49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Costanza:


Fair critique of the Niners offense by Kurt Warner.

Costanza, I can't thank you enough for posting this. This is probably the single best comprehensive breakdown of the systemic issues with our passing game I've seen to date.

Cliff Notes for fans like All (who won't watch/read):

"I'll show you what I see on almost a weekly basis in the passing game." ~ Kurt Warner

Good Jimmy (Big Plays even on Breakdowns or Poor Designs, Take the Sack, Throw away)
Bad Jimmy (Layups, Mentals, Forcing)
Off Schedule (Making it up)
Design
Route Concepts
Poor Redzone Concepts
Details
Receivers Routes
Receivers Details
No Outlets (No Hot Options)
Positive Hot Options
Poor Pressure Answers
No Availables
OL Slide Protections

Throw in all the key drops and penalties on top of all these issues and you can see why Kurt Warner said, "The drop back pass game is not one of it's (Kyle's offense) strengths."

"I don't know what they teach him...I don't know what they are trying to do...sometimes in this offense, I feel a lot like, turn around, this guy is going to be open or find a guy open...I keep looking at it and I have no idea what we're trying to do here."

Kurt Warner had difficulty even recognizing the designs and concepts of a number of these plays. I know 816 did as well yesterday. This is super concerning, not just because of the design/concepts called and where on the field these are called by Kyle, but because the receivers don't seem to know either or aren't executing their part to where it's even recognizable. Kyle and these receiver coaches...something is way off here.

He also breakdowns the Kittle/Wilson INT and Safety and reiterates what I was saying in discussion with 49erFaithful6 yesterday.

"It's just kind of a hodgepodge of stuff every week. ~ Kurt Warner

If you genuinely care about this team, these are the systemic issues we're seeing well beyond the QB position that no doubt, will extend to Trey Lance if these aren't fixed and fixed soon. It's a must-watch for any 49er fan, IMHO, and it's exactly in line with comprehensive breakdowns by Greg Panelli and our own, JD.

No problem. I wanted to share it with everyone after watching it…I learned so much listening to Kurt Warner break down all these issues that I feel like I'm way more informed now as it relates to the issues with this offense. Great job by Kurt Warner(who the Niners should probably hire as a consultant lol).

Hopefully Kyle sees this and can improve in these areas going forward or any QB for the Niners will struggle.

Originally posted by ChillninDaBay:

Originally posted by susweel:

Originally posted by ChillninDaBay:

Originally posted by susweel:
If he don't get to the NFC championship game this year with a weak NFC and stacked roster this year will be a huge disappointment. So far this season his coaching has been very supbar.

Subpar is Jimmy's middle name. KS was prepare for Trey as the starter, QB1. For "subpar" highest paid backup Jimmy to become QB1 again out of no where with no TC or preseason and adding on other injuries to starters like Eman, Armstead, Kinlaw, Jimmie Ward etc is beyond frustrating especially year after year and most likely a burned out for KS. 9er "fans" need to realize those issues and give KS a break.

Trey wasn't exactly setting the world on fire. I doubt the offense would have been much better with him. The injury excuse is old and tired and frankly not even that bad. Niner fans need to expect more from Kyle especially considering he's supposed to be an offensive genius but can't score in the second half of games.

God is teaching 9er "fans" and maybe even KS patience is a virtue. "Trail by fire"..

I wish God hadn't done that "patience" thing. I just don't do that well. Other than that, I am perfect.

Originally posted by Costanza:
No problem. I wanted to share it with everyone after watching it…I learned so much listening to Kurt Warner break down all these issues that I feel like I'm way more informed now as it relates to the issues with this offense. Great job by Kurt Warner(who the Niners should probably hire as a consultant lol).

Hopefully Kyle sees this and can improve in these areas going forward or any QB for the Niners will struggle.

Same here!

Originally posted by fropwns:
Tough to watch, but a fair analysis. I have to ask, what is Brian Griese doing? If it is me, I tell Grease "You stay with Jimmy Pornstar all day, every day, and we work on the simple stuff. Go grab a guy from the damn practice squad and have him work on simple completions."

I agree. I have said the same thing multiple times here.

I am a big fan of "good coaching." Having grown up in the Bill Walsh era, I know what good coaching is. I saw Walsh take guys like Jeff Kemp off the bench with another team and go win games against good teams. Bill Musgrave was another 2nd/3rd stringer that won a few games just because Walsh instilled good instincts and habits that other coaches ignored. Elvis Grbac was another Walsh creation. It was all a matter of spending the extra time to get things correct.

I don't buy for one hot minute the idea that Jimmy Garoppolo is no longer teachable. As you say, a good coach would pull up a couple of PS guys and work with Jimmy until his arm fell off. I recall Joe Montana telling about how Walsh would make him and Craig and Rathman stay after practice working on swing passes. They had to have 10 perfect completions in a row where the receiver did not have to vary his speed or route even a fraction in order to catch the ball. If anything went wrong, it was back to zero, and start the string all over. That is what Griese should be doing - getting the layups down so you just play it - you don't have to think about it.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Costanza:
No problem. I wanted to share it with everyone after watching it…I learned so much listening to Kurt Warner break down all these issues that I feel like I'm way more informed now as it relates to the issues with this offense. Great job by Kurt Warner(who the Niners should probably hire as a consultant lol).

Hopefully Kyle sees this and can improve in these areas going forward or any QB for the Niners will struggle.

Same here!

x3

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by fropwns:
Tough to watch, but a fair analysis. I have to ask, what is Brian Griese doing? If it is me, I tell Grease "You stay with Jimmy Pornstar all day, every day, and we work on the simple stuff. Go grab a guy from the damn practice squad and have him work on simple completions."

I agree. I have said the same thing multiple times here.

I am a big fan of "good coaching." Having grown up in the Bill Walsh era, I know what good coaching is. I saw Walsh take guys like Jeff Kemp off the bench with another team and go win games against good teams. Bill Musgrave was another 2nd/3rd stringer that won a few games just because Walsh instilled good instincts and habits that other coaches ignored. Elvis Grbac was another Walsh creation. It was all a matter of spending the extra time to get things correct.

I don't buy for one hot minute the idea that Jimmy Garoppolo is no longer teachable. As you say, a good coach would pull up a couple of PS guys and work with Jimmy until his arm fell off. I recall Joe Montana telling about how Walsh would make him and Craig and Rathman stay after practice working on swing passes. They had to have 10 perfect completions in a row where the receiver did not have to vary his speed or route even a fraction in order to catch the ball. If anything went wrong, it was back to zero, and start the string all over. That is what Griese should be doing - getting the layups down so you just play it - you don't have to think about it.

Let's not finger point Greise. He won a NC. He kept Brady on the bench. He played in the league vs Lynch, Ray Lewis, others. He knows the game. JG I don't show improvement from 2017 to 2020. Can't lay that at Greise's feet.

I think one big prob here.. KS spent all this time installing all offseason the TL concepts and it's all just complete trash right now.. none of that stuff usable in 2022 just on the scrap heap.. we wasted months working on all that stuff..

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
I think one big prob here.. KS spent all this time installing all offseason the TL concepts and it's all just complete trash right now.. none of that stuff usable in 2022 just on the scrap heap.. we wasted months working on all that stuff..

Ironically enough, Kyle didn't want Kaepernick back because he'd not only have to develop a whole new offense for him but it affects the other 10 guys too.

So now he does this for Trey and struggles getting back to a Jimmy Garoppolo offense?

This is why you need like-skill sets at the QB position.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
I think one big prob here.. KS spent all this time installing all offseason the TL concepts and it's all just complete trash right now.. none of that stuff usable in 2022 just on the scrap heap.. we wasted months working on all that stuff..

I'm sure Kyle was adding wrinkles to use Trey's talents but he wasn't completely remaking the offense. They would still be built as a running team and short passes would still be common. The only real differences would be running play options for the QB, more rollouts and more deep throws. The basic offense would be that different.

Originally posted by Sickaa:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by thl408:
It's time for Kyle to get very creative with the offense, no excuses. He has been searching for a dynamic, multi talented RB for years - starting with signing Jet, to drafting day 2 RBs for a system that has had success with UDFAs. Now he has a proven, ultra talented RB that can line up anywhere and is equally dangerous running or catching the ball. Even if the threat to attack deep is not legit, the ability to attack horizontally is more than enough to move the ball. When teams play man, Kittle and CMC are two very good man coverage beaters. When teams play zone, attack horizontally. I think this is the blueprint for the skillset for this group of offensive players.

I have been waiting for this as well.

An analogy we used back when I was spending time in auto racing: "Kyle reminds me of a wanna-be NASCAR mechanic who bought the entire Snap-On catalog but after he got the valve covers off the engine, all he knew how to use was a crescent wrench."

Not sure how meaningful that may be but it will work for some. He has SOOOO many weapons at his disposal that there is no excuse for not being more creative after the first 15 minutes. Saying Garoppolo's limitations are the reason is nonsense. There are a lot of plays he could be calling that do not depend on JG.

I agree with all of this. Especially the bolded.

Let's hope Kyle pulls his finger out and shows us once again why he's often referred to as an "offensive genius"

As you mentioned, too much talent on this offense to not be scoring points for fun, regardless of who's at QB.

I don't want Kyle's finger to get involved in any way, shape, or form. Trust me it gets messy then you're spending the entire weekend washing sheets.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by fropwns:
Tough to watch, but a fair analysis. I have to ask, what is Brian Griese doing? If it is me, I tell Grease "You stay with Jimmy Pornstar all day, every day, and we work on the simple stuff. Go grab a guy from the damn practice squad and have him work on simple completions."

I agree. I have said the same thing multiple times here.

I am a big fan of "good coaching." Having grown up in the Bill Walsh era, I know what good coaching is. I saw Walsh take guys like Jeff Kemp off the bench with another team and go win games against good teams. Bill Musgrave was another 2nd/3rd stringer that won a few games just because Walsh instilled good instincts and habits that other coaches ignored. Elvis Grbac was another Walsh creation. It was all a matter of spending the extra time to get things correct.

I don't buy for one hot minute the idea that Jimmy Garoppolo is no longer teachable. As you say, a good coach would pull up a couple of PS guys and work with Jimmy until his arm fell off. I recall Joe Montana telling about how Walsh would make him and Craig and Rathman stay after practice working on swing passes. They had to have 10 perfect completions in a row where the receiver did not have to vary his speed or route even a fraction in order to catch the ball. If anything went wrong, it was back to zero, and start the string all over. That is what Griese should be doing - getting the layups down so you just play it - you don't have to think about it.

Let's not finger point Greise. He won a NC. He kept Brady on the bench. He played in the league vs Lynch, Ray Lewis, others. He knows the game. JG I don't show improvement from 2017 to 2020. Can't lay that at Greise's feet.

As we have seen in numerous situations where a good former player has tried to coach, just because you played the game doesn't mean you can teach the game.

EDIT: 2017-2021 saw a rotation of QB coaches. Let's see if Griese stays around to get the job done with Lance.

Originally posted by dj43:
As we have seen in numerous situations where a good former player has tried to coach, just because you played the game doesn't mean you can teach the game.

I agree that there are two dif skills, playing and coaching. Everyone tells me JG was best in 2017 when he got off the plane. He hasn't improved in our system and it's not a Brian Griese issue, it goes back further than that imo.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by dj43:
As we have seen in numerous situations where a good former player has tried to coach, just because you played the game doesn't mean you can teach the game.

I agree that there are two dif skills, playing and coaching. Everyone tells me JG was best in 2017 when he got off the plane. He hasn't improved in our system and it's not a Brian Griese issue, it goes back further than that imo.

People in every walk of life eventually reach a level where they peak. They reach that level and can't improve anymore. Maybe Jimmy was as good as he was ever going to be and that's why Belichick was willing to trade him. If the physical abilities aren't there all the coaching in the world won't make you a top tier QB. I really believe Jimmy and Kyle get as much as he can out of him given his physical limitations.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
I'm sure Kyle was adding wrinkles to use Trey's talents but he wasn't completely remaking the offense. They would still be built as a running team and short passes would still be common. The only real differences would be running play options for the QB, more rollouts and more deep throws. The basic offense would be that different.

You may be right but what are your thoughts on his own comments here?

https://www.49erswebzone.com/articles/162761-notebook-shanahan-recalibration-needed-transition-garoppolo-mcglincheys-struggles/

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by fropwns:
Tough to watch, but a fair analysis. I have to ask, what is Brian Griese doing? If it is me, I tell Grease "You stay with Jimmy Pornstar all day, every day, and we work on the simple stuff. Go grab a guy from the damn practice squad and have him work on simple completions."

I agree. I have said the same thing multiple times here.

I am a big fan of "good coaching." Having grown up in the Bill Walsh era, I know what good coaching is. I saw Walsh take guys like Jeff Kemp off the bench with another team and go win games against good teams. Bill Musgrave was another 2nd/3rd stringer that won a few games just because Walsh instilled good instincts and habits that other coaches ignored. Elvis Grbac was another Walsh creation. It was all a matter of spending the extra time to get things correct.

I don't buy for one hot minute the idea that Jimmy Garoppolo is no longer teachable. As you say, a good coach would pull up a couple of PS guys and work with Jimmy until his arm fell off. I recall Joe Montana telling about how Walsh would make him and Craig and Rathman stay after practice working on swing passes. They had to have 10 perfect completions in a row where the receiver did not have to vary his speed or route even a fraction in order to catch the ball. If anything went wrong, it was back to zero, and start the string all over. That is what Griese should be doing - getting the layups down so you just play it - you don't have to think about it.

We are both old enough to remember Walsh.

Swear to god, when Warner said you have to make the layups, I am sitting there going: Run drills. I mean that seams like an easy fix. Just run them. These are professionals. They should respond to coaching. For Jimmy, if he hopes for even a reasonable pay day after he departs from here, he should be agreeable to it. Other things like the bonehead passes will take time. You work on that, too. But I think you focus on checkdown throws and making them as consistent and boring as possible. The result won't be. Think Kill Bill, where the bride has to practice, repeatedly, punching a board three inches in front of her chest.





I want Jimmy waking up in the middle of the f**king night throwing checkdowns. I want him moving so fast in the middle of his sleep that he knocks the pornstar out of bed because he thought it was Aaron Donald coming to rearrange his manhood.