When will Michael Crabtree be signed?

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by olapac:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by olapac:

Originally posted by ads_2006:

Originally posted by olapac:
Aaron Curry just signed...
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/08/08/seahawks-get-curry-under-contract/

6 years, 60 million, with 34 guaranteed.

Hope this isn't a bad sign for us trying to get Crab in. Curry, at 4, got more money than Tyson Jackson at 3. So there is now an example of a non-QB in the top ten getting more money than a guy drafted ahead of him.

I dont think it would/ should crabs.

If anything he may get DHB money, or a mill more, but he wont crack the top 6

What I meant to say is that the Niners (and us - the fans) can't keep saying he "has" to get paid in his slot. There's proof now that someone has jumped their slot and gotten more money then the guy ahead of him.

Now I still don't think he should get DHB money, but giving more money than the #9 is expected doesn't look so bad now.

Proof NOW????!!!

How about the massive list I provided all this week. This is the dumbest argument that keeps being parroted as the truth by many in the media and many fans.

Cheers

Didn't see the list. Apologies that I don't have time to review every single contract that was ever singed by a rookie. That's why we have you :-)

Regardless, I don't think it's commonplace for a non-QB in the Top 10 to "break" his slot and jump another player in salary. If I'm wrong, so be it.

You're right about this: Crabtree and his agent have the right to ask for any amount they deem fair. And also, the Niners have the right to do the same. But if he wants money greater than DHB, drafted 3 slots ahead of him and was the first WR drafted, I personally don't feel that's reasonable and hope the team holds firm. You can't expect the players to be Physical with an F on the field, then be pushovers in the front office.

And looking further at the deals for Jackson and Curry, it looks like it's not more. Jackson's deal is 5 years; Curry's 6. So if anything, the slotting continues.

My beef is certainly not with you, it is with the collection of unintelligent and/or sloppy journalists who have been propping this ridiculous sanctity of the "slotting". In their goal to embolden the populist rage that Crabtree has no business asking for more money than the normal 10th overall, they have completely neglected to do any form of research.

The low-level, unpaid hack currently typing these words, was able to find more than a dozen examples in the last few years of slotting-violations in about 30 minutes time, ranging from QB's, RB's, WR's, LB's, CB's who received more than players drafted above them. The supposed experts have discussed this about....zero times. Of all people, Ray Ratto, seems to be the only one to have considered the idea that Crabtree's attorney may have a case, as based on historical precedent. Most journalists have trumpeted the idea that Crabtree should stop being greedy, and simply sign.

I guess I am in a fight against sloppiness these days. Sloppiness in journalism, and sloppiness in thought.

It is as if people have completely shut off their brains.

You saw all this this coming, I believe, so it really should be no surprise.

This (Crabtree's holdout and contract demands) has become an emotional issue; the fans are angry. Particularly after Crabtree's cousin's ill considered statements a couple of days ago.

I find that an angry person rarely uses his or her brain to full capacity; they're too busy being angry.

The media simply plays along with it, fuels it, and believes they've done their job, rather than doing the sort of research and reasoning that you're talking about.

I read Ratto's article, and although he makes some valid points, I don't believe he falls into the category of "thoughtful jounalist" either. Most of what he said, the position he has taken, was fueled by his own agenda, which has historically been to take any side that's anti-49er. In this case, he just happened to stumble on a postion that had some logic to it as well. IMHO.

You always know how to temper my bludgening of certain board members, the media, players, coaches, etc.

And for that, I want to say thank you again.

How are you so cool-headed??? Maybe, I'll get there someday.

Originally posted by Chief:
I think he signs Monday morning.

There is a chance. However, I can't see anything done until Raji and Monroe sign. Raji is reportedly in Green Bay ready to sign, and Ted Thompson says that contract negotiations are ongoing.

Meanwhile, Monroe is still waiting for a better deal than the $18 million guaranteed, which was offered this week.

If Monroe is able to get $20 million guaranteed, then we have a great showdown between the Niners and Parker to see whether Crabtree will fit between Monroe and DHB, or pick up more than the $23.5 million guaranteed to the Raiders' WR.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by olapac:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by olapac:

Originally posted by ads_2006:

Originally posted by olapac:
Aaron Curry just signed...
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/08/08/seahawks-get-curry-under-contract/

6 years, 60 million, with 34 guaranteed.

Hope this isn't a bad sign for us trying to get Crab in. Curry, at 4, got more money than Tyson Jackson at 3. So there is now an example of a non-QB in the top ten getting more money than a guy drafted ahead of him.

I dont think it would/ should crabs.

If anything he may get DHB money, or a mill more, but he wont crack the top 6

What I meant to say is that the Niners (and us - the fans) can't keep saying he "has" to get paid in his slot. There's proof now that someone has jumped their slot and gotten more money then the guy ahead of him.

Now I still don't think he should get DHB money, but giving more money than the #9 is expected doesn't look so bad now.

Proof NOW????!!!

How about the massive list I provided all this week. This is the dumbest argument that keeps being parroted as the truth by many in the media and many fans.

Cheers

Didn't see the list. Apologies that I don't have time to review every single contract that was ever singed by a rookie. That's why we have you :-)

Regardless, I don't think it's commonplace for a non-QB in the Top 10 to "break" his slot and jump another player in salary. If I'm wrong, so be it.

You're right about this: Crabtree and his agent have the right to ask for any amount they deem fair. And also, the Niners have the right to do the same. But if he wants money greater than DHB, drafted 3 slots ahead of him and was the first WR drafted, I personally don't feel that's reasonable and hope the team holds firm. You can't expect the players to be Physical with an F on the field, then be pushovers in the front office.

And looking further at the deals for Jackson and Curry, it looks like it's not more. Jackson's deal is 5 years; Curry's 6. So if anything, the slotting continues.

My beef is certainly not with you, it is with the collection of unintelligent and/or sloppy journalists who have been propping this ridiculous sanctity of the "slotting". In their goal to embolden the populist rage that Crabtree has no business asking for more money than the normal 10th overall, they have completely neglected to do any form of research.

The low-level, unpaid hack currently typing these words, was able to find more than a dozen examples in the last few years of slotting-violations in about 30 minutes time, ranging from QB's, RB's, WR's, LB's, CB's who received more than players drafted above them. The supposed experts have discussed this about....zero times. Of all people, Ray Ratto, seems to be the only one to have considered the idea that Crabtree's attorney may have a case, as based on historical precedent. Most journalists have trumpeted the idea that Crabtree should stop being greedy, and simply sign.

I guess I am in a fight against sloppiness these days. Sloppiness in journalism, and sloppiness in thought.

It is as if people have completely shut off their brains.

You saw all this this coming, I believe, so it really should be no surprise.

This (Crabtree's holdout and contract demands) has become an emotional issue; the fans are angry. Particularly after Crabtree's cousin's ill considered statements a couple of days ago.

I find that an angry person rarely uses his or her brain to full capacity; they're too busy being angry.

The media simply plays along with it, fuels it, and believes they've done their job, rather than doing the sort of research and reasoning that you're talking about.

I read Ratto's article, and although he makes some valid points, I don't believe he falls into the category of "thoughtful jounalist" either. Most of what he said, the position he has taken, was fueled by his own agenda, which has historically been to take any side that's anti-49er. In this case, he just happened to stumble on a postion that had some logic to it as well. IMHO.

You always know how to temper my bludgening of certain board members, the media, players, coaches, etc.

And for that, I want to say thank you again.

How are you so cool-headed??? Maybe, I'll get there someday.

You're welcome. Just a matter of perspective, I suppose. Just trying to be helpful.

[ Edited by oldninerdude on Aug 8, 2009 at 20:06:52 ]

Here is the how the top five picks contracts look with per year averages.

1. Matthew Stafford

6 years
$72 million, an average of 12 a year with 6.95 million guaranteed per year.

2. Jason Smith

5 years
$61.78 million, an average of 12.355 a year with 6.6 million guaranteed per year.

3. Tyson Jackson

5 years
$57 million, an average of 11.4 a year with 6.2 million guaranteed per year.

4. Aaron Curry

6 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.7 million guaranteed per year.

5. Mark Sanchez

5 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.6 million guaranteed per year.

I am not sure how to interpret these figures, but they seem to indicate that in general there is a positive correlation between the draft slot, overall contract, and guaranteed money.

The numbers for Darrius Heyward-Bey are
5 years
$38.25 million, an average of 7.65 a year with 4.7 million guaranteed per year.

Based upon my belief that Crabtree will be much better than Darrius Heyward-Bey I think the contract with Crabtree will be something like

6 years
42 million, a average of 7 million a year with 5 million guaranteed per year.

Originally posted by buck:
Here is the how the top five picks contracts look with per year averages.

1. Matthew Stafford

6 years
$72 million, an average of 12 a year with 6.95 million guaranteed per year.

2. Jason Smith

5 years
$61.78 million, an average of 12.355 a year with 6.6 million guaranteed per year.

3. Tyson Jackson

5 years
$57 million, an average of 11.4 a year with 6.2 million guaranteed per year.

4. Aaron Curry

6 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.7 million guaranteed per year.

5. Mark Sanchez

5 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.6 million guaranteed per year.

I am not sure how to interpret these figures, but they seem to indicate that in general there is a positive correlation between the draft slot, overall contract, and guaranteed money.

The numbers for Darrius Heyward-Bey are
5 years
$38.25 million, an average of 7.65 a year with 4.7 million guaranteed per year.

Based upon my belief that Crabtree will be much better than Darrius Heyward-Bey I think the contract with Crabtree will be something like

6 years
42 million, a average of 7 million a year with 5 million guaranteed per year.

Nice info! Think it will all be done soon and us 49er fans will all be happy.

he will sign wednesday

Originally posted by buck:
Here is the how the top five picks contracts look with per year averages.

1. Matthew Stafford

6 years
$72 million, an average of 12 a year with 6.95 million guaranteed per year.

2. Jason Smith

5 years
$61.78 million, an average of 12.355 a year with 6.6 million guaranteed per year.

3. Tyson Jackson

5 years
$57 million, an average of 11.4 a year with 6.2 million guaranteed per year.

4. Aaron Curry

6 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.7 million guaranteed per year.

5. Mark Sanchez

5 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.6 million guaranteed per year.

I am not sure how to interpret these figures, but they seem to indicate that in general there is a positive correlation between the draft slot, overall contract, and guaranteed money.

The numbers for Darrius Heyward-Bey are
5 years
$38.25 million, an average of 7.65 a year with 4.7 million guaranteed per year.

Based upon my belief that Crabtree will be much better than Darrius Heyward-Bey I think the contract with Crabtree will be something like

6 years
42 million, a average of 7 million a year with 5 million guaranteed per year.

Im no draft math expert but would 6 years 5 mil guaranteed a yr mean he would be getting 30 mil in guaranteed, way above DHB 23.5?

no way Crabtree gets more than $23M guaranteed

In a desperate move its seems as if Crabtree's Cousin brought out the "Big Nickel Sub" against us.
But as we all know, it does not work.

Originally posted by Carney16:

Originally posted by buck:
Here is the how the top five picks contracts look with per year averages.

1. Matthew Stafford

6 years
$72 million, an average of 12 a year with 6.95 million guaranteed per year.

2. Jason Smith

5 years
$61.78 million, an average of 12.355 a year with 6.6 million guaranteed per year.

3. Tyson Jackson

5 years
$57 million, an average of 11.4 a year with 6.2 million guaranteed per year.

4. Aaron Curry

6 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.7 million guaranteed per year.

5. Mark Sanchez

5 years
$60 million, an average of 10 a year with 5.6 million guaranteed per year.

I am not sure how to interpret these figures, but they seem to indicate that in general there is a positive correlation between the draft slot, overall contract, and guaranteed money.

The numbers for Darrius Heyward-Bey are
5 years
$38.25 million, an average of 7.65 a year with 4.7 million guaranteed per year.

Based upon my belief that Crabtree will be much better than Darrius Heyward-Bey I think the contract with Crabtree will be something like

6 years
42 million, a average of 7 million a year with 5 million guaranteed per year.

Im no draft math expert but would 6 years 5 mil guaranteed a yr mean he would be getting 30 mil in guaranteed, way above DHB 23.5?

I say give him a 5 year 29 million, and 18 million guaranteed. that 5.8 a year with 3.6 guaranteed. Thats perfect for a #10 pick.

Originally posted by crzy:
no way Crabtree gets more than $23M guaranteed

I think there is a way.

When Crabtree fell to us most people quickly realized that in terms of talent we got the steal of the draft. Again assuming that Crabtree will be a much better football player than Hayward--Bey paying a premium for that talent is not unimaginable.

In my guesstimate, I have him signing a six year deal. A six year deal locks him up for a long time and delays his free agency, and I think. although I could be wrong, that delay saves the team money.

If he signs a five year deal, and five years would be better for Crabtree and not so good for the team. Thus, the guaranteed money in a five year deal would have to less--somewhat less than than Heyward-Bey got.

But, I will readily acknowledge that I am no expert in these matters and will not waste a lot of tme defending my speculations. We will shortly see what happens.

[ Edited by buck on Aug 8, 2009 at 22:24:26 ]

Originally posted by niner4life21:

Originally posted by teeohh:

Originally posted by 5timechamps:
i hope they trade his rights,and a first round pick to carolina.

wow he has become the most hated niner

we shouldn't be butt hurt just because he didn't sign immediately

exactly.....some people are overreacting.

I think if he comes in and lives up to expectations most of this will be forgotten. If not, or if it takes him awhile to hit stride, he might be in for a rough time with the fans.

what he's doing doesn't make sense...If you get drafted #10 you get #10 money...Like Dan Patrick said, just because he was high on mock drafts doesn't mean he should get that type of money...thats why the call it a Mock draft..

and his agents an idiot..so is his advisor..

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by olapac:
Aaron Curry just signed...
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/08/08/seahawks-get-curry-under-contract/

6 years, 60 million, with 34 guaranteed.

Hope this isn't a bad sign for us trying to get Crab in. Curry, at 4, got more money than Tyson Jackson at 3. So there is now an example of a non-QB in the top ten getting more money than a guy drafted ahead of him.

Whoa!! Hold on!!!

Shut down the NFL right now!! Aaron Curry, the 4th overall, received more money that Tyson Jackson, the 3rd overall. There should be rioting in the streets!! The media should be furious!! Fans across the NFL should be up in arms!!!

How dare Crabtree receive more money than the players above him!!!! He must bow to the 10th overall pick gods!!!!

Case #4567893 of how many in the media are dumb as bricks over this matter. Their populist, and stupid rants, which appeal to the lowest morons in the universe, gets shot down once again.

Sloppiness sucks. Crabtree's agent has every right to appeal for a salary beyond the normal tenth overall pick.

P.S. Looking for intelligent writers in the NFL to debunk this stupid "Crabtree must fall into the tenth slot" argument. The exception list to the sanctity of the slotting grew one more just today. Very strange that Ray Ratto, for once in his career, seems to get it.

Would you quit posting stuff like this, we all know that some players get paid higher than their slot or the player ahead of him. But the reason people are so mad at Crabtree is because he is a diva, is coming off an injury, and is not asking for a little bit more or just making more than the guy ahead of him, he is trying to get two to three times more than his slot. He is trying to get more than the player picked three slots ahead of him. So it is not the same thing. By the way another thing I believe that got people so mad, is they wanted to believe Crabs wasn't such a diva, but we are finding out he probably is just as bad or even worse than we thought. Oh and Crabs is the only one to have someone say he is willing to re-enter the draft(yes I know his agent said it's not true, but the fact is, it did come from someone from his camp).

[ Edited by philmo on Aug 9, 2009 at 02:48:09 ]

Originally posted by philmo:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by olapac:
Aaron Curry just signed...
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/08/08/seahawks-get-curry-under-contract/

6 years, 60 million, with 34 guaranteed.

Hope this isn't a bad sign for us trying to get Crab in. Curry, at 4, got more money than Tyson Jackson at 3. So there is now an example of a non-QB in the top ten getting more money than a guy drafted ahead of him.

Whoa!! Hold on!!!

Shut down the NFL right now!! Aaron Curry, the 4th overall, received more money that Tyson Jackson, the 3rd overall. There should be rioting in the streets!! The media should be furious!! Fans across the NFL should be up in arms!!!

How dare Crabtree receive more money than the players above him!!!! He must bow to the 10th overall pick gods!!!!

Case #4567893 of how many in the media are dumb as bricks over this matter. Their populist, and stupid rants, which appeal to the lowest morons in the universe, gets shot down once again.

Sloppiness sucks. Crabtree's agent has every right to appeal for a salary beyond the normal tenth overall pick.

P.S. Looking for intelligent writers in the NFL to debunk this stupid "Crabtree must fall into the tenth slot" argument. The exception list to the sanctity of the slotting grew one more just today. Very strange that Ray Ratto, for once in his career, seems to get it.

Would you quit posting stuff like this, we all know that some players get paid higher than their slot or the player ahead of him. But the reason people are so mad at Crabtree is because he is a diva, is coming off an injury, and is not asking for a little bit more or just making more than the guy ahead of him, he is trying to get two to three times more than his slot. He is trying to get more than the player picked three slots ahead of him. So it is not the same thing. By the way another thing I believe that got people so mad, is they wanted to believe Crabs wasn't such a diva, but we are finding out he probably is just as bad or even worse than we thought. Oh and Crabs is the only one to have someone say he is willing to re-enter the draft(yes I know his agent said it's not true, but the fact is, it did come from someone from his camp).

Phil ... he's trying to get 2 to 3 times more than his slot?
So you think he's gunning for 75 million? I think you better get that calculator back out.
His agent is doing his job, eventually he will back off the demands a little and this will be a memory.