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Biggest Suprise Post Lockout: Team FAs

Biggest Suprise Post Lockout: Team FAs

Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Of course Soap split some time with Mcdonald. He is one of the best pass rushers on our team and up and coming.

He was franchised 2 years in a row because they werent convinced he was worth a long term contract which is obvious because they havent given him one. Franklin had an avg 2010 campaign and he wont be missed IMO. Not to mention Franklin gets no push up the middle. We rarely stopped the oposition in short yardage run plays going at him. Franchising a player doesnt mean he is your best player. It just means you dont want to sign them long term and there is no better option available at the time. It cost more but it leaves your options open. If we let Franklin walk last year we dont have anyone proven to play LDE. If Franklin was a part of this teams future he would already be under contract. So obviously he isnt highly regarded by our front office.

This statement completely contradicts what you said about Soap being a better option at nose. They wouldn't have franchised Franklin if that were true. Obvioiusly Franklin is not our best player. Willis, Justin Smith think hes underrated and will be missed. I think they know a little bit more then you do about what the defense needs to succeed.

I never used the words Soap was a better NT. I said he was quicker, stronger and more explosive. In fact I said we dont know how he will fair for certain. But all indications point towards him being able to play the 1 gap scheme well. What are they supposed to say? Screw Franklin we dont need him?
Nate is not going to restructure. He's headed back east within two weeks.
Thanks, Nate, for the past few years. We wish you the best.
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Of course Soap split some time with Mcdonald. He is one of the best pass rushers on our team and up and coming.

He was franchised 2 years in a row because they werent convinced he was worth a long term contract which is obvious because they havent given him one. Franklin had an avg 2010 campaign and he wont be missed IMO. Not to mention Franklin gets no push up the middle. We rarely stopped the oposition in short yardage run plays going at him. Franchising a player doesnt mean he is your best player. It just means you dont want to sign them long term and there is no better option available at the time. It cost more but it leaves your options open. If we let Franklin walk last year we dont have anyone proven to play LDE. If Franklin was a part of this teams future he would already be under contract. So obviously he isnt highly regarded by our front office.

This statement completely contradicts what you said about Soap being a better option at nose. They wouldn't have franchised Franklin if that were true. Obvioiusly Franklin is not our best player. Willis, Justin Smith think hes underrated and will be missed. I think they know a little bit more then you do about what the defense needs to succeed.

I never used the words Soap was a better NT. I said he was quicker, stronger and more explosive. In fact I said we dont know how he will fair for certain. But all indications point towards him being able to play the 1 gap scheme well. What are they supposed to say? Screw Franklin we dont need him?

The difference here is I am using past events that actually happened to back up my argument while yours is based purely off of assumptions you have gathered by reading beat writers all off season.

Soap is a downgrade from Franklin at nose. If he wasnt he would have been playing nose last year and Franklin would have been on another team.
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Carson Palmer gets Traded to Sea!

The Raiders.
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years.

Wow. Soap has been splitting time with Ray Mac for the past two years. What team are you watching?

A team that's started Soap every game the last 2+ years.


Starting the game doesnt make you a full time player. The rotate ray macdonald in at his position in passing situations all the time. A full time starter is a guy like justin smith who is on the field 3 downs every series.

There is a difference between a starter and a full time stater.

Franklin - Full time starter

Soap - Rotational starter

All that will be fixed as soon as Franklin takes his walk. Soap starts full time and so does Ray Mac. I think you are actually starting to see the obvious writing on the wall.

Lol fixed? I am not at all arguing what will happen. I am arguing the facts as they are up to this point. How am I seeing obviousl writing on the wall now? Try coming up with something that makes sense to make a point.

The "obvious" writing on the wall is, Franklin will walk and Raymac who has been stealing PT will finally start. Naturally Soap would slide to NT. It doesnt get more obvious then that. Raymac is ready to start so soap slides back inside and Franklin walks. Pretty simple really! Just look whos under contract and who is demanding more money then they are worth.
[ Edited by PiratePete on Jul 19, 2011 at 4:56 PM ]
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years.

Wow. Soap has been splitting time with Ray Mac for the past two years. What team are you watching?

A team that's started Soap every game the last 2+ years.


Starting the game doesnt make you a full time player. The rotate ray macdonald in at his position in passing situations all the time. A full time starter is a guy like justin smith who is on the field 3 downs every series.

There is a difference between a starter and a full time stater.

Franklin - Full time starter

Soap - Rotational starter

All that will be fixed as soon as Franklin takes his walk. Soap starts full time and so does Ray Mac. I think you are actually starting to see the obvious writing on the wall.

Lol fixed? I am not at all arguing what will happen. I am arguing the facts as they are up to this point. How am I seeing obviousl writing on the wall now? Try coming up with something that makes sense to make a point.

The "obvious" writing on the wall is, Franklin will walk and Raymac who has been stealing PT will finally start. Naturally Soap would slide to NT. It doesnt get more obvious then that. Raymac is ready to start so soap slides back inside and Franklin walks. Pretty simple really! Just look whos under contract and who is demanding more money then they are worth.

Lol. You must be 6 years old or seriously slow. I didn't ever argue that any roster move will or will not happen. I merely said we should re-sign Franklin.
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Of course Soap split some time with Mcdonald. He is one of the best pass rushers on our team and up and coming.

He was franchised 2 years in a row because they werent convinced he was worth a long term contract which is obvious because they havent given him one. Franklin had an avg 2010 campaign and he wont be missed IMO. Not to mention Franklin gets no push up the middle. We rarely stopped the oposition in short yardage run plays going at him. Franchising a player doesnt mean he is your best player. It just means you dont want to sign them long term and there is no better option available at the time. It cost more but it leaves your options open. If we let Franklin walk last year we dont have anyone proven to play LDE. If Franklin was a part of this teams future he would already be under contract. So obviously he isnt highly regarded by our front office.

This statement completely contradicts what you said about Soap being a better option at nose. They wouldn't have franchised Franklin if that were true. Obvioiusly Franklin is not our best player. Willis, Justin Smith think hes underrated and will be missed. I think they know a little bit more then you do about what the defense needs to succeed.

I never used the words Soap was a better NT. I said he was quicker, stronger and more explosive. In fact I said we dont know how he will fair for certain. But all indications point towards him being able to play the 1 gap scheme well. What are they supposed to say? Screw Franklin we dont need him?

The difference here is I am using past events that actually happened to back up my argument while yours is based purely off of assumptions you have gathered by reading beat writers all off season.

Soap is a downgrade from Franklin at nose. If he wasnt he would have been playing nose last year and Franklin would have been on another team.

Really? Then who was supposed to play LDE? Franklin will be playing for another team this year. So put that in your pipe and smoke it. Obviously you dont know how the franchise tag works and how it can be used. Ever heard of Vincent Jackson?
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years.

Wow. Soap has been splitting time with Ray Mac for the past two years. What team are you watching?

A team that's started Soap every game the last 2+ years.


Starting the game doesnt make you a full time player. The rotate ray macdonald in at his position in passing situations all the time. A full time starter is a guy like justin smith who is on the field 3 downs every series.

There is a difference between a starter and a full time stater.

Franklin - Full time starter

Soap - Rotational starter

All that will be fixed as soon as Franklin takes his walk. Soap starts full time and so does Ray Mac. I think you are actually starting to see the obvious writing on the wall.

Lol fixed? I am not at all arguing what will happen. I am arguing the facts as they are up to this point. How am I seeing obviousl writing on the wall now? Try coming up with something that makes sense to make a point.

The "obvious" writing on the wall is, Franklin will walk and Raymac who has been stealing PT will finally start. Naturally Soap would slide to NT. It doesnt get more obvious then that. Raymac is ready to start so soap slides back inside and Franklin walks. Pretty simple really! Just look whos under contract and who is demanding more money then they are worth.

Lol. You must be 6 years old or seriously slow. I didn't ever argue that any roster move will or will not happen. I merely said we should re-sign Franklin.

And I explained to you why that wont happen. But you just dont get it! I doubt you ever will.
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years.

Wow. Soap has been splitting time with Ray Mac for the past two years. What team are you watching?

A team that's started Soap every game the last 2+ years.


Starting the game doesnt make you a full time player. The rotate ray macdonald in at his position in passing situations all the time. A full time starter is a guy like justin smith who is on the field 3 downs every series.

They were your words, not mine, bro.

"Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years"

These are not my words

wtf are you talking about? I think I am done arguing with someone who makes sense 1 out of every 5 times they say something

Really? Read your own gd post. I'm out.
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by PiratePete:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by RichmondPete:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
It's possible that Manny tests the FA waers, and the money that he expected is not out there. Under that scenario, maybe he comes back. If Snyder really wants Franklin, he will shovel money at him, and Abrayu will get fat and happy.

Nate refusing to restructure could be another possibility; that dude seems pretty proud, and accepting a pay cut is a serious shot to the ego.

I can see any of those scenerios playing out.

I think that if Snyder is out of the Franklin sweep stakes there is a good chance we resign him. It's likely Houston will go after a big name CB, in which case they wont go after Franklin. Outside of that, I think we can complete with any other 3-4 team. I just dont know that I want him. Age and talent isn't the problem, it's the dedication. I worried about anyone that is strictley after the money.

Yeah, I think he is a case of "happy fat guy" waiting to happen. Last year, everyone said he was training hard on his own while he sat out practices w/ his Franchise Tag, but he sucked for the first few weeks. It seems that most of the dirtbag big money FA flops are big guys (DL or OL). Some guys don't make it because their skill set doesn't translate to a new scheme, but it seems like a lot of big guys get paid and quit trying.

As far as Snyder goes, I think they need an NT, and they know it. Mebane is a maybe, as he's been in a 4-3 his whole career, so Abrayu is the best option for Washington (I am of the mind that they need to dump Haynesworth for whatever they can get).

Any guy who has to put in work as a backup for 6 years before they get a chance to start has a good work ethic.

I dont think that' neccessarily true, Pete. Some guys are motivated because financially they need to be. Once they get paid, the motivation is gone. That's not just true of sports, that's true of almost any business.

Yeah but to stay in the league for 6 years as a journeyman and then finally get your shot as a starter and never look back requires a good work ethic. Its not like he was ever guaranteed any money anywhere before Nolan traded for him. Nolan was notorious for wanting to bring in lunch pale guys with extrodinary work ethic. I don't think Franklin has shown anything besides a little rust post-holdout.

Then I hope we sign him and I hope you're right....

I hope we sign him too. We have the cap room and we need him. I really don't understand why theres a hesitation to pay him. Maybe they really believe in Soap and RayMac as starters.

1 gap NT`s like Franklin are a dime a dozen. Its a 2 gap NT thats hard to replace. He is getting his walking papers and we wont skip a beat with our current roster.

If they were a dime a dozen every 3-4 team would be running a 1 gap scheme. Our defense looks alot worse when Franklin is not in the game so I don't know why you think we will be just as good with our current roster minus Franklin. That makes no sense.

Because we have a coaching staff that wont be sleeping in the press box( Raye ) and openly admitting that they have never heard of Brian westbrook. Saying he would need to watch tape to see how good he was and if how we could use him. Or a HC who not only hires such a scrub, but actually puts the idiot in charge of the offense. All while instilling his family crap and only working 8-10 hrs a day when every other HC is putting in 100 hr work weeks.

Soap was asked to play a 2 gap scheme when he was our NT. Assuming we stick with a one gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

What does Jimmy Raye have to do with the defense? When Soap played nose in a 2 gap scheme WE SUCKED.

It shows how stupid our HC was last year. You know the guy who runs the team.

As I said before, assuming we stay with a 1 gap scheme Soap is much quicker, stronger and more explosive then Franklin.

If Soap is so much more suited to play nose in a 1 gap then why didn't he play nose last year? We could have started Smith-Soap-RayMac last year if that was the case but we didn't. We franchised Franklin and payed him top dollar to start instead. Why would the team do that if he can be replaced so easily by a guy we already have under contract? And don't blame it on Sing because he didn't decide who got the franchise tag.

Dont blame it on Sing? Sing makes the final call on who plays. The same Sing who started Troy Smith over Alex and costed us the playoffs. Wasnt it also Scotty M who was fired btw, the one who franchised Franklin?

They havent gave Franklin a contract yet and they wont because he isnt worth it.

You don't seem to read everything that is said, so I will underline what was actually important out of my statement.

Sing did not decide who got franchise tagged and payed the average of the top 5 players at their position. The front office decided that.

Players who get franchised by an organization always start (duh)

Soap wasn't even a full time starter at d end this year.

Teams don't franchise tag players that they can easily replace with another player that is under contract. If you think they do then you are slow.

As state earlier by another poster, Becuase surely I have to repeat everything previously stated....

- Manusky was happy to have Sopoaga play LDE... he was our best option at that spot.

- Franklin had flashes of excellence in 2009 and we didn't yet know where his ceiling was.

- We don't know for sure if Sopoaga will thrive in a 1-gap NT role... but looking at his skill-set, it stands to reason that he can do it well.

Again, Soap split time with Macdonald last year. He was not a full time starter.

Franklin was franchise tagged 2 years in a row.

We may not know if Soap will thrive, but considering we had a defensive coaching staff in place that did know, because a 1gap 34 was the defense in place, we would not have wasted 12 million dollars to sign someone who could be replaced by somone we have locked up long term making reasonable money.

Patrick Willis and Justin Smith, our two best defenseive players, have both stated Franklin is underrated by fans and have lobbied for his return as recently as last week.

Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years.

Wow. Soap has been splitting time with Ray Mac for the past two years. What team are you watching?

A team that's started Soap every game the last 2+ years.


Starting the game doesnt make you a full time player. The rotate ray macdonald in at his position in passing situations all the time. A full time starter is a guy like justin smith who is on the field 3 downs every series.

They were your words, not mine, bro.

"Soap's been the full time starter the past 2+ years"

These are not my words

wtf are you talking about? I think I am done arguing with someone who makes sense 1 out of every 5 times they say something

Really? Read your own gd post. I'm out.

You are retarded
Originally posted by captain_planet:
I'm suprised so few people think a player will be unexpectedly cut. I mean "unexpectedly" is a subjective term but I can see Harbaugh dropping the ax on a few guys like Carroll did when he got to Seattle, albeit Harbaugh is inheriting a better roster.

Feel free to elaberate...
LOL @ this argument.
Originally posted by Shifter:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by NineFourNiner:
This one:


Niners will throw up gang signs wasn't an option....

LOL@ Oakland Niner.....that isnt a gang sign friend. Its The Shocker, use your imagination. If you cant figure THAT out maybe try redtube.com (ONLY IF YOU ARE OVER 18) search:Shocker








Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by NineFourNiner:
This one:


Niners will throw up gang signs wasn't an option....

I laughed out loud for several minutes after reading this post!
Awesome article on FAs actually ......

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/6782227/free-agents-meet-hell

I really think we should let Franklin walk. No long-term deal for a 30 yo undersized NT. Just sayin. Name 2 players on D better than Franklin? Okay - Willis, and Smith. The fact that Franklin could possibly be the 3rd best player on this D is NOTHING to brag about. Press the upgrade button.