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So... is it Hill or is it our W.R.'s?

Originally posted by BigMar:
Our last offensive possession were we went 3 and out on 3 runs. That was the game, right there!

If the 9ers don't have enough faith in Shaun Hill to connect or try one freak'en pass on that series. Then something is very, very wrong somewhere.

Now the question becomes.... Is it Shaun Hill or the Coaches?

The 10,000 dollar question right there. Right now, I have to say it's the coaches and Raye in particular, without question, given Hill clearly demonstrated a high passing level last year under Martz. Raye is still learning about Hill and his capabilities and is trying to ensure we don't make the mistakes that we made under Martz and being too aggressive.

Without doubt though, Hill, three games in a row, when called on to pass, does very well and is very effecient. It's like the Barry Bonds effect - teams used to walk him all the time so to put up the numbers he did with 1/2 the opportunities other sluggers got is mind-boggling.

It's obvious it starts with Singletary b/c we see this conservative approcah with both Manusky (prevent) and Raye (predictable). Hill has made it very clear that he is being taught not to lose games and "manage" them.

The defense can hide the conservsative nature a little more b/c the players on defense have been in this system for a long time now and can take a few chances. Raye doesn't "feel" he has that luxury.

My question to Singletary is how can he preach punching people in the mouth and then playing not to lose when the game is on the line. He's making our players play tentatively and cautiously (Hill is the best example of that).

The other issue with Raye's vanilla offense is that now the injuries are pilling up and he's going to have to be FORCED to use Hill more (Singletary's strong statement that he doesn't want to have to be put in a position where Hill has to win the game for us - though it's been Hill three times now in the 4th Q who's had to do just that).

When it's telegraphed to the world the offense is completely reliant on Gore and that we'll only run it up the middle, it's super easy to tell if it's going to be a pass or run, defenses are making adjustments and playing on our side of the LOS and the injuries are pilling up b/c of it naturally and Hill is being forced to make split-second decisions and playing off his back foot.

I feel Hill and this offense are somehow succeeding INSPITE of Singletary's "play not to lose" philosphy and Raye's inability to have a feel for the game and game plan anything other then "vanilla."
Originally posted by 9ermj:
Originally posted by dirtysouthniner:
Originally posted by Sugatis:
Originally posted by SJniner7:
Originally posted by Sugatis:
Hard to catch a ball when it is rarely if ever on target - Hill can through a curl route on target if it is 15 yards or under that is about it...never going anywhere with Hill as the QB he is a career backup plain and simple

wow, so far from the truth. Do you even watch the games? Hill's arm strength issues show when he tried to hit the 15 yard outs and curls, as there is no zip on the ball. He has good touch, as shown by the 2 TDs to Davis.

Let me ask you this, he puts us ahead with 1:30 to go, and our defense can't hold an 80 yard drive, that is Hill's fault?

We shouldn't have been ahead - he the INT he threw showed that - the only reason he got a 2nd chance is his incompotent ass got called for delay of game - Now Hill is okay we will win games with him but he will NEVER win us the game . We can probably win Our division with him just managing the game because it is so weak but great QB play wins in the playoffs - Shaun Hill may be capable of a good game once in awhile maybe a great game against Detroit or this years Bucs but that is about it....

if he throws the ball once on stride and on target to Bruce we were up another score - Def was on the field way to long again today - and why is that because Shaun Hill isn't allowed or isn't capable of audibling at the line of scrimmage when he see's 8 or 9 men in the box


Hey we were just talking about people like you in another thread
Originally posted by Schulzy:
The bright side is that maybe Sing and Raye will let Shaun have more control of the offense. He's shown them, and all the anti-Hill idiots on here, that he can take this team to the playoffs.

But other than that, I don't see much of a bright side. We had a big chance to give ourselves a nice cushion in the division today and choked it away.

Those Anti-Hill idiots are here to stay.

Apparently so are the Pro Hill idiots

Amen.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by BigMar:
Our last offensive possession were we went 3 and out on 3 runs. That was the game, right there!

If the 9ers don't have enough faith in Shaun Hill to connect or try one freak'en pass on that series. Then something is very, very wrong somewhere.

Now the question becomes.... Is it Shaun Hill or the Coaches?

The 10,000 dollar question right there. Right now, I have to say it's the coaches and Raye in particular, without question, given Hill clearly demonstrated a high passing level last year under Martz. Raye is still learning about Hill and his capabilities and is trying to ensure we don't make the mistakes that we made under Martz and being too aggressive.

Without doubt though, Hill, three games in a row, when called on to pass, does very well and is very effecient. It's like the Barry Bonds effect - teams used to walk him all the time so to put up the numbers he did with 1/2 the opportunities other sluggers got is mind-boggling.

It's obvious it starts with Singletary b/c we see this conservative approcah with both Manusky (prevent) and Raye (predictable). Hill has made it very clear that he is being taught not to lose games and "manage" them.

The defense can hide the conservsative nature a little more b/c the players on defense have been in this system for a long time now and can take a few chances. Raye doesn't "feel" he has that luxury.

My question to Singletary is how can he preach punching people in the mouth and then playing not to lose when the game is on the line. He's making our players play tentatively and cautiously (Hill is the best example of that).

The other issue with Raye's vanilla offense is that now the injuries are pilling up and he's going to have to be FORCED to use Hill more (Singletary's strong statement that he doesn't want to have to be put in a position where Hill has to win the game for us - though it's been Hill three times now in the 4th Q who's had to do just that).

When it's telegraphed to the world the offense is completely reliant on Gore and that we'll only run it up the middle, it's super easy to tell if it's going to be a pass or run, defenses are making adjustments and playing on our side of the LOS and the injuries are pilling up b/c of it naturally and Hill is being forced to make split-second decisions and playing off his back foot.

I feel Hill and this offense are somehow succeeding INSPITE of Singletary's "play not to lose" philosphy and Raye's inability to have a feel for the game and game plan anything other then "vanilla."

the only reason the 49ers were in position to loose is becuase of shaun hills arm.

hill might actually be a better qb then i give credit for.

i dont fault the coaching staff for this loss.

running to force time outs is par for the course....and sound football.

it was the right call and it worked....it took an insanely lucky pass from outside of fg range to win the game.

when this offense hits midseason form i really hope they give hill more opertunity.....he is clearly not the weak link on offense.




hill has answered the question mark about his productivty.

he is legit.

its a damn shame the 49ers let go of antonio bryant , they actually have a qb now that use him.
Originally posted by Dshearn:
the only reason the 49ers were in position to loose is becuase of shaun hills arm.

hill might actually be a better qb then i give credit for.

i dont fault the coaching staff for this loss.

running to force time outs is par for the course....and sound football.

it was the right call and it worked....it took an insanely lucky pass from outside of fg range to win the game.

when this offense hits midseason form i really hope they give hill more opertunity.....he is clearly not the weak link on offense.




hill has answered the question mark about his productivty.

he is legit.

its a damn shame the 49ers let go of antonio bryant , they actually have a qb now that use him.

But there are other plays besides running into the back of your Center that you can do AND keep the clock moving.

I still think a safe rollout slide in bounds if you don't see anyone open would have been a safe call.
Our third down percentage is a f**king horrid 27%. That's 28th in the NFL. We're getting 14 first downs a game which is 30th in the NFL.

Shaun Hill has done very well so far, but 0/11 on 3rd down is not going to cut it. If we go 0/11 again this season, I bet you we lose that game as well.

4th quarter drives for touchdowns are awesome, but I wish he could do it earlier so our defense could start blitzing more often.
[ Edited by Method on Sep 29, 2009 at 9:47 AM ]
Originally posted by Method:
Our third down percentage is a f**king horrid 27%. That's 28th in the NFL. We're getting 14 first downs a game which is 30th in the NFL.

Shaun Hill has done very well so far, but 0/11 on 3rd down is not going to cut it. If we go 0/11 again this season, I bet you we lose that game as well.

4th quarter drives for touchdowns are awesome, but I wish he could do it earlier so our defense could start blitzing more often.

They gotta let Hill throw the ball around more. But honestly I don't think the Niners WR corp scares any CB's in the entire league. So teams load the box and play man coverage on the WR's. And the Rams game is gonna be tough b/c the Niners havne't proven they can throw the ball. Rams just gonna load the box everydown.
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by Method:
Our third down percentage is a f**king horrid 27%. That's 28th in the NFL. We're getting 14 first downs a game which is 30th in the NFL.

Shaun Hill has done very well so far, but 0/11 on 3rd down is not going to cut it. If we go 0/11 again this season, I bet you we lose that game as well.

4th quarter drives for touchdowns are awesome, but I wish he could do it earlier so our defense could start blitzing more often.

They gotta let Hill throw the ball around more. But honestly I don't think the Niners WR corp scares any CB's in the entire league. So teams load the box and play man coverage on the WR's. And the Rams game is gonna be tough b/c the Niners havne't proven they can throw the ball. Rams just gonna load the box everydown.

What's funny is this was happening to Smith too, and a lot of fans blamed him as a QB instead of our p***y play calling. IMO, I'll give Hill the benefit of the doubt like I did to Smith and say it's the play-calling. Until Hill has a game where he's given an exponential amount of pass attempts, we'll never know if it's him or the play calling.
I think its Singletary who's instructing Hill to be conservative or rather to pick his spots.

It looks like the only time they do downfield (more than 30 years), it'll be with specific players like Bruce or Delanie Walker (like the route where his feet got tangled and gave up).

Singletary will have to learn though, when the defense is stacking their linebackers right along side the d-lineman and shooting the gaps on almost every down, that Hill will have to test them downfield to keep them honest.
Originally posted by 9ermj:
Originally posted by dirtysouthniner:
Originally posted by Sugatis:
Originally posted by SJniner7:
Originally posted by Sugatis:
Hard to catch a ball when it is rarely if ever on target - Hill can through a curl route on target if it is 15 yards or under that is about it...never going anywhere with Hill as the QB he is a career backup plain and simple

wow, so far from the truth. Do you even watch the games? Hill's arm strength issues show when he tried to hit the 15 yard outs and curls, as there is no zip on the ball. He has good touch, as shown by the 2 TDs to Davis.

Let me ask you this, he puts us ahead with 1:30 to go, and our defense can't hold an 80 yard drive, that is Hill's fault?

We shouldn't have been ahead - he the INT he threw showed that - the only reason he got a 2nd chance is his incompotent ass got called for delay of game - Now Hill is okay we will win games with him but he will NEVER win us the game . We can probably win Our division with him just managing the game because it is so weak but great QB play wins in the playoffs - Shaun Hill may be capable of a good game once in awhile maybe a great game against Detroit or this years Bucs but that is about it....

if he throws the ball once on stride and on target to Bruce we were up another score - Def was on the field way to long again today - and why is that because Shaun Hill isn't allowed or isn't capable of audibling at the line of scrimmage when he see's 8 or 9 men in the box


Hey we were just talking about people like you in another thread
Originally posted by Schulzy:
The bright side is that maybe Sing and Raye will let Shaun have more control of the offense. He's shown them, and all the anti-Hill idiots on here, that he can take this team to the playoffs.

But other than that, I don't see much of a bright side. We had a big chance to give ourselves a nice cushion in the division today and choked it away.

Those Anti-Hill idiots are here to stay.

Apparently so are the Pro Hill idiots

That's me!!! I am proud to say I am a Pro Hill idiot. I believe he give us the best chance to win this season. I have tried to support Smith but he lets me down every time I've seen him drop back during his career. His brightest moment came in that game over two years ago when he made the winning pass to Gore. The problem was he was terrible in that game too. I like Nate but don't think he is ready yet. And if it wasn't for a answered prayer for the Vikings we probably go 4-0 to begin the season.