QB depth chart after 4th preseason game.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

God Tolzien. LOL....

Originally posted by 9erred:
I just watched the tape again, you get a different feel from Tolzien. He is reading the defesnes better, he makes reads and throws the receiver open. When Jed York was telling us that Baalke wanted Tolzien and was pissed when they did not get him, you now know Baalke knows what he is doing.

Truth!

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
1) Alex Smith - 14 - 4, NFC Championship game, low interceptions, definitely improved, worked on his mechanics, doesn't straighten out that knee so much anymore.


2) Scott Tolzien - clearly above and beyond any QB on our roster for pocket presense, awarness, accuracy. Practice squad? Please! Who are we kidding. No question he is the 2nd best QB on this team right now and I don't think it's close.


3) Colin Kaepernick - incredible, explosive, long run. Looks good outside the pocket. Clearly lacks timing, accuracy, decision making from within the pocket. Inside the pocket looks like he will struggle. He seems Tebow - esque. Great running and throwing outside the pocket running around. But confused and inaccurate inside the pocket. Not what you want. Looks exactly like the pistol offense guy he was at Nevade. Does he have huge upside? Yes. Is he ready now to be a pocket NFL QB? Hell no!


4) Josh Johnson - Harbaughs one time pupil at San Diego Torreros. At one time I thought Tolzien would be the odd man out. But I think it's him. There is talent, athleticism, and a pretty good arm there. And a history with Harbaugh. But why would you expose Tolzien who is CLEARLY better IMO? Keep him just because you have a history? I think you have to separate yourself from that. Look Alex makes it by default. Kaep didn't get picked that high to give up on. So he makes it too obviously. It comes down to 2 for 1 position. And I think Tolzien is clearly more accurate, more poised and greater command of things out there. Plus we already have 1 running QB. Why do we need 2? We need a pocket guy. And that's Tolzien.

It will be alex one, colin two, and Tolzien third. Get over it, your the same people who wanted david carr starting, you all hurt your credibility with that one...

Originally posted by 9erred:

Originally posted by monsterzero789:

1. Alex

2. Kaepernick (only because we have such a high draft pick invested in him. He needs more time to develop)

3. Tolzien (2nd best qb on the roster right now)

4. Johnson (don't see him making the team)

I hope you see your flawed logic above. If tolzien is the 2nd best qb on the team, draft status should not matter. He should be #2. Remember when other low draft picks beat out high draft picks to start??

Brady > made Bledsoe a back uip
Kurt Warner> got starting job by injury never looked back
Gus Ferrotte- started over Heath Schuler although Heath was a high pick.

I just watched the tape again, you get a different feel from Tolzien. He is reading the defesnes better, he makes reads and throws the receiver open. When Jed York was telling us that Baalke wanted Tolzien and was pissed when they did not get him, you now know Baalke knows what he is doing.

I agree that draft status doesn't matter and the best player should play. But we are talking about someone who unless Alex goes down won't see the field much at all. So they can afford to take their time with kaep. By the end of preseason it could be a real possibility that Tolzien is #2. But for now I think they stay with how it is. Kaep wasn't that impressive but he did look better than he did last season.

Originally posted by 9erred:

I just watched the tape again, you get a different feel from Tolzien. He is reading the defesnes better, he makes reads and throws the receiver open. When Jed York was telling us that Baalke wanted Tolzien and was pissed when they did not get him, you now know Baalke knows what he is doing.

It seems you're under the impression that feelings have some sort of bearing on a qbs future success. I'm sure many QBs who have failed horribly have made a fan "feel" like he's special. Hell, the last 10 years how many guys have we had who have had that "feel" to them ( ), I seem to recall it happening quite a bit; Basically whenever we had a QB who wasn't a total f**k-job.

I'm not saying Tolzien isn't God, or that he has no chance of being a quality starter in this league, but to act like a feeling based off of 1-2 quarters of play is a sign that a guy is special...that s**t's cray.

And as for Baalke wanting him and that being a good sign because Baalke knows what hes doing...I agree. but I question how much Baalke wanted him. Actions speak louder than words and Baalke worked his ass off to trade up for Kaepernick.

Remember that CK got drafted soon after Andy Dalton. AD got his team into the playoffs last year and generally showed poise and maturity. On the other hand, CK is nothing more that a gimmick QB at this point. His run was great, but how often will that happen in the regular season? Harbaugh may use him for a change-of-pace QB for a few plays, but if Alex goes down it won't be CK going in. CK still has a huge telegraphed wind-up and when he throws over the middle, almost every pass looks like a potential INT.

Tolzien is a competent back-up QB. JJ still has potential. No NFL team has a better stable of QBs. JH knows QBs, and knows how to develop them.Two months into the regular season, we will see the likes of Charlie Batch starting for several teams. QBs go down almost every week. Keep all 4 till then and auction of one to the highest bidder.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

wow. that would've been sweet.

Just as a complete side note, I don't think anyone here is dismissing anything Alex Smith did last season. He is the undisputed starter, regardless of what happens in the preseason. He's earned that by helping us get to where we were last season. That said, I got that same "feeling" from Tolzien last offseason when he played against us with San Diego. I remember watching with awe, thinking to myself "why didn't we go after THIS guy??!" Watching Kaepernick last preseason was what it was -- painfully watching a rookie go through his growing pains. But Tolzien -- also a rookie --- displayed a cool and calm demeanor that none of our quarterbacks, at the time, had. He looked almost polished, albeit a bit raw, with only a few weeks of digesting a playbook.

Fast forward to last night. It's obvious Kaep has made a degree of improvement. He looked much more calm, and seemed to have taken the next step. But he still looks uncertain in the pocket. Enter Tolzien...that same polished looking pocket passer from last season seems to have taken a step forward, as well. He took complete command of the offense, and he seemed to have complete trust in his teammates abilities (and we're talking about second and third stringers!).

If Kaepernick has taken an appropriate step forward, then Tolzien has as well. Being that he was already ahead of Kaep last offseason, I'd say he's just as much ahead of him this offseason, if not by much more! Unfortunately, draft stock is still playing it's part in the decision making process. Because of the investment, they WANT Kaep to be the better QB. But with a few more performances like last night, it won't be long until Harbaugh/Baalke have to admit they were off with their assessment of Kaep --- and there's nothing wrong with that.

Mistakes can be made --- just make them RIGHT in the end.

I pretty much agree with the order. However, let us not forget this is
#1 Just the first preseason game
#2 Where or who they are playing at the time they enter the game.
#3 The vikings weren't at full strength on the other side of the ball (not trying to rain on anyones parade, but we need to keep things in proper perspective if you are assessing things.)

Last year I wanted Josh because he is familiar with JH and has some experience, but now I don't see him making the team, because he and Kaep are similar. Kaep, is younger however and by the time he accumilates the # of years Josh has, I expect him to be much much better. Plus if Tolz keeps improving throughout the preseason, no way he makes it to the practice squad without someone picking him up like we did off San Diego, hell SD might return the favor if we tried. You want to keep your young talent.

Tolz looked good and yes he was playing with and against lesser players, so I'd like to see him with and against more talented players and over a series of games before annoiting him the next best thing. Still, things are looking good. The interception was not his fault, but (and this is being nit picking), hope he gets a better feel for those moments and takes the sack instead of forcing the throwing when the pocket collapses like that. He did miss, according to the announcer Reuland on the previous play that would have been an easy six. In that one he was fixated on the screen I believe.

I also like how Alex was decisive in his descesions in this game. Placed the ball where he had to and trusted wr to adjust. Also, saw the pocket collapsing and didn't try to dance around to buy time and made a dash and almost picked up the first down. Then in another just let in fling without trying to make sure his feet was properly set first.

Criticize Kaep all you want, but he moved the ball and got two scores, could have gotten a third if had 30 more seconds on the clock. Not saying he will be Steve Young, but people forget how raw Steve was and how much he had to be reeled in to be more of a pocket passer. Plus unlike, Walsh, JH doesn't mind letting his QB's run. Most don't want their QB's running cause they don't want them getting hurt, but we all know JH is not conventional.

Still a long way to go, but it was a good start.

Did anybody see who it was that gave up the hit? Was it Mike Person?

Originally posted by monsterzero789:
I agree that draft status doesn't matter and the best player should play. But we are talking about someone who unless Alex goes down won't see the field much at all. So they can afford to take their time with kaep. By the end of preseason it could be a real possibility that Tolzien is #2. But for now I think they stay with how it is. Kaep wasn't that impressive but he did look better than he did last season.

I think people forget how unconventional JH is, everyone is doing the spread or some type of wide open passing offense, people have even talked about the west coast offense when talking about his style, which is in my view a misnomer. I like what the announcer said when the other brought up the term of the niners running a WC off, he said. "more like a midwest offense." I couldn't help but agree and laugh.

If anything Harbaugh is unconventional and likes his QB's athletic, look at his history. He liked Kaep and likes proving people wrong (like when he kept Alex), I amsure this is not so much a Baalke pick but JH pick and when Baalke said you sure this is the one, JH nodded then Baalke made it happen. However, JH is not studpid either, he didn't like what Tolz did to us, so just like LMJ, if you can't beat'm, make them join your team.

Originally posted by Gore_21:
Did anybody see who it was that gave up the hit? Was it Mike Person?

Don't know, but if he did, it just adds to the fact he may not make the team, cause one source said to a reporter that he hasn't been looking good in camp. If that is true, don't want another Chilo.

Yeah Tolzien did look pretty good, but lets not forget he played in the third qtr. not the first and second. Kap made plays against legit starters, and Tolzien put up a good effort against mostly special teamers and PS guys. Kaps our #2. Tolzien is a very close #3.

Originally posted by Gore_21:
Did anybody see who it was that gave up the hit? Was it Mike Person?

yep

JJ wanted sooooo badly to be reunited with Harbaugh and to have a chance to compete for the starting position with the 9ers...wonder what he's thinking now?

I'm thinking he might have figured he was going into a familiar situation. Pretty sure he didn't think he'd have this much competition with Alex Smith and a few rookies...let alone having to worry about just making the team.