes a big play.

Am I the only one whose pet peeve is when people spell Carlos Rogers with a d?

Originally posted by YOUNGster08:

Am I the only one whose pet peeve is when people spell Carlos Rogers with a d?

Yes, probably.

And I was disappointed with Smith this game, but I haven't been particularly impressed with the receivers all season. They don't get paid to catch a ball which lands in their hands. They get paid to fight their way open and to go after the ball.

Originally posted by 49erswillbeback:
First few words of this thread "Something I noticed during the game. The Delanie Walker INT could have been avoided had Delanie attacked the ball instead of waiting for it to land in his hands." Really? Alex threw a bad ball and now a thread is being made to cover up all his bad balls? WOW!

If you can remember that game in London vs the Broncos.. Troy Smith threw a rainbow jump-ball to Walker.. in between two DBs named Dawkins and Bailey. Walker high pointed the ball on quite a jump and hauled it in.. and that catch was big-time. People that never liked Alex were suddenly championing Troy. Not because the throw was remarkable.. but because Troy trusted his guy to go up and get the ball. This is really no different than what Alex did... and yet he is vilified vs Troy being celebrated for it. Now why do you suppose that is?

( not really asking... we all know it is because Alex can do no right and any QB not named Alex Smith will be applauded for such a throw. You can admit that, but I expect no one to do so )

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by 49erswillbeback:
First few words of this thread "Something I noticed during the game. The Delanie Walker INT could have been avoided had Delanie attacked the ball instead of waiting for it to land in his hands." Really? Alex threw a bad ball and now a thread is being made to cover up all his bad balls? WOW!

If you can remember that game in London vs the Broncos.. Troy Smith threw a rainbow jump-ball to Walker.. in between two DBs named Dawkins and Bailey. Walker high pointed the ball on quite a jump and hauled it in.. and that catch was big-time. People that never liked Alex were suddenly championing Troy. Not because the throw was remarkable.. but because Troy trusted his guy to go up and get the ball. This is really no different than what Alex did... and yet he is vilified vs Troy being celebrated for it. Now why do you suppose that is?

( not really asking... we all know it is because Alex can do no right and any QB not named Alex Smith will be applauded for such a throw. You can admit that, but I expect no one to do so )

I all honesty, it was a different pass. Troy was still able to get it slightly behind the DB whereas Alex punted and it was short. Saw Peyton Manning throw a ball last night with defenders in a similar position. But Manning zipped it to the sidelines but high enough so player could undercut it. Smith threw it like a wheel route that was supposed to have no FS over the top.

It was just a bad throw. The difference between allowing a receiver to make a play on a ball and a ball getting picked is inches. Alex is usually a few inches off...like the one to Manningham that was a few inches too far to the inside and Manningham is a receiver who gets the ball so no excuses on that one? We are focusing way too much on the Walker pass but ignoring other throws that were off. It's not just one receiver but multiple throws.

An inch off makes a possible circus catch into an interception.

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by 49erswillbeback:
First few words of this thread "Something I noticed during the game. The Delanie Walker INT could have been avoided had Delanie attacked the ball instead of waiting for it to land in his hands." Really? Alex threw a bad ball and now a thread is being made to cover up all his bad balls? WOW!

If you can remember that game in London vs the Broncos.. Troy Smith threw a rainbow jump-ball to Walker.. in between two DBs named Dawkins and Bailey. Walker high pointed the ball on quite a jump and hauled it in.. and that catch was big-time. People that never liked Alex were suddenly championing Troy. Not because the throw was remarkable.. but because Troy trusted his guy to go up and get the ball. This is really no different than what Alex did... and yet he is vilified vs Troy being celebrated for it. Now why do you suppose that is?

( not really asking... we all know it is because Alex can do no right and any QB not named Alex Smith will be applauded for such a throw. You can admit that, but I expect no one to do so )

I all honesty, it was a different pass. Troy was still able to get it slightly behind the DB whereas Alex punted and it was short. Saw Peyton Manning throw a ball last night with defenders in a similar position. But Manning zipped it to the sidelines but high enough so player could undercut it. Smith threw it like a wheel route that was supposed to have no FS over the top.

It was just a bad throw. The difference between allowing a receiver to make a play on a ball and a ball getting picked is inches. Alex is usually a few inches off...like the one to Manningham that was a few inches too far to the inside and Manningham is a receiver who gets the ball so no excuses on that one? We are focusing way too much on the Walker pass but ignoring other throws that were off. It's not just one receiver but multiple throws.

An inch off makes a possible circus catch into an interception.

Wrong about a couple of things. The throw was basically the same.. same arc. Same TE/WR that had a shot at it. Only significant difference was that Walker was still running and then would have had to plant and jump.. which there was time for, had he the skills. The other thing you are wrong about is saying it was a poor throw. The ball was right in line for Walker had the FS not been there... but he was. That's why if anything, it was a poor decision. Alex thought the FS committed to the inside route to Rio.. but the FS quickly flipped his coverage to stay over on Walker.

Bottom line is that we have seen Walker come down with such a pass anyway.. and the pass was lauded back then for another QB. People wanted Alex to give his guys a chance... and he did give Walker a chance.. and Walker didn't have the tracking +/or effort to go and get the ball. The FS wanted it more.

... and people wonder why Alex doesn't give his guys more chances when they aren't perfectly open?

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:

Originally posted by 49erswillbeback:
First few words of this thread "Something I noticed during the game. The Delanie Walker INT could have been avoided had Delanie attacked the ball instead of waiting for it to land in his hands." Really? Alex threw a bad ball and now a thread is being made to cover up all his bad balls? WOW!

If you can remember that game in London vs the Broncos.. Troy Smith threw a rainbow jump-ball to Walker.. in between two DBs named Dawkins and Bailey. Walker high pointed the ball on quite a jump and hauled it in.. and that catch was big-time. People that never liked Alex were suddenly championing Troy. Not because the throw was remarkable.. but because Troy trusted his guy to go up and get the ball. This is really no different than what Alex did... and yet he is vilified vs Troy being celebrated for it. Now why do you suppose that is?

( not really asking... we all know it is because Alex can do no right and any QB not named Alex Smith will be applauded for such a throw. You can admit that, but I expect no one to do so )

I all honesty, it was a different pass. Troy was still able to get it slightly behind the DB whereas Alex punted and it was short. Saw Peyton Manning throw a ball last night with defenders in a similar position. But Manning zipped it to the sidelines but high enough so player could undercut it. Smith threw it like a wheel route that was supposed to have no FS over the top.

It was just a bad throw. The difference between allowing a receiver to make a play on a ball and a ball getting picked is inches. Alex is usually a few inches off...like the one to Manningham that was a few inches too far to the inside and Manningham is a receiver who gets the ball so no excuses on that one? We are focusing way too much on the Walker pass but ignoring other throws that were off. It's not just one receiver but multiple throws.

An inch off makes a possible circus catch into an interception.

Wrong about a couple of things. The throw was basically the same.. same arc. Same TE/WR that had a shot at it. Only significant difference was that Walker was still running and then would have had to plant and jump.. which there was time for, had he the skills. The other thing you are wrong about is saying it was a poor throw. The ball was right in line for Walker had the FS not been there... but he was. That's why if anything, it was a poor decision. Alex thought the FS committed to the inside route to Rio.. but the FS quickly flipped his coverage to stay over on Walker.

Bottom line is that we have seen Walker come down with such a pass anyway.. and the pass was lauded back then for another QB. People wanted Alex to give his guys a chance... and he did give Walker a chance.. and Walker didn't have the tracking +/or effort to go and get the ball. The FS wanted it more.

... and people wonder why Alex doesn't give his guys more chances when they aren't perfectly open?

The bold makes the biggest difference in the world. They were two different scenarios. One, Walker was pretty much at a standstill and was able to push and jump. The other, he was already running forward and was not able to standstill and jump.

Originally posted by Joecool:
The bold makes the biggest difference in the world. They were two different scenarios. One, Walker was pretty much at a standstill and was able to push and jump. The other, he was already running forward and was not able to standstill and jump.

Again.. he had time to plant an jump. A decent offensive receiver would have been able to do something... and we are going in pointless circles, so I'll be the first to walk away.