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The NFL's # 1 Defense Thread

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Insert "DefensEXCUSES" here:

What excuses? Let's just sweep it under the rug and blame the offense!

Per MS: No need to look at Haralson/Lawson as they are playing "great!" and collectively, save for the KC game, the defense has been playing "lights out!"

W. T. F!!!!

Look how many points they are giving up. Look how many huge plays they are giving up. Look at the red zone scores. Look how the can't stop a RB screen.

Insert DefensEXCUSES:

I thought blaming the offense WAS the DefensEXCUSE? LOL
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Nolan's defense was fairly complicated also. He's had success in Denver and is having success in MIA

I thought about this too! So, EVERYONE knew that Nolan was known as Mr. Vanilla as a DC and coach here with SF. Then, he goes to Denver and Miami and becomes totally aggressive. Why? B/c his new employers asked him too or b/c he had better talent to execute a more aggressive defense. Again, was he, like Manusky now, hand-cuffed here b/c of the lack of talent in 3 of the 4 LBers and their inability to do their primary jobs which in turn affects the secondary and what their strengths are? Tough call...

Then that doesn't explain Brooks.

Touche'
This is how many downs you will get against the Niner D:


Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Nolan's defense was fairly complicated also. He's had success in Denver and is having success in MIA

I thought about this too! So, EVERYONE knew that Nolan was known as Mr. Vanilla as a DC and coach here with SF. Then, he goes to Denver and Miami and becomes totally aggressive. Why? B/c his new employers asked him too or b/c he had better talent to execute a more aggressive defense. Again, was he, like Manusky now, hand-cuffed here b/c of the lack of talent in 3 of the 4 LBers and their inability to do their primary jobs which in turn affects the secondary and what their strengths are? Tough call...

Then that doesn't explain Brooks.

Touche'

Personally, the only mistakes this Defense made were that last drive against NO (Best Offense in the NFL) and they looked dismantled against KC (appeared to be more of scheme issue/illegal play by KC).

Overall, in terms of stats, they played NO and SEA very well.

I don't think even the Ravens defense can overcome 4+ turnovers in each of 2 games.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Nolan's defense was fairly complicated also. He's had success in Denver and is having success in MIA

I thought about this too! So, EVERYONE knew that Nolan was known as Mr. Vanilla as a DC and coach here with SF. Then, he goes to Denver and Miami and becomes totally aggressive. Why? B/c his new employers asked him too or b/c he had better talent to execute a more aggressive defense. Again, was he, like Manusky now, hand-cuffed here b/c of the lack of talent in 3 of the 4 LBers and their inability to do their primary jobs which in turn affects the secondary and what their strengths are? Tough call...

Then that doesn't explain Brooks.

Touche'

Personally, the only mistakes this Defense made were that last drive against NO (Best Offense in the NFL) and they looked dismantled against KC (appeared to be more of scheme issue/illegal play by KC).

Overall, in terms of stats, they played NO and SEA very well.

I don't think even the Ravens defense can overcome 4+ turnovers in each of 2 games.

The Ravens offense did absolutely nothing in the first 2 weeks yet they found a way to keep their O in the game. If you examine the stats Our offense has been very similar to the Ravens O but they aren't getting blown out of anywhere

Forget stats when we needed them most they failed against NO. We score a TD to take the lead and they go down the field and score a TD in 2 minutes. Against the "Best Offense in the NFL" who isn't even in the top 10 in yds or scoring.

I find it amazing how many people will go around saying alexcuses but turn around and make excuse for everyone else. The sword cuts both ways.
Originally posted by redmanc07:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Nolan's defense was fairly complicated also. He's had success in Denver and is having success in MIA

I thought about this too! So, EVERYONE knew that Nolan was known as Mr. Vanilla as a DC and coach here with SF. Then, he goes to Denver and Miami and becomes totally aggressive. Why? B/c his new employers asked him too or b/c he had better talent to execute a more aggressive defense. Again, was he, like Manusky now, hand-cuffed here b/c of the lack of talent in 3 of the 4 LBers and their inability to do their primary jobs which in turn affects the secondary and what their strengths are? Tough call...

Then that doesn't explain Brooks.

Touche'

Personally, the only mistakes this Defense made were that last drive against NO (Best Offense in the NFL) and they looked dismantled against KC (appeared to be more of scheme issue/illegal play by KC).

Overall, in terms of stats, they played NO and SEA very well.

I don't think even the Ravens defense can overcome 4+ turnovers in each of 2 games.

The Ravens offense did absolutely nothing in the first 2 weeks yet they found a way to keep their O in the game. If you examine the stats Our offense has been very similar to the Ravens O but they aren't getting blown out of anywhere

Forget stats when we needed them most they failed against NO. We score a TD to take the lead and they go down the field and score a TD in 2 minutes. Against the "Best Offense in the NFL" who isn't even in the top 10 in yds or scoring.

I find it amazing how many people will go around saying alexcuses but turn around and make excuse for everyone else. The sword cuts both ways.

I agree...if you really watch the defense, every play, you can see how badly we are playing as a group. Against KC, we gave up 7 plays of 20 yards or more. This defense has been getting destroyed.
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by kem99:
Originally posted by nyc49erking:
For how many years are going to keep saying this defense is good ? They never stop a good passing team, never get any pass rush on the opposing qb, and THEY CANT EVER STOP A TEAM IN THE FOURTH QUARTER, EVER.

This defense has let us down, time after time, after time. Everybody loves Willis, but the brother cant even recognize a simply screen pass play. The heat needs to be put on the defensive players and Manusky, his job should not be safe either. They dont produce in the future, send them all home.

Relax...the defense has been, could be and probably will be better. It certainly has not been as bad as you make out. The pass rush could be more consistent but they were tied for 3rd in sacks last year with 44. They have stopped teams in games where the offense was of little help and the defense kept them in or won the game (e.g. Indy and the Bears last year). They have had good games against passing teams (e.g. Indy and the Cardinals twice last year, Saints this year). By yards, they were in the top 10 of defenses last year and they gave up the least number of points in the division. They're also generally a young defense that should get better as some of the older players are transitioned out for the younger players (e.g. Bowman, Mays)

With that said, there are deficiencies that seem to repeat themselves....

Defending screen passes was a problem that hurt them last year and has again this year.

This is clearly a different defense at home. They play faster, have fewer mistakes, etc. They just don't seem to play the same on the road or be able to stop a team's momentum as well as they do at home.

The sacks and turnovers seem to come in bunches.

One would like to see them be more consistent. Against Seattle, they dominated the first quarter and a half and then it snowballed on them. KC was only 10-3 at halftime with little help from the offense but then it snowballed again.
So I'm all done talking about the offense for this week.

What I don't understand is; where is this "tough guy" defense that was supposed to smack people in the mouth?

Teams have learned the 49ers try to shield blockers away from Willis so he can make tackles. So they run screens and picks so he can't pursue and Manusky has not countered with anything to take advantage of that. The 49er defense lacks speed and when Willis gets screened off the play, no one steps up to make plays. Clements was the leading tackler in KC. That fact alone should tell us a lot. Anytime a corner back is you leading tackler you are going to lose...BIG!

Justin Smith is the only guy that has played with any consistency in the front line. Franklin has not had the same impact he had last year and Sopoaga has been inconsistent as well. Ray McDonald isn't seeing the field as much as he had last year and that is a problem because he does get some push on the passer.

This team STILL needs a pass rusher or a scheme that puts pressure on the QB. Seattle killed the 49ers with blitz packages but Sing/Manusky apparently didn't learn anything from them because they put little pressure on Cassel. If you don't have stud pass rushers, you have to do it with scheme...and that isn't happening.

If the defense had done its job on NO's final drive, this team would be 1-2 and the mood would be much better...but they didn't. Singletary and Manusky should be getting as much heat about the defense as he got about the offense. As bad as the offense has been, it was good enough to have won one game. The defense lost the NO game and got blown out in the other two.

Where is the vinegar about the defense? Alex Smith doesn't play defense. We can't blame him. Who takes the heat for the worst defense in the league?

I don't have an explanation but I'm a firm believer that if the offense plays well, it inspires the defense.

As far as the NO game, the defense played exceptionally well, and Drew Brees game winning drive wouldn't have happened if the Niners didnt turn the ball over so many times, that NO game should've been won by a huge margin.
It is true that one side of the ball can inspire the other, and to the extent that DOES influence the team, the defense should have been totally fired up by the offense at the end of the NO game. The offense had just driven the length of the field on one of the very best drives of the last five years. Yet that apparently didn't have any impact as the defense just went to sleep on some very predictable plays.

The defense had just had a nice rest and they came back on the field and couldn't do the job. Sorry, I cannot lay that one on the offense. Up to that point, Brees and his offense had done no better than Smith and his offense. It was an even game until the defense let it slip away.

In this era a really good offense playing at a high level simply can't be stopped. Could any team have stopped that last drive? Probably not.

Sing hates this, but it does come down to outscoring the other team. Maybe it is a misconception, but it sure seems that in most every game you see, the team that has the ball last in a close game usually scores or gets damn close to scoring.
Wow, Brown on White the entire drive. This guy is and has been garbage for years...players playing off deep. letting quick passes to the sidelines and getting out of bounds, zero pressure save for a couple from Haralson/Smith, etc. OLB's asked to continue to cover 20 yards down the field, remains terrible in coverage in the middle of the field (includes everyone, even Willis), etc. The defense FINDS a way to lose when the game is on the line...every time...this is part of a losing culture. I've been saying it for years but a bad team finds great ways to lose and it just amazes me how creative we are at finding new ways to lose each and every week. The underline theme is...dumb! We just don't have smart players or coaches. Now that Johnson looks promising, it's time to turn the heat over to Manusky!

BTW: We may need to look at benching Goldson...was HORRIBLE today. Worst safety play I've seen since Mark Roman!
[ Edited by NCommand on Oct 3, 2010 at 1:42 PM ]
our DEFENSE is fukin horrible. you guys can talk all the smack you want about smith, sing, offense, but we have already read 2 teams with less than 2 minues drive 60 yards and hit the game winning field goal on us. i dont want to hear anyone say that our defense is good anymore, we suck, we are horrible, cant stop anyone when it counts, it looks like the other teams just plays catch. horiibleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Our bend but don't break mentality breaks every time.
Originally posted by kstolai:
Our bend but don't break mentality breaks every time.

We have a bend dont break mentality. But we live in a break not bend reality...
Originally posted by nyc49erking:
For how many years are going to keep saying this defense is good ? They never stop a good passing team, never get any pass rush on the opposing qb, and THEY CANT EVER STOP A TEAM IN THE FOURTH QUARTER, EVER.

This defense has let us down, time after time, after time. Everybody loves Willis, but the brother cant even recognize a simply screen pass play. The heat needs to be put on the defensive players and Manusky, his job should not be safe either. They dont produce in the future, send them all home.

how in the world do we play amazing D through out the game if our offense cannot score points or maintain a drive?
This is not a top 5 defense. We have already accepted that it was a bend but don't break defense (BBDB). Well a BBDB gives up field goals but not as many TD's. Guess what, we ain't stopping any team that needs a FG to win the game.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Wow, Brown on White the entire drive. This guy is and has been garbage for years...players playing off deep. letting quick passes to the sidelines and getting out of bounds, zero pressure save for a couple from Haralson/Smith, etc. OLB's asked to continue to cover 20 yards down the field, remains terrible in coverage in the middle of the field (includes everyone, even Willis), etc. The defense FINDS a way to lose when the game is on the line...every time...this is part of a losing culture. I've been saying it for years but a bad team finds great ways to lose and it just amazes me how creative we are at finding new ways to lose each and every week. The underline theme is...dumb! We just don't have smart players or coaches. Now that Johnson looks promising, it's time to turn the heat over to Manusky!

BTW: We may need to look at benching Goldson...was HORRIBLE today. Worst safety play I've seen since Mark Roman!

Yea, the whole putting brown on white that last drive was mind-boggling
i was surprised after the niners recovered kolb's fumble that they said it was the niners 1st recovered fumble of the year....
far different than from last year when the defense forced alot of turnovers...