What was a bigger problem last year?

Coaching, it starts from the top. QB next because of coaching and to add in for good measure the O-line. . . yes because of coaching.

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

No, I get that. I love the poll (and responses) because it clearly exposes the 9% that choose QB over Coaching... so that everyone knows who to ignore and dismiss as.. well, I'll just leave it at that.

The biggest problem was the coaching... no question. But Alex was, and IMHO will continue to be, the weak link in the offense. I'd expect Harbaugh and his staff to be able to improve the Offense in almost every statistical category this year. But Alex will remain mediocre until proven otherwise.

Coaching and awful play calling

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

No, I get that. I love the poll (and responses) because it clearly exposes the 9% that choose QB over Coaching... so that everyone knows who to ignore and dismiss as.. well, I'll just leave it at that.

Amen brother.

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

No, I get that. I love the poll (and responses) because it clearly exposes the 9% that choose QB over Coaching... so that everyone knows who to ignore and dismiss as.. well, I'll just leave it at that.

Amen brother.

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

No, I get that. I love the poll (and responses) because it clearly exposes the 9% that choose QB over Coaching... so that everyone knows who to ignore and dismiss as.. well, I'll just leave it at that.

Well it depends on the situation, there are a lot of greys when observing a situation. Last year, it was obvious that the stubbornous of Singletary doomed whatever offensive coordinator and the team. Not saying he had to be a mad bomber, but it was like the offense yelling out to the opp D, "Hey, we are going to run at you on this play ok? You got that we are going to run. or Oh, its 3rd and ten guess what we are going to pass, got that? Pass.

However, we don't have a good QB, so that doesn't help either. As for OL, well, see above, and second a good QB can make an OL look that much better, cause he'll make the line adjustments that the center doesn't, and either gets rid of the ball faster or can buy time.

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

No, I get that. I love the poll (and responses) because it clearly exposes the 9% that choose QB over Coaching... so that everyone knows who to ignore and dismiss as.. well, I'll just leave it at that.

Well it depends on the situation, there are a lot of greys when observing a situation. Last year, it was obvious that the stubbornous of Singletary doomed whatever offensive coordinator and the team. Not saying he had to be a mad bomber, but it was like the offense yelling out to the opp D, "Hey, we are going to run at you on this play ok? You got that we are going to run. or Oh, its 3rd and ten guess what we are going to pass, got that? Pass.

However, we don't have a good QB, so that doesn't help either. As for OL, well, see above, and second a good QB can make an OL look that much better, cause he'll make the line adjustments that the center doesn't, and either gets rid of the ball faster or can buy time.

See, that was a great first paragraph... but then you completely corrupt it by throwing blame at the QB like that. You are basically saying this..

" Well, Fred was then kneecapped, but damn Fred for not being able to run as well as the others in the race. "

Get how that is?

As for Alex and Troy debate, both are inconsistent, but for different reasons and both are no more than backup QBs. Alex has somethings that Troy lacks and Troy has some things that Alex lacks. Either way, neither can carry the team to more than a division title or wildcard birth and at their best-only a first round win with a good/great HC/OC.

Simply put no matter how you debate it, neither is the answer period.

Seems like a dodge from answering to me... c'mon, for real...

If you can evidently throw heaps of blame on the offense for being stubborn and predictable.... why can't you cut a QB the slack for being stuck in that very offense? How can anyone really assess the QB under those horrendous conditions?

Recognizing the offense for what it was... and then looking at the numbers of the QB through the time period of that offense... would it not stand to reason that the QB was held back (kneecapped) by the offensive stubborness and predictability? So then, could we not fairly imagine that QB going from an 82 QBR to something better when the offense isn't being restricted and predictable? And wouldn't better put him around the top half of all QBs? So wouldn't this mean he can be good (or at least very servicable at minimum) ?

It is just connecting the dots here. No guarantees, but it is very logical to connect them like this.

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Love how over 90% of the hundreds of votes goes to coaching, and yet the same lil group of detractors keep crying the loudest about the QB.

well, to be fair, there are only two options. Both of which were major reasons for our pathetic display in recent years. QB is the lesser of the two evils. But that's like saying you're the best limbless swimmer in the pool.

No, I get that. I love the poll (and responses) because it clearly exposes the 9% that choose QB over Coaching... so that everyone knows who to ignore and dismiss as.. well, I'll just leave it at that.

Well it depends on the situation, there are a lot of greys when observing a situation. Last year, it was obvious that the stubbornous of Singletary doomed whatever offensive coordinator and the team. Not saying he had to be a mad bomber, but it was like the offense yelling out to the opp D, "Hey, we are going to run at you on this play ok? You got that we are going to run. or Oh, its 3rd and ten guess what we are going to pass, got that? Pass.

However, we don't have a good QB, so that doesn't help either. As for OL, well, see above, and second a good QB can make an OL look that much better, cause he'll make the line adjustments that the center doesn't, and either gets rid of the ball faster or can buy time.

See, that was a great first paragraph... but then you completely corrupt it by throwing blame at the QB like that. You are basically saying this..

" Well, Fred was then kneecapped, but damn Fred for not being able to run as well as the others in the race. "

Get how that is?

Your analogy is corrupted!
You need to learn to read-the question was what was the "BIGGER" problem last year. The bigger was Coaching, but that does not mean the QB, escapes blame. Even if the coaches were bad, a good QB could have still won some of those games that we lost. You still need to execute the plays, there were many instances where the QB, both Troy and Alex had misfired and it had nothing with the play calling or the OL or others.

response given above yours..

Coaching has to be first... No matter who is your QB if the defense is calling out the offensive play before the snap, the play is already over before it began. We were trying to run an offense predicated on establishing the run and then deep passes. Well the run plays were about as uncreative as you could get and we don't have a consistent deep threat receiver. Throw in the special teams debacle caused by getting rid of Rossum, and Spurlock which led to inconsistency in the return game like fumbles and injuries. It was all bad. The QB isn't blameless is this either, but neither Troy nor Alex was helped by the coaching staff ignoring the fact that the main time our O-line showed consistency was when Chilo was out and Snyder was in...but yet Dingleberry kept plugging Chilo in for some unknown reason.

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Seems like a dodge from answering to me... c'mon, for real...

If you can evidently throw heaps of blame on the offense for being stubborn and predictable.... why can't you cut a QB the slack for being stuck in that very offense? How can anyone really assess the QB under those horrendous conditions?

Recognizing the offense for what it was... and then looking at the numbers of the QB through the time period of that offense... would it not stand to reason that the QB was held back (kneecapped) by the offensive stubborness and predictability? So then, could we not fairly imagine that QB going from an 82 QBR to something better when the offense isn't being restricted and predictable? And wouldn't better put him around the top half of all QBs? So wouldn't this mean he can be good (or at least very servicable at minimum) ?

It is just connecting the dots here. No guarantees, but it is very logical to connect them like this.

The above was not a a response to you but in general to what some of the things that was being said.