Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by DRCHOWDER:
My honest opinion, hes gonna be a bust lol... but I hope I eat hella crow and he wins hella rings.......

anything's possible

Originally posted by maxsmart:

Originally posted by genus49:
Yeah QB has become such a high impact and high price position that if you think you can get a legit starter with top talent then the cost doesn't matter if you actually get that guy.

The trade will be a great one if Lance is a star. If he sucks then it won't matter because it likely means we're going into another rebuild with different coaches and front office shakeups.

True star QB's are worth the price, and always have been.

But if he sucks it will matter because we have SB aspirations now, even with JG starting.

The problem is that the draft is a crap shoot and a gamble, so if you overpay for a player and it doesn't work out then you are screwed.
Trey Lance seems like a great guy and I advocated his drafting, but the Trey Lance trade is definitely a major projection/gamble with such a thin college resume. I will be very impressed and vigorously applaud Shanny-Lynch if they turn out to be right.

It is a major gamble. But I'd say the idea that we are a SB team with Jimmy is loose at best.

- Brady wasn't in the NFC in '19
- We had numerous "good bounces" through the year
- the Saints and Seahawks were beat in the playoffs without requiring us to play them
- GB had no answer for our running attack
- our defense was definitely better than now (our offense may be better)

I'm not saying we didn't deserve to be there, but I am saying it requires a lot of luck and in '19, we had that going for us. I'd say we're a similarly skilled team this year and have a relatively easy schedule. We should be a playoff team barring injuries to Bosa, Warner, Williams, Kittle, Aiyuk, or both Jimmy and Trey. We may even have a shot at the championship.

My point is champions runs require luck too, unless you have a top 5 QB, which we all agree we 'currently' don't have.

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:

Originally posted by DRCHOWDER:
My honest opinion, hes gonna be a bust lol... but I hope I eat hella crow and he wins hella rings.......

anything's possible

I'm curious why someone would think he'll be a bust. I mean only Big Ben and Wilson came into better rookie situations. He seems very bright, talented, grounded, and a hard worker. I honestly think the floor is pretty high. We'll see how good he gets, but it seems unlikely for him to be a bust to me, barring serious injury.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by Rsrkshn:
Given the alternatives on the board, I am excited with the team's final choice. Lance was, I believe the right pick. They swung for the fences which they had to do; for someone who pretty-much most talent evaluators believe is a potentially generational talent. Now we have to wait and see if it pays dividends.

But everything you say is unqualifiedly accurate. Especially the assessment about KS, who is aided and abetted by his crony lapdog GM. I've never liked the hiring of the latter. Kyle is like a kid in a candy store. What a rookie, immature head coach needs is a mature, experienced talent evaluator, negotiator and organizer to provide a steadying influence. Kyle was basically to a brilliant OC with no experience in running an organization. Instead the owner's son hires a stuffed shirt with even less skills in running organizations, negotiating and evaluating talent to provide the guidance; a yes man. To be fair, many of the qualified candidates who were approached turned down the offer; the Niners were in disarray and most of the quality guys didn't want to have anything to do with the place after the Baalke, Tomsula, Kelly debacle.

So now it's amateur's hour. IMO it's not so much WHO they've drafted or acquired even, but HOW they drafted, acquired and compensated them; it's been absolutely cringe-worthy. Without Paraag in the FO managing the finances, the whole operation would be a shambles. As time passes Kyle will eventually assimilate the lessons learned and grow into the complete package. Hopefully, if he's still here, the 49ers will be the ones reaping the benefits.

I'm not sure why you think Lynch has no idea how to evaluate talent. You don't think playing all those years in the NFL and then broadcasting games on TV give him any weight? How do you evaluate talent? Watching it on TV? It's true it's his first time as GM but every GM has a first time. That doesn't mean he can't do the job. They've done an excellent job of not having leaks since this current group took over. That was a real issue with the prior regime. The draft and free agent acquisitions have been pretty god so far. Some misses and some real finds. That's true with most teams. There are probably only a handful of good, experienced GMs and they aren't usually available. When you're successful you tend to stay put. GMs come and go just like coaches in the NFL. There are at least 4 or 5 new ones every year.

It's my opinion. Probably I'm being a little harsh. I am disdainful of poseurs. He did play and broadcast. Wears a suit and tie. Nolan v2. Does that qualify him to be a GM?

I didn't say he had "no idea" how to evaluate talent. I'm sure that he has his own ideas. Just as I'm sure that he leans pretty heavily on the reviews of the scouting department. Peters and others. But he has to be able to filter through what he sees and is being told too. IMO he's weak at doing that. Pretty much what Kyle says goes; what I did say is that he is less talented at evaluating talent than Kyle. Certainly he doesn't have the confidence in his own assessment if he has one. He succumbed to Kyle's wishes on Foster, Williams, Beathard, Pettis. No push back or discussion, it sounded like. All trade ups. The first two were off the team's board (presumably compiled by the scouting department) because of character concerns. He constantly insinuates that he's the big boss, but who is actually running the show? Sure looks and sounds like Kyle and Lynch falls all over himself trying to please him. Kyle could do with better help . . . that's what I'm saying.

When Lynch speaks, I haven't heard anything inciteful. Have you? Totally lacking in gravitas. Smarmy. I don't think he contributes anything substantial. That includes building the roster (as some people are giving him all the credit for doing).

As I said . . . its my read. If people disagree . . . that's fine too. Moving on.

I can't remember the last time I was this excited for training camp. I hope Trey balls the hell out and pushes Jimmy for the starting job.

Originally posted by swoosh6996:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by TheGore49er:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by DASeiler49:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by Sickaa:

Originally posted by 9moon:
.... that's why KS offense is a GIMMICK.... once that initial target is covered, you see our QBs get into trouble..

When I said that he'll be introduced to the league the way Michael Vick was, it meant that he will only be asked to look for THAT target... it has nothing to do with his intelligence, I wasn't insulting THE FUTURE ..

It's far from a gimmick, we Just need a QB who knows how to go through his progressions and read the D. Having protection helps too, Hopefully we get enough of that with our new draft picks.

BUT that's it..... in this offense, KS designs plays that are meant for that initial target to be open that when they are not, the QB are forced to find a target that may not be there ... and if that QB isn't mobile, they end up eating grass.

Unlike other offenses that are design for the QB to read where the ball should go... and this is the reason why JG's skill has regressed..

Worst take I've seen in here in a long time.

danggggg !!! I just caught all KS's fishes, now they all in ONE pond !!!

Stick to dumb nicknames and awful trade ideas. You are clueless when it comes to actual football.

Moon on a mission to embarrass himself in every thread possible. Impressive.

What's new? This guy has been doing this probably before the Webzone was in existence

Someone still reads his posts?

I blocked him 2 years ago.

Actually enjoy reading about football. Not insanity.

Originally posted by NinerBuff:
It is a major gamble. But I'd say the idea that we are a SB team with Jimmy is loose at best.

- Brady wasn't in the NFC in '19
- We had numerous "good bounces" through the year
- the Saints and Seahawks were beat in the playoffs without requiring us to play them
- GB had no answer for our running attack
- our defense was definitely better than now (our offense may be better)

I'm not saying we didn't deserve to be there, but I am saying it requires a lot of luck and in '19, we had that going for us. I'd say we're a similarly skilled team this year and have a relatively easy schedule. We should be a playoff team barring injuries to Bosa, Warner, Williams, Kittle, Aiyuk, or both Jimmy and Trey. We may even have a shot at the championship.

My point is champions runs require luck too, unless you have a top 5 QB, which we all agree we 'currently' don't have.

Ahmm....no

49ers weren't healthy in 2019...Brady is the GOAT but he wasn't beating that 2019 defense.

We had numerous good bounces? What are you talking about? We played one of the toughest schedules while dealing with some of the worst injury situation in the league that year. We completely outplayed Seattle all year long and needed to beat them at their house to even win their division because they coasted and got a cheap win over us with half the team out due to injury, including the kicker who missed a game winner in OT

Who had an answer for our running game when we were healthy and committed to it? KC didn't stop it, we stopped it.

We don't know if our defense was better then or will be next year. It certainly wasn't great in the 2nd half of the season. Losing Buckner and not having Ford is a downgrade. Getting younger players to develop further and having an actually legit corner in Verrett to play with a great DL is another situation.

Overall I'd say our team is definitely better on paper.

Originally posted by maxsmart:

Originally posted by Rsrkshn:

Originally posted by maxsmart:

Originally posted by gold49digger:
Got into a "debate" on Facebook about trey lance. Apparently someone thought that was by far the biggest reach and he has a 5th round grade on him...

That's ridiculous, he's a legit mid first rounder
But trading up to #3 giving up three first rd picks is a hell of a big projection/gamble for a small school 20 y/o QB with only about 300 passes against weak competition. Pat Mahomes and Deshaun Watson played at major big-time schools against great players and had >1200+ passes over 3 full years and went #10 & #12. So it will be considered a major historic reach unless Lance turns out to be excellent. And if he does excel, it will be considered a historically great draft pick trade

Kyle falls in love with players and MUST HAVE THEM!!! He fell in love and traded up to the 3rd for CJ Beathard who was projected in rd 6. He fell in love and traded up to the 4th for Joe Williams who most teams didn't have on their boards. He gets tunnel vision once he falls for a player. Hopefully this time is the charm and he hits the jackpot with Trey Lance.

Given the alternatives on the board, I am excited with the team's final choice. Lance was, I believe the right pick. They swung for the fences which they had to do; for someone who pretty-much most talent evaluators believe is a potentially generational talent. Now we have to wait and see if it pays dividends.

But everything you say is unqualifiedly accurate. Especially the assessment about KS, who is aided and abetted by his crony lapdog GM. I've never liked the hiring of the latter. Kyle is like a kid in a candy store. What a rookie, immature head coach needs is a mature, experienced talent evaluator, negotiator and organizer to provide a steadying influence. Kyle was basically to a brilliant OC with no experience in running an organization. Instead the owner's son hires a stuffed shirt with even less skills in running organizations, negotiating and evaluating talent to provide the guidance; a yes man. To be fair, many of the qualified candidates who were approached turned down the offer; the Niners were in disarray and most of the quality guys didn't want to have anything to do with the place after the Baalke, Tomsula, Kelly debacle.

So now it's amateur's hour. IMO it's not so much WHO they've drafted or acquired even, but HOW they drafted, acquired and compensated them; it's been absolutely cringe-worthy. Without Paraag in the FO managing the finances, the whole operation would be a shambles. As time passes Kyle will eventually assimilate the lessons learned and grow into the complete package. Hopefully, if he's still here, the 49ers will be the ones reaping the benefits.

I agree, they Yorks have done a horrible job for most of their ownership tenure in hiring good management (see list below). They really needed and still need an experienced good John McVay type exec to provide wisdom. But the funny/scary truth is that it's "amateur's hour" almost everywhere nowadays. Just look at our incompetent president, senators and congress critters, news people, teachers, etc. Most are weak, many are idiots, some are downright evil. They get by because they are good liars and BS artists.
Look at our last five GM's. They were all very very poor GM's:
Carmen Policy
Dwight Clark
Terry Donahue
Scot McCloughan
Trent Baalke

And it's like that in throughout many parts of society and on many teams in the NFL. Luckily that should give us a chance to win if we hire the right men. Lynch and Shannahan started out doing poorly in drafting/trading (talent eval and player valuation); but they have improved considerably. They still tend to 'fall in love' and over pay for players they want, but they seem to be learning and hopefully continue to improve. This year should tell a lot.

True, that.
It's a whole different topic, but society here at home sure seems like in a freefall.

This is probably old news, but FWIW . . .

The Falcons were represented at both of Lance's Pro Days, and as Jeremy Fowler of ESPN.com writes, if there was a signal-caller to stop Atlanta from taking Pitts, Lance might have been it (subscription required). A source tells Fowler that Lance thought the Falcons were the club most interested in him, and after the Pro Days, NDSU coaching staff got the sense that Lance would not fall past Atlanta.

Originally posted by genus49:
Ahmm....no

49ers weren't healthy in 2019...Brady is the GOAT but he wasn't beating that 2019 defense.

We had numerous good bounces? What are you talking about? We played one of the toughest schedules while dealing with some of the worst injury situation in the league that year. We completely outplayed Seattle all year long and needed to beat them at their house to even win their division because they coasted and got a cheap win over us with half the team out due to injury, including the kicker who missed a game winner in OT

Who had an answer for our running game when we were healthy and committed to it? KC didn't stop it, we stopped it.

We don't know if our defense was better then or will be next year. It certainly wasn't great in the 2nd half of the season. Losing Buckner and not having Ford is a downgrade. Getting younger players to develop further and having an actually legit corner in Verrett to play with a great DL is another situation.

Overall I'd say our team is definitely better on paper.

Definitely?! I mean, maybe better. Jimmy had a few great games (@ARI, @NO, and @SEA) but overall, he was a better than average QB.

I agree that the second half of the year the defense was injured and not nearly as good as the first half of the season. But still, I can't imagine our defense being as good as '19, in totality. I can imagine our offense being better. Deebo got progressively better through the year, and at this point Aiyuk is better than Sanders and we have him for the whole season. Our O-line should be better as well. I see our running attack as about the same, possibly better but not by much.

Overall, I think we're similar when healthy, but our step back in defense seems more drastic than any potential improvement to our offense. If we're to return to the SB, it'll be because we're getting substantially better play at QB.

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
This is probably old news, but FWIW . . .

While the #49ers took this decision off the table, Trey Lance viewed the #Falcons as the team most interested in him going into the draft https://t.co/Mp2f1BqGvV

— Pro Football Rumors (@pfrumors) May 23, 2021

The Falcons were represented at both of Lance's Pro Days, and as Jeremy Fowler of ESPN.com writes, if there was a signal-caller to stop Atlanta from taking Pitts, Lance might have been it (subscription required). A source tells Fowler that Lance thought the Falcons were the club most interested in him, and after the Pro Days, NDSU coaching staff got the sense that Lance would not fall past Atlanta.

Frank Gore doing dirty bird dance gif here

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
This is probably old news, but FWIW . . .

While the #49ers took this decision off the table, Trey Lance viewed the #Falcons as the team most interested in him going into the draft https://t.co/Mp2f1BqGvV

— Pro Football Rumors (@pfrumors) May 23, 2021

The Falcons were represented at both of Lance's Pro Days, and as Jeremy Fowler of ESPN.com writes, if there was a signal-caller to stop Atlanta from taking Pitts, Lance might have been it (subscription required). A source tells Fowler that Lance thought the Falcons were the club most interested in him, and after the Pro Days, NDSU coaching staff got the sense that Lance would not fall past Atlanta.

Agree, if not the 49ers -- then Atlanta. Trey was too talented to fall to the 12th pick. Mac would probably have been the pick at the 12th position, but for the trade up.

Originally posted by Heroism:
I can't remember the last time I was this excited for training camp. I hope Trey balls the hell out and pushes Jimmy for the starting job.

When you have the arm talent and the intangibles that Trey has, and the fact that he's a young and pretty moldable player, with not many bad habits-- then add to that an offensive wizard as a coach, it can't get any more exciting than that.

If it all works out with Trey, he will be dominating the NFC the way some of our past 49er legends have done in the past.

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:

This is probably old news, but FWIW . . .

While the #49ers took this decision off the table, Trey Lance viewed the #Falcons as the team most interested in him going into the draft https://t.co/Mp2f1BqGvV

— Pro Football Rumors (@pfrumors) May 23, 2021

The Falcons were represented at both of Lance's Pro Days, and as Jeremy Fowler of ESPN.com writes, if there was a signal-caller to stop Atlanta from taking Pitts, Lance might have been it (subscription required). A source tells Fowler that Lance thought the Falcons were the club most interested in him, and after the Pro Days, NDSU coaching staff got the sense that Lance would not fall past Atlanta.

Interesting. So maybe he wasn't a reach after all!

Originally posted by Rsrkshn:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by Rsrkshn:

Given the alternatives on the board, I am excited with the team's final choice. Lance was, I believe the right pick. They swung for the fences which they had to do; for someone who pretty-much most talent evaluators believe is a potentially generational talent. Now we have to wait and see if it pays dividends.

But everything you say is unqualifiedly accurate. Especially the assessment about KS, who is aided and abetted by his crony lapdog GM. I've never liked the hiring of the latter. Kyle is like a kid in a candy store. What a rookie, immature head coach needs is a mature, experienced talent evaluator, negotiator and organizer to provide a steadying influence. Kyle was basically to a brilliant OC with no experience in running an organization. Instead the owner's son hires a stuffed shirt with even less skills in running organizations, negotiating and evaluating talent to provide the guidance; a yes man. To be fair, many of the qualified candidates who were approached turned down the offer; the Niners were in disarray and most of the quality guys didn't want to have anything to do with the place after the Baalke, Tomsula, Kelly debacle.

So now it's amateur's hour. IMO it's not so much WHO they've drafted or acquired even, but HOW they drafted, acquired and compensated them; it's been absolutely cringe-worthy. Without Paraag in the FO managing the finances, the whole operation would be a shambles. As time passes Kyle will eventually assimilate the lessons learned and grow into the complete package. Hopefully, if he's still here, the 49ers will be the ones reaping the benefits.

I'm not sure why you think Lynch has no idea how to evaluate talent. You don't think playing all those years in the NFL and then broadcasting games on TV give him any weight? How do you evaluate talent? Watching it on TV? It's true it's his first time as GM but every GM has a first time. That doesn't mean he can't do the job. They've done an excellent job of not having leaks since this current group took over. That was a real issue with the prior regime. The draft and free agent acquisitions have been pretty god so far. Some misses and some real finds. That's true with most teams. There are probably only a handful of good, experienced GMs and they aren't usually available. When you're successful you tend to stay put. GMs come and go just like coaches in the NFL. There are at least 4 or 5 new ones every year.

It's my opinion. Probably I'm being a little harsh. I am disdainful of poseurs. He did play and broadcast. Wears a suit and tie. Nolan v2. Does that qualify him to be a GM?

I didn't say he had "no idea" how to evaluate talent. I'm sure that he has his own ideas. Just as I'm sure that he leans pretty heavily on the reviews of the scouting department. Peters and others. But he has to be able to filter through what he sees and is being told too. IMO he's weak at doing that. Pretty much what Kyle says goes; what I did say is that he is less talented at evaluating talent than Kyle. Certainly he doesn't have the confidence in his own assessment if he has one. He succumbed to Kyle's wishes on Foster, Williams, Beathard, Pettis. No push back or discussion, it sounded like. All trade ups. The first two were off the team's board (presumably compiled by the scouting department) because of character concerns. He constantly insinuates that he's the big boss, but who is actually running the show? Sure looks and sounds like Kyle and Lynch falls all over himself trying to please him. Kyle could do with better help . . . that's what I'm saying.

When Lynch speaks, I haven't heard anything inciteful. Have you? Totally lacking in gravitas. Smarmy. I don't think he contributes anything substantial. That includes building the roster (as some people are giving him all the credit for doing).

As I said . . . its my read. If people disagree . . . that's fine too. Moving on.

Those are all good points. Lynch's basic personality is a poser, attention seeker, grandstander, empty suit. Not the studious analytic type. Like most good broadcasters, he likes the spotlight, but he's all talk and no substance. It's questionable whether he is competent, but he does seem to be getting better, hopefully. At least he helps do what Kyle wants done. He is smart, so maybe he's getting better? They are lucky to have Parage, & they would be smart to try to hire a wise man like John McVay, etc (or Rsrkshn, mad dog, or me ).