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:::OFFICiAL::: 2012 NFL SCOUTING COMBINE THREAD

Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
Damn, I just did some research on 40 times and players currently in the NFL (posted in top 10 WR thread) in response to the hate for dropping Wright, Sanu and Jeffery.

Every single WR that was top 25 for yards run under a 4.6. The 4 worst 40s from the top 25 WRs last year were Brandon Marshall (but he is what, 6-4, 220+?, 4.57 speed), Antonio Brown (combine 4.57, then pro day did a 4.47), Steve Johnson (4.59, IMO this guy won't last but we will see), and Marques Colston (4.55, but I think he is 6'4, or at least 6'3). A lot of the top 25 WR's ran in the low 4.5s (9 guys).

I'm really against Kendall Wright and Sanu now. Those numbers are pretty shocking IMO.

Wright is going to run a 4.4 IMO at his pro day. I remember Joe Haden ran slow as f**k at the combine and came back and ran a faster time on grass even at his pro day, and he has turned out to be real good. That's my guess and I'm sticking to it.

BTW didn't Fitz run a 4.62 at his pro day and not a 40 at the combine? Boldin was a 4.7 something(although his production kind of fell off when he went to BMore) and I want to say TO was a 4.6 guy too but I'm not sure on that one.
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Wright is going to run a 4.4 IMO at his pro day. I remember Joe Haden ran slow as f**k at the combine and came back and ran a faster time on grass even at his pro day, and he has turned out to be real good. That's my guess and I'm sticking to it.

BTW didn't Fitz run a 4.62 at his pro day and not a 40 at the combine? Boldin was a 4.7 something(although his production kind of fell off when he went to BMore) and I want to say TO was a 4.6 guy too but I'm not sure on that one.

Yeah I quoted in the other thread, SI link says he ran in the 4.5s but news articles said he ran a 4.63.

We will see what Kendall Wright can do, if he can bounce back.
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
Yeah I quoted in the other thread, SI link says he ran in the 4.5s but news articles said he ran a 4.63.

We will see what Kendall Wright can do, if he can bounce back.

hope he doesnt he needs to fall to us
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Wright is going to run a 4.4 IMO at his pro day. I remember Joe Haden ran slow as f**k at the combine and came back and ran a faster time on grass even at his pro day, and he has turned out to be real good. That's my guess and I'm sticking to it.

BTW didn't Fitz run a 4.62 at his pro day and not a 40 at the combine? Boldin was a 4.7 something(although his production kind of fell off when he went to BMore) and I want to say TO was a 4.6 guy too but I'm not sure on that one.

Yeah I quoted in the other thread, SI link says he ran in the 4.5s but news articles said he ran a 4.63.

We will see what Kendall Wright can do, if he can bounce back.

Yeah I'm tellin you man I think he will bounce back. I saw him play a lot and he can get open deep. I dunno what was going on at the combine but he's more athletic than he showed.

btw never been a big fan of Sanu personally though. Don't hate him but I wasn't on the Sanu bandwagon in the 1st either.
  • mayo49
  • Veteran
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Originally posted by ishkabibel:
Originally posted by mayo49:
Well, folks another year has gone by and another Combine has come and gone. That you for participating and everyone have a good night.


Maybe next year you could run the 40 for us as well

OTC Draft Blog: Ten Combine Sleepers

http://draft watchers.com/node/1138

Originally posted by OTC:
1) RB Cyrus Gray, Texas A&M - Coming off a shoulder injury, Gray put up 21 lifts of 225 showing he is fully healed from it. On top of this, he clocked a nice 4.47 and put up solid numbers across the board in his other workouts. Overall Gray looks like a good late 3rd round prospect.

2) WR Devon Wylie, Fresno State - Perhaps my favorite slot/KR prospect, Wylie clocked a 4.39 and further showcased his explosive physical ability with a 39-inch vertical and 10-03 broad jump. He also showed some strength for his 5-9 187 pound size, putting up 17 reps on the bench.

3) OG Ryan Miller, Colorado - Coming in at a monstrous 6-7 321, Miller showcased an impressive blend of power and athleticism, putting up 32 reps on the bench, despite his long arms, and clocking one of the better 40 times (5.27) and other agility drill times among offensive linemen.

4) TE James Hanna, Oklahoma - I've seen Hanna play and the kid reminds me a lot of Dallas Clark. Hanna widened quite a few eyes at the combine after putting up an amazing 40 for a tight end at 4.49. He easily had the best agility numbers too (shuttle run: 4.11, 3-cone: 6.76) and lifted the bar 24 times. On top of already having brownie points for being a versatile player for Oklahoma, Hanna's combine boosted his stock even higher and assured him a draft spot this April, making him a lot of money.

5) NT Hebron Fangupo, BYU - Checked in at 6-1 323 and ran pretty well (5.18) for a man that size. He tied for 2nd most reps on the bench among DL with 36. Fangupo is a middle round talent who could slide due to past injuries. He could go as high as the 4th, or as low as the 6th right now.

6) OLB Miles Burris, San Diego St. - Had an outstanding combine, checking in at a rock solid 6-2 246. While he did not run the 40, he displayed tremendous strength (31 reps on the bench) and explosive physical abilities with a 37 1/2-inch vertical and 10-01 broad jump.

7) CB Justin Bethel, Presbyterian - Bethel came in with great size for a corner at 6-0 200, and already showed at his all-star game that he can run with some of the top receiver prospects. I think he plays a little faster than his timed 4.58, which really isn't bad (especially compared to many of the other DB times this year - Hayward ran a 4.57), but the 40-time is less important that his other measurables which were terrific. One of the strongest corners at the combine, Bethel put up 19 reps of 225, and had the 2nd best broad jump at 10 feet 11 inches. He also ran a 6.79 3-cone time, which is pretty darn good.

8) CB Coty Sensabaugh, Clemson - He was one of the few players noted as an impressive prospect in the Players All Star classic, and Sensabaugh came in at roughly 5-11 190 at the combine. His measurables really helped him, and he stands a good chance of being drafted this April after putting up a 4.42 forty time, 15 reps on the bench, and one of the top shuttle and 3-cone times each.

9) CB Ron Brooks, LSU - Weighed in at a thick 5-10 190 and blew people away with a 4.37 forty, one of the fastest times this year. He was a solid performer at LSU and should be a strong ST's contributor early and a good developmental corner.

10) S Sean Richardson, Vanderbilt - Richardson, who can play both safety spots, is a big man for a DB (6-2 216) but he can run well, and proved this with his solid 4.52 forty and 7.01 3-cone time. Richardson easily had the best vertical and broad jump among all safeties at the combine this year with a 38 1/2-inch leap, and 10-08 broad jump.
[ Edited by OnTheClock on Mar 1, 2012 at 5:58 PM ]
  • sfout
  • Veteran
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Originally posted by OnTheClock:
OTC Draft Blog: Ten Combine Sleepers

http://draft watchers.com/node/1138

Originally posted by OTC:
1) RB Cyrus Gray, Texas A&M - Coming off a shoulder injury, Gray put up 21 lifts of 225 showing he is fully healed from it. On top of this, he clocked a nice 4.47 and put up solid numbers across the board in his other workouts. Overall Gray looks like a good late 3rd round prospect.

2) WR Devon Wylie, Fresno State - Perhaps my favorite slot/KR prospect, Wylie clocked a 4.39 and further showcased his explosive physical ability with a 39-inch vertical and 10-03 broad jump. He also showed some strength for his 5-9 187 pound size, putting up 17 reps on the bench.

3) OG Ryan Miller, Colorado - Coming in at a monstrous 6-7 321, Miller showcased an impressive blend of power and athleticism, putting up 32 reps on the bench, despite his long arms, and clocking one of the better 40 times (5.27) and other agility drill times among offensive linemen.

4) TE James Hanna, Oklahoma - I've seen Hanna play and the kid reminds me a lot of Dallas Clark. Hanna widened quite a few eyes at the combine after putting up an amazing 40 for a tight end at 4.49. He easily had the best agility numbers too (shuttle run: 4.11, 3-cone: 6.76) and lifted the bar 24 times. On top of already having brownie points for being a versatile player for Oklahoma, Hanna's combine boosted his stock even higher and assured him a draft spot this April, making him a lot of money.

5) NT Hebron Fangupo, BYU - Checked in at 6-1 323 and ran pretty well (5.18) for a man that size. He tied for 2nd most reps on the bench among DL with 36. Fangupo is a middle round talent who could slide due to past injuries. He could go as high as the 4th, or as low as the 6th right now.

6) OLB Miles Burris, San Diego St. - Had an outstanding combine, checking in at a rock solid 6-2 246. While he did not run the 40, he displayed tremendous strength (31 reps on the bench) and explosive physical abilities with a 37 1/2-inch vertical and 10-01 broad jump.

7) CB Justin Bethel, Presbyterian - Bethel came in with great size for a corner at 6-0 200, and already showed at his all-star game that he can run with some of the top receiver prospects. I think he plays a little faster than his timed 4.58, which really isn't bad (especially compared to many of the other DB times this year - Hayward ran a 4.57), but the 40-time is less important that his other measurables which were terrific. One of the strongest corners at the combine, Bethel put up 19 reps of 225, and had the 2nd best broad jump at 10 feet 11 inches. He also ran a 6.79 3-cone time, which is pretty darn good.

8) CB Coty Sensabaugh, Clemson - He was one of the few players noted as an impressive prospect in the Players All Star classic, and Sensabaugh came in at roughly 5-11 190 at the combine. His measurables really helped him, and he stands a good chance of being drafted this April after putting up a 4.42 forty time, 15 reps on the bench, and one of the top shuttle and 3-cone times each.

9) CB Ron Brooks, LSU - Weighed in at a thick 5-10 190 and blew people away with a 4.37 forty, one of the fastest times this year. He was a solid performer at LSU and should be a strong ST's contributor early and a good developmental corner.

10) S Sean Richardson, Vanderbilt - Richardson, who can play both safety spots, is a big man for a DB (6-2 216) but he can run well, and proved this with his solid 4.52 forty and 7.01 3-cone time. Richardson easily had the best vertical and broad jump among all safeties at the combine this year with a 38 1/2-inch leap, and 10-08 broad jump.

Burris and Richardson are the guys I want for OLB and S depth. :D Glad you've taken Richardson as well OTC.
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
Damn, I just did some research on 40 times and players currently in the NFL (posted in top 10 WR thread) in response to the hate for dropping Wright, Sanu and Jeffery.

Every single WR that was top 25 for yards run under a 4.6. The 4 worst 40s from the top 25 WRs last year were Brandon Marshall (but he is what, 6-4, 220+?, 4.57 speed), Antonio Brown (combine 4.57, then pro day did a 4.47), Steve Johnson (4.59, IMO this guy won't last but we will see), and Marques Colston (4.55, but I think he is 6'4, or at least 6'3). A lot of the top 25 WR's ran in the low 4.5s (9 guys).

I'm really against Kendall Wright and Sanu now. Those numbers are pretty shocking IMO.

Good research man.
Originally posted by sfout:
Burris and Richardson are the guys I want for OLB and S depth. :D Glad you've taken Richardson as well OTC.

After re-signing Brooks, we have some really nice options late in the draft for OLB depth now. I'd take Burris in the 5th immediately if he's there.


Originally posted by Travisty13:
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
Damn, I just did some research on 40 times and players currently in the NFL (posted in top 10 WR thread) in response to the hate for dropping Wright, Sanu and Jeffery.

Every single WR that was top 25 for yards run under a 4.6. The 4 worst 40s from the top 25 WRs last year were Brandon Marshall (but he is what, 6-4, 220+?, 4.57 speed), Antonio Brown (combine 4.57, then pro day did a 4.47), Steve Johnson (4.59, IMO this guy won't last but we will see), and Marques Colston (4.55, but I think he is 6'4, or at least 6'3). A lot of the top 25 WR's ran in the low 4.5s (9 guys).

I'm really against Kendall Wright and Sanu now. Those numbers are pretty shocking IMO.

Good research man.

Would have to see what their Pro Days look like first. I am willing to guarantee Wright will clock at least a full tenth of a second faster at his Pro Day, if not more. I'm expecting a 4.4 at the pro day. Sanu? I am not expecting much better than a high 4.5.
  • sfout
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Originally posted by OnTheClock:
After re-signing Brooks, we have some really nice options late in the draft for OLB depth now. I'd take Burris in the 5th immediately if he's there.

After Burris I would opt for Darius Fleming, that is if he still has a later round grade. Whats his stock look like after the combine?
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by sfout:
Burris and Richardson are the guys I want for OLB and S depth. :D Glad you've taken Richardson as well OTC.

After re-signing Brooks, we have some really nice options late in the draft for OLB depth now. I'd take Burris in the 5th immediately if he's there.


Originally posted by Travisty13:
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
Damn, I just did some research on 40 times and players currently in the NFL (posted in top 10 WR thread) in response to the hate for dropping Wright, Sanu and Jeffery.

Every single WR that was top 25 for yards run under a 4.6. The 4 worst 40s from the top 25 WRs last year were Brandon Marshall (but he is what, 6-4, 220+?, 4.57 speed), Antonio Brown (combine 4.57, then pro day did a 4.47), Steve Johnson (4.59, IMO this guy won't last but we will see), and Marques Colston (4.55, but I think he is 6'4, or at least 6'3). A lot of the top 25 WR's ran in the low 4.5s (9 guys).

I'm really against Kendall Wright and Sanu now. Those numbers are pretty shocking IMO.

Good research man.

Would have to see what their Pro Days look like first. I am willing to guarantee Wright will clock at least a full tenth of a second faster at his Pro Day, if not more. I'm expecting a 4.4 at the pro day. Sanu? I am not expecting much better than a high 4.5.

We shall see. As I've said, I'm totally open to changing my rankings.

But I'm trying to be as objective as possible. I think its dangerous liking guys early on and too much, might lead you to put the blinders on when bad info comes out. I know this because I've done it many times.

People keep saying 40s don't matter, but I think any objective person would disagree when you look at the numbers I pulled up. The key is a 40 time doesn't MAKE a player, but it can KILL a player.

As key as it is to evaluate talent coming out, I think its also key to look at the past couple of seasons to see what worked and what didn't work to identify red flags or gems.

What happened:
1st Round
-Only WRs drafted in the 1st ran a sub 4.5 (well not counting Crabtree) (Nicks ran a 4.49)
-Britt, also out of Rutgers and who drew comparisons to TO, ran a 4.47
-I'd say this years crop was good (not many 1st round WR busts) but not great
-despite the flak DHB gets, he actually had a great 3rd year
2nd Round
-Robiskie fell into the 2nd, was considered very highly until he ran a 4.59 40, busts in the NFL
-Massaquoi ran a 4.66 and went int the 2nd, I'd say he hasn't panned out in the NFL but there is a chance its because he is on the Browns
3rd Round
-After not many WRs being taken, there was a run on them late in the 3rd
-Derrick Williams runs a 4.68 despite showing great athleticism in college, bust
-Mike Wallace, who wasn't productive in college (never topped 800 yards recieving) runs a blazing 40 and has done pretty well in the NFL, wouldn't you 40-haters say?
-Brandon Tate had an all around good combine, been decent
-Ramses Barden runs a 4.61, overlooked because he is 6'6, and then busts in the NFL
-Patrick Turner runs a 4.68, busts in the NFL
-Deon Butler runs a great 40, hasn't panned out
4th Round
-Mike Thomas, the midget, runs a 4.4 flat. I'd say he was worth the pick, done pretty well on a s**tty passing offense
-Brian Hartline runs a 4.58, been a mediocre player (kind of same problem as Mike Thomas
-Louis Murphy, not productive in college but leading team reciever in college, runs a 4.43, he has been a mixed bag
-Austin Collie, SUPER productive mid-major reciever, runs a 4.63, he has worked out as a slot reciever
5th Rounder
-The only WR thats been productive out fo the 5th? Johnny Knox who ran a 4.34

I'd categorize (Based on their first 3 seasons) the recievers as follows:
Great Value: Harvin (if he was healthy, can't plan for migraines), Nicks, Mike Wallace, Brandon Tate (back-to-back 1000yard seasons for a 3rd rounder), Johnny Knox
About Right: Maclin, Britt (Hard to rank him, cuz IMO if he stays healthy he will be a 1000yrd reciever), Mike Thomas, Louis Murphy, Austin Collie
Reach: DHB, Crabtree, Massaquoi, Deon Butler
Bust: Robiskie, Derrick Williams, Ramses Barden, Patrick Turner, Brian Hartline

So overall I'd say 40 times were pretty important! Robiskie ran a 4.59, DWill ran a 4.68, Barden ran a 4.61, Turner ran a 4.68, Hartline ran a 4.58, Massauoi ran a 4.66. So of the 7 guys in the first 4 rounds who haven't produced, only one of them had a great 40.

DHB and Crabs have been productive, but so far they haven't been worth a top 10 pick.

Of the best values, all of them had a great combines. Tate and Nicks didn't have blazing 40s, but they had good 40s so that it wasn't an achilles heel. The other 3 best values had blazing 40s.

One out of the 14 recievers that has worked out put up decen numbers (Collie ran a 4.63).
[ Edited by SunDevilNiner79 on Mar 1, 2012 at 7:02 PM ]
^^ i agree 40 do matter

but it only matters to people like jeffery or sanu those people that have speed concerns coming out

every scouting report shows that wright has elite speed and athlethicisim and it shows when you watch this guy in games therfore 40 for him doesnt matter

the 40 in draft is very dependent on track form which a bad form could easily add ,2 seconds to your time
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
^^ i agree 40 do matter

but it only matters to people like jeffery or sanu those people that have speed concerns coming out

every scouting report shows that wright has elite speed and athlethicisim and it shows when you watch this guy in games therfore 40 for him doesnt matter

the 40 in draft is very dependent on track form which a bad form could easily add ,2 seconds to your time

The bad form is a theory, to my knowledge I haven't seen any breakdown of the film of him running a 40 showing the bad form.

Edit: I'm sure people can disagree with my ranking of the 09 draft class of WRs. Hopefully that doesn't derail conversation as that wasn't my point. Feel free to rank them as you want, but notice what produces in the NFL and what kind of combines they had (and yes I looked at more then 40, espicially with guys that ran in low 4.5s).
[ Edited by SunDevilNiner79 on Mar 1, 2012 at 7:06 PM ]
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:

What happened:

2nd Round
-Robiskie fell into the 2nd, was considered very highly until he ran a 4.59 40, busts in the NFL
-Massaquoi ran a 4.66 and went int the 2nd, I'd say he hasn't panned out in the NFL but there is a chance its because he is on the Browns
3rd Round
-After not many WRs being taken, there was a run on them late in the 3rd
-Derrick Williams runs a 4.68 despite showing great athleticism in college, bust
-Mike Wallace, who wasn't productive in college (never topped 800 yards recieving) runs a blazing 40 and has done pretty well in the NFL, wouldn't you 40-haters say?
-Brandon Tate had an all around good combine, been decent
-Ramses Barden runs a 4.61, overlooked because he is 6'6, and then busts in the NFL
-Patrick Turner runs a 4.68, busts in the NFL
-Deon Butler runs a great 40, hasn't panned out
4th Round
-Mike Thomas, the midget, runs a 4.4 flat. I'd say he was worth the pick, done pretty well on a s**tty passing offense
-Brian Hartline runs a 4.58, been a mediocre player (kind of same problem as Mike Thomas
-Louis Murphy, not productive in college but leading team reciever in college, runs a 4.43, he has been a mixed bag
-Austin Collie, SUPER productive mid-major reciever, runs a 4.63, he has worked out as a slot reciever
5th Rounder
-The only WR thats been productive out fo the 5th? Johnny Knox who ran a 4.34

I'd categorize (Based on their first 3 seasons) the recievers as follows:
Great Value: Harvin (if he was healthy, can't plan for migraines), Nicks, Mike Wallace, Brandon Tate (back-to-back 1000yard seasons for a 3rd rounder), Johnny Knox
About Right: Maclin, Britt (Hard to rank him, cuz IMO if he stays healthy he will be a 1000yrd reciever), Mike Thomas, Louis Murphy, Austin Collie
Reach: DHB, Crabtree, Massaquoi, Deon Butler
Bust: Robiskie, Derrick Williams, Ramses Barden, Patrick Turner, Brian Hartline

So overall I'd say 40 times were pretty important! Robiskie ran a 4.59, DWill ran a 4.68, Barden ran a 4.61, Turner ran a 4.68, Hartline ran a 4.58, Massauoi ran a 4.66. So of the 7 guys in the first 4 rounds who haven't produced, only one of them had a great 40.

DHB and Crabs have been productive, but so far they haven't been worth a top 10 pick.

Of the best values, all of them had a great combines. Tate and Nicks didn't have blazing 40s, but they had good 40s so that it wasn't an achilles heel. The other 3 best values had blazing 40s.

One out of the 14 recievers that has worked out put up decen numbers (Collie ran a 4.63).

Robiskie ran a sub 4.5
Massaquoi has been very good for the Browns
Barden has had injury issues
Originally posted by sfout:
Burris and Richardson are the guys I want for OLB and S depth. :D Glad you've taken Richardson as well OTC.


Originally posted by OnTheClock:
OTC Draft Blog: Ten Combine Sleepers

http://draft watchers.com/node/1138

Cyrus gray is solid, watch a few texas am this year. 4.47 was surprising