Chicago Bears vs. San Francisco 49ers Rebuilding Plan

Originally posted by genus49:

Kyle and John trading for Jimmy and seeing him carry the team to 5 straight wins with the junk we had last year led to a lot of false hope and probably blinded us to how far away we're still are and honestly if Jimmy is healthy we may be looking at an 8-3 or at least a 6-5 record and we're still in the playoff hunt.

But Pace couldn't afford to build through the draft and needed to make sure Trubisky is babied as much as possible. They hired Nagy to be the HC/OC to help him. They threw big bucks in free agency on Allen, Gabriel and Burton. Then added James Daniels and Anthony Miller in the draft to help the OL and add WR depth.

We're not in the same spot and the team didn't feel the need that they had to surround Jimmy with all this high priced talent to ensure his success because he already showed he can play with inferior talent and produce.

This is precisely why I don't necessarily define the start of a rebuild based on a regime change. You can be rebuilding forever despite changing regimes many times over. IMHO, it starts, or is highlighted the second your FO believes it's found its FQB. That, is precisely why you believe we'd have a similar record as them right now had JG remained healthy and the two extra years Pace got, or who he inherited, really didn't amount to much.

I disagree with the sense of urgency of your last two paragraphs. Pace already aided in securing a top DC and building up a top 10 defense. He didn't have to be the most aggressive and get Mack. It was a choice. Once he hired Nagy, he didn't need to surround a young HC and QB with top notch skill positions. It was a choice as was the acquisition of securing both.

And the second we acquired Garoppolo, we had every license to do the exact same thing, even with many of the same players they secured. They added high talent in coaches and personnel via FA and the draft. We had the same license but are choosing a more long-game approach via the draft and mild player acquisitions approach.

Originally posted by NCommand:
This is precisely why I don't necessarily define the start of a rebuild based on a regime change. You can be rebuilding forever despite changing regimes many times over. IMHO, it starts, or is highlighted the second your FO believes it's found your FQB. That, is precisely why you believe we'd have a similar record as them right now had JG remained healthy and the two extra years Pace got, or who he inherited, really didn't amount to much.

I disagree with the sense of urgency of your last two paragraphs. Pace already aided in securing a top DC and building up a top 10 defense. He didn't have to be the most aggressive and get Mack. It was a choice. Once he hired Nagy, he didn't need to surround a young HC and QB with top notch skill positions. It was a choice as was the acquisition of securing both.

And the second we acquired Garoppolo, we had every license to do the exact same thing, even with many of the same players they secured. They added high talent in coaches and personnel via FA and the draft. We had the same license but are choosing a more long-game approach via the draft and mild player acquisitions approach.

I don't think that's the case though. IMO you have to judge it based on the regime change, specifically the GM assuming they're the ones making the decisions on the roster.

A team can decide to rebuild by rebuilding their whole OL, defense and making sure as much of the foundation is in place before going in on a FQB by keeping stop gaps or journey men QBs. Another team could identify their QB right away and try to build around him but otherwise starting out with a pretty inferior roster.

By definition the GM coming in has a plan for getting the team to winning ways. It started in 2015 with Pace and it started in 2017 with Lynch/Shanny.

Originally posted by genus49:

It started in 2015 with Pace and it started in 2017 with Lynch/Shanny.

I did a side-by-side for that too (Post #219) . Just curious what your thoughts are on that.

PS: FTR I used to define the start of a rebuild the same and on a general level, I do agree.

Remember when Jim Harbaugh and Trent Baalke 'officially' took over? Did the rebuild start then? Of course not.

90% of what they needed to make a playoff run was inherited. Baalke added a couple FA's and got Aldon while Alex was already on the uptick and Harbaugh instituted the culture. But did they really "rebuild" the San Francisco 49ers? Nope...the rebuild actually started 7 years prior, or depending on your definition, the second Alex Smith was drafted.

The owner of the Rams didn't change but look what McVay walked in to. That rebuild started 8 years ago.

Once you get that FQB, s**t gets real (unless you flop on that player).

Originally posted by philosoraptor:
Im not sure this is much of a comparison. A lot of their defensive core came from the prior regime. Leonard floyd, kyle fuller, adrian amos, Eddie Goldman, and Akiem hicks. Some of those guys are probowlers. Plus some of their offensive starters jordan howard, cody whitehair, and kyle long. No doubt the bears have done a very good job, but they started with soooooooo much more to work with. We literally have Buckner, tartt, arik, and staley as starters from that 2016 team. We over turned 80% of our roster. Plus we have lost our qb for the majority of the season. Baalke screwed us so much worse in terms of drafting the the bears prior regime did.

Pace inherited Fuller, Long, and Leno Jr. from the prior regime. The rest of those guys he signed or drafted.

Originally posted by Chibamarines:

Pace inherited Fuller, Long, and Leno Jr. from the prior regime. The rest of those guys he signed or drafted.

The Fangio Effect.

I think a lot of teams will study how the Bears D beat Rams.

Originally posted by NinerGM:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

The point is simple...

BEFORE OUR INJURIES WE LOOKED LIKE THE BETTER ROSTER AND 99% OF THE PEOPLE AGREED WITH THIS BUT NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN THERE ARE CLAIMS THAT CHICAGO BY FAR HAS SUPERIOR TALENT...

WHICH IS IT

But they didn't? The main reason for the enthusiasm was Garoppolo being seen as a far better QB option than Trubisky. And then Garoppolo got injured. Overall their team has better talent and depth, even before they acquired Mack. That is the advantage of having four years to build your roster instead of two.

But again, that extra talent resulted in 3 and 5 wins. It wasn't until they got their FQB and got aggressive in FA that the extra two years of rebuilding talent 'suddenly' hit/mattered.

I understand you are defining the start of a rebuild when a whole regime changes over. I'm cool with that.

I'm just saying theirs simply had no barring in this comparison because we had the same records over those two years and then added a FQB in the same year and had Garoppolo stayed healthy, the records would probably reflect that (whether you believe they had longer to rebuild, are more talented or had more depth).

Thing is Pace made the big trade up for Trubisky. As a GM he knew the move was widely criticized and the only way to defend it or stop people from questioning it is to ensure Trubisky is successful.

With that in mind his rebuild plan was escalated and altered imo. Kyle and John trading for Jimmy and seeing him carry the team to 5 straight wins with the junk we had last year led to a lot of false hope and probably blinded us to how far away we're still are and honestly if Jimmy is healthy we may be looking at an 8-3 or at least a 6-5 record and we're still in the playoff hunt.

But Pace couldn't afford to build through the draft and needed to make sure Trubisky is babied as much as possible. They hired Nagy to be the HC/OC to help him. They threw big bucks in free agency on Allen, Gabriel and Burton. Then added James Daniels and Anthony Miller in the draft to help the OL and add WR depth.

Then the big move to acquire Mack and really cement that already top 10 defense from prior season to another level.

We're not in the same spot and the team didn't feel the need that they had to surround Jimmy with all this high priced talent to ensure his success because he already showed he can play with inferior talent and produce.

Stellar post and dead on about our approach to the team. We went after "pieces" and not playmakers assuming we could let Jimmy carry the load for both long shots in the draft and FA.

Seems to be true. Although I wouldn't agree with the 49ers going all in like how the Rams or even the Bears did in free agency. They are winning because of the D and they have a [b]great[b] defensive coordinator who should get HC interviews, have drafted well on defense AND supplemented that with free agent pickups and great trades.

For the 49ers, we have a great OC, have drafted (Kittle, Breida, Pettis, McGlinchey) some good players, made some great trades (Jimmy G, Goodwin). Now that needs to be supplemented with some good FA signings. Can't count McKinnon yet and all we can say about Richburg is he's better than Kilgore.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:
I think a lot of teams will study how the Bears D beat Rams.

Fangio. Bears D is loaded with studs (like when he was here, Smiths, Bow, Willis, Brooks, etc)...

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Before they went after more studs, they were a top defense - that we beat I might add last season. They turned a corner when they added more this year - like we did when we added Whitner, Rogers, and drafted Aldon. We went from good to great.

Yup that's true...they were hitting on all cylinders with that D last night.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

I think a lot of teams will study how the Bears D beat Rams.

Nothing special. Double Gurley and pressure Goff. Best game plan vs any high scoring offense is to not let them run and get to the QB.

Freezing temperatures stop the best offenses, especially sunny California teams.

NY85, your inbox is full.

Originally posted by RishikeshA:
Freezing temperatures stop the best offenses, especially sunny California teams.

Didn't stop the 88 49ers

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by RishikeshA:

Freezing temperatures stop the best offenses, especially sunny California teams.

Didn't stop the 88 49ers

Bewm!