Marcellus Wiley says NFL culture still has "no tolerance" for homosexuality

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by PTulini:

Originally posted by crzy:
If there can be an active, openly gay or bisexual rugby player who is accepted, then there will eventually be an active, openly gay accepted NFL player or an NBA player.

Someone has to break the barrier. It will happen eventually!

I doubt it. We've only talked about how it would divide a team if they did that. But if they were openly gay can you imagine the harrassment they'd get on the road by opposing fans and opposing players? It's just in their best interest not to flaunt their gayness preference. It's not even like all the other team's fans and players hate gay people, but you know they would harrass that guy just because they'd try to get in his head and want to win. In football you have people injuring eachother intentionally and holding and insulting eachother or doing roids or whatever, just so they can get an edge. You think they wouldn't use the their opponent's homosexuality as a way to get an advantage? Of course they would. They'd be close to ruining their life IMO. And it wouldn't be like how eventually the racism towards black athletes ended, because there wound up being so many of them. No matter what a bunch of gay guys arent ever going to enter the NFL, they'll always be a part of a very small minority.

I think we're all missing the most important reason too. Money. Especially in the NFL were contracts aren't guaranteed. Unless you're camp fodder to begin with I don't think your job is in immediate jeopardy, but let's face once your contract expires or you're cut you're pretty much risking everything financially

I don't think most owners or GM's have a problem with gays, but I do know they have a problem with guys that are radioactive in the locker room. I say this as a fan. I would not want a Niner to come out of the closet. I'm not risking a season for that. You can be gay all you want, and it's none of my business. Just keep it that way.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by PTulini:

Originally posted by crzy:
If there can be an active, openly gay or bisexual rugby player who is accepted, then there will eventually be an active, openly gay accepted NFL player or an NBA player.

Someone has to break the barrier. It will happen eventually!

I doubt it. We've only talked about how it would divide a team if they did that. But if they were openly gay can you imagine the harrassment they'd get on the road by opposing fans and opposing players? It's just in their best interest not to flaunt their gayness preference. It's not even like all the other team's fans and players hate gay people, but you know they would harrass that guy just because they'd try to get in his head and want to win. In football you have people injuring eachother intentionally and holding and insulting eachother or doing roids or whatever, just so they can get an edge. You think they wouldn't use the their opponent's homosexuality as a way to get an advantage? Of course they would. They'd be close to ruining their life IMO. And it wouldn't be like how eventually the racism towards black athletes ended, because there wound up being so many of them. No matter what a bunch of gay guys arent ever going to enter the NFL, they'll always be a part of a very small minority.

I think we're all missing the most important reason too. Money. Especially in the NFL were contracts aren't guaranteed. Unless you're camp fodder to begin with I don't think your job is in immediate jeopardy, but let's face once your contract expires or you're cut you're pretty much risking everything financially

I don't think most owners or GM's have a problem with gays, but I do know they have a problem with guys that are radioactive in the locker room. I say this as a fan. I would not want a Niner to come out of the closet. I'm not risking a season for that. You can be gay all you want, and it's none of my business. Just keep it that way.

That and what if our player starts sleeping with the enemy (Tards, Lambs, Seachickens, Cowgirls)?

Originally posted by blizzuntz:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by PTulini:

Originally posted by crzy:
If there can be an active, openly gay or bisexual rugby player who is accepted, then there will eventually be an active, openly gay accepted NFL player or an NBA player.

Someone has to break the barrier. It will happen eventually!

I doubt it. We've only talked about how it would divide a team if they did that. But if they were openly gay can you imagine the harrassment they'd get on the road by opposing fans and opposing players? It's just in their best interest not to flaunt their gayness preference. It's not even like all the other team's fans and players hate gay people, but you know they would harrass that guy just because they'd try to get in his head and want to win. In football you have people injuring eachother intentionally and holding and insulting eachother or doing roids or whatever, just so they can get an edge. You think they wouldn't use the their opponent's homosexuality as a way to get an advantage? Of course they would. They'd be close to ruining their life IMO. And it wouldn't be like how eventually the racism towards black athletes ended, because there wound up being so many of them. No matter what a bunch of gay guys arent ever going to enter the NFL, they'll always be a part of a very small minority.

I think we're all missing the most important reason too. Money. Especially in the NFL were contracts aren't guaranteed. Unless you're camp fodder to begin with I don't think your job is in immediate jeopardy, but let's face once your contract expires or you're cut you're pretty much risking everything financially

I don't think most owners or GM's have a problem with gays, but I do know they have a problem with guys that are radioactive in the locker room. I say this as a fan. I would not want a Niner to come out of the closet. I'm not risking a season for that. You can be gay all you want, and it's none of my business. Just keep it that way.

That and what if our player starts sleeping with the enemy (Tards, Lambs, Seachickens, Cowgirls)?

Yeah, it would just be a mess for them and a huge distraction for their team. They'd both have a mutual interest to keep it on the DL.

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by PTulini:

Originally posted by phatbutskinny:

Originally posted by PTulini:

Originally posted by kray28:
Hearst got in trouble just a short decade ago for basically saying the same thing in a slightly less diplomatic fashion....he was roasted by the NFL, the media, and the team and forced to apologize.

But the truth is that while the NFL is happy to pay political lip service to the gay community, it has unwritten rules about what basically amounts to a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy when it comes to homosexuals in the locker room.

A certain component of a player's success is political...the coach and your peers have to like you enough to want to play with you. Being gay basically limits that possibility totally and completely. So if you re in fact gay, you better not let them know.

Someone has to break the barrier, man. It was the same for black players at one time too. Someone will eventually!

but homosexuality isnt a race its a choice, thats y they will never break the barrier.

I'm sorry, I respect alot of opinions of other people on the Webzone, but I think it is offensive to society to think that being gay is a choice! I have several friends who I know from when I was in college that are gay. Believe me, it isn't a choice. And no matter what, I support them 100%! Even gays guys have standards. Much like most men, they don't check out everyone.

lol You're acting like they'd be checking out dudes who are playing dungeons and dragons or whatever. There's a big difference between any random person and an extremely fit and most likely tall athlete. Of course they'd check those guys out.

I'm sorry but it's alot easier for you guys to say "well they should be allowed to be openly gay etc. no matter what because they're having to lie about who they are" and then actually being in a lockerroom with people who are acting or maybe actually are gay. Number one its f**king annoying, number two you get paranoid, and number three its rather awkward. You guys aren't the people who have to deal with it.

As far as crzy's comment how they just get changed etc. and get on their way and get out if they're allowed to be gay, isn't that what the closeted homos do NOW? The main difference is your scenario where they do that creeps everyone in the lockerroom out and they cause a distraction for the team vs they can just keep their stuff private and still do what they want anyway! Just because I like girls doesn't mean I go around telling everyone "YEAH I LIKE TITTIES AND VAGINAS, WOOHOO!", is that me "lying" about who I am? No. If you're just doing business your sexual preferences don't need to be broadcast because it only needs to be your business anyway. I don't see how their sexual preferences have anything to do with their career, other than they want to be openly gay so gay people can be even more popular and they can have more attention.

its a good thing that people with your way of seeing things are a dwindling part of the population.

So because I personally wouldn't be comfortable sharing a lockerroom with gays, and I know people that wouldn't, and I don't think professional athletes would, that means that it's a good thing people who agree with me are dying off or not thinking the same way? I thought that people like you were all about accepting EVERYONE even if you disagree with them personally, not just those who agree with you. That's kind of hypocritical IMO.

we have a new winner for the dumbest statement in this thread.

Whatever, tulini even said "cant everyone just get along", and your posts are certainly slanted in that direction. Pretty much you don't like tolerating people who disagree with you, atleast that's how it seems to me. And that's what you are accusing me and other people of doing. It's nearly the same exact thing dude. Just because I don't want gay guys in the shower with me doesn't mean I hate gay people or don't accept them, I just dont want to take a f**king shower with one.

well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

obviously i was being somewhat facetious. but the subtext of my post was that if a bunch of grown men who are accustomed to being naked around other naked grown men have a problem being naked around a particular kind of naked grown man, they obviously aren't completely grown up yet.

again: the "showering with a gay dude" argument is a childish, completely homophobic fear and a red herring. The real reasons why there is "no tolerance" for homosexuality in the NFL has to do with an outdated definition of manhood. A gay guy couldn't possibly be tough enough for the NFL, could he? He's not a "real man." You couldn't count on him in the trenches. Etc. Etc. That's why the first openly gay player is going to have to be one of the best players in the league, to prove that his human nature doesn't affect his ability to play.

Silly, and sad, that such a thing still needs to be proven.

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

obviously i was being somewhat facetious. but the subtext of my post was that if a bunch of grown men who are accustomed to being naked around other naked grown men have a problem being naked around a particular kind of naked grown man, they obviously aren't completely grown up yet.

again: the "showering with a gay dude" argument is a childish, completely homophobic fear and a red herring. The real reasons why there is "no tolerance" for homosexuality in the NFL has to do with an outdated definition of manhood. A gay guy couldn't possibly be tough enough for the NFL, could he? He's not a "real man." You couldn't count on him in the trenches. Etc. Etc. That's why the first openly gay player is going to have to be one of the best players in the league, to prove that his human nature doesn't affect his ability to play.

Silly, and sad, that such a thing still needs to be proven.

haha what? This has nothing to do with being childish or gay people being a "real man" or them having to prove thmeselves, I'd be surprsed if you ever played a varsity/collegiate sport, you simply cannot relate. I'm over this conversation

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

obviously i was being somewhat facetious. but the subtext of my post was that if a bunch of grown men who are accustomed to being naked around other naked grown men have a problem being naked around a particular kind of naked grown man, they obviously aren't completely grown up yet.

again: the "showering with a gay dude" argument is a childish, completely homophobic fear and a red herring. The real reasons why there is "no tolerance" for homosexuality in the NFL has to do with an outdated definition of manhood. A gay guy couldn't possibly be tough enough for the NFL, could he? He's not a "real man." You couldn't count on him in the trenches. Etc. Etc. That's why the first openly gay player is going to have to be one of the best players in the league, to prove that his human nature doesn't affect his ability to play.

Silly, and sad, that such a thing still needs to be proven.

haha what? This has nothing to do with being childish or gay people being a "real man" or them having to prove thmeselves, I'd be surprsed if you ever played a varsity/collegiate sport, you simply cannot relate. I'm over this conversation

its okay, you'll grow up someday.

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

obviously i was being somewhat facetious. but the subtext of my post was that if a bunch of grown men who are accustomed to being naked around other naked grown men have a problem being naked around a particular kind of naked grown man, they obviously aren't completely grown up yet.

again: the "showering with a gay dude" argument is a childish, completely homophobic fear and a red herring. The real reasons why there is "no tolerance" for homosexuality in the NFL has to do with an outdated definition of manhood. A gay guy couldn't possibly be tough enough for the NFL, could he? He's not a "real man." You couldn't count on him in the trenches. Etc. Etc. That's why the first openly gay player is going to have to be one of the best players in the league, to prove that his human nature doesn't affect his ability to play.

Silly, and sad, that such a thing still needs to be proven.

haha what? This has nothing to do with being childish or gay people being a "real man" or them having to prove thmeselves, I'd be surprsed if you ever played a varsity/collegiate sport, you simply cannot relate. I'm over this conversation

its okay, you'll grow up someday.

totally

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

obviously i was being somewhat facetious. but the subtext of my post was that if a bunch of grown men who are accustomed to being naked around other naked grown men have a problem being naked around a particular kind of naked grown man, they obviously aren't completely grown up yet.

again: the "showering with a gay dude" argument is a childish, completely homophobic fear and a red herring. The real reasons why there is "no tolerance" for homosexuality in the NFL has to do with an outdated definition of manhood. A gay guy couldn't possibly be tough enough for the NFL, could he? He's not a "real man." You couldn't count on him in the trenches. Etc. Etc. That's why the first openly gay player is going to have to be one of the best players in the league, to prove that his human nature doesn't affect his ability to play.

Silly, and sad, that such a thing still needs to be proven.

haha what? This has nothing to do with being childish or gay people being a "real man" or them having to prove thmeselves, I'd be surprsed if you ever played a varsity/collegiate sport, you simply cannot relate. I'm over this conversation

its okay, you'll grow up someday.

totally

I don't see how it's an issue of growing up. Some people simply aren't comfortable being naked around people of the same gender who are attracted to them. It's that f'ing simple. Just because it's a bunch of guys showering off doesn't mean its gay, because none of them are thinking of eachother that way. I mean damn, they gotta get clean somewhere. Gay players would atleast have to have their own shower or something.

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by DynastyChile:

Originally posted by HessianDud:


well, you don't know me, and I doubt you even know "people like me." I never said you had to "tolerate" anything you don't want to, and I don't think you can force anyone to "just get along." But I think everyone should have the same right and freedom to live their life and pursue their choices without someone's else's intolerance getting in the way.

lol im intolerant because I would feel awkward if there was a gay dude showering next to me every day? comon, your arguments are losing their "equal opportunity for everyone" pull. Just accept the fact that 52 dudes knowing 1 dude is gay would be awkward in a locker room.

oh, i can accept that, i understand that that is "the culture" of the NFL, i just think its ludicrous and irrational to think/feel that, and I think anyone excusing that behavior is equally immature, homophobic, and behind the times.

its not about "equal opportunity", its about the NFL and its players growing up and realizing that they are one of the few workplace environments in this country where that kind of thinking is allowed to persist.

Im sorry, how many other workplaces do you shower/ get naked and interact in the sort of manner/ like a football locker room? Do you do that at your job with all of your male employees?

you make a good point: NFL players shower with other guys all the time. Its already the gayest workplace in the country. What difference does it make if someone is actually gay?

you do know what being gay means, right?

obviously i was being somewhat facetious. but the subtext of my post was that if a bunch of grown men who are accustomed to being naked around other naked grown men have a problem being naked around a particular kind of naked grown man, they obviously aren't completely grown up yet.

again: the "showering with a gay dude" argument is a childish, completely homophobic fear and a red herring. The real reasons why there is "no tolerance" for homosexuality in the NFL has to do with an outdated definition of manhood. A gay guy couldn't possibly be tough enough for the NFL, could he? He's not a "real man." You couldn't count on him in the trenches. Etc. Etc. That's why the first openly gay player is going to have to be one of the best players in the league, to prove that his human nature doesn't affect his ability to play.

Silly, and sad, that such a thing still needs to be proven.

haha what? This has nothing to do with being childish or gay people being a "real man" or them having to prove thmeselves, I'd be surprsed if you ever played a varsity/collegiate sport, you simply cannot relate. I'm over this conversation

its okay, you'll grow up someday.

totally

I don't see how it's an issue of growing up. Some people simply aren't comfortable being naked around people of the same gender who are attracted to them. It's that f'ing simple. Just because it's a bunch of guys showering off doesn't mean its gay, because none of them are thinking of eachother that way. I mean damn, they gotta get clean somewhere. Gay players would atleast have to have their own shower or something.

just because a guy is gay doesn't mean he is attracted to every man he sees and can't control his sexual advances/appetites. to think the opposite is a naive and immature--childish--way of seeing homosexuals.

Originally posted by MoistButtCheeks:

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
I think there is plenty of tolerance for a homosexual to play the game.

There is zero tolerance when it comes to a gay person in the LOCKER ROOM. I play adult league hockey every week and I would just consider it to be completely rude for a gay person to dress in the same locker room as me. Go get dressed in the bathroom or in your own locker room and meet us out on the ice. Just like I wouldn't consider it appropriate for a female hockey player to dress in our locker room.

why would it be "rude" to get dressed in the locker room? That's where people get dressed, no?

I guess I kinda see SDN point... But I could care less who's washing their ass around me. Unless dude starts asking me to wash his back. Then we might have an issue.

Hessian, would it be rude for me to be in a women's locker room at the gym?