Manny Lawson skips OTAs in hopes of more money

he sucks at madden

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by TonyStarks:

Originally posted by 5280High:
People are assuming he is holding out for some monster contract...which isn't true. Him and his agent have to understand he is a two down linebacker but they probably also understand he is vastly underpaid at $650k this year. Just sign him to a two year extension for like $1-2m per year.

All this trade talk is retarded, he is a starter and should be paid accordingly. He is getting paid backup money right now, just pay him the same as a middle of the pack LB and be done with it.

Yeah, that's what I said.

He's only getting barely half a million.....at that?

He's been paid

7/28/2006: Signed a five-year, $13.9 million contract. The deal includes $4.9 million guaranteed and $5.1 million in incentives. 2009: $915,000, 2010: $625,000, 2011: Free Agent

It's not what you were paid.. it's what you are paid. NFL careers are short, you gotta make what you can while you can. His FMV is higher than $650k so it's in his best interest to try and get a decent extension that pays him on par with a normal starter.

For example, when I joined my firm I got a nice signing bonus then subsequently a promotion bonus... but due to the economy the raises have been frozen for the past two years. I average 65-70 hours a week, do you think I care about the money the firm already gave me in bonuses? No, I wanna be paid what I feel I should be making in the open market and is why I'm leaving the firm. This happens all the time and the hate for Manny, who has been an amazing teammate and never been in any trouble, is immature and unfounded.

Did you sign a contract saying you would make X amount of dollars over a 5 year span? We front loaded his contract like we just did with Willis. I didn't hear him complaining when he got the other 4.3 million the past 4 years.

So you think that it's okay for a guy to be left in limbo when they have a year left on their contract while someone with 2 or 3 years left on their deal gets a 5 year extension on it?

Look I'm hugely ecstatic with us extending Bam Bam's contract. But he had 2 years left to go. If anyone's contract should have been hammered out it's Franklin. Was Bam Bam going to hold out? No. Franklin doesn't care cause he's making top 5 money for the season. But Manny was out with that freak injury and he's got one year left on his deal. He OBVIOUSLY wants to remain with the team or he wouldn't have missed anything over money. He's good enough that he'll be highly sought if he hits the market. But apparently in San Francisco the fans feel that Manny is overrated.

At this point I hope he leaves and kicks our asses as much as you all been dissin him. It'd serve ya right.

Yeah I know, now I'm gonna get flamed for that. But you know what? I don't care. You guys are talkin out your rectums.

+1 Afrikan, +1.

I bet jeff was on board with Bam Bam's extension. Hypocrite.

~Ceadder

[ Edited by Ceadderman on May 5, 2010 at 22:07:17 ]

lets sign adalius thomas and dump lawson

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by TonyStarks:

Originally posted by 5280High:
People are assuming he is holding out for some monster contract...which isn't true. Him and his agent have to understand he is a two down linebacker but they probably also understand he is vastly underpaid at $650k this year. Just sign him to a two year extension for like $1-2m per year.

All this trade talk is retarded, he is a starter and should be paid accordingly. He is getting paid backup money right now, just pay him the same as a middle of the pack LB and be done with it.

Yeah, that's what I said.

He's only getting barely half a million.....at that?

He's been paid

7/28/2006: Signed a five-year, $13.9 million contract. The deal includes $4.9 million guaranteed and $5.1 million in incentives. 2009: $915,000, 2010: $625,000, 2011: Free Agent

It's not what you were paid.. it's what you are paid. NFL careers are short, you gotta make what you can while you can. His FMV is higher than $650k so it's in his best interest to try and get a decent extension that pays him on par with a normal starter.

For example, when I joined my firm I got a nice signing bonus then subsequently a promotion bonus... but due to the economy the raises have been frozen for the past two years. I average 65-70 hours a week, do you think I care about the money the firm already gave me in bonuses? No, I wanna be paid what I feel I should be making in the open market and is why I'm leaving the firm. This happens all the time and the hate for Manny, who has been an amazing teammate and never been in any trouble, is immature and unfounded.

Did you sign a contract saying you would make X amount of dollars over a 5 year span? We front loaded his contract like we just did with Willis. I didn't hear him complaining when he got the other 4.3 million the past 4 years.

So you think that it's okay for a guy to be left in limbo when they have a year left on their contract while someone with 2 or 3 years left on their deal gets a 5 year extension on it?

Look I'm hugely ecstatic with us extending Bam Bam's contract. But he had 2 years left to go. If anyone's contract should have been hammered out it's Franklin. Was Bam Bam going to hold out? No. Franklin doesn't care cause he's making top 5 money for the season. But Manny was out with that freak injury and he's got one year left on his deal. He OBVIOUSLY wants to remain with the team or he wouldn't have missed anything over money. He's good enough that he'll be highly sought if he hits the market. But apparently in San Francisco the fans feel that Manny is overrated.

At this point I hope he leaves and kicks our asses as much as you all been dissin him. It'd serve ya right.

Yeah I know, now I'm gonna get flamed for that. But you know what? I don't care. You guys are talkin out your rectums.

+1 Afrikan, +1.

I bet jeff was on board with Bam Bam's extension. Hypocrite.

~Ceadder

How about a history lesson?

Originally posted by MaliCali:
some of you guys get too caught up on how he isnt a hugely productive pass rusher..when he isn't even used as such that often...

he is arguably the best coverage 3-4 OLB in the league, amazing considering he was a converted DE, and if you ever actually watch games, he is an absolute terror in run defense, and is one of the reasons we are so good against the run...he is constantly forcing backs back inside.

go watch some "tape" as some of you guys like to pretend you do.

My Response:
He was drafted for a reason and hasn't fulfilled that reason. Sure he has other great qualities and is generally liked by everybody but he's the one holding out. How much money do you think we should pay a 2 down OLB then figure how much money he thinks he should be paid. If he wants like a 4 year 8-10 million dollar deal I would be ok with that. But I'm thinking he wants a lot more then 10 mill.

Did I have a problem with us extending Staley before his contract was up....nope. Do I have a problem with extending Willis before his contract us up....nope. Whats the difference between Willis and Lawson....3 probowls. Whats the difference between Staley and Lawson....he's a cornerstone of the offensive line.

Obviously by bringing in an OLB FA and by taking Manny out of passing downs his presence on the field isn't that game changing. So to act like we owe him something doesn't make sense.

Guess what genius Vernon Davis, Aubrayo Franklin, Dashon Goldson, Alex Smith Manny Lawson, Ray McDonald, Takeo Spikes, David Baas, and Barry Sims are all in contract years. Should we resin everybody right now to make them happy.....well should we? I don't hear people screaming to resign Smith to an extension and I'm sure he would like to stay in SF. Or maybe its more important to sign an OLB then a starting QB? Baas showed up to work out, I'm pretty sure Goldson will, Smith was working out...in fact I bet they all will even Franklin once he signs his tender. So don't give me this he had a freak accident crap, Smith has had more injury issues then Manny and he was there and his contract is up this year.

Tell me where I was "dissin him" because I want him to earn his f**king money.... yeah novel concept isn't it!! And the hypocrite comment was real smart by the way....Willis a future HOF player vs Lawson a 2 down OLB, yeah we should of signed Lawson first. Why don't you pull your head out of your rectum and use some common sense.

just give him a new contract already.

Originally posted by Ceadderman:
In any case, people are talkin out their butts about Manny. If he misses camp then fine we'll burn that bridge when we get to it. But It's F'n OTA's. The level of the Zoners "sky is falling" mentality is getting lower and lower every year I believe. Don't turn such a minor thing into such outrageous crap.

4 real. Some much hate spewing over nothing. Manny nor his agent has said a word. Just because some blog says "a source close to Lawson" says something doesn't mean s**t.

Originally posted by Wodwo:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

I think the coaches feel they don't have to address the OLB position because they have a few players waiting in the wings that they seem to be quite fond of, namely Brooks, AND they had other positions of need that were more pressing and deserved more focus. People love to take facts like this (not addressing the position) to mean the staff thinks so-and-so is a good player. We didn't really address the O-Line for several years, did that mean the staff thought the guys on the line were good? Obviously not.

A few? Who besides Brooks? The host of undrafted free agents who haven't played a snap in the NFL?

We have 5 OLBs with game experience... that's if you want to include Briggs who has 2 tackles to his name.

Breakdown of OLBs with game experience production per game. Career totals in parenthesis. Stats from NFL.com.

LaBoy has .35 sacks per game (23.5) and 2 tackles per game (136).

Haralson has .28 sacks per game (15.5) and 2.4 tackles per game (130).

Brooks has .3 sacks per game (8) and 2.1 tackles per game (58).

Lawson has .25 sacks per game (12) and 3.8 tackles per game (181).

As a comparison:

Ware has .81 sacks per game (64.5) and 4.4 tackles per game (354).

Merriman has .76 sacks per game (43.5) and 3.9 tackles per game (225).

Woodley has .66 sacks per game (29) and 3.1 tackles per game (136).

For fun:

Willis has .19 sacks per game (9) and 9.7 tackles per game (467).

So, while I realize that this proves absolutely nothing (anybody know where to find number of snaps played?), I think it's fun to compare the production of players and some of it is interesting. Obviously, none of our OLBs have proven to be anything but mediocre to poor rushing the passer when compared to players considered to be dominant pass rushers. I also think it's interesting that there appears to be little disparity among our OLBs when it comes to producing sacks.

Also, we did address the offensive line. In the five seasons before this draft we have drafted one tackle in the first round, two guards in the second round, a guard/tackle in the third round, a center in the fourth round, and we have signed one top free agent tackle and one hall of fame guard. Just because players don't always work out does not mean the team has not attempted to address a position. Your example is also ironic because the offensive line was obviously considered a position of need by the staff as reflected in our first round selections. Yet, not one OLB was drafted.

Lastly:

Originally posted by Barrows:
On Friday, I asked Mike Singletary about free-agent linebacker Adalius Thomas, someone the 49ers were very interested in during free agency three years ago. Singletary, who coached Thomas in Baltimore, acknowledged that past interest but said he was content with the OLBs the 49ers have on the roster right now.

link

I think you're missing the point of that post. I said [b/]they[b] probably have guys they like waiting in the wings. Briggs is the other guy they seem to be high on, and then they got LaBoy. That's a few guys. I didn't say these guys have experience nor do I necessarily agree with the staff about whether or not these guys have promise.

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by Wodwo:

Originally posted by jreff22:
I didn't hear him complaining.

Should have stopped the sentence here. He hasn't said anything yet.

Actions speak louder then words and so far he's been MIA.

You have no idea if that is the case. He has not missed any mandatory team anything yet and we have no idea of he or his representation has been in contact with the team.

Just because bloggers and beat writers are not privy to those conversations doesn't mean they haven't happened.

Originally posted by Gavintech:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by Wodwo:

Originally posted by jreff22:
I didn't hear him complaining.

Should have stopped the sentence here. He hasn't said anything yet.

Actions speak louder then words and so far he's been MIA.

You have no idea if that is the case. He has not missed any mandatory team anything yet and we have no idea of he or his representation has been in contact with the team.

Just because bloggers and beat writers are not privy to those conversations doesn't mean they haven't happened.

Well actually I do know that's the case...see we had some practices and he wasn't there, hence the MIA comment. Regardless if they were mandatory or not that fact is he wasn't attending, and that's all that I said.

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by Gavintech:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by Wodwo:

Originally posted by jreff22:
I didn't hear him complaining.

Should have stopped the sentence here. He hasn't said anything yet.

Actions speak louder then words and so far he's been MIA.

You have no idea if that is the case. He has not missed any mandatory team anything yet and we have no idea of he or his representation has been in contact with the team.

Just because bloggers and beat writers are not privy to those conversations doesn't mean they haven't happened.

Well actually I do know that's the case...see we had some practices and he wasn't there, hence the MIA comment. Regardless if they were mandatory or not that fact is he wasn't attending, and that's all that I said.

MIA = missing in action = no one knows where he is or why he isn't with the team. You don't know that. Singltary or Balke may very well have spoke to him or his agent and knew he wasn't going to be at the OTAs.

He didnt show up for some meaningless OTA's ------ big deal. When it's manditory and he doesn't show up then we have a problem. I love the fact that others are getting th reps when he is absent. This will be an important year for Manny to showcase himself as much as possible. I like Manny but he has underachieved as a pass rusher.

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by jreff22:

Originally posted by TonyStarks:

Originally posted by 5280High:
People are assuming he is holding out for some monster contract...which isn't true. Him and his agent have to understand he is a two down linebacker but they probably also understand he is vastly underpaid at $650k this year. Just sign him to a two year extension for like $1-2m per year.

All this trade talk is retarded, he is a starter and should be paid accordingly. He is getting paid backup money right now, just pay him the same as a middle of the pack LB and be done with it.

Yeah, that's what I said.

He's only getting barely half a million.....at that?

He's been paid

7/28/2006: Signed a five-year, $13.9 million contract. The deal includes $4.9 million guaranteed and $5.1 million in incentives. 2009: $915,000, 2010: $625,000, 2011: Free Agent

It's not what you were paid.. it's what you are paid. NFL careers are short, you gotta make what you can while you can. His FMV is higher than $650k so it's in his best interest to try and get a decent extension that pays him on par with a normal starter.

For example, when I joined my firm I got a nice signing bonus then subsequently a promotion bonus... but due to the economy the raises have been frozen for the past two years. I average 65-70 hours a week, do you think I care about the money the firm already gave me in bonuses? No, I wanna be paid what I feel I should be making in the open market and is why I'm leaving the firm. This happens all the time and the hate for Manny, who has been an amazing teammate and never been in any trouble, is immature and unfounded.

Did you sign a contract saying you would make X amount of dollars over a 5 year span? We front loaded his contract like we just did with Willis. I didn't hear him complaining when he got the other 4.3 million the past 4 years.

So you think that it's okay for a guy to be left in limbo when they have a year left on their contract while someone with 2 or 3 years left on their deal gets a 5 year extension on it?

Look I'm hugely ecstatic with us extending Bam Bam's contract. But he had 2 years left to go. If anyone's contract should have been hammered out it's Franklin. Was Bam Bam going to hold out? No. Franklin doesn't care cause he's making top 5 money for the season. But Manny was out with that freak injury and he's got one year left on his deal. He OBVIOUSLY wants to remain with the team or he wouldn't have missed anything over money. He's good enough that he'll be highly sought if he hits the market. But apparently in San Francisco the fans feel that Manny is overrated.

At this point I hope he leaves and kicks our asses as much as you all been dissin him. It'd serve ya right.

Yeah I know, now I'm gonna get flamed for that. But you know what? I don't care. You guys are talkin out your rectums.

+1 Afrikan, +1.

I bet jeff was on board with Bam Bam's extension. Hypocrite.

~Ceadder

How about a history lesson?

Originally posted by MaliCali:
some of you guys get too caught up on how he isnt a hugely productive pass rusher..when he isn't even used as such that often...

he is arguably the best coverage 3-4 OLB in the league, amazing considering he was a converted DE, and if you ever actually watch games, he is an absolute terror in run defense, and is one of the reasons we are so good against the run...he is constantly forcing backs back inside.

go watch some "tape" as some of you guys like to pretend you do.

My Response:
He was drafted for a reason and hasn't fulfilled that reason. Sure he has other great qualities and is generally liked by everybody but he's the one holding out. How much money do you think we should pay a 2 down OLB then figure how much money he thinks he should be paid. If he wants like a 4 year 8-10 million dollar deal I would be ok with that. But I'm thinking he wants a lot more then 10 mill.

Did I have a problem with us extending Staley before his contract was up....nope. Do I have a problem with extending Willis before his contract us up....nope. Whats the difference between Willis and Lawson....3 probowls. Whats the difference between Staley and Lawson....he's a cornerstone of the offensive line.

Obviously by bringing in an OLB FA and by taking Manny out of passing downs his presence on the field isn't that game changing. So to act like we owe him something doesn't make sense.

Guess what genius Vernon Davis, Aubrayo Franklin, Dashon Goldson, Alex Smith Manny Lawson, Ray McDonald, Takeo Spikes, David Baas, and Barry Sims are all in contract years. Should we resin everybody right now to make them happy.....well should we? I don't hear people screaming to resign Smith to an extension and I'm sure he would like to stay in SF. Or maybe its more important to sign an OLB then a starting QB? Baas showed up to work out, I'm pretty sure Goldson will, Smith was working out...in fact I bet they all will even Franklin once he signs his tender. So don't give me this he had a freak accident crap, Smith has had more injury issues then Manny and he was there and his contract is up this year.

Tell me where I was "dissin him" because I want him to earn his f**king money.... yeah novel concept isn't it!! And the hypocrite comment was real smart by the way....Willis a future HOF player vs Lawson a 2 down OLB, yeah we should of signed Lawson first. Why don't you pull your head out of your rectum and use some common sense.

He doesn't earn his money? I think you should ask TKO, Bam Bam and Icebox if he "earns his money" as you say he doesn't. Many is so quick to seal the edge that the Back HAS TO cut back inside.

Ask all the opposing QBs' if Manny earns his money. Freakin homers are driving me nuts. Look man I like ya, but you are lost in this argument. Manny was drafted by NOLAN who wanted an off the edge Rusher. But Nolan never used him this way. Then he was INJURED and out for a season. is that Manny's fault?

Coming back from the injury he had was a long process but he's always been pretty solid on the field. Always. You ask everyone that Manny's play affects on the Defense and I bet they say similar things about Manny that they do about ABF.

Nobody is saying overpay the man. Geez this team has paid players based on less. Throw some money at a guy that WANTS to be a 9er. It wasn't THAT long ago that we had guys that wanted to go elsewhere. I'll complain all day long about guys that don't want to play for this team and hold out. But a guy misses a few OTAs' and everyone wants to run him out of town on the nearest rail right through a roofing vat and a pillow factory.

Just chill and wait to see how Parage handles this. Sheesh.

~Ceadder

I like Lawson, I like rallying for the underdog. I hope this gets sorted out and Lawson stays with the 9ers.

People really need to relax. I'm sure Singletary has already spoken to him. Plus, it says that he's working out on his own anyways.

Does it really make a difference if he sits out or not? I don't think Manny comes back as a Niner in 2011, anyways. Barring a monster season in sacks, does anyone see Lawson coming back next year?

[ Edited by mayo63 on May 6, 2010 at 08:59:36 ]