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Burnout?

Every camp begins rough from what I've heard from friends that are fans of other teams. Then the pull back the closer the season gets.
I'm not quite sure that we're the team that can afford to have half speed practices...

And yes, as mentioned before, there's "shape" and then there's "football shape."

-9fA
  • Chico
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,091
Sing should be tough with the rookies and easy on the veterans. Once the season is halfway through, he should take it easy on everyone or there WILL be a burnout!
Don Shula was extreemly hard on his players and all the did is go 16-0.
And to add, I'm not sure how giving a 5-8 minute talk throughout practice will work either. HOF or not, sooner or later, any player is going to start thinking about, [I don't see you doing this s**t right now old man]. Not that it would be deserved to think that of Sing, but it's only natural.
Originally posted by Joecool:
And to add, I'm not sure how giving a 5-8 minute talk throughout practice will work either. HOF or not, sooner or later, any player is going to start thinking about, [I don't see you doing this s**t right now old man]. Not that it would be deserved to think that of Sing, but it's only natural.

TWo days into TC and you're nit picking Singletary's coaching? Isn't this the HOF middle LB who went to ten (10) pro bowls during his career? Didn't he show some pretty good football smarts in his stint as "interim" HC last season?

Hasn't he begun to change the losing culture of the past six (6) years, and done so, so far, by completely demolishing the country club atmosphere established by his predecessor--and his predecessor's sloppy practices.

Think that change might have an effect on the play we see on the field in the upcoming season?

Come on, Joe, can't you give him just a little time, cut him just a little slack? Before you start a thread titled "Burnout?"
Originally posted by Bejaard49er:
Singletary is being smart just like2007 there has been a lot of press about us being a playoff sleeper, etc. He doesn’t want these guys believing the stories that have been written about us this year.

I think Singletary is using the same methods used in military boot camp. Initially you break down the individual then half way through camp the drill Sgt. eases up a little and begins to build you up. The secret is understanding how to treat each individual during the breaking down period. If Sing hasn’t eased up by the end of the 2nd pre-season game I will become concerned that he is a coach that just rides guys to hard until it blows up in his face and by the 10th game of the season the players are physically and mentally wore out and frustrated.

I think this is the best response to this thread. Remember, Singletary played for a tough coach, and team, but he is also a motivational guy. After he has the team somewhat broken down and humbled, he can then build them up into the team he is envisioning.

I think you have a good point joe, but I believe at this stage Singletary is smart enough to know that the human body can only be pushed so hard.
Look the bottom line is, Sing knows what it takes to become a championship team and this is how championship teams train.

You gotta earn it....coach knows that.
Only the strong survive!
Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Originally posted by Joecool:
And to add, I'm not sure how giving a 5-8 minute talk throughout practice will work either. HOF or not, sooner or later, any player is going to start thinking about, [I don't see you doing this s**t right now old man]. Not that it would be deserved to think that of Sing, but it's only natural.

TWo days into TC and you're nit picking Singletary's coaching? Isn't this the HOF middle LB who went to ten (10) pro bowls during his career? Didn't he show some pretty good football smarts in his stint as "interim" HC last season?

Hasn't he begun to change the losing culture of the past six (6) years, and done so, so far, by completely demolishing the country club atmosphere established by his predecessor--and his predecessor's sloppy practices.

Think that change might have an effect on the play we see on the field in the upcoming season?

Come on, Joe, can't you give him just a little time, cut him just a little slack? Before you start a thread titled "Burnout?"

Yes, I am nit picking on noting some thoughts only. However, in "the old days", motivational speeches and killer training worked well when guys bodies and minds were not worth more than even a million dollars. Now, you mess with a guys body and it costs that player multi-millions in future investments of himself. It's not the same game. A guy getting paid $80,000 a year who has some of that money, let's say $40k to lose can be made up much easier than a guy who is getting paid $4 million and can lose $2 million if he gets hurt.

These guys are training year round, busting their arses off year round only to hear that they aren't working hard enough from a guy from an era where players rarely worked in the offseason. From a guy from an era where when football season or TC began, they were already salivating to play a kids game? Present players don't salivate at TC to desperately play a kids game because their off season never ended and they weren't away from it long enough to miss it.

I'm just saying, it's different mentality going into TC than it was in 85. Also, with how much bigger, stronger, and faster these players are, they hit bigger, stronger and faster so it could possibly burn them out by week 8, especially rookies.
Originally posted by Grigga2021:
Look the bottom line is, Sing knows what it takes to become a championship team and this is how championship teams train.

You gotta earn it....coach knows that.

So did Bill Walsh and he minimized contact and preaching. Look at the better coaches in the league such as Belachick, Andy Ried, Holmgren, and some other brainiacs that believe in being a technician over brute force. The guys like Ditka come strong but they burn fast. Players can only take that for so long when they begin understanding that the game isn't all about full speed and need that extra learning of the smaller intricacies of the game which is what makes a dynasty.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Originally posted by Joecool:
And to add, I'm not sure how giving a 5-8 minute talk throughout practice will work either. HOF or not, sooner or later, any player is going to start thinking about, [I don't see you doing this s**t right now old man]. Not that it would be deserved to think that of Sing, but it's only natural.

TWo days into TC and you're nit picking Singletary's coaching? Isn't this the HOF middle LB who went to ten (10) pro bowls during his career? Didn't he show some pretty good football smarts in his stint as "interim" HC last season?

Hasn't he begun to change the losing culture of the past six (6) years, and done so, so far, by completely demolishing the country club atmosphere established by his predecessor--and his predecessor's sloppy practices.

Think that change might have an effect on the play we see on the field in the upcoming season?

Come on, Joe, can't you give him just a little time, cut him just a little slack? Before you start a thread titled "Burnout?"

Yes, I am nit picking on noting some thoughts only. However, in "the old days", motivational speeches and killer training worked well when guys bodies and minds were not worth more than even a million dollars. Now, you mess with a guys body and it costs that player multi-millions in future investments of himself. It's not the same game. A guy getting paid $80,000 a year who has some of that money, let's say $40k to lose can be made up much easier than a guy who is getting paid $4 million and can lose $2 million if he gets hurt.

These guys are training year round, busting their arses off year round only to hear that they aren't working hard enough from a guy from an era where players rarely worked in the offseason. From a guy from an era where when football season or TC began, they were already salivating to play a kids game? Present players don't salivate at TC to desperately play a kids game because their off season never ended and they weren't away from it long enough to miss it.

I'm just saying, it's different mentality going into TC than it was in 85. Also, with how much bigger, stronger, and faster these players are, they hit bigger, stronger and faster so it could possibly burn them out by week 8, especially rookies.

i see what you saying that's why i don't mind players missing OTA's. they gotta have time to recover. But as of right now none of us know how these tough practices will effect the team. Only time will tell but I do prefer hitting than not hitting at all.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Grigga2021:
Look the bottom line is, Sing knows what it takes to become a championship team and this is how championship teams train.

You gotta earn it....coach knows that.

So did Bill Walsh and he minimized contact and preaching. Look at the better coaches in the league such as Belachick, Andy Ried, Holmgren, and some other brainiacs that believe in being a technician over brute force. The guys like Ditka come strong but they burn fast. Players can only take that for so long when they begin understanding that the game isn't all about full speed and need that extra learning of the smaller intricacies of the game which is what makes a dynasty.

Yeah but those teams are established. Im sure before they became contenders, they worked damn hard to get there, and now that they have they can relax a little bit.

Right now, this team needs to be pushed.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Grigga2021:
Look the bottom line is, Sing knows what it takes to become a championship team and this is how championship teams train.

You gotta earn it....coach knows that.

So did Bill Walsh and he minimized contact and preaching. Look at the better coaches in the league such as Belachick, Andy Ried, Holmgren, and some other brainiacs that believe in being a technician over brute force. The guys like Ditka come strong but they burn fast. Players can only take that for so long when they begin understanding that the game isn't all about full speed and need that extra learning of the smaller intricacies of the game which is what makes a dynasty.

I understand what you're saying, and I think you may have a valid point. (I do think you're jumping the gun, somewhat.) I also think there's another way to look at it.

The thing that's overlooked, somewhat (not necessarily in your posts), seems to me to be that Singletary's not just running a physically tough training camp. He's equally requiring more, MENTALLY, from the team.

Frankly, I think the whole "oh, Singletary's TC is so physical" stuff is overblown. His TC cannot that much more demanding, physically, than those of other NFL teams. It may just seem that way because of the laxity of the past six years or so at Niner's TCs.

When Singletary stops practice, or makes the whole team run, it's because of a mental lapse of some kind. He's demanding that the entire team concentrate better, and he's insisting that the team focus more on what they're trying to accomplish.

Hard work, determination, focus, guts, heart, dedication--ultimately it may be the team's mental toughness that makes the difference as much as any physical prowess, and I think that's what Singletary's trying to instill as much as any "old school" "boot camp" physical conditioning.

Yes, we hear alot about the "nutcracker"--but that's not just a physically tough conditioning drill. Its almost like a statement exercise: "we're going to get back to the basics, and try to whip other teams by being tougher, mentally as well as physically."

No shortcuts, no "going around" the opponent, no nonsense, no finesse, no tricks, no quit--we're simply going to out-tough the other guy.

Its been my experience that such a mindset can be extremely difficult to beat, and it's one reason why sometimes less gifted guys can defeat physically superior opponents. It starts with a mental state, a mindset.

Singletary, himself, may have been one of the premier embodiments of that kind of mindset during his playing days. He was not the most physically imposing MLB, but he was going to be there all day, and the more physical it got, the better he responded, mentally. "I like this kind of party" as he would say.

The "nutcracker" drill seems kind of symbolic, as much as anything, of what Singletary's trying to get across to the team, and to instill in them.

Just the fact that Singletary's trying to instill such an attitude in the team during TC is a stark contrast to the practices of his predecessor.

It will be interesting to see how it translates to the field on Sundays this fall.

[ Edited by oldninerdude on Aug 3, 2009 at 16:41:38 ]
  • AZ9er
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 6,472
Originally posted by Joecool:
The difference between the "Old School" and present time ball is that players didn't work year around in "Old School" where a grueling training camp trying to use every second to develop and get into shape was vital.

Now, these players haven't even taken more than 6 weeks off at one time. These guys all seem to be in shape coming into camp so by week 8 of the season, I could smell a burnout.

Very valid point. Another reason to get rid of one preseason game. If not they should expand the roster by 3-4 so you can get more depth on both OL's and LB positions. With the added depth then you could more freely substitute. But yeah the grueling year round training will surely decrease the life span of the players.
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