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Better Defensive Player?

Better Defensive Player?

I love P Willis, but in a 3-4 defense the D-linemen are more important to the team success than the MLBs. If we were playing a 4-3 it'd be different.
Originally posted by Leathaface:
I love P Willis, but in a 3-4 defense the D-linemen are more important to the team success than the MLBs. If we were playing a 4-3 it'd be different.

Not really your d lineman are more critical to success in almost any scheme, but that doesn't mean a once in a generation player like Willis can't be the MVP of this particular defense, and make no mistake 34 defenses do require extremely athletic inside linebackers. A safety is normally one of the lowest paid positions on any given team, but a guy like Troy Polamalu in his prime was a normally the best defensive player on the field for a series of very very good defenses. The things Willis can do for a defense in the run game cannot be understated. He took us from complete garbage to decent in his rookie year and we have gotten better ever since
[ Edited by DirtyP on Jun 17, 2012 at 10:07 PM ]
  • Chief
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How beautiful is it that we can have this argument?
Let me see... PWillis has been a top ten def player since he came in the league and Justin has been a awesome player and is really finding his niche kinda late. I will have to say Willis.

He has more assignments and less mileage than Justin and has always been number one avoidance focus of offenses that we play. That said not many are Running up Justin's gap either without holding, chipping or chopping.
When we got him we were trying our best to get Jared Allen who even visited us at the time. I must admit that I wasn't pleased back then, but now I wonder how I could even remember that we courted Allen the way smith has played.
  • Axl49
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OMG I .....CANT.......CHOOSE!!!!!!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
  • Axl49
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Always have loved Smith even in Cincy was always a monster and got no love till this day he barely is starting to get recognized. P willis since day one has been a beast though. AND WE HAVE THEM BOTH ON OUR TEAM
Originally posted by tmpluff:
Originally posted by VDpwndMjenkins:
Originally posted by DirtyP:
Patrick Willis will be in the hall of fame Justin Smith will not

Says who????

Just curious, are you doubting Willis going to the HOF or that Smith won't?

Smith not goin.lmao,sayin Patrick not goin is a sin of the highest order.

Thanx for askin,I shoulda clarified.DERP
  • mike
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Depends on what you mean.

Better at his position?- P.Willis. Easily one of the best up there with only Ray Lewis. J.Smith is also one of the better DE's in the league but doesn't post the double digit sack monster numbers a hand full of guys post up. Don't get me wrong overall he's an amazing player and his numbers don't always reflect his motor, but would you say he's top two at his position the way Willis is?No.

Now, if the question is which guy impacts our team more and, if we somehow lost one of them, which would hurt our D more to lose? The answer would be Justin. We lost Willis last year and had solid play from Larry Grant and Bowman. It's a matter of which position is more important to football teams today.

Take Justin out and Aldon wouldn't have the help he had last year to get his double digit sacks. We don't really have proven depth there either, with someone like Dobbs having to step in if Justin got hurt. I have no doubt that we'd struggle to get pressure with just the front 4 like we were able to get last year. We'd be forced to blitz, opening up opportunities for any elite QB to rip us open.

I can't choose unless someone tells me which it is, better player period or person we'd miss the most?
[ Edited by mike on Jun 18, 2012 at 12:47 AM ]
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:

Good comparison
Originally posted by DirtyP:
Originally posted by strickac:
Willis, easily.

Justin was nearly considered a bust early in his career. Willis instantly was in the elite status when he entered the league. Willis is the consensus best MLB in the game. Justin, even in his prime, is among the best, but he doesn't dominate his competition (other DEs) like Willis does.

I'm a huge Justin fan, but I think he'd be easier to replace than Willis. We're just fortunate to have guys like Bowman and McDonald complimenting them.

Not even close. Only considered a bust by Bengals fans who don't know how to appreciate good line play

Thank you!!!dog,I live in ohio and thats exactly why they didnt resign him.(besides mike brown bein the worse owner of a franchise next to the bidwells)
Originally posted by Chief:
How beautiful is it that we can have this argument?

No f**kin doubt
Originally posted by mike:
Depends on what you mean.

Better at his position?- P.Willis. Easily one of the best up there with only Ray Lewis. J.Smith is also one of the better DE's in the league but doesn't post the double digit sack monster numbers a hand full of guys post up. Don't get me wrong overall he's an amazing player and his numbers don't always reflect his motor, but would you say he's top two at his position the way Willis is?No.

Now, if the question is which guy impacts our team more and, if we somehow lost one of them, which would hurt our D more to lose? The answer would be Justin. We lost Willis last year and had solid play from Larry Grant and Bowman. It's a matter of which position is more important to football teams today.

Take Justin out and Aldon wouldn't have the help he had last year to get his double digit sacks. We don't really have proven depth there either, with someone like Dobbs having to step in if Justin got hurt. I have no doubt that we'd struggle to get pressure with just the front 4 like we were able to get last year. We'd be forced to blitz, opening up opportunities for any elite QB to rip us open.

I can't choose unless someone tells me which it is, better player period or person we'd miss the most?


Not only is Justin Smith far and away the best player at his position, he was the best defensive player in the league last year.

It could easily be argued that Bowman outplayed Willis last year.
  • mike
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Originally posted by BrianGO:
Not only is Justin Smith far and away the best player at his position, he was the best defensive player in the league last year.

It could easily be argued that Bowman outplayed Willis last year.

In a league that values pass rush and playmaking stats, I doubt that. He didn't win DPOY, Suggs did.

As for guys within his own position, Jared Allen? 22 sacks, 8 more tackles than Smith, a safety, one more FF than Smith, an interception...So I would say he was better. Then you can look at a guy like Jean Pierre Paul with easily the most tackles at his position, 16.5 sacks, a safety, and 2 FF. (not to mention a dominant postseason)

That's just without going into guys with fewer tackles but way more sacks, guys like Babin, clemons, long and avril.

Bowman would have outplayed willis IF all that mattered was stopping the run. These days dominating the run is a luxury compared to stopping the pass. Turnovers are also key, and Bowman had zero forced fumbles compared to Willis' 4(in fewer games).
[ Edited by mike on Jun 18, 2012 at 2:20 AM ]
Once again, apples and oranges. Just glad to have both on the team.