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Shawntae Spencer

Originally posted by Frisco69ers:
Originally posted by 49ersNoKaOi:
It comes down to scheme. Our CB's line up 10 yards off WR's allowing quick passes/screens/slants to happen without much difficulty. When do you see Revis or Asomugha playing so far off the WR's? Rarely if ever. They play physical, bumping off routes making it hard for QB's and WR's to get into rhythm.
Also pass rush, we send so many people in to blitz it sickens me how long it takes to get close to the QB. We run a 3-4 D. That means 3 down lineman rush and one LB disguises himself and rushes. I can call the LB's that blitz every play, it's too obvious. With that the QB has time to pass with less players in coverage and he knows where the rush is coming from.
Secondary:
Mays- young mistakes are expected.
Glodson- In 7 games the "ballhawk" has not touched the ball, gets picked on in crunch time, and dose not now how to tackle.
Clements- Overaggressive but besides getting burnt he is a great CB, also great in the run game.
Spencer- I would say our best coverage CB.
James- Garbage, personally I would play T. Brown before him.

I'm afraid that Bradford will tear our secondary up.

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i really dont understand why James is on the field?? he sucks

Not sure how they put this guy on the field with a straight face.
I wonder sometimes, if it is our defensive scheme. Other teams seem to find decent consistent corners. Since we shifted to the 3-4, Mike Nolan's 3-4 which by the way looks good in Miami, and did well in Denver, our corners and safeties have looked pretty bad.

I also think our front seven does not get lots of pressure on the QB even when we bring more than four. Justin Smith seems to be our only top flight D-linemen, and Willis our only top flight Linebacker. The rest range from average to good. We need maybe one more D-linemen to open things up and get pressure quicker with four.

It does seem like our D-line is more about clogging run lanes rather than rushing the passer, and that we set the edges with a OLBs. Leaving one MLB to play pass and the other to flow to the ball. We often times play "cover 4" or a "quarters" scheme, this gives up some of the underneath stuff, sorta "bend don't break" pass coverage.

So I guess what I am saying is I think Spencer is a good, not great NFL corner, but it is hard to tell in our system!
Originally posted by NatralBrnThrila:
We can call it the Nol-Man-Sing F'n thing.

Wow, that was a really nice post. That's a great name for our clearly hybrid 3-4 frankenstein monster--you certainly had me laughing.

Your point about the pass rush is never a very popular argument. After all, it's just so much easier to say, "the pass rush sucks," call out a few players, and be done with it.

But you're absolutely right, the pass rush is the cornerstone of the pass defense. Moreover, the fact that our pass rush is reliably anemic allows opposing QBs to develop a consistent sense for how long they have to read their routes before making the check down. That's the main accomplishment of the Nol-Man-Sing F'n Thing--it allows QBs to confidently read our secondary for a known amount of time on every single passing play. Our poor secondary doesn't stand a chance against that.
Originally posted by lamontb:
He's average. Looks good then looks bad. To be a called a good corner you can't be getting beat by David Gettis.
Clements- Overaggressive but besides getting burnt he is a great CB, also great in the run game.


-[/quote

Great cornerbacks don't get burnt, that's wut most people don't understand. He might have been good at one point but he is average at best. Besides our safeties he is a defensive liability.
  • Wodwo
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Originally posted by Ajanke:
Originally posted by lamontb:
He's average. Looks good then looks bad. To be a called a good corner you can't be getting beat by David Gettis.

The main problem with Spencer has been the same since he joined the team as a rookie.

He's always had very good coverage skills. He sticks with his man and doesn't give him a lot of space. The issue that I see is that he lacks ball awareness. This is something he has admitted himself and worked on in the past (going off memory, no links, sorry). He has improved since his rookie season, but is still very inconsistent.

Gettis TD

On the TD pass to Gettis, he gets beat off the line (well, off his cushion anyway), but stays with his man. The problem comes when he doesn't give a quick look at the QB on the break inside by Gettis. If he does this, he has a chance to under-cut the route and use his leaping ability (see INT from last game) to make a play on the ball. He needs to learn when it is vital during a route to make a quick glance back to see if the ball is in the air.

I could be totally off base here, it's just my perception. I just don't see Spencer getting beat on plays where he's given the WR much space. Anybody seeing something different?
Originally posted by Ajanke:
Originally posted by lamontb:
He's average. Looks good then looks bad. To be a called a good corner you can't be getting beat by David Gettis.

well its weird, there are above average QBs who get burnt by WRs like Fitzgerald over and over.....but Shawntae usually shuts him down....as well as other big name WRs.

there are only a few times I have ever seen him get embarrassed....usually if he gets beat, like the poster above me just said, he is usually right there to try to knock the ball down...but the WR just makes a great play on the ball to bring it down.

and SanDiegoNiner...how can you say Spencer can't "hit"? HA! he has always shown he can tackle....let alone hitting someone hard.
Originally posted by BubbaParisMVP:
Originally posted by NatralBrnThrila:
We can call it the Nol-Man-Sing F'n thing.

Wow, that was a really nice post. That's a great name for our clearly hybrid 3-4 frankenstein monster--you certainly had me laughing.


Thank you sir. Although I think I like your Frankenstein analogy better. Franken-D is probably more fitting and easier to spit out.

Like all good Frankenstein's, I think this one just needs the brain of a killer installed. Our LB's are the strength of our team and capable of so much more aggression than they show. It makes me mad to see them so mentally and schematically handcuffed the way they are. I'm convinced Manusky or Sing or both have these LB's so concerned about keeping the play in front of them, and giving themselves the necessary space to make reads etc etc... that they're scared to bounce around at the line of scrimmage and basically afraid to play football. I don't understand what the fun part of playing LB is if you can't F with the QB and the lineman??? Sure they get up on the line and "show" some looks...but barely.

Perfect opportunity to shoot our gun next week. If we're too scared to throw some looks at a rookie then what's the point of running a 3-4? We seen what Bradford does to defenses when he has time and there's no doubt in my mind he'll punk us too if we let em.

Gotta let the guys play, and absolutely positively gotta keep P Willy clean to make plays. I don't think he needs to be taking on lineman as much as he has been. Not that he isn't capable, I just think we could get more out of him.....along with the rest of our defense.
Originally posted by Gore_21:
Originally posted by 49ersNoKaOi:

Basically what I said.....

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Sorry, didn't really read the above posts. I went back and read it and totally agree.

To add onto my post...
It's not as bad as it use to be because we occasionally let our CBs play up but mostly they play back and especially in the 2 minute situation. We have physical corners yet we let them play 10 yards off the line. Let them get up and jam the WRs. When they have plenty of time we let them work the way down the field 10 yards at a time and eventually kick the game winner. You would think a bunch of professional coaches would be smarter.

Edit: I think we went into prevent with like 4 plus minutes left during the Carolina game.

And as for Goldson last year we put up with his missed tackles and spotty coverage because he had 3FF, 4INTs and 2 sacks. This year he hasn't 0FF, 0INTs, 0 sacks (game close on one that I think Smith helped him with).

Oh, and I think COMMUNICATION is a big part of the problem. Anyone see Spencer pass off LLoyd on the big TD catch to Mays and Mays ended up getting behind? Wondering why Spencer passed him off when he then stopped and didn't cover anybody (nobody was on that side of the field). I mentioned in another thread it's like the elementary school play ground... I don't feel like covering him, here you cover him.

This is a very good observation about passing off to Mays. That just didn't seem right at all
  • Wodwo
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Originally posted by Afrikan:

and SanDiegoNiner...how can you say Spencer can't "hit"? HA! he has always shown he can tackle....let alone hitting someone hard.

Actually, his first few seasons he was really thin and wasn't real physical. He's totally turned that around since, IMO.
Originally posted by JaaDogg49:
Clements- Overaggressive but besides getting burnt he is a great CB, also great in the run game.


-[/quote

Great cornerbacks don't get burnt, that's wut most people don't understand. He might have been good at one point but he is average at best. Besides our safeties he is a defensive liability.

That's like saying a QB cant be great cause he throws too many ints. Or a RB fumbles too much so he cant be great, AP(last year) or Gore. You can be great and have a fault. Clements in every other aspect of his game is great, NT sees negatives more than positive. How was our run D last year without him? sh!t.

Great CB's don't get burnt? One of the best DB's today.....

In can keep posting vids of great DB's getting burnt, but nah. Chew on this for a while then come back with a NT kind of argument.

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  • Wodwo
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Originally posted by GoGetit:

This is a very good observation about passing off to Mays. That just didn't seem right at all

Hard to say without knowing the coverage scheme.

Play in question.

It's hard to tell for sure, but I think this one might actually be on Goldson. I think he bit on the play fake.
  • Wodwo
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Originally posted by 49ersNoKaOi:

In can keep posting vids of great DB's getting burnt, but nah. Chew on this for a while then come back with a NT kind of argument.

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I can't help myself.

I've seen T.O. embarrass Champ Baily in his prime...as well as Charles Woodson (Raiders)...

although Woodson seems like he has reached his prime twice..if that makes sense.
  • Wodwo
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Originally posted by Afrikan:
I've seen T.O. embarrass Champ Baily in his prime...as well as Charles Woodson (Raiders)...

although Woodson seems like he has reached his prime twice..if that makes sense.

Rice beat Sanders.

Everybody gets beat. Everyone makes mistakes and there's always gonna be a bigger fish.
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