Why did we overpay so much for Brooks? And where does that leave us now?

Originally posted by SportsFan:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
I'm glad to have him back too. But an average OLB is not worth $44 million.... How do we plan on signing these guys now?


~ Alex Smith - ascending albeit not great. 2nd year players are much worse than him. Don't kid yourself.

~ Dashon Goldson - Turned down 5 years and $25 million last year before his monster year. Will be espensive this year.

~ Carlos Rogers - Would love to have him back. But huge money for a 31 year old CB doesn't make sense.

~ Adam Snyder - Have you seen Chilo play? Don't think this guy is important?.....

~ Ted Ginn - Have you seen Kyle Williams try to return kicks? Do you think going into 2012 with KW as your primary return man is a good idea?.....


With the massive overpayment to Brooks now multiple of these may not be able to be signed. I just don't know what the front office was thinking? The highest sacks he ever had was 7. The highest tackes he ever had was 49. You explain it to me?

IMO he's a product of the players around him. Justin Smith and Aldon Smith are beasts. And Ray McDonald is hugely underrated. Sopoaga is good. Willis is great. Bowman is good. He's in a phenomenal front 7. And the attention is put to other guys. I just don't think he is $44 million good. And it has future salary cap implications. I'm fine with keeping our players. But I don't think that means massively overpay. We could have made OLB a priority in the draft too and picked up Vincent Jackson or Bowe with the money. I just don't know about this deal. Glad to have him back? Yes. At this price? No way.

You would think someone with 30k posts would know a few things

1) there is already a thread on the Brooks signing. Or did you feel our misguided opinion required its own special thread

2) Your opinion is misguided as it appears you don't have a basic understanding of how NFL contracts work

During the off season, SanDiego always looks to criticize anything and everything the 49ers FO and coaching staff do. Either he is a fairweather fan (my belief) or he just likes stirring up adversity where none exists... or maybe both.

Brooks was not overpaid. Paraag and Baalke are very smart football people.

Originally posted by Eli_23:
U can't spell overreaction without ovary

um yeah, yeah you can.

You're an idiot. You need to do your homework on how contracts play out bud. Be happy that our front seven is intact. Now go have a beer and smoke a bowl...

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by SFrush:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Wimbley had 11 sacks and 69 tackles as career highs respectively. Show me when Brooks did that?.....

The 11 sacks came his rookie season. He hasn't reached double digit sacks since. Maybe I'm missing something.

When did Brooks ever do 11 sacks? Ever? Above 10 ever? Double digits. Aldon Smith came in and did it as a rookie and made it look easy.

SD -

You are getting to hung up on the stats. You dont think Harbaugh, Vic and Baalke have looked at every single play involving Brooks 3 and 4 times over? There are a lot of things the stat line wont capture. Clearly what our FO saw on film (and everyday workouts) impressed them enough to offer him what they did. This isn't some FA that they've only watched film on or read about. He's been on the team for 3/4 years. They know him well. The bottom line is this signing wont stop us from signing the rest of the guys we value in FA. And if we can keep one of the most elite front 7s in history together for a few more years then its worth it.

I'm fine with keeping this front 7 together and think it's a good idea. I just hope we can sign the rest of the guys we also want.

Originally posted by longtime49erfan:
During the off season, SanDiego always looks to criticize anything and everything the 49ers FO and coaching staff do. Either he is a fairweather fan (my belief) or he just likes stirring up adversity where none exists... or maybe both.

Brooks was not overpaid. Paraag and Baalke are very smart football people.

I agree that Paraag and Baalke seem to know what they are doing, and for a while now. Add Harbaugh to the mix, I think all decisions are more or less a reflection of a smart group of people. I assume they knew the implications of signing Brooks to that deal, how much it leaves for the rest of the folks,etc. It's well documented who the free agents are, and the org basically knows by now how much each of those players potentially want. This is a business...you win some and you lose some.

Originally posted by ImaMod:


We hit and miss with OLBs for 5 years and we finally find a couple and people get mad that we resign him for $17 mil guaranteed ($44 mil total)...

3-4 OLBs are very hard to find because they require such a large skill set... A good OLB has to be able to...

rush the passer

be strong against the run

set the edge

occasionally drop back in coverage, and...

play with a hand in the dirt sometimes.

Brooks is definitely worth the money because he's the most complete OLB on the team right now. (Aldon needs work against the run and in pass coverage).

Slightly edited but with the main points emphasized... (thanks ImaMod)

Note to all those zoners who are questioning this contract: This was a bargain!! If Brooks hits the open market, he gets perhaps $22-25 mil guaranteed. He is a special player (for the reasons above) and was by far the best OLB on the market.

Simply put, I don't think many of you realize how good a player Brooks actually is... IMHO, he has the talent to make multiple Pro Bowl teams. When he was drafted, he was considered an elite athlete and only some character concerns kept him from being a first round pick. He is now 28 and much more mentally mature.

Brooks played virtually every down on a championship caliber defense and by all accounts, played a huge role in making it so. What is not to like about resigning a guy like that for a deserved raise when he is in his prime? Also, before the signing the team was woefully thin at OLB having kept just 3 on the entire roster all of this past season and this now allows the Niners to avoid having to take an OLB in their first 3-4 selections in the upcoming draft. Gee, that sucks!

Quit your b*tchin!

Cheers!

I trust Paraage.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by SFrush:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Wimbley had 11 sacks and 69 tackles as career highs respectively. Show me when Brooks did that?.....

The 11 sacks came his rookie season. He hasn't reached double digit sacks since. Maybe I'm missing something.

When did Brooks ever do 11 sacks? Ever? Above 10 ever? Double digits. Aldon Smith came in and did it as a rookie and made it look easy.

SD -

You are getting to hung up on the stats. You dont think Harbaugh, Vic and Baalke have looked at every single play involving Brooks 3 and 4 times over? There are a lot of things the stat line wont capture. Clearly what our FO saw on film (and everyday workouts) impressed them enough to offer him what they did. This isn't some FA that they've only watched film on or read about. He's been on the team for 3/4 years. They know him well. The bottom line is this signing wont stop us from signing the rest of the guys we value in FA. And if we can keep one of the most elite front 7s in history together for a few more years then its worth it.

I'm fine with keeping this front 7 together and think it's a good idea. I just hope we can sign the rest of the guys we also want.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by SFrush:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Wimbley had 11 sacks and 69 tackles as career highs respectively. Show me when Brooks did that?.....

The 11 sacks came his rookie season. He hasn't reached double digit sacks since. Maybe I'm missing something.

When did Brooks ever do 11 sacks? Ever? Above 10 ever? Double digits. Aldon Smith came in and did it as a rookie and made it look easy.

SD -

You are getting to hung up on the stats. You dont think Harbaugh, Vic and Baalke have looked at every single play involving Brooks 3 and 4 times over? There are a lot of things the stat line wont capture. Clearly what our FO saw on film (and everyday workouts) impressed them enough to offer him what they did. This isn't some FA that they've only watched film on or read about. He's been on the team for 3/4 years. They know him well. The bottom line is this signing wont stop us from signing the rest of the guys we value in FA. And if we can keep one of the most elite front 7s in history together for a few more years then its worth it.

I'm fine with keeping this front 7 together and think it's a good idea. I just hope we can sign the rest of the guys we also want.

You dont think Praag the mathmatical geek has the numbers all maped out? I highly doubt they are just doing one offs. As Baalke has said, they have a value assigned to each guy. I assume that means they know at one point one players contract would prevent them from signing anothers. If they gave Brooks 7 million a year (potentially) its because they felt they could still sign the players they want for the value they want them. It will work out. I bet we sign Goldson, Brooks, Morgan and Snyder to long term deals. I wouldn't be suprised or that upset if the rest walked. That would be a pretty kick ass offseason assuming we get a corner or maybe keep Spencer around?

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
But an average OLB is not worth $44 million.... How do we plan on signing these guys now?

With the massive overpayment to Brooks now multiple of these may not be able to be signed. I just don't know what the front office was thinking? The highest sacks he ever had was 7. The highest tackes he ever had was 49. You explain it to me?

IMO he's a product of the players around him. Justin Smith and Aldon Smith are beasts. And Ray McDonald is hugely underrated. Sopoaga is good. Willis is great. Bowman is good. He's in a phenemonal front 7. And the attention is put to other guys. I just don't think he is $44 million good. And it has future salary cap implications. I'm fine with keeping our players. But I don't think that means massively overpay. We could have made OLB a priority in the draft too and picked up Vincent Jackson or Bowe with the money. I just don't know about this deal. Glad to have him back? Yes. At this price? No way.

Try waiting until the details of the contract are released before claiming this contract is a "massive overpayment."

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by SFrush:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Wimbley had 11 sacks and 69 tackles as career highs respectively. Show me when Brooks did that?.....

The 11 sacks came his rookie season. He hasn't reached double digit sacks since. Maybe I'm missing something.

When did Brooks ever do 11 sacks? Ever? Above 10 ever? Double digits. Aldon Smith came in and did it as a rookie and made it look easy.

SD -

You are getting to hung up on the stats. You dont think Harbaugh, Vic and Baalke have looked at every single play involving Brooks 3 and 4 times over? There are a lot of things the stat line wont capture. Clearly what our FO saw on film (and everyday workouts) impressed them enough to offer him what they did. This isn't some FA that they've only watched film on or read about. He's been on the team for 3/4 years. They know him well. The bottom line is this signing wont stop us from signing the rest of the guys we value in FA. And if we can keep one of the most elite front 7s in history together for a few more years then its worth it.

I'm fine with keeping this front 7 together and think it's a good idea. I just hope we can sign the rest of the guys we also want.

You dont think Praag the mathmatical geek has the numbers all maped out? I highly doubt they are just doing one offs. As Baalke has said, they have a value assigned to each guy. I assume that means they know at one point one players contract would prevent them from signing anothers. If they gave Brooks 7 million a year (potentially) its because they felt they could still sign the players they want for the value they want them. It will work out. I bet we sign Goldson, Brooks, Morgan and Snyder to long term deals. I wouldn't be suprised or that upset if the rest walked. That would be a pretty kick ass offseason assuming we get a corner or maybe keep Spencer around?

I don't see Ted Ginn in there or Alex Smith. The young guys are not ready (QB's). Think about it. But for 2 fumbled punt returns ALEX SMITH would have had us in the Super Bowl. He really would have.

What about Vincent Jackson? How do we sign him now?

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by crabman82:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
He won't be paid $44 Million . . .

if your against the deal, you'll reference 44 mil, if u like the deal you'll reference 17.5 mil, simply put its just how it is

If he meets all incentives and signing bonuses he will get $44 million. That's too much of a cap # for an average OLB. I repeat he had 7 sacks tops in his career and 49 tackles tops. That's the best he ever did. EVER! Rediculous what they paid him and how he will effect our cap for years to come.

This is just like last offseason.. these Vets are coming out of the woodwork to critique moves, and will soon go back into the wood work during the season when they actually work out. It's as though your elevator isnt' going to the top floor...if he meets all incentives...HE WON'T BE PLAYING LIKE AN AVERAGE OLB

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by SFrush:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Wimbley had 11 sacks and 69 tackles as career highs respectively. Show me when Brooks did that?.....

The 11 sacks came his rookie season. He hasn't reached double digit sacks since. Maybe I'm missing something.

When did Brooks ever do 11 sacks? Ever? Above 10 ever? Double digits. Aldon Smith came in and did it as a rookie and made it look easy.

SD -

You are getting to hung up on the stats. You dont think Harbaugh, Vic and Baalke have looked at every single play involving Brooks 3 and 4 times over? There are a lot of things the stat line wont capture. Clearly what our FO saw on film (and everyday workouts) impressed them enough to offer him what they did. This isn't some FA that they've only watched film on or read about. He's been on the team for 3/4 years. They know him well. The bottom line is this signing wont stop us from signing the rest of the guys we value in FA. And if we can keep one of the most elite front 7s in history together for a few more years then its worth it.

I'm fine with keeping this front 7 together and think it's a good idea. I just hope we can sign the rest of the guys we also want.

You dont think Praag the mathmatical geek has the numbers all maped out? I highly doubt they are just doing one offs. As Baalke has said, they have a value assigned to each guy. I assume that means they know at one point one players contract would prevent them from signing anothers. If they gave Brooks 7 million a year (potentially) its because they felt they could still sign the players they want for the value they want them. It will work out. I bet we sign Goldson, Brooks, Morgan and Snyder to long term deals. I wouldn't be suprised or that upset if the rest walked. That would be a pretty kick ass offseason assuming we get a corner or maybe keep Spencer around?

I don't see Ted Ginn in there or Alex Smith. The young guys are not ready (QB's). Think about it. But for 2 fumbled punt returns ALEX SMITH would have had us in the Super Bowl. He really would have.

What about Vincent Jackson? How do we sign him now?

LOL....I dont know how I over looked Smith....duh.

I'm not sure if the question of VJ was a joke? I doubt a big name FA was ever in the plans. Not that everything Baalke says is gospel, but he did say FA is a marathon, not a sprint. He was implying that he's not going to get into bidding wars for the high priced/ over priced 1st tier FAs. Unless Jackson (D and V) ended up on the market weeks after March 13th, I dont see them in the plans.

P.S. Ginn may or not stay. I wont lose sleep either way.

All I have to say to the OP is...drugs are bad m'kay! Why is is so hard to understand that if Brooks plays average then he won't earn the full contract! If he does earn the full contract then it means he plays ABOVE average and becomes a pro-bowler.

Also, I highly suggest you forget about any big name free agents. If you haven't figured out Baalke's strategy yet then you will be very disappointed when free agency starts. He believes in building through the draft and finding undervalued free agents.

It was evident that the team would have to choose between keeping Brooks or Rogers. Most people, myself included, thought Brooks would be allowed to leave but Baalke/Harbaugh chose Brooks and that's fine with me. I'm not going to argue against those two.

For all of the people that said we overpaid for Brooks......yes we may have but 44 Million is not guaranteed, 17.5 million is guaranteed. He is going to have to play out of his mind to make the 44 million which is good for us.

Ahmad Brooks is very close to being elite, he had 7.5 sacks, (he should have had more), 3rd on the team in pressures, 11 tackles for losses and it was his first year as a starter in a new system. The guy is going to get better.

And look at the list of the linebackers that were free agents, if we didn't resign Brooks we would have been screwed. We would have no depth at OLB, we practically have no depth there now.

Say we didn't resign brooks.......WHO WOULD WE HAVE PICKED UP that is anywhere close? Brooks also plays all downs and can play DE. He would have been signed by another team for sure.

Jarret Johnson, DE/OLB, Ravens. Age: 31. Jarret Johnson doesn't rush the passer well despite playing outside linebacker in a 3-4. He's amazing in all other facets of the game, however. He's one of the most underrated players in the NFL.

Ahmad Brooks, DE/OLB, 49ers. Age: 28. Ahmad Brooks has developed into a potent pass-rusher. He had seven sacks in 2011, but could have had a few more, as he was unlucky in certain situations.

Erin Henderson, OLB, Vikings. Age: 26. Erin Henderson had a solid year at weakside linebacker for the Vikings. At just 26, he has a bright future ahead of him.

Leroy Hill, OLB, Seahawks. Age: 29. Leroy Hill, b*****d of Lannisport, is a three-down weakside linebacker with no liabilities, save for health. He was always injury-prone, but made it through unscathed in 2011. He'll be 30 on Sept. 14.

Manny Lawson, OLB, Bengals. Age: 28. As expected, Manny Lawson thrived in the 4-3. He was a stout run defender as a two-down strongside linebacker in Cincinnati's stop unit.

Rocky McIntosh, OLB, Redskins. Age: 29. I called Rocky McIntosh an idiot for re-signing with the Redskins last offseason. He's not a good fit in the 3-4. I don't get how he didn't understand that. Maybe he'll learn his lesson and sign on with a 4-3 team.

Phillip Wheeler, OLB, Colts. Age: 27. Phillip Wheeler is a pretty solid two-down weakside linebacker who thrives in run support. The Colts should re-sign him.

Wesley Woodyard, OLB, Broncos. Age: 26. Wesley Woodyard could be a starting weakside linebacker somewhere, but didn't get the opportunity to play at that position this past year because of D.J. Williams.

Aaron Maybin (RFA), DE/OLB, Jets. Age: 24. Aaron Maybin notched six sacks with the Jets last year, but had none in his final four games. It seemed like teams caught on to him. Chris Chamberlain, OLB, Rams. Age: 26.

Chris Chamberlain is a special teams ace and a solid reserve/two-down spot starter at linebacker. He plays well against the run, but gets lost in coverage. Russell Allen (RFA), OLB, Jaguars. Age: 26. Russell Allen stepped in for an injured Clint Session at weakside linebacker toward the end of last season, and did a solid job.
Bobby Carpenter, OLB, Lions. Age: 29. Brandon Johnson, OLB, Bengals. Age: 29. Mario Haggan, OLB, Broncos. Age: 32. Gary Guyton, OLB, Patriots. Age: 26. Erik Walden, DE/OLB, Packers. Age: 27. Brady Poppinga, OLB, Rams. Age: 32. Kenny Onatlu (RFA), OLB, Vikings. Age: 29. Ernie Sims, OLB, Colts. Age: 27. Jamaal Westerman (RFA), DE/OLB, Jets. Age: 27. Clark Haggans, DE/OLB, Cardinals. Age: 35. Jo-Lonn Dunbar, OLB, Saints. Age: 27. Mike Peterson, OLB, Falcons. Age: 36. Thomas Williams, OLB, Panthers. Age: 27. Dan Skuta (RFA), OLB, Bengals. Age: 26. Ashlee Palmer (RFA), OLB, Lions. Age: 26. David Vobora, OLB, Seahawks. Age: 26. Tracy White, OLB, Patriots. Age: 31. Bryan Kehl, OLB, Rams. Age: 28. Isaiah Ekejiuba, OLB, Lions. Age: 30. Joey Porter, DE/OLB, Cardinals. Age: 35. Omar Gaither, OLB, Panthers. Age: 28. Jason Phillips (RFA), OLB, Panthers. Age: 26. -- Re-signed with Panthers (1 year)Xavier Adibi, OLB, Vikings. Age: 27. Patrick Bailey, OLB, Titans. Age: 26. Edgar Jones, DE/OLB, Ravens. Age: 27.