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MadDog's 49ers Draft Board- Stacking the Board

Nice work, Mad Dog. Couple of questions for you:

What are your thoughts on Charles Brown? Under the radar, LT only, fit for a zone blocking scheme only, etc.

What are your thoughts about Devin McCourty? IMO he fits the Niners mold perfectly with his size, speed and special teams ability. But where does he fit value wise?
As always MD

Surprised you have Spiller that high, I love the kid but I didn't think you thought that highly of him. Aside from Okung who is your favorite option for us at RT and are you still skeptical of A Davis? Surprised you are that high on Dex!! Do you think there is any chance that we wait for an OT till the 2nd. Having a Spiller/Haden/Graham possible combo in the 1st would be nasty. I just don't think we would risk passing on a much needed OT this year, especially with 2 1st rounders.
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I love it MadDog!

With the 13th pick in the NFL draft the 49ers select: CJ Spiller
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by 23zack80:
Pouncey higher than Bulaga? Also, do you think Sean Weatherspoon could play mike in a 3-4, but left him off as Patrick Willis is invincible and he's too small for the ted?

I didn't like Weatherspoon this season as the Tigers' Mike backer. He was MUCH better last year as a Sam, where I think he will play in the NFL.

To me, Bulaga has a limited upside to his game. His length presents a problem at the next level. Pouncey and Iupati are easily the best interior linemen, and grade pretty high in my book.

MD,
Does your placement of Iupati and designating him as OG/OT suggest you as Baalke believe the Niners will consider Iupati at tackle? Second question, do you think the Niners should trade down from either #13 or #17 and/or trade up from #49. If so, who for?

If I was with the organization, I'd hold at the current spots, unless the team did not draft an OT at 13 and 17. I would then move up from 49 to beat the rush of leftover OL before the second round begins.

However, I think the Niners might be inclined to trade the 17th overall if they can land an OT at 13.

As for Iupati, I believe teams will draft him as a guard, but attempt to develop him into a tackle over time. I think teams should draft him to play LG and leave him there. It is better to have a stud LG than an above average RT.
Originally posted by m_brockalexander:
Nice work, Mad Dog. Couple of questions for you:

What are your thoughts on Charles Brown? Under the radar, LT only, fit for a zone blocking scheme only, etc.

What are your thoughts about Devin McCourty? IMO he fits the Niners mold perfectly with his size, speed and special teams ability. But where does he fit value wise?

I think Brown is the odds-on favorite to be the pick at 17, unless the Giants grab himat 15, or the Seahawks take Berry at 6 and then Brown at 14.

Brown has gained some weight to be in the 300-305 pound range, and can probably still stack on ten more pounds. He'll never be a 325 jumbo-sized guy like Davis. Brown has a lot in common with Staley: former TE's, guys who added weight to get to 300 pounds before the draft, both players flying under the radar until the end, and a solid pass protector who needs to work on the running game. Strikingly similar.

Brown played in a pro-style set at USC, and appears more than nimble enough to play in a zone scheme, or in our hybrid-style system (I'm not sure what direction our team will head in blocking schemes this year). Probably best at LT, but there is enough there to think that RT is not going to be an issue.

I have been a big fan of McCourty for some time. He presents late first, early second round value. Great size/speed combo, sensational footwork, hustle. He can play on an island. Excellent special teamer (probably top 5 in the draft) who will play nickle this year, and then start next year when Clements is released.

If the Niners do not draft Haden, Thomas, Wilson in the first round, then I think they target Owusu-Ansah in the second, especially with his return ability. He is a brilliant return man.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by m_brockalexander:
Nice work, Mad Dog. Couple of questions for you:

What are your thoughts on Charles Brown? Under the radar, LT only, fit for a zone blocking scheme only, etc.

What are your thoughts about Devin McCourty? IMO he fits the Niners mold perfectly with his size, speed and special teams ability. But where does he fit value wise?

I think Brown is the odds-on favorite to be the pick at 17, unless the Giants grab himat 15, or the Seahawks take Berry at 6 and then Brown at 14.

Brown has gained some weight to be in the 300-305 pound range, and can probably still stack on ten more pounds. He'll never be a 325 jumbo-sized guy like Davis. Brown has a lot in common with Staley: former TE's, guys who added weight to get to 300 pounds before the draft, both players flying under the radar until the end, and a solid pass protector who needs to work on the running game. Strikingly similar.

Brown played in a pro-style set at USC, and appears more than nimble enough to play in a zone scheme, or in our hybrid-style system (I'm not sure what direction our team will head in blocking schemes this year). Probably best at LT, but there is enough there to think that RT is not going to be an issue.

I have been a big fan of McCourty for some time. He presents late first, early second round value. Great size/speed combo, sensational footwork, hustle. He can play on an island. Excellent special teamer (probably top 5 in the draft) who will play nickle this year, and then start next year when Clements is released.

If the Niners do not draft Haden, Thomas, Wilson in the first round, then I think they target Owusu-Ansah in the second, especially with his return ability. He is a brilliant return man.

Thanks Mad Dog. Having another Staley wouldn't be bad, but I am a little skeptical about picking him at #17.

Getting either McCourty or Owusu-Ansah would be fantastic.
Originally posted by jreff22:
As always MD

Surprised you have Spiller that high, I love the kid but I didn't think you thought that highly of him. Aside from Okung who is your favorite option for us at RT and are you still skeptical of A Davis? Surprised you are that high on Dex!! Do you think there is any chance that we wait for an OT till the 2nd. Having a Spiller/Haden/Graham possible combo in the 1st would be nasty. I just don't think we would risk passing on a much needed OT this year, especially with 2 1st rounders.

I'd move Staley to RT if Okung was drafted. But, with the other guys, I see strengths and weakness of each. Most are probably best suited for RT. Both Davis and Williams would be a tremendous upgrade. I'd rate them highest at RT, Williams over Davis (less bust potential, even though Davis may have a better upside).

However, none of the OT's are going to be on the board. I see the order shaking down like this:
Williams at 4
Okung at 5
Davis at 6
Campbell at 8
Bulaga at 9

So, either the Niners select Brown at 13, or hope that the Giants pass. I doubt we wait to the second round for an OT. Simply dealing with leftovers at this point, or jumbo-sized guys who will try to transition to RT (Ducasse, Jerry). And, these guys might be gone anyways. Saffold will be gone by the mid-20's. OT inflation.

Spiller and Bryant are explosive players, and the NFL is moving that direction. Plodding down the field is not a winning formula right now. And, the Niners need somebody who is a threat to score every time he touches the ball. Spiller is that type of player.

Bryant runs the field like T.O., very angry. And, I like that rage. He's going to run over a LOT of DB's in the NFL.
Originally posted by m_brockalexander:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by m_brockalexander:
Nice work, Mad Dog. Couple of questions for you:

What are your thoughts on Charles Brown? Under the radar, LT only, fit for a zone blocking scheme only, etc.

What are your thoughts about Devin McCourty? IMO he fits the Niners mold perfectly with his size, speed and special teams ability. But where does he fit value wise?

I think Brown is the odds-on favorite to be the pick at 17, unless the Giants grab himat 15, or the Seahawks take Berry at 6 and then Brown at 14.

Brown has gained some weight to be in the 300-305 pound range, and can probably still stack on ten more pounds. He'll never be a 325 jumbo-sized guy like Davis. Brown has a lot in common with Staley: former TE's, guys who added weight to get to 300 pounds before the draft, both players flying under the radar until the end, and a solid pass protector who needs to work on the running game. Strikingly similar.

Brown played in a pro-style set at USC, and appears more than nimble enough to play in a zone scheme, or in our hybrid-style system (I'm not sure what direction our team will head in blocking schemes this year). Probably best at LT, but there is enough there to think that RT is not going to be an issue.

I have been a big fan of McCourty for some time. He presents late first, early second round value. Great size/speed combo, sensational footwork, hustle. He can play on an island. Excellent special teamer (probably top 5 in the draft) who will play nickle this year, and then start next year when Clements is released.

If the Niners do not draft Haden, Thomas, Wilson in the first round, then I think they target Owusu-Ansah in the second, especially with his return ability. He is a brilliant return man.

Thanks Mad Dog. Having another Staley wouldn't be bad, but I am a little skeptical about picking him at #17.

Getting either McCourty or Owusu-Ansah would be fantastic.

Brown is going to go earlier than expected, as a mad rush for OT's will happen again. I hope he's there at 17.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by DarthNiner:
Originally posted by DarthNiner:
Great job MD.

Interesting that you had Brandon Graham ahead of the #2,#3, and #4 OTs in the draft. Hmmm....

Also with Dez Bryant since WR isn't exactly a need at the moment....

I graded Bryant better than Crabtree at the end of the 2008 season, and have not changed my opinion. He's going to be pretty outstanding in the NFL. I do have some concerns about how he will blend into a team, but his skills are off the chart. The best WR prospect since Calvin Johnson.

As for the OL in this draft, I only see one elite OT in Okung. The rest of the top level guys are interchangeable in many ways to me, having some form of flaw that drops them a bit.

Graham is simply a phenom. Pop in the Michigan-Iowa game and watch him thrash both Bulaga and Calloway. And, then he starred at Senior Bowl week. He is nearly unblockable. Love the kid, a ton.

Last week, it was revealed that he requested/demanded that scouts allow him to run as a CB in drills at his Pro Day. He wanted to show his ability to drop into coverage. For a 265-270 guy to have that form of confidence, I want a kid like that on my team.


They really have to look hard at Graham. He could be that 3 down OLB that this team really needs. Plus he can be a replacement for Manny when he departs. Sub in Brooks for Parys on 3rd downs and you have something special.

I can't put my finger on why I just think Bryant won't pan out. Nothing about his character just a hunch or hate I guess. But as a prospect he's impressive and he's a film rat.

One question is why don't you think the Niners would have Alex Carrington on there board somewhere?
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by jreff22:
As always MD

Surprised you have Spiller that high, I love the kid but I didn't think you thought that highly of him. Aside from Okung who is your favorite option for us at RT and are you still skeptical of A Davis? Surprised you are that high on Dex!! Do you think there is any chance that we wait for an OT till the 2nd. Having a Spiller/Haden/Graham possible combo in the 1st would be nasty. I just don't think we would risk passing on a much needed OT this year, especially with 2 1st rounders.

However, none of the OT's are going to be on the board. I see the order shaking down like this:
Williams at 4
Okung at 5
Davis at 6
Campbell at 8
Bulaga at 9

So, either the Niners select Brown at 13, or hope that the Giants pass. I doubt we wait to the second round for an OT. Simply dealing with leftovers at this point, or jumbo-sized guys who will try to transition to RT (Ducasse, Jerry). And, these guys might be gone anyways. Saffold will be gone by the mid-20's. OT inflation.



You really expect that....like seriously? If that does happen why burn a pick on Brown at 13, I see that has bad value if Spiller or Haden is there. Why not take Spiller at 13 then take the OT at 17, I don't see NY going after an OT if McClain is still there.
Hey MadDog, what is your specific reason for having Jason Pierre-Paul so low? I can think of two reasons he would be that low, 1) he only played one season, 2) He may be better in a 4-3. Did you have a different reason in mind, or was it a combination of a couple of reasons?

I think he would be great as a 3-4 OLB, but he has so little film I would drop his value, I just think that would put his value at ~13.
Heres the situation you seem to be describing:
There will be huge run on OTs and this will cause multiple top-10 talents from other positions to fall to both our 13 and 17 pick. However we will definitely take a OT, which means we will take a late-first/2nd round talent over a top 10 talent, because of need.

I know the need for an OT has been something reiterated ad nauseum on this board (and any mock without one has been laughed out of existence), but would people really be ok with that big of a drop off in talent at our 17th pick?

Would you take Campbell or Scaffold over Graham, Bryant or Iupati(G)?
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by jreff22:
As always MD

Surprised you have Spiller that high, I love the kid but I didn't think you thought that highly of him. Aside from Okung who is your favorite option for us at RT and are you still skeptical of A Davis? Surprised you are that high on Dex!! Do you think there is any chance that we wait for an OT till the 2nd. Having a Spiller/Haden/Graham possible combo in the 1st would be nasty. I just don't think we would risk passing on a much needed OT this year, especially with 2 1st rounders.

I'd move Staley to RT if Okung was drafted. But, with the other guys, I see strengths and weakness of each. Most are probably best suited for RT. Both Davis and Williams would be a tremendous upgrade. I'd rate them highest at RT, Williams over Davis (less bust potential, even though Davis may have a better upside).

However, none of the OT's are going to be on the board. I see the order shaking down like this:
Williams at 4
Okung at 5
Davis at 6
Campbell at 8
Bulaga at 9

So, either the Niners select Brown at 13, or hope that the Giants pass. I doubt we wait to the second round for an OT. Simply dealing with leftovers at this point, or jumbo-sized guys who will try to transition to RT (Ducasse, Jerry). And, these guys might be gone anyways. Saffold will be gone by the mid-20's. OT inflation.

Spiller and Bryant are explosive players, and the NFL is moving that direction. Plodding down the field is not a winning formula right now. And, the Niners need somebody who is a threat to score every time he touches the ball. Spiller is that type of player.

Bryant runs the field like T.O., very angry. And, I like that rage. He's going to run over a LOT of DB's in the NFL.


Conversely, this is why I say you can never have enough CB/Cover Safety talent. The league is becoming a wide open, spread, home run league, and we definitely saw that last year several times where we just couldn't cover guys like C. Johnson, Owen Daniels, and Dallas Clark among others.

Hey I'd love to have one of these two offensive weapons, but we have to solve our ROT problem, and we also need depth and talent in our secondary.
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by DarthNiner:
Originally posted by DarthNiner:
Great job MD.

Interesting that you had Brandon Graham ahead of the #2,#3, and #4 OTs in the draft. Hmmm....

Also with Dez Bryant since WR isn't exactly a need at the moment....

I graded Bryant better than Crabtree at the end of the 2008 season, and have not changed my opinion. He's going to be pretty outstanding in the NFL. I do have some concerns about how he will blend into a team, but his skills are off the chart. The best WR prospect since Calvin Johnson.

As for the OL in this draft, I only see one elite OT in Okung. The rest of the top level guys are interchangeable in many ways to me, having some form of flaw that drops them a bit.

Graham is simply a phenom. Pop in the Michigan-Iowa game and watch him thrash both Bulaga and Calloway. And, then he starred at Senior Bowl week. He is nearly unblockable. Love the kid, a ton.

Last week, it was revealed that he requested/demanded that scouts allow him to run as a CB in drills at his Pro Day. He wanted to show his ability to drop into coverage. For a 265-270 guy to have that form of confidence, I want a kid like that on my team.


They really have to look hard at Graham. He could be that 3 down OLB that this team really needs. Plus he can be a replacement for Manny when he departs. Sub in Brooks for Parys on 3rd downs and you have something special.

I can't put my finger on why I just think Bryant won't pan out. Nothing about his character just a hunch or hate I guess. But as a prospect he's impressive and he's a film rat.

One question is why don't you think the Niners would have Alex Carrington on there board somewhere?

It is simply not a big enough need, and he falls just outside this list. I do have one 3-4 DE on the list, Odrick, who is a better prospect than Tyson Jackson.
MD we just got Ginn....is Spiller still a real possibility? (I think so)