There are 175 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

McCloughan's fall from grace was his own doing.

Originally posted by 49erWill:
niners to speak today

It'd be great if they finally levelled with us and said, "we're sorry for ruining this beloved franchise, but we gots to have our dough".
Originally posted by 9eridiot:
Originally posted by NinerGM:
Originally posted by 9eridiot:
Originally posted by NinerGM:
Originally posted by WINiner:
Originally posted by 9eridiot:
Originally posted by WINiner:
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
It's just the Yorks being stupid and self destructing the team like they always do. Only the Yorks could come up with a plan to get rid of the GM 5 weeks before the draft with no replacement on hand. They could have done it at the very beginning of the offseason and may have been able to land the likes of Holmgren or Shannahan in the role if they were willing to pay for it. But they aren't willing to pay for it and everything the Yorks do is reactionary and spur of the moment with no forward planning. It's how the roll. Destroy the team and figure out the consequences later. It's how they have rolled for a decade.

You don't get it. They are not looking to bring someone from outside the organization in to replace Scott. THAT'S why it doesn't matter that he was canned 5 weeks before the draft. The Niners are going to make Baalk, Gamble, or Marathe GM and the team will continue forward with little change in the short term.

This in my opinion is not at all reactionary or spur of the moment, but a culmination of discretions that led to the change. I don't think for a moment that the management had any interest at all in GM candidates outside the team earlier this off-season. I think if anything, the team waited too long.

... and Balke it is !

True too, the team had no interest in GM candidates; but, more importantly, no GM candidates had any interest in the Niners. Why would a strong GM accept the restrictive conditions set by York?

Only a tool would do it ... and Balke it is !

Exactly what restrictive conditions are you speaking of?

WIN - totally agree with your perspective. Contrary to what people think here, I don't think the Yorks are reactionary - I think they take too long to make decisions. Case in point: the stadium. The Yorks are not football people and run their business like any corporation - conservatively. They initially brought that approach. That created the perfect situation that was resistant to change; firing Mooch took too long - he had long since lost the team. Firing of Donahue and Erickson took too long. Firing of Mike Nolan took too long. And if they thought McCloughan wasn't doing a good job. McCloughan said himself it was a longstanding issue. So obviously there was something going on for a while. Again, it took too long. If anything, the 49ers need an active owner - maybe Jed - who can make a good hire. It doesn't take a genius to make a great hire, it just needs to be an educated/smart hire. If anything the 49ers are still suffering from mistakes made years ago that are coming to light now.

Winner,

York set restrictive conditions in place when he took over. As NinerGM alludes, "the 49ers were still suffering from mistakes made years ago". I would argue that these prior mistakes, which led to 5 Super Bowl Championships, weren't mistakes at all - but, serendipitous actions which led to an organizational value on par with the f**king cowboys.

York, though, without a background or interest in football, came to the organization with one narrow-minded viewpoint toward the business that did not understand the complexities of a major sports franchise.

In so doing, he gutted the administrative complex that Eddie D established. The approach was an overall pragmatic restriction of expenitures - from the GM to the punter.

Eddie D wanted to win. Daddy York wants to make sure he makes money. It's a simple difference. Hopefully Sing can take the competitive squad that York allows purchased and win a division title for us fans.

The mistakes I'm alluding to are the mistakes the Yorks made in hiring DE and giving a rookie coach like Mike Nolan complete control over the rebuilding of an organization. McCloughan was a part of the Nolan regime. The point I was attempting to make was that the Yorks may have started out bad, but we've seen an evolution and in no small way. If the 49ers were only interested in money they wouldn't have brought in Jennings, Clements, Smith, and Jones (who I still think is a colossal waste of money).

Thanks GM,
I stand corrected re: past mistakes. My gist was comparing the York vs. Eddie D. 'business 'model'.

As to your point, I agree the Yorks started badly. I also believe York had a strong desire to not follow the path Eddie D laid out. He wanted to chart his own course and have future results unconnected to his brother-in-law.

As far as spending money and bringing in free agents, whether it was through Donohue, Nolan, McCloughan, or now Baalke & Gamble, the Niner GM can only spend money that York allows them to spend.

York's smart enough to realize that there has to be some base level of free agent signings to maintain a competitive product; and, I think that's where you've seen some good free agent signings like Justin and ... ?

But, you can't use the Clements signing as an example since he was forced by minimum cap rules that year to spend money.

What I'd really like to know is if Scot felt any pressure or if there was a strategy in place last year to throw away the #2 in case Crabtree was picked instead of Oher.

It seems clear that York has a pattern of primarily making fiscal rather than football decisions.

I wouldn't say the "pattern is clear". Remember we could have re-signed Marques Douglas for a lot cheaper than we signed Justin Smith. That would have been the cheaper option. As for Clements, of course he can be used as an example in that we gave him the richest contract to any player that season. This could have been split between other players - so the minimum spend rule didn't have to invest in one guy. Additionally Justin Smith followed by contract extensions to Spencer, Staley, Snyder and others. I think if anything the trend looks to be reversing. Given the 49ers were charging among the least in ticket prices to attend games (living here in Texas my company paid for some of us to go to a Dallas game) - and expectedly so, we have the oldest stadium in the league. Yes, the Yorks hold the purse strings, but at the same time I really haven't seen those purse strings tighten.

What has been of question - and where I've been very critical over the past season have been the off-season decision-making with personnel. I know I've been one of McCloughan's chief critics here because of what I've seen as basic failures (Marvel Smith, Brandon Jones) - pinning hopes of an entire offense on players coming off of injury. For someone who claims to only be interested in bigger, stronger players - I guess including "healthy" in that prerequisite would be asking too much.

Whatever happens, the team needs to relinquish the compartmentalization in which it operates. There just seems to be such a dissonance between scouting, position coaches and scheme. Are we selecting the right players whether it be FA or draft whose talent can be developed and then be used effectively in our scheme? That used to be the 49er way and IMHO, that has nothing to do with purse strings, more that has to do with those at the top. If the GM hasn't asked for this power, he should. I never got the sense that Scot was any more than a talent evaluator and as I've said before the GM has to be more than just the Scout-in-Chief.

Many call this being an "arm-chair GM", rather I'm only comparing how the 49ers have been successful in the past and how teams are still successful today. Are we maximizing the process? The Shaun Hill/David Carr trade/debacle seems indicative of that. Someone at the top either didn't know what was going on or was asleep at the wheel. Team leaders weren't notified and I have a feeling Singletary didn't know exactly when the deal was executed but was required to defend the move. I'm just saying there have been a lot of questions over the years about Scot's effectiveness. This may be due to his personal struggles. In any case, something needed to be done and it looks like it has.

I'm just hoping there's a clear plan going forward, but that would require Jed to make sure the ship is righted.
Originally posted by 49erWill:
niners to speak today

that should mean by 5 o'clock eastern time something should magically "leak" out to what's really going on.
  • FL9er
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,916
Originally posted by lamontb:

It will only remain private til Scot is officially not part of the team. Then you will she the "unnamed sources" spill the beans. I think he did something that the team and ownership can't take anymore and want him out. Probably one of those things that was the last straw for whatever reason and they want him out.

My thinking was when they said out of the loop was that he was just not answering there calls or would be out of contact for 4 or 5 days during the week when critical decision had to be made. Maybe the team missed out on free agents b/c he was"out of the loop" time will tell

Tim Kawakami alluded to this when he mentioned in his blog, that McCloughan would just fade away and not be seen/heard from for long stretches of time. Remember when Terry Donahue spent more time in LA than the team headquarters when he was GM?
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by 49erWill:
niners to speak today

that should mean by 5 o'clock eastern time something should magically "leak" out to what's really going on.
Originally posted by FL9er:
Originally posted by lamontb:

It will only remain private til Scot is officially not part of the team. Then you will she the "unnamed sources" spill the beans. I think he did something that the team and ownership can't take anymore and want him out. Probably one of those things that was the last straw for whatever reason and they want him out.

My thinking was when they said out of the loop was that he was just not answering there calls or would be out of contact for 4 or 5 days during the week when critical decision had to be made. Maybe the team missed out on free agents b/c he was"out of the loop" time will tell

Tim Kawakami alluded to this when he mentioned in his blog, that McCloughan would just fade away and not be seen/heard from for long stretches of time. Remember when Terry Donahue spent more time in LA than the team headquarters when he was GM?

Interesting, I have a feeling this story is just getting started.
Originally posted by NinerGM:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by 49erWill:
niners to speak today

that should mean by 5 o'clock eastern time something should magically "leak" out to what's really going on.


LMAO

...That theme song cracks me up
I think one thing that hurt Mac was his own stubbornness...he just couldn't break away from his "bigger is better" player philosophy. Add Singletary bringing in Mike Solari to coach the OL and you can begin to understand that was one of the first overt signs of an eventual split w/McCloughan. Solari's all about getting quicker, more agile OL who can do many things well, while Mac was about acquiring maulers. That and the overall last place grade-out of the OL were some of the factors that most likely led to him leaving the team. The fact Singletary has been so heavily involved in draft preparation also lends credence to Mac leaving. Now Trent Baalke will lead the draft, but you know he and Singletary are pretty much in synch. We're in good, perhaps better hands now going forward. I think we'll see some changes in the approach to the draft...I believe we'll see Coach/Baalke grab some playmakers on offense, defense and ST's. Some of those guys will most likely not fit the "bigger is better" philosophy Mac clung to so stubbornly...and I see that as a very good thing.
Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
I think one thing that hurt Mac was his own stubbornness...he just couldn't break away from his "bigger is better" player philosophy. Add Singletary bringing in Mike Solari to coach the OL and you can begin to understand that was one of the first overt signs of an eventual split w/McCloughan. Solari's all about getting quicker, more agile OL who can do many things well, while Mac was about acquiring maulers. That and the overall last place grade-out of the OL were some of the factors that most likely led to him leaving the team. The fact Singletary has been so heavily involved in draft preparation also lends credence to Mac leaving. Now Trent Baalke will lead the draft, but you know he and Singletary are pretty much in synch. We're in good, perhaps better hands now going forward. I think we'll see some changes in the approach to the draft...I believe we'll see Coach/Baalke grab some playmakers on offense, defense and ST's. Some of those guys will most likely not fit the "bigger is better" philosophy Mac clung to so stubbornly...and I see that as a very good thing.

Add Alex Smith to the list. Mcloughan was stubbornly trying to redeem his #1 draft pick mistake by not aggressively looking for better QB talent for the team. If he found a better QB, it would be an admission of wasting a lot of the team's money & time.
[ Edited by djfullshred on Mar 22, 2010 at 1:00 PM ]
Just thought of something.....Didn't McCloughan say something recently that was essentially tampering in an interview.

http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/thread.php?num=138314&highlight=Tampering
So the Niners are finally going to speak huh? My money is still on hookers and blow.
I doubt anything ground breaking comes from this:

1. McCloughan on leave, indefinite absence
2. Baalke takes over for the interim

-9fA
Originally posted by 9erfanAUS:
I doubt anything ground breaking comes from this:

1. McCloughan on leave, indefinite absence
2. Baalke takes over for the interim

-9fA

This.
Jed York approaches the podium:

First I would like to thank Scot McCloughan for all the hard work he has put into this organization from the day he got here. However we feel that due to his own personal issues he can no longer be responsible for his General Manager duties ...



......will take over those duties and we will move forward and become a Championship team in 2010.
Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:
Jed York approaches the podium:

First I would like to thank Scot McCloughan for all the hard work he has put into this organization from the day he got here. However we feel that due to his own personal issues he can no longer be responsible for his General Manager duties ...



......will take over those duties and we will move forward and become a Championship team in 2010.

And that pretty much wraps it up. They might as well cancel Jed's appearance and post this on the front page of their website.