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I'm not falling for the hype!!

^^ Was too lazy/tired to type the word "though."
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
We'll give you a cookie if you're right in 3-5 years.

Seriously doe, the draft is all about projection, whether that be based on measureables, college production or a combination of the two. IMO, Jeffrey is as talented as any WR in this draft, but he hasn't always shown the necessary dedication/work ethic that you'd like to see in a top pick, nor has displayed the kind of speed you want to see in a big-bodied WR. So based on projections, Hill is likely to be picked higher than Jeffrey, but both have great size and are crazily talented/athletic. But if I was investing millions of dollars in a young WR, I'd go with the faster one who caught everything in sight at the combine and who displayed big-play a bility but who played in a run-oriented offense (upside) over the guy who's slower and has a questionable work. But that's me.

Jeffrey hasnt run yet, what if he runs a 4.6 like wright, is that fast enough for you? Anquan Boldin and Marcus Colston arent thought of as "fast" but dudes are studs!

Oh and I'll give u a cookie if you are right!
[;)

Ok, if it makes you feel better about yourself, we'll all just agree with you and not offer up any differing opinions. I went out of my way to point out how talented Jeffrey is, and only pointed out that speed is an issue (not a deal-breaker or a death blow to his career). I hope he runs well and I hope he has a great career....was just saying if it was up to me, I'd place my bet on Hill. You feel differently, that's America for you.


What the heck, dont go away sad, convince me! By the way u brought up the cookies
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
We'll give you a cookie if you're right in 3-5 years.

Seriously doe, the draft is all about projection, whether that be based on measureables, college production or a combination of the two. IMO, Jeffrey is as talented as any WR in this draft, but he hasn't always shown the necessary dedication/work ethic that you'd like to see in a top pick, nor has displayed the kind of speed you want to see in a big-bodied WR. So based on projections, Hill is likely to be picked higher than Jeffrey, but both have great size and are crazily talented/athletic. But if I was investing millions of dollars in a young WR, I'd go with the faster one who caught everything in sight at the combine and who displayed big-play a bility but who played in a run-oriented offense (upside) over the guy who's slower and has a questionable work. But that's me.

Jeffrey hasnt run yet, what if he runs a 4.6 like wright, is that fast enough for you? Anquan Boldin and Marcus Colston arent thought of as "fast" but dudes are studs!

Oh and I'll give u a cookie if you are right!
[;)

Ok, if it makes you feel better about yourself, we'll all just agree with you and not offer up any differing opinions. I went out of my way to point out how talented Jeffrey is, and only pointed out that speed is an issue (not a deal-breaker or a death blow to his career). I hope he runs well and I hope he has a great career....was just saying if it was up to me, I'd place my bet on Hill. You feel differently, that's America for you.


What the heck, dont go away sad, convince me! By the way u brought up the cookies

Meh, I like both and would take either one, but i don't think Hill will be there when we pick anyway, so it's a moot point. Can't get too worked up over those....
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
We'll give you a cookie if you're right in 3-5 years.

Seriously doe, the draft is all about projection, whether that be based on measureables, college production or a combination of the two. IMO, Jeffrey is as talented as any WR in this draft, but he hasn't always shown the necessary dedication/work ethic that you'd like to see in a top pick, nor has displayed the kind of speed you want to see in a big-bodied WR. So based on projections, Hill is likely to be picked higher than Jeffrey, but both have great size and are crazily talented/athletic. But if I was investing millions of dollars in a young WR, I'd go with the faster one who caught everything in sight at the combine and who displayed big-play a bility but who played in a run-oriented offense (upside) over the guy who's slower and has a questionable work. But that's me.

Jeffrey hasnt run yet, what if he runs a 4.6 like wright, is that fast enough for you? Anquan Boldin and Marcus Colston arent thought of as "fast" but dudes are studs!

Oh and I'll give u a cookie if you are right!
[;)

Ok, if it makes you feel better about yourself, we'll all just agree with you and not offer up any differing opinions. I went out of my way to point out how talented Jeffrey is, and only pointed out that speed is an issue (not a deal-breaker or a death blow to his career). I hope he runs well and I hope he has a great career....was just saying if it was up to me, I'd place my bet on Hill. You feel differently, that's America for you.


What the heck, dont go away sad, convince me! By the way u brought up the cookies

Meh, I like both and would take either one, but i don't think Hill will be there when we pick anyway, so it's a moot point. Can't get too worked up over those....


It's all good... Do you think Jeffrey will be there at 30 and would u take him there ? I would
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
We'll give you a cookie if you're right in 3-5 years.

Seriously doe, the draft is all about projection, whether that be based on measureables, college production or a combination of the two. IMO, Jeffrey is as talented as any WR in this draft, but he hasn't always shown the necessary dedication/work ethic that you'd like to see in a top pick, nor has displayed the kind of speed you want to see in a big-bodied WR. So based on projections, Hill is likely to be picked higher than Jeffrey, but both have great size and are crazily talented/athletic. But if I was investing millions of dollars in a young WR, I'd go with the faster one who caught everything in sight at the combine and who displayed big-play a bility but who played in a run-oriented offense (upside) over the guy who's slower and has a questionable work. But that's me.

Jeffrey hasnt run yet, what if he runs a 4.6 like wright, is that fast enough for you? Anquan Boldin and Marcus Colston arent thought of as "fast" but dudes are studs!

Oh and I'll give u a cookie if you are right!
[;)

Ok, if it makes you feel better about yourself, we'll all just agree with you and not offer up any differing opinions. I went out of my way to point out how talented Jeffrey is, and only pointed out that speed is an issue (not a deal-breaker or a death blow to his career). I hope he runs well and I hope he has a great career....was just saying if it was up to me, I'd place my bet on Hill. You feel differently, that's America for you.


What the heck, dont go away sad, convince me! By the way u brought up the cookies

Meh, I like both and would take either one, but i don't think Hill will be there when we pick anyway, so it's a moot point. Can't get too worked up over those....


It's all good... Do you think Jeffrey will be there at 30 and would u take him there ? I would

I have some concerns about his ability to get off the line/shake coverage, but overall if he checked out ok on the character side and ran a decent forty, I'd definitely take him at #30.
stephen hill is gonna be good
If you don't want college ball and you don't watch specific players, youtube scouting and stat lines wont convince you.

GT runs one of the most boring, run heavy offenses in college ball, the system is not friendly to WR's. But Texas Tech ran one of the most pass friendly systems and Crabtree has turned out lackluster. So what would you of used to convince me he was not worth the 10th pick...he had stats, publicity, awards...was he worth it?

Jeffrey didnt run for a reason, and I'm assuming that was to not embarrass himself or lower his stock.

Neither are 1st round talent IMO, but Hill is the better athlete and was not able to fully showcase his skills in college, not his fault. He is bigger and faster and is already skilled in blocking because of the GT style of ball. We had a major issues with an overall lack of speed last year, you get that again with Jeffery, you don't have that issue with Hill.
Originally posted by Kolohe:
28 catches for 800+ yards, keep in mind he was in a run heavy offense. Imagine if Hill was in a pass-first offense and had 30 more catches, that's 1,600 yards. But you need to look at more than just measureables and production, its about getting separation at the next level and creating mismatches. Sometimes production doesn't always equal production in the NFL but more so if a payer will fit into your system or complement your existing players and I believe Hill can do just that.

i completely agree but some could say that he got his seperation because people were too worried about the run. i am a stephen hill believer but just saying.
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Originally posted by Kolohe:
28 catches for 800+ yards, keep in mind he was in a run heavy offense. Imagine if Hill was in a pass-first offense and had 30 more catches, that's 1,600 yards. But you need to look at more than just measureables and production, its about getting separation at the next level and creating mismatches. Sometimes production doesn't always equal production in the NFL but more so if a payer will fit into your system or complement your existing players and I believe Hill can do just that.

Disappointed Kolohe. You know his yards would tail off if he was in a more balance offense.

He his YPC is so massive because he typically his man to man coverage and the box is load to stop the run, yes he beats double or bracket sometimes as well but you know as well as anyone that the reason he did so well is because of the run heavy offense. Had to been at a more balance program such as South Carolina or Alabama he probably wouldn't look anywhere near as flashy as he does in GT's triple option.

also we can't really expect the same kind of play that CJ or even Thomas puts on the field, they are both 20 pounds heavier then Hill is. Hill will be a lot less physical when you compare him to those two. The fact that he had already bulked up 10 pounds from his listed college weight gives us the indication that he will likely only be able to add at most another 5 pounds of muscle.

Hill is completely a boom or bust pick, just because he runs a 4.3 doesn't mean he'll be the best WR since Calvin Johnson, we're in a waiting game now and with the FO still wanting to give Crabtree the chance to prove himself as #1 I dont see it as a complete lock that we even go WR in the 1st.
Originally posted by jreff22:
If you don't want college ball and you don't watch specific players, youtube scouting and stat lines wont convince you.

GT runs one of the most boring, run heavy offenses in college ball, the system is not friendly to WR's. But Texas Tech ran one of the most pass friendly systems and Crabtree has turned out lackluster. So what would you of used to convince me he was not worth the 10th pick...he had stats, publicity, awards...was he worth it?

Jeffrey didnt run for a reason, and I'm assuming that was to not embarrass himself or lower his stock.

Neither are 1st round talent IMO, but Hill is the better athlete and was not able to fully showcase his skills in college, not his fault. He is bigger and faster and is already skilled in blocking because of the GT style of ball. We had a major issues with an overall lack of speed last year, you get that again with Jeffery, you don't have that issue with Hill.

I bet Kendall Wright wishes he didnt run the 40...but anyway the 40 is overrated, and the only reason why a lot of us want Hill in the first round is because of that 40
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
I bet Kendall Wright wishes he didnt run the 40...but anyway the 40 is overrated, and the only reason why a lot of us want Hill in the first round is because of that 40

I think the reason most want him is because he's big and people think he'll turn into Larry fitz or CJ and be our RZ saviour. He won't. Fitz and CJ were highly coveted and expected to be monster receivers when they were in college, none of these besides Blackmon has that potential and theres no way we'll get him.
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by jreff22:
If you don't want college ball and you don't watch specific players, youtube scouting and stat lines wont convince you.

GT runs one of the most boring, run heavy offenses in college ball, the system is not friendly to WR's. But Texas Tech ran one of the most pass friendly systems and Crabtree has turned out lackluster. So what would you of used to convince me he was not worth the 10th pick...he had stats, publicity, awards...was he worth it?

Jeffrey didnt run for a reason, and I'm assuming that was to not embarrass himself or lower his stock.

Neither are 1st round talent IMO, but Hill is the better athlete and was not able to fully showcase his skills in college, not his fault. He is bigger and faster and is already skilled in blocking because of the GT style of ball. We had a major issues with an overall lack of speed last year, you get that again with Jeffery, you don't have that issue with Hill.

I bet Kendall Wright wishes he didnt run the 40...but anyway the 40 is overrated, and the only reason why a lot of us want Hill in the first round is because of that 40


Not really. Hil's forty was impressive, but it was also his size (6'4", 215) and the great hands he showed during the drills. If he was 5'11" and showed mediocre hands, his forty wouldn't be causing such a buzz, but when you put all of that in one package, you get a very unique prospect.
Hill also jumped like four feet off the ground. That with good hands and being fast and tall would make you think touchdowns. He is very similar to Demaryus Thomas when he came out, and he just keeps getting better. I'd rather draft Fleener over Jeffery if we're looking for straight redone production, but if you want a guy who could become a number 1 wideout at #30, it's Hill. Don't forget Jeffery got himself kicked out of his last game for fighting, Baalke will pass and this conversation should end as it looks like savage wants to get to 5000 posts faster than anybody.
[ Edited by D-Money on Mar 16, 2012 at 7:57 AM ]
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by jreff22:
If you don't want college ball and you don't watch specific players, youtube scouting and stat lines wont convince you.

GT runs one of the most boring, run heavy offenses in college ball, the system is not friendly to WR's. But Texas Tech ran one of the most pass friendly systems and Crabtree has turned out lackluster. So what would you of used to convince me he was not worth the 10th pick...he had stats, publicity, awards...was he worth it?

Jeffrey didnt run for a reason, and I'm assuming that was to not embarrass himself or lower his stock.

Neither are 1st round talent IMO, but Hill is the better athlete and was not able to fully showcase his skills in college, not his fault. He is bigger and faster and is already skilled in blocking because of the GT style of ball. We had a major issues with an overall lack of speed last year, you get that again with Jeffery, you don't have that issue with Hill.

I bet Kendall Wright wishes he didnt run the 40...but anyway the 40 is overrated, and the only reason why a lot of us want Hill in the first round is because of that 40


Not really. Hil's forty was impressive, but it was also his size (6'4", 215) and the great hands he showed during the drills. If he was 5'11" and showed mediocre hands, his forty wouldn't be causing such a buzz, but when you put all of that in one package, you get a very unique prospect.


Well Streeter and Quick have size also, they just didnt run as fast, therefore nobody wants these guys in the first.
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by SAVAGE49er:
Originally posted by jreff22:
If you don't want college ball and you don't watch specific players, youtube scouting and stat lines wont convince you.

GT runs one of the most boring, run heavy offenses in college ball, the system is not friendly to WR's. But Texas Tech ran one of the most pass friendly systems and Crabtree has turned out lackluster. So what would you of used to convince me he was not worth the 10th pick...he had stats, publicity, awards...was he worth it?

Jeffrey didnt run for a reason, and I'm assuming that was to not embarrass himself or lower his stock.

Neither are 1st round talent IMO, but Hill is the better athlete and was not able to fully showcase his skills in college, not his fault. He is bigger and faster and is already skilled in blocking because of the GT style of ball. We had a major issues with an overall lack of speed last year, you get that again with Jeffery, you don't have that issue with Hill.

I bet Kendall Wright wishes he didnt run the 40...but anyway the 40 is overrated, and the only reason why a lot of us want Hill in the first round is because of that 40


Not really. Hil's forty was impressive, but it was also his size (6'4", 215) and the great hands he showed during the drills. If he was 5'11" and showed mediocre hands, his forty wouldn't be causing such a buzz, but when you put all of that in one package, you get a very unique prospect.


Well Streeter and Quick have size also, they just didnt run as fast, therefore nobody wants these guys in the first.

Streeter really struggled to catch the ball during his time at Miami, and showed the same shaky hands at the combine. Quick is an interesting prospect and might get drafted higher than people think....but yes, neither of the two you just mentioned have showed the overall potential that Hill has, which is why there's more buzz about him. But there are legit question marks about all of the 2nd tier WRs (outside of Blackmon and Floyd), so we'll see how it all shakes out.
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