Is Alex REALLY a bust?? Read Ponder Vote...

Originally posted by xx49erfanxx:

Originally posted by Archie:
How long, how long, how long do we wait for Smith? Smith is better but he's still mediocre at best and I mean the best case is that Smith is mediocre.

Originally posted by Joecool:
So far, Alex Smith is a 5th year QB who has lost way more than won.

Shaun Hill, when he came to this team was a 5 year backup and has won more than lost.

However, we can't go back. We need to make sure Alex is a backup at best or if he's a starter. Must keep him starting until halfway through next season. If he's sucking up to that point, then we need to try plan C.

Ask Tampa how much longer should they have waited on Steve Young????????

I know Steve Young and he is no Steve Young...

Originally posted by darkknight49:

Originally posted by Spoonerism:

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:
If you do not think Alex Smith is a bust, you are just not watching the games...I do not care who the other QBs are...and I know one of them is probably Steve Young...

I've seen the games and I'd like to know what you're seeing that I'm not seeing? I'm not saying Smith played well or didn't play well. He is up and down but hasn't quite been able to seal the deal this year when the game was on the line. It looks to me like he doesn't quite trust what is going on at times and lacks chemistry with some of his receivers. However, he is also improvising and reading defenses much better than I've seen him in the past. Regardless, none of us can sit here and say for sure whether or not Smith is a bust after 10 quarters.

He's shown good stuff, he's shown bad stuff. I can see how you can have an argument either way.

I guess it just comes down to this: Are you an optimist or a pessimist?

No, it comes down to time...how much TIME do we give this creep, not to mention all the $$$ he has been given that, for the last four years, could have been put to better use...

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:

Originally posted by darkknight49:

Originally posted by Spoonerism:

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:
If you do not think Alex Smith is a bust, you are just not watching the games...I do not care who the other QBs are...and I know one of them is probably Steve Young...

I've seen the games and I'd like to know what you're seeing that I'm not seeing? I'm not saying Smith played well or didn't play well. He is up and down but hasn't quite been able to seal the deal this year when the game was on the line. It looks to me like he doesn't quite trust what is going on at times and lacks chemistry with some of his receivers. However, he is also improvising and reading defenses much better than I've seen him in the past. Regardless, none of us can sit here and say for sure whether or not Smith is a bust after 10 quarters.

He's shown good stuff, he's shown bad stuff. I can see how you can have an argument either way.

I guess it just comes down to this: Are you an optimist or a pessimist?

No, it comes down to time...how much TIME do we give this creep, not to mention all the $$$ he has been given that, for the last four years, could have been put to better use...

We're losing even more time by starting Shaun Hill. At least with Smith in there, we'll know for sure at the end of this season if we need to acquire another QB or not. At this point, it's still too early to tell if he's a bust or not. If he's still turning the ball over and losing games at the end of the year, I'd tell you that he's a bust. You can't give up on players too soon though. Imagine if we gave up on Vernon Davis.

Either way, we have nobody on the roster that's worth starting, so it doesn't really matter at this point if Smith is a bust or not. The bottom line is, he's the best we have right now so all we can do is hope he plays well.

[ Edited by B650 on Nov 9, 2009 at 17:38:43 ]

In my opinion, Alex Smith IS NOT a bust. I just can't get over the whole OC thing. I don't care who your QB is, if you give him 5 different OC's in 5 years, nobody can get any consistency. In the game on Sunday, one of the announcers said that Peyton Manning has had the same OC and same QB coach for 12 years !! We need to upgrad our O-line, mainly RT and RG, and then see what Smith can do with more time to throw...he will have Crabtree and Morgan with another year under their belt, and will have VD coming off a Pro-Bowl year ( yes I said it, he will make the Pro-Bowl ! ). With a better line Gore will have more holes, and thus give Alex's PA passes some real threat. Also, consider that this is really Alex's 3rd real year under center. In 2007 he only played 3 games, got hurt and really shouldn't have come back at all. He also had NO good WR's at all. Coming into this year, I was very optimistic and thought playoffs were a real possibility. Realistically, I think that we'll end up 8 -8 . It's still a step forward. We will be in a good cap situation, and can upgrade our O-line, and pass rush. Let's see what Alex can do with a good line, good WR's, and a whole off season and training camp knowing he is the # 1 QB. Then we can judge. If all this happens, and he flops, then cast him aside. I mean think about it, who else is out there for a QB next season ?? Do you really wanna start over with a rookie ?? You can't make the same mistake and start a rookie in his 1st year. He needs to develop and learn the system. Is Nate Davis the guy next year ?? Maybe. I think he needs to learn the system. We need to keep the SAME OC for more than 1 year !! How can a team gel when the system keeps getting altered ?? I think Smith will be fine. After all, he hasn't played in almost 2 years and has more TD's and yards per game than Hill did in less games.

Originally posted by diehardfor20yrs:
In my opinion, Alex Smith IS NOT a bust. I just can't get over the whole OC thing. I don't care who your QB is, if you give him 5 different OC's in 5 years, nobody can get any consistency. In the game on Sunday, one of the announcers said that Peyton Manning has had the same OC and same QB coach for 12 years !! We need to upgrad our O-line, mainly RT and RG, and then see what Smith can do with more time to throw...he will have Crabtree and Morgan with another year under their belt, and will have VD coming off a Pro-Bowl year ( yes I said it, he will make the Pro-Bowl ! ). With a better line Gore will have more holes, and thus give Alex's PA passes some real threat. Also, consider that this is really Alex's 3rd real year under center. In 2007 he only played 3 games, got hurt and really shouldn't have come back at all. He also had NO good WR's at all. Coming into this year, I was very optimistic and thought playoffs were a real possibility. Realistically, I think that we'll end up 8 -8 . It's still a step forward. We will be in a good cap situation, and can upgrade our O-line, and pass rush. Let's see what Alex can do with a good line, good WR's, and a whole off season and training camp knowing he is the # 1 QB. Then we can judge. If all this happens, and he flops, then cast him aside. I mean think about it, who else is out there for a QB next season ?? Do you really wanna start over with a rookie ?? You can't make the same mistake and start a rookie in his 1st year. He needs to develop and learn the system. Is Nate Davis the guy next year ?? Maybe. I think he needs to learn the system. We need to keep the SAME OC for more than 1 year !! How can a team gel when the system keeps getting altered ?? I think Smith will be fine. After all, he hasn't played in almost 2 years and has more TD's and yards per game than Hill did in less games.

I agree. The problem now is, do we keep Jimmy Raye for another season just to build continuity?

Not a bust! Give him the rest of the year it can't hurt any worse.

Originally posted by diehardfor20yrs:
In my opinion, Alex Smith IS NOT a bust. I just can't get over the whole OC thing. I don't care who your QB is, if you give him 5 different OC's in 5 years, nobody can get any consistency. In the game on Sunday, one of the announcers said that Peyton Manning has had the same OC and same QB coach for 12 years !! We need to upgrad our O-line, mainly RT and RG, and then see what Smith can do with more time to throw...he will have Crabtree and Morgan with another year under their belt, and will have VD coming off a Pro-Bowl year ( yes I said it, he will make the Pro-Bowl ! ). With a better line Gore will have more holes, and thus give Alex's PA passes some real threat. Also, consider that this is really Alex's 3rd real year under center. In 2007 he only played 3 games, got hurt and really shouldn't have come back at all. He also had NO good WR's at all. Coming into this year, I was very optimistic and thought playoffs were a real possibility. Realistically, I think that we'll end up 8 -8 . It's still a step forward. We will be in a good cap situation, and can upgrade our O-line, and pass rush. Let's see what Alex can do with a good line, good WR's, and a whole off season and training camp knowing he is the # 1 QB. Then we can judge. If all this happens, and he flops, then cast him aside. I mean think about it, who else is out there for a QB next season ?? Do you really wanna start over with a rookie ?? You can't make the same mistake and start a rookie in his 1st year. He needs to develop and learn the system. Is Nate Davis the guy next year ?? Maybe. I think he needs to learn the system. We need to keep the SAME OC for more than 1 year !! How can a team gel when the system keeps getting altered ?? I think Smith will be fine. After all, he hasn't played in almost 2 years and has more TD's and yards per game than Hill did in less games.

hey hey!! i am so happy that your support me that i agree you this! i am soo piss off that i am bad grammar because ppl don't understand me what i am saying my speech.. Thank you thank you!

I give up. I can only name two of them. Terry Bradshaw and Steve Young. Somebody will come up with it.

You know what's amazing? Joe Namath finished his career with 173 TD's and 220 Int's. Oh, I forgot, he played in New York.

I found it. It's Jim Plunkett.

Terry Bradshaw, Steve Young, and Jim Plunkett.

[ Edited by dbdublin on Nov 9, 2009 at 18:22:29 ]

Originally posted by diehardfor20yrs:
In my opinion, Alex Smith IS NOT a bust. I just can't get over the whole OC thing. I don't care who your QB is, if you give him 5 different OC's in 5 years, nobody can get any consistency. In the game on Sunday, one of the announcers said that Peyton Manning has had the same OC and same QB coach for 12 years !! We need to upgrad our O-line, mainly RT and RG, and then see what Smith can do with more time to throw...he will have Crabtree and Morgan with another year under their belt, and will have VD coming off a Pro-Bowl year ( yes I said it, he will make the Pro-Bowl ! ). With a better line Gore will have more holes, and thus give Alex's PA passes some real threat. Also, consider that this is really Alex's 3rd real year under center. In 2007 he only played 3 games, got hurt and really shouldn't have come back at all. He also had NO good WR's at all. Coming into this year, I was very optimistic and thought playoffs were a real possibility. Realistically, I think that we'll end up 8 -8 . It's still a step forward. We will be in a good cap situation, and can upgrade our O-line, and pass rush. Let's see what Alex can do with a good line, good WR's, and a whole off season and training camp knowing he is the # 1 QB. Then we can judge. If all this happens, and he flops, then cast him aside. I mean think about it, who else is out there for a QB next season ?? Do you really wanna start over with a rookie ?? You can't make the same mistake and start a rookie in his 1st year. He needs to develop and learn the system. Is Nate Davis the guy next year ?? Maybe. I think he needs to learn the system. We need to keep the SAME OC for more than 1 year !! How can a team gel when the system keeps getting altered ?? I think Smith will be fine. After all, he hasn't played in almost 2 years and has more TD's and yards per game than Hill did in less games.

Gannon said it.

~Ceadder

Originally posted by B650:

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:

Originally posted by darkknight49:

Originally posted by Spoonerism:

Originally posted by Bobbi9698:
If you do not think Alex Smith is a bust, you are just not watching the games...I do not care who the other QBs are...and I know one of them is probably Steve Young...

I've seen the games and I'd like to know what you're seeing that I'm not seeing? I'm not saying Smith played well or didn't play well. He is up and down but hasn't quite been able to seal the deal this year when the game was on the line. It looks to me like he doesn't quite trust what is going on at times and lacks chemistry with some of his receivers. However, he is also improvising and reading defenses much better than I've seen him in the past. Regardless, none of us can sit here and say for sure whether or not Smith is a bust after 10 quarters.

He's shown good stuff, he's shown bad stuff. I can see how you can have an argument either way.

I guess it just comes down to this: Are you an optimist or a pessimist?

No, it comes down to time...how much TIME do we give this creep, not to mention all the $$$ he has been given that, for the last four years, could have been put to better use...

We're losing even more time by starting Shaun Hill. At least with Smith in there, we'll know for sure at the end of this season if we need to acquire another QB or not. At this point, it's still too early to tell if he's a bust or not. If he's still turning the ball over and losing games at the end of the year, I'd tell you that he's a bust. You can't give up on players too soon though. Imagine if we gave up on Vernon Davis.

Either way, we have nobody on the roster that's worth starting, so it doesn't really matter at this point if Smith is a bust or not. The bottom line is, he's the best we have right now so all we can do is hope he plays well.

Exactly.

I would like to see how Alex finishes the season out.

Originally posted by Ceadderman:
After all the slack jawing about Smith being a bust based on one game(be honest he was not that bad against the Colts), I decided to go poking around for some comparative stats.

These three QBs' who shall be for the time being remain nameless put up either comparable numbers or worse numbers than Alex.

QB1: Posted these numbers in his first two years...

year 1: in 5 games Started 138 passes attempted/ 72 completed/ for 935 yards/ 3 TD and 8 INTs.

Year 2: 13 games Started. 363 passes attempted/ 195 completed/ for 2282 yards/ 8 TDs and 13 INTs.

QB2: Posted these numbers in 3 years...

Year 1: 13 games Started. 218 Attempts/ 83 completed/ 1410 yards/ 6 TDs 24 INTs'.

Year 2: 14 games Started. 373 Attempts/ 203 completed/ 2259 yards/ 13 TDs and 22 INTs.

Year 3: 14 games Started. 308 Attempts/ 147 completed/ 1887 yards/ 12 TD and 12 INTs'.

And QB3: Posted these numbers in 3 years...

Year 1: 14 games Started. 328 Attempts/ 158 Completed/ 2158 yards/ 19 TD and 16 INTs.

Year 1: 14 games Started. 355 Attempts/ 169 Completed/ 2196 yards/ 8 TD and 25 INTs.

Year 3 14 games Started. 376 Attempts/ 193 Completed/ 2550 yards/ 13 TD and 17 INTs.

Now, Alex Smith...

Year 1: 9 G/ 7 Started/ 165 Attempts/ 89 Completed/ 875 yards/ 1 TD and 11 INTs'.

Year 2: 16 games Started/442 Attempts/ 257 Completed/ 2890 yards/ 16 TD and 16INTs.

Year 3: 7 games Started/ 193 Attempts/ 94 Completed/ 914 yards/ 2 TD and 4 INTs'.

I used the numbers from 3 well known QBs' all from their 1st 2 or 3 years in the league. All have had issues with the teams that drafted them.

So you be the Judge is he a bust, or are all of them busts.

I'll post the names of the 3 QBs' in a few days on my profile.

Let the conversation begin.

~Ceadder

24 TDs and 36 INTs

That bothers me, alot. I know there is another half a season to play but what happens from here on out will determine whether or not there is a QB acquisition in the offseason, be it FA or Draft.

The common thread amongst really good teams in the league is a Great or very good QB. We have neither.

Man...There are always stats out there that make a guy look good or look bad. What you have to ask youself is..Is Alex the right QB for this team now, or next season. Does he have the hearts of the coaches and the wideouts. Can he ever win a game for us this season or next when we need him to...And the answer is a big NO!!!!

He is a Coach and drive killer, and is one pass away from getting someones
season ended. There is no way to cut it. He sucks for us. And who cares if he
leaves and becomes a good QB for some other team. He is just not our Guy no matter how you look at the numbers.

Originally posted by dbdublin:
I give up. I can only name two of them. Terry Bradshaw and Steve Young. Somebody will come up with it.

You know what's amazing? Joe Namath finished his career with 173 TD's and 220 Int's. Oh, I forgot, he played in New York.

I found it. It's Jim Plunkett.

Terry Bradshaw, Steve Young, and Jim Plunkett.

Well you aren't the first to get it, but Im gonna end this early I guess. I'm tired of mailing people requesting they pull down the answers.

Indeed these are the guys.

What's REALLY funny is I'm not advocating wait until Alex becomes one of them.

What's ironic is that it took both Bradshaw AND Plunkett over 5 or more years to get it right.

Steve was lucky in that he was traded to us and we had a solid system that he could grow into without having to get his skull bashed in trying to learn.

What REALLY has me miffed about this is that Steve went to Atlanta to help Vick become a better QB, but he lives in the Bay Area and doesn't even offer assistance where Alex is concerned. Okay I'm disappointed in both people Steve for not offering Alex for not asking.

I think what would really help Alex is learning Coach Walsh's step cadence. He should be reading his reads from the very first step in dropping back. This is the kind of thing that our QB coach is NOT teaching Alex. The kind of thing that Steve CAN teach.

I think that Alex should have this and next year to either show it and stay or not and leave. No more chances after that.

~Ceadder

Alex's numbers look a lot like Drew Brees' numbers through 3 seasons. I don't think he's a bust (yet) either. He's gotta get at least the rest of this year to get it together and show who is is / can be. Although if the next 8 games are really REALLY bad for him that's it.

P.S. I don't think he played that bad on Sunday. 2 of the 3 picks could just as easily been incomplete and were great plays by the DB's or they may have even gone for completions. The 2nd pick was pretty bad but every NFL QB does that at least a few times in a season.