Who's Right? Harbaugh/Coaches . . . . . or . . . . . Baalke/York/Mgmt?

Not posting...

Originally posted by LZRD_WZRD:
I'm on the side of good management decision. HaRoman's pitiful offense was a joke last year and there were no signs it was getting better. Something needed to change because we were playing with a high-functioning, but broken, machine

This x 10000.......

Depending on the day of the week, I can side either with HaRoman or York/Baalke.

Naturally given what has happened, I'd like to side with the latter because that's the reality of what we have.

To me, the ideal situation (which I think 99% of us would agree on) would have been to keep Harbaugh and just jettison Roman and perhaps some of the other O staff, keep Fangio and the D staff intact. That would have been the absolute "safest" change.

However, I must say that another year of 2014 is not something I'd like to see. I would much rather see what we have now than another 2014 coaching staff led season.

Tony Parrish told me he felt the offense sucked because of chemistry and felt Harbaugh probably has a piece in it (whether it was actually Harbaugh himself or him keeping Roman).

I wonder what Gore would say behind closed doors. My guess is something similar.

If we indeed have a better offensive coaching staff, and the defense performs close to what it did last year, we probably will have a good idea whether Tomsula is as good or better than Harbaugh -- the main idea being that Harbaugh was carried by Fangio and was just a players coach (and we know pretty well Tomsula can be that too without a stupid catchphrase after the end of a game).

I'm being optimistic because that's my duty as a San Francisco 49er fan.

What keeps me feeling ok about all of this is that it's extremely doubtful we ever would have won an SB with Harbaugh given his nature (we had the wrong Harbaugh). I'd rather explore into the unknown than keep on with the same old story.

Originally posted by Vito_Corleone:
Today Jeff Garcia bashed Baalke/York and ~90% of the comments on that site were anti-York/Baalke and pro-Harbaugh.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/04/04/jeff-garcia-thinks-fans-should-scrutinize-the-49ers-management/
…. . .
What is the consensus here on the webzone?
Are we another case of management screwing up and "firing good 'Mariucci' and having 10 losing seasons due to bad management" or are we an example of a good management decision like the Warriors ie. "firing a bad 'Mark Jackson' and replacing him with a good 'Steve Kerr'"???

Which Side Are You On?

Correction: Warriors fired a GOOD Mark Jackson for a GREAT Steve Kerr

Maybe the 49ers fired a good Jim for a great Jim? Who knows, time will tell.

Go 9ers, I have faith!

Originally posted by 9ersLiferInChicago:

Originally posted by TheRickestRick:

You really couldn't find a thread with this topic? I call BS... Almost every thread turns into this topic on its own, all this thread is gonna do is get people warned or banned

I know some vets around here don't really see this as a topic worth more discussion. But you know what? Unless and until Jimmy T & Co. wins (and get this team back to the playoffs, and deep) for Zoners and fans alike this will continue to to be a major sore point of discussion. I know some are just sick and tired of it - and to an extent so am I. But fans DO have a point of discussion.

Now, I didn't vote on this because, frankly, I see the validity of both sides. I can understand why JH was fired. His offense was a real weakness, even in the SB. And him trying to change Kaep into something he clearly wasn't (and will never be), and his dogged unwillingness to adapt when the change wasn't working, was a glaring failing of JH. This has been my major criticism of JH. This is the NFL. And like it or not, JH cannot win in the NFL without adaptation, even at times to core philosophy. Blind stubbornness to philosophy don't work in the NFL. It just don't!

But many fans and Zoners have a real point. Firing JH, by many reports, had very little to do with actual football, but personality and just bare naked egos and pride. And who's to say that JH wouldn't have returned to a winning philosophy better suited for Kaep had he not been fired? After all, as a football coach myself, I can attest to the difficulty of changing schemes mid-season. In any event, if non-football spats played the major roll that's been reported I have to say that that's a FO deal. After all, he did usher 3 straight NFC titles and a SB appearance. The last time I looked they just don't give those things away, you have to be doing something right. I think that should have earned him some leeway to coach his last season to prove himself.

IMHO

I agree with this post. I understand some fans wanted to move on and thats fine. They have valid points.

It is the way in which it was done and reasons that irked some of us. No one knows what happens so its all speculation so it depends on what you believe.

This would have been much better for me at least if we were able to retain fangio and co. And bring in shanny or even gase or other reputable HC and coordinators.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Rascal:

Originally posted by AB81Rules:

Originally posted by Rascal:
If you ask Webzone then I can bet you any dollar the majority will side with York and Baalke. But, if you want to gauge a more balanced view of the entire 49ers fan base outside of Webzone, then I would say Jeff Garcia is spot on.

Initially, I resisted trying to be overly critical with the move, but once I saw the HC hiring debacle, that was the very last straw for me. I did want to have an open mind at the start cos afterall Harbaugh couldn't sort out Kap and the offense and we ended up with a 8-8 season. But, come on Jim Tomsula?! That is just the pits!! I cringe everytime I see one of his interviews to a point I now no longer want to watch nor hear what the heck he has to say anymore.

So, absolutely as a fan I have the right and will continue to slam York and Baalke until they prove me wrong.

I honestly question whether or not Kap is the right QB for us. I just see him at times as nothing more than a gimmicky QB, then sometimes he does something great, but IDK, I think it's 50-50 on whether he improves or not. I think he has a max of 2 more years before the FO will cut him. He really screwed up by giving the 49ers a great deal, cause he can be cut easily in the next 2 offseasons without a huge hit.

You are not the only one, I question that too. And is not even a matter of pocket passer vs running QB, in short he is just not a very good QB, period.

You are already very kind to give me 2 more years, I think we will only give him this coming season and that's it. Also, it will be interesting to see whether we draft a QB such as a Bryce Petty for example, if we do then we will have a pretty good idea how the organization feels about him.

Kaep didn't even have a bad year...to what he had to deal with on the play calling....there's easily 12-15 qbs that are worse then kaep

Your guys hate is so strong on kaep is that you have him leaving before we have anything suitable to replace him with !

I don't hate Kap at all, I like him, liked him coming out of Nevada, but I question his decision making. He seems to lock onto one target, and looks off open receivers at times. He had a down year, not a bad or terrible year, but it wasn't great, and it's not all on play calling, he should of made some plays if he s the supposed franchise QB, even with bad play calling, he could of made plays, but he didn't.

I never said replace him right away, I think he could be cut after the 2015 season.

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by 9ersLiferInChicago:

Originally posted by TheRickestRick:

You really couldn't find a thread with this topic? I call BS... Almost every thread turns into this topic on its own, all this thread is gonna do is get people warned or banned

I know some vets around here don't really see this as a topic worth more discussion. But you know what? Unless and until Jimmy T & Co. wins (and get this team back to the playoffs, and deep) for Zoners and fans alike this will continue to to be a major sore point of discussion. I know some are just sick and tired of it - and to an extent so am I. But fans DO have a point of discussion.

Now, I didn't vote on this because, frankly, I see the validity of both sides. I can understand why JH was fired. His offense was a real weakness, even in the SB. And him trying to change Kaep into something he clearly wasn't (and will never be), and his dogged unwillingness to adapt when the change wasn't working, was a glaring failing of JH. This has been my major criticism of JH. This is the NFL. And like it or not, JH cannot win in the NFL without adaptation, even at times to core philosophy. Blind stubbornness to philosophy don't work in the NFL. It just don't!

But many fans and Zoners have a real point. Firing JH, by many reports, had very little to do with actual football, but personality and just bare naked egos and pride. And who's to say that JH wouldn't have returned to a winning philosophy better suited for Kaep had he not been fired? After all, as a football coach myself, I can attest to the difficulty of changing schemes mid-season. In any event, if non-football spats played the major roll that's been reported I have to say that that's a FO deal. After all, he did usher 3 straight NFC titles and a SB appearance. The last time I looked they just don't give those things away, you have to be doing something right. I think that should have earned him some leeway to coach his last season to prove himself.

IMHO

I agree with this post. I understand some fans wanted to move on and thats fine. They have valid points.

It is the way in which it was done and reasons that irked some of us. No one knows what happens so its all speculation so it depends on what you believe.

This would have been much better for me at least if we were able to retain fangio and co. And bring in shanny or even gase or other reputable HC and coordinators.

Well said.

Originally posted by CRABTREE:
Harbaugh failed He couldn't use the players to what they do best except the kicker He was chucky except chucky won the superbowl then got fired

Harbaugh got fired for 2 reasons, one he couldn't get along with Jed, and 2. because he wouldn't let Roman go.

I don't buy this crap that he was gone because he couldn't get the job done, ask most 49ers fan outside of this place, and they say he was fired because he couldn't ge along with Jed. He should of been given a 5th year, he was 49-19-1 for gods sake, he had a great winning percentage, he led us to 3 NFC Title games, a Super Bowl, division title.

I wonder why Jed didn't hire Tomsula after 2010 if he feels Tomsula is the right guy for the job, why waste 4 years on our hopes and dreams, screw over Harbuagh, and coaches. We were 8-8 due to 1. Injuries, and 2. all the s**t that was in media.

Originally posted by AB81Rules:

Harbaugh got fired for 2 reasons, one he couldn't get along with Jed, and 2. because he wouldn't let Roman go.

I don't buy this crap that he was gone because he couldn't get the job done, ask most 49ers fan outside of this place, and they say he was fired because he couldn't ge along with Jed. He should of been given a 5th year, he was 49-19-1 for gods sake, he had a great winning percentage, he led us to 3 NFC Title games, a Super Bowl, division title.

I wonder why Jed didn't hire Tomsula after 2010 if he feels Tomsula is the right guy for the job, why waste 4 years on our hopes and dreams, screw over Harbuagh, and coaches. We were 8-8 due to 1. Injuries, and 2. all the s**t that was in media.

Apparently jed made a bad choice picking harbaugh over tum tum.

We woulda had a ring with tomsula at the helm these past four year with our talent?

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by AB81Rules:
Harbaugh got fired for 2 reasons, one he couldn't get along with Jed, and 2. because he wouldn't let Roman go.

I don't buy this crap that he was gone because he couldn't get the job done, ask most 49ers fan outside of this place, and they say he was fired because he couldn't ge along with Jed. He should of been given a 5th year, he was 49-19-1 for gods sake, he had a great winning percentage, he led us to 3 NFC Title games, a Super Bowl, division title.

I wonder why Jed didn't hire Tomsula after 2010 if he feels Tomsula is the right guy for the job, why waste 4 years on our hopes and dreams, screw over Harbuagh, and coaches. We were 8-8 due to 1. Injuries, and 2. all the s**t that was in media.

Apparently jed made a bad choice picking harbaugh over tum tum.

We woulda had a ring with tomsula at the helm these past four year with our talent?

Agree

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by AB81Rules:

Harbaugh got fired for 2 reasons, one he couldn't get along with Jed, and 2. because he wouldn't let Roman go.

I don't buy this crap that he was gone because he couldn't get the job done, ask most 49ers fan outside of this place, and they say he was fired because he couldn't ge along with Jed. He should of been given a 5th year, he was 49-19-1 for gods sake, he had a great winning percentage, he led us to 3 NFC Title games, a Super Bowl, division title.

I wonder why Jed didn't hire Tomsula after 2010 if he feels Tomsula is the right guy for the job, why waste 4 years on our hopes and dreams, screw over Harbuagh, and coaches. We were 8-8 due to 1. Injuries, and 2. all the s**t that was in media.

Apparently jed made a bad choice picking harbaugh over tum tum.

We woulda had a ring with tomsula at the helm these past four year with our talent?

Man you guys like making bs up...and trying to pass it off as truth...Im starting to feel bad for you guys

Why is thread even in here. Harbaugh is gone get over it. Some people cannot move on this is starting to look like when Alex was traded people could not move on. I don't care what Jeff I can't get a coaching job in the NFL says. The owner and management moved on the way they saw fit and they can do what ever they choose.

Originally posted by leakyfausett:
....

Done. It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood.