Where do you expect our defense to be Ranked this season?

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by jeepzilla:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
It's difficult to guess when we don't know if Mangini will be a good DC.

Also, we don't know if the injured players will come back 100%.

I think if everyone comes 100%, and Mangini does a good job, we have the talent to be in the top 10.

I agree with this. I don't know why anyone has faith in Mangini?

I guess you could have said the same about fangio
Looking at his stats, but if we would have had a lower ranked defense it wouldn't have surprised me.

Why does anyone think Mangini is this great d-cord. I've seen all the stats and the ages of the pats d as everyone has pointed out.
I have zero faith in the clown.

I was never a Fangio fan. He had the two best ILB, the best pass rushing OLB(Aldon), the best 3-4 DE(Smith) and probowl talent at every other position, for the most part. We could've had any DC from 2011-2013 and had a top 5 defense.

We really have no idea what Mangini can bring to the table. Will he blitz more than Fangio, I hope. Will he have our CBs playing 10yrds back on 3rd and short situations like Fangio, I hope not.

It is a tad unnerving that I never heard his name associated with any teams, for a DC position, since his last stint as coach. Why is it.....?

We didn't always have Aldon on the field and Watt is the best 3-4 DE. Also, Bowman was on the bench before Fangio arrived. Fangio also coached the dome patrol in NO, which was one of the best LB core in NFL history. I doubt it is merely a coincidence that he coached two of the finest linebackers squads and had little to do with their success.

Also, Fangio was DC on the expansion Panthers and they were a really good defense for a few years. They had some good linebackers there as well. Expansion teams don't have much talent but he made it work just like with the plethora of injuries we had last year.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but I belive Stanford also had a great Defense.

Sure, he had some not so great seasons but he's also has had success coaching. Mangini on the other hand, has alienated himself from teams with his behavior and lack of success. Probably explains why he, a defensive guy, ended up coaching TEs here. I don't know what else to judge him on besides his failure as a HC, DC and TE coach, all excuses aside.

Sometimes coaches luck out and end up with great players(phil jackson with Kobe and Jordan). The "dome patrol" and our LBs were more about their talent level than his coaching. In 2010 we had the 13th ranked defense.

J.Smith was the best 3-4 DE from 2010-2012.

Fangio was an average coach with exceptional talent, plus we were a running team that normally won the time of possession. We'll see how Chicago looks this year.

Lakers with kobe and shaq didn't get over the hump until jackson arrived. Same with MJ and the bulls.

Its Hard to say Fangio just keeps getting that lucky with talent without giving him any credit for coaching up great players.

What about the success with the panthers when they were an expansion team? Lack of talent didn't stop him there.

And stanford? Any comment on those two stints?

The Panthers weren't an expansion team like the Bucs or teams in the past when there were no FAs. I just saw something about the Panthers today and other GMs(mainly the Bucs) called them a FA team and not expansion.

While Fangio was at Stanford they had Luck, and a killer running game. They dominated the TOP.

I don't think he's a horrible coach by any means. I do however feel like he benefited greatly from the talent we had.

Did it not drive you crazy when we wouldn't blitz, or when our DBs would play way too deep, on short yardage situations, letting the other team complete short passes for easy 1st downs?

Top 5-10 easy. Last year we were down to practice squad players at cb and backups all around and were still top 5.

We still have the best lb corp in the nfl and it's not even close. Aldon and bowman and brooks are all pros and wilhoite is a starter on any team except ours. With Borland out and Willis out he is a solid starter.

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

Originally posted by jeepzilla:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:

It's difficult to guess when we don't know if Mangini will be a good DC.

Also, we don't know if the injured players will come back 100%.

I think if everyone comes 100%, and Mangini does a good job, we have the talent to be in the top 10.

I agree with this. I don't know why anyone has faith in Mangini?

I guess you could have said the same about fangio
Looking at his stats, but if we would have had a lower ranked defense it wouldn't have surprised me.

Why does anyone think Mangini is this great d-cord. I've seen all the stats and the ages of the pats d as everyone has pointed out.
I have zero faith in the clown.

I was never a Fangio fan. He had the two best ILB, the best pass rushing OLB(Aldon), the best 3-4 DE(Smith) and probowl talent at every other position, for the most part. We could've had any DC from 2011-2013 and had a top 5 defense.

We really have no idea what Mangini can bring to the table. Will he blitz more than Fangio, I hope. Will he have our CBs playing 10yrds back on 3rd and short situations like Fangio, I hope not.

It is a tad unnerving that I never heard his name associated with any teams, for a DC position, since his last stint as coach. Why is it.....?

We didn't always have Aldon on the field and Watt is the best 3-4 DE. Also, Bowman was on the bench before Fangio arrived. Fangio also coached the dome patrol in NO, which was one of the best LB core in NFL history. I doubt it is merely a coincidence that he coached two of the finest linebackers squads and had little to do with their success.

Also, Fangio was DC on the expansion Panthers and they were a really good defense for a few years. They had some good linebackers there as well. Expansion teams don't have much talent but he made it work just like with the plethora of injuries we had last year.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but I belive Stanford also had a great Defense.

Sure, he had some not so great seasons but he's also has had success coaching. Mangini on the other hand, has alienated himself from teams with his behavior and lack of success. Probably explains why he, a defensive guy, ended up coaching TEs here. I don't know what else to judge him on besides his failure as a HC, DC and TE coach, all excuses aside.

Sometimes coaches luck out and end up with great players(phil jackson with Kobe and Jordan). The "dome patrol" and our LBs were more about their talent level than his coaching. In 2010 we had the 13th ranked defense.

J.Smith was the best 3-4 DE from 2010-2012.

Fangio was an average coach with exceptional talent, plus we were a running team that normally won the time of possession. We'll see how Chicago looks this year.

Lakers with kobe and shaq didn't get over the hump until jackson arrived. Same with MJ and the bulls.

Its Hard to say Fangio just keeps getting that lucky with talent without giving him any credit for coaching up great players.

What about the success with the panthers when they were an expansion team? Lack of talent didn't stop him there.

And stanford? Any comment on those two stints?

The Panthers weren't an expansion team like the Bucs or teams in the past when there were no FAs. I just saw something about the Panthers today and other GMs(mainly the Bucs) called them a FA team and not expansion.

While Fangio was at Stanford they had Luck, and a killer running game. They dominated the TOP.

I don't think he's a horrible coach by any means. I do however feel like he benefited greatly from the talent we had.

Did it not drive you crazy when we wouldn't blitz, or when our DBs would play way too deep, on short yardage situations, letting the other team complete short passes for easy 1st downs?

FA team or expansion or whatever. He took a bunch of guys who never played together and made them a top 10 unit. That says a lot to me, especially when you couple that with his successfull stints here, in NO and at standford.

As for the strategies, i didn't have a problem with fangio. Whatever he was doing was working. Sure there was some mistakes but we were dominant.

The only time i felt the Defense let us down during fangio's tenure was the end of the NE game, the end of the saints game, and sadly, the biggest bed wet was in the super bowl. Other then that whatever he did make us a top 5 dominating D and I was fine with it. Its hard for me to knit pick that kind of consistant success, especially with the cards he was dealt last year.

I totally have more faith in him then mangini. Way more.

35th

Top ten. Ahmad Brooks had an off year in terms of rushing the passer. If Lynch can avoid the sophomore slump there is a rotation of guys who can flat out pressure any QB. Aldon is a top 5 pass rusher if not the best during stretches. Adding Dockett to the pass rush will be fun to watch. What concerns me is the run defense. The other guys up front will have to take a couple of steps forward in order to have a legit top 5 defense. Whoever plays NT and slides over to DT will have to be stout against the run. We were gashed on a regular basis up the middle and between the tackles last year.

CB's are a big question mark but the pass rush will help them and allow to scheme "help" for our corners if necessary.

I should say we will be top 10 in yards allowed but maybe top 20 in points allowed. I don't think we will have a great percentage of stopping teams in the red zone this year. This squad as it is predraft will continue to have issues against the run and defending short passing situations.

I hope they don't miss a beat and stay around the top 5. But I'll hold off my vote till about week 3 of the preseason when we will have a more concrete idea of the starting defense, there may be some surprises during the off-season.

NT logic: Defense finishes top 5 and #1 in TO's with the following players on IR: NT: Glenn Dorsey & Ian Williams, ILB: Patrick Willis, NaVorro Bowman & Chris Borland, CB: Kenneth Acker, Chris Cook, Jimmie Ward & Keith Reaser and DE: Kaleb Ramsey. Not to mention Justin was hurt again, Aldon was suspended for 9 games and McDonald was cut plus players like Quinton Dial (NT instead of LDE), Craig Dahl, Michael Wilhoite, TJE, Nick Moody, Dontae Johnson (outside/slot), Perrish Cox, Marcus Cromartie and Leon McFadden all had to start significant game. Again, defense finishes top 5 and #1 in TO.

All these injured players are coming back, we added more talent via FA and will add even more via the draft.

NT logic = regression and 15th-20th or worse b/c of a coordinator change.

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
The Panthers weren't an expansion team like the Bucs or teams in the past when there were no FAs. I just saw something about the Panthers today and other GMs(mainly the Bucs) called them a FA team and not expansion.

While Fangio was at Stanford they had Luck, and a killer running game. They dominated the TOP.

I don't think he's a horrible coach by any means. I do however feel like he benefited greatly from the talent we had.

Did it not drive you crazy when we wouldn't blitz, or when our DBs would play way too deep, on short yardage situations, letting the other team complete short passes for easy 1st downs?

Oh YEAH!

I would yell at the TV - I really look forward to Mangini being more aggressive.

Originally posted by NCommand:
Good discussion fellas. Donatell, Leavitt, Tomsula and Fangio were 4 of the best. Just look at how much Goldson, Whitner, Culliver, Cox, McDonald, Brown, Rogers, etc. got paid on the open market. And how have they done since they've left?

Fangio deserves credit for growing and developing AND sustaining that success for 4 years. If not we would have been a .500 team every year at best no doubt.

That said, we can't ignore the talent either. Last year was a great example of a GM and a defensive staff finding and getting the most out of players.

We can only hope that Mangini has grown as well as the rest of the position coaches and that they grow as a unit like the previous regime!

That speaks volumes LOUD and clear.

So many people lamented losing Goldson and Whitner - saying we'd be worse off.

I thinks those same people are at it again.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
The Panthers weren't an expansion team like the Bucs or teams in the past when there were no FAs. I just saw something about the Panthers today and other GMs(mainly the Bucs) called them a FA team and not expansion.

While Fangio was at Stanford they had Luck, and a killer running game. They dominated the TOP.

I don't think he's a horrible coach by any means. I do however feel like he benefited greatly from the talent we had.

Did it not drive you crazy when we wouldn't blitz, or when our DBs would play way too deep, on short yardage situations, letting the other team complete short passes for easy 1st downs?

Oh YEAH!

I would yell at the TV - I really look forward to Mangini being more aggressive.

lol, so would I.

Im guessing between 1 threw 32

i think it will depend on the CB position..hopefully brock can come back and play well. Plus the young guys like Dontae Johnson need to keep progressing

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Top 30

LOL!!

Originally posted by NCommand:
NT logic: Defense finishes top 5 and #1 in TO's with the following players on IR: NT: Glenn Dorsey & Ian Williams, ILB: Patrick Willis, NaVorro Bowman & Chris Borland, CB: Kenneth Acker, Chris Cook, Jimmie Ward & Keith Reaser and DE: Kaleb Ramsey. Not to mention Justin was hurt again, Aldon was suspended for 9 games and McDonald was cut plus players like Quinton Dial (NT instead of LDE), Craig Dahl, Michael Wilhoite, TJE, Nick Moody, Dontae Johnson (outside/slot), Perrish Cox, Marcus Cromartie and Leon McFadden all had to start significant game. Again, defense finishes top 5 and #1 in TO.

All these injured players are coming back, we added more talent via FA and will add even more via the draft.

NT logic = regression and 15th-20th or worse b/c of a coordinator change.

Truth!!

Originally posted by LVJay:

Originally posted by NCommand:

NT logic: Defense finishes top 5 and #1 in TO's with the following players on IR: NT: Glenn Dorsey & Ian Williams, ILB: Patrick Willis, NaVorro Bowman & Chris Borland, CB: Kenneth Acker, Chris Cook, Jimmie Ward & Keith Reaser and DE: Kaleb Ramsey. Not to mention Justin was hurt again, Aldon was suspended for 9 games and McDonald was cut plus players like Quinton Dial (NT instead of LDE), Craig Dahl, Michael Wilhoite, TJE, Nick Moody, Dontae Johnson (outside/slot), Perrish Cox, Marcus Cromartie and Leon McFadden all had to start significant game. Again, defense finishes top 5 and #1 in TO.

All these injured players are coming back, we added more talent via FA and will add even more via the draft.

NT logic = regression and 15th-20th or worse b/c of a coordinator change.

Truth!!

Very true. I'm just worried if Brock gets injured we are done at cb. That is why I think we need to draft a cb at 15 or in the first round. Our depth is not quality. However our DL depth is. Wr, if boldin or smith get injured we aren't looking too good but not too bad either.