Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Not a single one of these posts show that anyone was rooting against Jimmy or happy we lost. Not a one.

Another one of the usual suspects not following the conversation and changing the argument. Shocker.

You cant be serious. YOU started this whole thing by saying this:

Posters were openly rooting against Jimmy. They literally said those words lol stop it. "I want the Niners to win, but I also want Jimmy to suck so that we move on from him."

Then TreyDey called me and a few others out saying that myself and a few others were gloaty and happy that we lost, which you wholeheartedly agree with and posted a bunch of posts that didnt show a single person was happy we lost.

But its me thats not following and changing the argument

Whatever Steve Young said when just recently asked about the upcoming season for the Niners and the QB situation in general, he basically said in a nutshell his advice to Trey would be don't leave here stay right where you are. Fight and scratch and claw your way to somehow get on the field. But you ask yourself how's he supposed to do that? I don't know, who the hell cares. The same thing happened with Steve after a few years being on the team he was ready to say screw it I'm never gonna play here I should go somewhere else. After a chance conversation he had with Steven R. Covey, the motivational speaker and author, he realized he had no other better situation in his football career than still being the backup to Joe Montana. That's not saying Purdy is Montana but it's a similar situation. Anything other people are trying to say about what Trey should do or not do aside of what Steve Young thinks is basically a crock of s**t. Young is spot on he knows from personal experience.

Originally posted by Furlow:
Again, that's a different argument. Follow along and it will help the flow of the conversation.

And I'm saying NARRATIVE to 9ers4eva because he keeps repeating that when it comes to Trey vs. Darnold/Purdy. He's hinting at racism, but too scared to outright say it. So I'm giving him s**t for it.

You think thats the narrative i was referring to?

Man you really are lost to all reality

Let me help you out. You support Darnold over Trey because you are butthurt that your binky got replaced by Trey so you are willing to give ANYONE the benefit of the doubt over him. Just like faithful. Just like kolohe. Just like a bunch of others. It's sad.

Racism?

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Not a single one of these posts show that anyone was rooting against Jimmy or happy we lost. Not a one.

Another one of the usual suspects not following the conversation and changing the argument. Shocker.

You cant be serious. YOU started this whole thing by saying this:

Posters were openly rooting against Jimmy. They literally said those words lol stop it. "I want the Niners to win, but I also want Jimmy to suck so that we move on from him."

Then TreyDey called me and a few others out saying that myself and a few others were gloaty and happy that we lost, which you wholeheartedly agree with and posted a bunch of posts that didnt show a single person was happy we lost.

But its me thats not following and changing the argument

You and the others were absolutely gloating. Niners lose a heartbreaker in the NFCCG and the first thing y'all think to do is go in the Jimmy thread and say "I told you so?" Give it a rest, dude. You hated/hate Jimmy, that's fine. Just own it and stop hiding behind this nonsense. He's not even on the team anymore so stop being scared and just say how you really feel.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
I mean I agree that Trey should get more leeway than a long term vet. There's no doubt about that. His mistakes and poor play are completely understandable and expected given his lack of experience and unrefined skills.

Just saying neither are palatable options for this team. Why bother going to the mattresses about it?

Because the excuse makers wanna excuse giving 137 million for slightly above average play as some great move while simultaneously hating the move for Trey. They even have a higher expectation for a rook who was traded up for then they do for a guy getting franchise qb money.

Giving Jimmy all that money was a mistake. There is no question. It appears trading up for Trey will end up a mistake. I can admit both were mistakes if thats how it ends up. Others will NEVER admit the former.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
Again, that's a different argument. Follow along and it will help the flow of the conversation.

And I'm saying NARRATIVE to 9ers4eva because he keeps repeating that when it comes to Trey vs. Darnold/Purdy. He's hinting at racism, but too scared to outright say it. So I'm giving him s**t for it.

You think thats the narrative i was referring to?

Man you really are lost to all reality

Let me help you out. You support Darnold over Trey because you are butthurt that your binky got replaced by Trey so you are willing to give ANYONE the benefit of the doubt over him. Just like faithful. Just like kolohe. Just like a bunch of others. It's sad.

Racism?

But Purdy also replaced my "binky," so why have I embraced him so much? To the point that I say that I realized it was indeed Jimmy (and yes the combo of Kyle/Jimmy) that was holding us back?

Why did I defend Trey so harshly that I got a two month timeout for doing so?

Sorry, your theory doesn't hold up.

And if it's not racism, then what "narrative" do you keep referring to? Man up and just outright say it.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Kolohe:
One player, the 9ers gave up a s**tload of draft picks for not to mention three possible franchise 1st rounders. And he's someone who should have no excuses right out the gate for what they spent to get him. The 8th year vet, has limitations and is injury prone, but when healthy the 9ers win. Not to mention they only gave up a measly 2nd round pick to get him. So yes, they should be held to the same standards. Lets also not forget Trey Lance has shown he's been just as injury prone as the guy he was replacing.

Um they gave 137 million dollars to keep him. Something that is far more valuable than draft picks. To suggest all Jimmy cost us is a 2 is ridiculous.

So a young player who you trade lots of picks for gets no excuses from the jump but a guy who pay franchise qb money to gets years worth?

Okay and whats the difference, they also gave Trey Lance $30 million. Both aren't making peanuts and expectations were/are high on both. It was the same way with Alex Smith, expectations were he could step right in and look at least more promising than the guy he's replacing.

And the guy they gave $137 million to at least help guide the 9ers to a Super Bowl. The best you guys can tell me about Trey Lance is that he beat a weak ass Houston team.

Originally posted by Kolohe:
Okay and whats the difference, they also gave Trey Lance $30 million. Both aren't making peanuts and expectations were/are high on both. It was the same way with Alex Smith, expectations were he could step right in and look at least more promising than the guy he's replacing.

And the guy they gave $137 million to at least help guide the 9ers to a Super Bowl. The best you guys can tell me about Trey Lance is that he beat a weak ass Houston team.

Technically we only paid Jimmy $122M 😏. Hahaha that contract really wasn't all that bad. Giving it to him when we did, was a huge risk, but idk how much choice we really had. He was on a huge trajectory up, no one expected him to get hurt.

also, with the way contracts for QBs have skyrocketed since around that time, he was a decent deal, didn't hurt us. It wasn't like he was a bust. Lol he was in the top 8-12 range in the league, typically.

Jimmie's contract also had outs for the team. So rewarding him with that contract isn't as harsh on a team as three first round picks, IMO. Especially when you're still getting quality play from the guy you paid.

the biggest issue with Lance has been his injuries, that's what really has robbed him of his opportunities, not some player/coach. It robbed him of getting more chances to start/play his rookie year (finger & knee) and essentially his entire sophomore year (broken ankle/dislocated).

then another player stepped up and balled. Meanwhile, from numerous reports, the team has been underwhelmed with Trey - which seems to be true based on how they're treating him now.

so it isn't some player/coach that's boned him and didn't give him opportunities, it's his body that's mainly failed him to grow, which was what he needed most cause of his inexperience.

Originally posted by Furlow:
But Purdy also replaced my "binky," so why have I embraced him so much? To the point that I say that I realized it was indeed Jimmy (and yes the combo of Kyle/Jimmy) that was holding us back?

Why did I defend Trey so harshly that I got a two month timeout for doing so?

Sorry, your theory doesn't hold up.

And if it's not racism, then what "narrative" do you keep referring to? Man up and just outright say it.

I just told you want the narrative is. Anyone but Trey. That includes Brock and would've included Brock no matter how he played. Only difference is Brock played so well you couldn't realistically keep on the resign Jimmy path. Had Brock played average you still would've been beating the resign Jimmy drum just like you and the others were until he got hurt.

Same reason it includes Darnold now. It would include Jamarcus Russell if we signed him.

If you were legit about "realizing" it was Jimmy you wouldn't hedge. Kyle was never the issue. Kyle wont be the issue if Trey fails either.

The fact that you thought it referred to racism says more about your internal thoughts than anything.

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Kolohe:
One player, the 9ers gave up a s**tload of draft picks for not to mention three possible franchise 1st rounders. And he's someone who should have no excuses right out the gate for what they spent to get him. The 8th year vet, has limitations and is injury prone, but when healthy the 9ers win. Not to mention they only gave up a measly 2nd round pick to get him. So yes, they should be held to the same standards. Lets also not forget Trey Lance has shown he's been just as injury prone as the guy he was replacing.

Um they gave 137 million dollars to keep him. Something that is far more valuable than draft picks. To suggest all Jimmy cost us is a 2 is ridiculous.

So a young player who you trade lots of picks for gets no excuses from the jump but a guy who pay franchise qb money to gets years worth?

Okay and whats the difference, they also gave Trey Lance $30 million. Both aren't making peanuts and expectations were/are high on both. It was the same way with Alex Smith, expectations were he could step right in and look at least more promising than the guy he's replacing.

And the guy they gave $137 million to at least help guide the 9ers to a Super Bowl. The best you guys can tell me about Trey Lance is that he beat a weak ass Houston team.

So what you're saying is 21 year old rookie is on the same expectation footing as an 8 year vet right?

Just want to get the main conversation piece in order.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Because the excuse makers wanna excuse giving 137 million for slightly above average play as some great move while simultaneously hating the move for Trey. They even have a higher expectation for a rook who was traded up for then they do for a guy getting franchise qb money.

Giving Jimmy all that money was a mistake. There is no question. It appears trading up for Trey will end up a mistake. I can admit both were mistakes if thats how it ends up. Others will NEVER admit the former.

I just don't think it's fair to put higher expectations on Trey because of the investment that was made in him. That blame goes to Kyle and CO. To expect a guy to come in and set the world on fire after missing the COVID year and having one full season at the FCS level is unrealistic. Most rookies take time and Trey was behind the average high level prospect in terms of development. He needs extended playing time to get better in my opinion. My expectations for him without that are pretty low.

As for Jimmy's contract, the team was just in a tough spot with his pending free agency. Ideally you don't pay a guy franchise QB level money and have him not reach expectations, but I was fine with the move at the time. I guess they could have tagged him, but that's an easier judgement in hindsight. Not only did he play well in 17, but he galvanized the team and the fanbase. That's going to be considered when making a decision to commit, and we still had outs in that contract at least. I also think Jimmy gave us a pretty solid return, even though we didn't reach the ultimate goal. His contract ended up being in line with what he was as a player in the later years, even though he was initially paid as a top guy. That said, I definitely felt it was best to try and improve the spot. He's an average player who can't stay healthy.

Originally posted by tankle104:
Technically we only paid Jimmy $122M 😏. Hahaha that contract really wasn't all that bad. Giving it to him when we did, was a huge risk, but idk how much choice we really had. He was on a huge trajectory up, no one expected him to get hurt.

also, with the way contracts for QBs have skyrocketed since around that time, he was a decent deal, didn't hurt us. It wasn't like he was a bust. Lol he was in the top 8-12 range in the league, typically.

Jimmie's contract also had outs for the team. So rewarding him with that contract isn't as harsh on a team as three first round picks, IMO. Especially when you're still getting quality play from the guy you paid.

the biggest issue with Lance has been his injuries, that's what really has robbed him of his opportunities, not some player/coach. It robbed him of getting more chances to start/play his rookie year (finger & knee) and essentially his entire sophomore year (broken ankle/dislocated).

then another player stepped up and balled. Meanwhile, from numerous reports, the team has been underwhelmed with Trey - which seems to be true based on how they're treating him now.

so it isn't some player/coach that's boned him and didn't give him opportunities, it's his body that's mainly failed him to grow, which was what he needed most cause of his inexperience.

He was never top other than his small stint last year. 2020 and 2021 he was 14-16 range at best. 2019 he had some good games but he was maybe 12th. That isn't franchise qb production. If we give Brock or Trey 40 mil I won't be satisfied with that either. Just like I won't be satisfied with 14th-16th overall going forward from Nick Bosa either. When you pay guys you need them to be elite (Like Kittle and Warner.) Deebo needs to show more this year than he did too.

It's absolutely as harsh because you actually lose a proven commodity like DeForrest Buckner. We MAYBE lost a proven commodity with a draft pick.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by genus49:
Question was what does Trey have to show to beat out Brock. Darnold has nothing to do with that question.

If Trey beats out Brock...he's beating out Darnold. Your response is not much different than earlier discussion when I brought up that we haven't been able to see Trey play with CMC and Kittle and people came in taking that and turning it into "oh I guess unless Trey has all pros all around him we can't evaluate him properly"

The ability of people here to disregard things and move the goalposts to push their narratives is elite level

Lol, Darnold has quite a bit to do with that question considering he's splitting reps with Lance in a competition between the two. Where do you think the first opportunity is for either Lance or Darnold to show what they have? In practice. You're so emotional you can't comprehend basic concepts.

The question of "what does Lance have to do to beat out Brock?" Is simple, he needs to start by beating out Darnold. Once he does that, then you can have a convo regarding how can he beat out Brock.

only way Lance is seeing the field before Brock as the starter is if an injury/setback happens to Brock.

otherwise, it's just not going to happen. Lol

Another one...SD asked a good question and you two just want to stick with the Lance may not even have the QB2 job secured takes.

Then again you were the dude who made the bolded jump above so it checks out.

Well that's what I think when someone says he didn't have kittle/CMC, it's a poor excuse. He still has multiple all pros, pro bowlers, and 1k receiver around him. So it's an excuse.

it would of helped sure, but how much freakin help does he need to play well?

Brock missed games with deebo, he barely had him. That's an all pro, it wouldn't of been an excuse to me as to why he didn't play well.

CMC wasn't even on the team when he has played, so idk his that's even factored in. He still had two quality running backs in Mitchell and/or Wilson - which Mitchell averaged 6 yards when he played with Lance.

it's just a weak excuse. Lol not having an all pro or not having a player who wasn't even on the freakin team, is no excuse when you still have a bunch of excellent players around him.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by tankle104:
Technically we only paid Jimmy $122M 😏. Hahaha that contract really wasn't all that bad. Giving it to him when we did, was a huge risk, but idk how much choice we really had. He was on a huge trajectory up, no one expected him to get hurt.

also, with the way contracts for QBs have skyrocketed since around that time, he was a decent deal, didn't hurt us. It wasn't like he was a bust. Lol he was in the top 8-12 range in the league, typically.

Jimmie's contract also had outs for the team. So rewarding him with that contract isn't as harsh on a team as three first round picks, IMO. Especially when you're still getting quality play from the guy you paid.

the biggest issue with Lance has been his injuries, that's what really has robbed him of his opportunities, not some player/coach. It robbed him of getting more chances to start/play his rookie year (finger & knee) and essentially his entire sophomore year (broken ankle/dislocated).

then another player stepped up and balled. Meanwhile, from numerous reports, the team has been underwhelmed with Trey - which seems to be true based on how they're treating him now.

so it isn't some player/coach that's boned him and didn't give him opportunities, it's his body that's mainly failed him to grow, which was what he needed most cause of his inexperience.

He was never top other than his small stint last year. 2020 and 2021 he was 14-16 range at best. 2019 he had some good games but he was maybe 12th. That isn't franchise qb production. If we give Brock or Trey 40 mil I won't be satisfied with that either. Just like I won't be satisfied with 14th-16th overall going forward from Nick Bosa either. When you pay guys you need them to be elite (Like Kittle and Warner.) Deebo needs to show more this year than he did too.

It's absolutely as harsh because you actually lose a proven commodity like DeForrest Buckner. We MAYBE lost a proven commodity with a draft pick.

If we weren't paying jimmy, we were going to pay Cousins. So we would of probably lost defo anyways. Lol

we weren't going to get great qb play regardless. We would of still had a bad playoff qb regardless.

Originally posted by ninerjok:
Whatever Steve Young said when just recently asked about the upcoming season for the Niners and the QB situation in general, he basically said in a nutshell his advice to Trey would be don't leave here stay right where you are. Fight and scratch and claw your way to somehow get on the field. But you ask yourself how's he supposed to do that? I don't know, who the hell cares. The same thing happened with Steve after a few years being on the team he was ready to say screw it I'm never gonna play here I should go somewhere else. After a chance conversation he had with Steven R. Covey, the motivational speaker and author, he realized he had no other better situation in his football career than still being the backup to Joe Montana. That's not saying Purdy is Montana but it's a similar situation. Anything other people are trying to say about what Trey should do or not do aside of what Steve Young thinks is basically a crock of s**t. Young is spot on he knows from personal experience.

Different circumstances though. Montana was on his way out and has already won a few Super Bowls. Both Purdy and Lance are basically the same age in football years. Gonna be a lot tougher for Lance to pull a Steve Young. And not to mention the salary cap is also working against him, Young didn't have that baggage to carry around either.