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Can the Niners attain No. 1 seed in NFC?

  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by HessianDud:
yeah, the Steelers are playing really well right now. They have good balance, for sure, and more experience.

I don't care about the rankings. The Niners have the most efficient passing game in the league. The Steelers put up big numbers but pass the ball twice as much a game and are near the top of the league in sacks allowed. The Niners excel in all three phases of the game and are near the top of the league in many important categories, in every phase.

Efficient thanks to the Defense. They don't take any real risks passing the ball like most teams. I'm sure if Big Ben was restricted in what he was able to do his numbers would look great too. They are willing to take more risks and rely on the defense. Which is what the 49ers should do considering they have one of the best defenses in the league.
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
yeah, the Steelers are playing really well right now. They have good balance, for sure, and more experience.

I don't care about the rankings. The Niners have the most efficient passing game in the league. The Steelers put up big numbers but pass the ball twice as much a game and are near the top of the league in sacks allowed. The Niners excel in all three phases of the game and are near the top of the league in many important categories, in every phase.

Efficient thanks to the Defense. They don't take any real risks passing the ball like most teams. I'm sure if Big Ben was restricted in what he was able to do his numbers would look great too. They are willing to take more risks and rely on the defense. Which is what the 49ers should do considering they have one of the best defenses in the league.

No...efficient in all phases.

#1 in points per yard gained and #1 in points allowed per yard gained.
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
yeah, the Steelers are playing really well right now. They have good balance, for sure, and more experience.

I don't care about the rankings. The Niners have the most efficient passing game in the league. The Steelers put up big numbers but pass the ball twice as much a game and are near the top of the league in sacks allowed. The Niners excel in all three phases of the game and are near the top of the league in many important categories, in every phase.

Efficient thanks to the Defense. They don't take any real risks passing the ball like most teams. I'm sure if Big Ben was restricted in what he was able to do his numbers would look great too. They are willing to take more risks and rely on the defense. Which is what the 49ers should do considering they have one of the best defenses in the league.


sorry, that makes no sense. the passing offense is efficient because we complete a high percentage of passes without turning it over and convert short fields into scores. you can thank the defense for the short field but you have to credit the offense for doing something with it.

the offense, particularly the passing offense, can get better, and it must. we need to get better on 3rd downs. we need to complete the long shots that we do take (because we do take shots downfield, but are inconsistent in completing them.), and we need to get even better in the red zone (we're ok, and convert in most "clutch" situations, but can improve). So there's a lot of room for improvement. but despite the yardage rankings the passing offense is not poor. Its working, the entire offense is working, and it gets better every week.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
the packers are good. they got hot and had a great postseason and Rodgers has been playing out of his mind since they lost to the Lions last year. But they're not invincible. They have a poor running game and a suspect defense overall, especially against the pass. not sure how they are against the run.

not saying the niners are as good, or better, but they are more balanced. they're the most balanced team in the league, IMO.

In the NFL nobody is invincible, anybody can lose to anybody but there are elite teams and Green bay is one of them. Not sure how you can call the 49ers balanced when the passing offense is second to last. The Steelers are the most balanced team in the league.

Ya want balance?

Niners vs Browns. 174 yards passing, 174 yards rushing.

The rest of the NFL is IMbalanced toward the pass. That's why the Niners are 31st.

The NFL has become more and more of a passing league. Defenses have adjusted and are sheming ways to stop the pass (line the wide 9 in Detroit and Philly). The players are fast edge type players and big run stuffing Bs are dinosaurs.

Enter a team willing to put 6 or 7 O-Linemen in a game with 2 TEs....and Pass. The Niners are STOMPING people. Its a change of philosophy. Don't be surprised if people copy it.

Oh yeah....and the Niners have run 214 times to 185 passes. Thats a difference of 29.

Steelers have run 212 times to 286 passes. Thats a differenc of 74.

How exactly are they more balanced?
  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by HessianDud:

sorry, that makes no sense. the passing offense is efficient because we complete a high percentage of passes without turning it over and convert short fields into scores. you can thank the defense for the short field but you have to credit the offense for doing something with it.

the offense, particularly the passing offense, can get better, and it must. we need to get better on 3rd downs. we need to complete the long shots that we do take (because we do take shots downfield, but are inconsistent in completing them.), and we need to get even better in the red zone (we're ok, and convert in most "clutch" situations, but can improve). So there's a lot of room for improvement. but despite the yardage rankings the passing offense is not poor. Its working, the entire offense is working, and it gets better every week.

How does it not make sense? Completing a high percentage of passes is a deceptive stat. I'm more concerned about Smith overthrowing and missing wide open deep passes. He missed 3 last week. That's uncalled for at this level with his experience. I like to look ahead and I can't see this working for too much longer once teams prepare for Gore more and more. I can't wait until the Baltimore game. That's going to show whether or not this style offense is effective or not. IMO
  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Oh yeah....and the Niners have run 214 times to 185 passes. Thats a difference of 29.

Steelers have run 212 times to 286 passes. Thats a differenc of 74.

How exactly are they more balanced?

Ummm There's more to balance than Run Vs. Pass.
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by HessianDud:

sorry, that makes no sense. the passing offense is efficient because we complete a high percentage of passes without turning it over and convert short fields into scores. you can thank the defense for the short field but you have to credit the offense for doing something with it.

the offense, particularly the passing offense, can get better, and it must. we need to get better on 3rd downs. we need to complete the long shots that we do take (because we do take shots downfield, but are inconsistent in completing them.), and we need to get even better in the red zone (we're ok, and convert in most "clutch" situations, but can improve). So there's a lot of room for improvement. but despite the yardage rankings the passing offense is not poor. Its working, the entire offense is working, and it gets better every week.

How does it not make sense? Completing a high percentage of passes is a deceptive stat. I'm more concerned about Smith overthrowing and missing wide open deep passes. He missed 3 last week. That's uncalled for at this level with his experience. I like to look ahead and I can't see this working for too much longer once teams prepare for Gore more and more. I can't wait until the Baltimore game. That's going to show whether or not this style offense is effective or not. IMO

it makes sense because the defense isn't on the field when the offense is, so the offensive efficiency can't be due to the defensive performance.

you say pass completion % is deceptive, but you are concerned about the completion % on deep passes? That's just silly.

Sorry. I play fantasy football too, but I can separate that from actual NFL games. It's helpful.
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Oh yeah....and the Niners have run 214 times to 185 passes. Thats a difference of 29.

Steelers have run 212 times to 286 passes. Thats a differenc of 74.

How exactly are they more balanced?

Ummm There's more to balance than Run Vs. Pass.

? Dude. What the hell are you talking about?

What does balance mean to you then?

They run slightly more than they pass and their yards per game are similar in either catagory. They have teams off balance because they never know if its run or pass. What the hell do YOU call balance?
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Nov 4, 2011 at 4:31 PM ]
  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by HessianDud:
it makes sense because the defense isn't on the field when the offense is, so the offensive efficiency can't be due to the defensive performance.

you say pass completion % is deceptive, but you are concerned about the completion % on deep passes? That's just silly.

Sorry. I play fantasy football too, but I can separate that from actual NFL games. It's helpful.

Short passes is the reason I said the high completion stat is deceptive. Its' not like they are throwing a bunch of 20 yard outs. Smith is being restricted and it's not going to work for much longer. The reason they are getting close to the goal line and able to score is in part due to good field position, thanks to the Defense, and forcing 3 and outs causing the opposing D to tire fast. And of course Frank Gore . Yes I'm concerned about Smiths accuracy when it comes to missing wide open receivers. You should be too.
  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by Marvin49:
? Dude. What the hell are you talking about?

What does balance mean to you then?

Since when does A Balanced team only mean Run Plays and Pass Plays. Pittsburgh has a Great Run and Pass Defense Along, with damn good Special Teams, Rushing and Passing Attack. That is Balance. Not ust how many times they throw vs. run.
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
it makes sense because the defense isn't on the field when the offense is, so the offensive efficiency can't be due to the defensive performance.

you say pass completion % is deceptive, but you are concerned about the completion % on deep passes? That's just silly.

Sorry. I play fantasy football too, but I can separate that from actual NFL games. It's helpful.

Short passes is the reason I said the high completion stat is deceptive. Its' not like they are throwing a bunch of 20 yard outs. Smith is being restricted and it's not going to work for much longer. The reason they are getting close to the goal line and able to score is in part due to good field position, thanks to the Defense, and forcing 3 and outs causing the opposing D to tire fast. And of course Frank Gore . Yes I'm concerned about Smiths accuracy when it comes to missing wide open receivers. You should be too.

Yes, but that has NOTHING to do with the efficiency we are talking about. We are talking only about Yards per point. Thats it.

Does good field position play into that? Of course it does. It also LOWERS yardage totals when the fields are shorter.

Does Alex miss recievers downfield? Yes. Is anyone here calling him a perfect QB? No.

Please....stick to one arguement and stop changing the discussion to be right.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Nov 4, 2011 at 4:38 PM ]
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
it makes sense because the defense isn't on the field when the offense is, so the offensive efficiency can't be due to the defensive performance.

you say pass completion % is deceptive, but you are concerned about the completion % on deep passes? That's just silly.

Sorry. I play fantasy football too, but I can separate that from actual NFL games. It's helpful.

Short passes is the reason I said the high completion stat is deceptive. Its' not like they are throwing a bunch of 20 yard outs. Smith is being restricted and it's not going to work for much longer. The reason they are getting close to the goal line and able to score is in part due to good field position, thanks to the Defense, and forcing 3 and outs causing the opposing D to tire fast. And of course Frank Gore . Yes I'm concerned about Smiths accuracy when it comes to missing wide open receivers. You should be too.

Our offense isn't based on chucking the ball down the field. Smith's downfield accuracy is a problem that can be partially fixed with more practice time with Crabtree, who has not been able to practice much. But ALL Qb's accuracy goes down the farther they throw it down field. That's a fact.

Field position is part of what makes us so balanced.
Originally posted by Kense:
Originally posted by Marvin49:
? Dude. What the hell are you talking about?

What does balance mean to you then?

Since when does A Balanced team only mean Run Plays and Pass Plays. Pittsburgh has a Great Run and Pass Defense Along, with damn good Special Teams, Rushing and Passing Attack. That is Balance. Not ust how many times they throw vs. run.

This is a joke, right?

The DEFINITION of balance in the football sense is run vs pass. The whole point of balance is so that a D doesn't know if you are going to run or pass so you can't sell out to stop one and not risk getting beat with the other. Thats why you strive for balance.

If you are going to add special teams...OK...they are one of the best in that regard as well.

I don't get your entire concept of balance or how you can claim the Steelers to be the most balanced. Ben threw like 50 passes last week.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Nov 4, 2011 at 4:41 PM ]
  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Yes, but that has NOTHING to do with the efficiency we are talking about. We are talking only about Yards per point. Thats it.

Does good field position play into that? Of course it does. It also LOWERS yardage totals when the fields are shorter.

Does Alex miss recievers downfield? Yes. Is anyone here calling him a perfect QB? No.

Please....stick to one arguement and stop changing the discussion to be right.

I'll discuss things however I want to.
  • Kense
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 76
Originally posted by Marvin49:
This is a joke, right?

The DEFINITION of balance in the football sense is run vs pass. The whole point of balance is so that a D doesn't know if you are going to run or pass so you can't sell out to stop one and not risk getting beat with the other. Thats why you strive for balance.

If you are going to add special teams...OK...they are one of the best in that regard as well.

I don't get your entire concept of blanace or how you can claim the Steelers to be the most balanced. Ben threw like 50 passes last week.

Actually Is this a Joke? So a team means offense to you? Nothing more. A balanced team is ONLY offense right? Yeah sure. The 2000 Ravens were a balanced team I forgot.