2024 Draft Class: DB

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:

Originally posted by scooterhd:

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
Ya, team captain kind of character, ball skills, aggressive, and versatile. Exactly what this team looks for. I love Hufanga, but if the safety market has a bounce back next year, I'm not allocating a large cap hit to the position.

But in DeJean, you'd be allocating draft capital to the position, and then if he performs above or beyond expectation as you want, then youd be setting yourself to allocate a large cap hit to the position in the future.

By the end of his 5 year rookie deal, Fred Warner is gone. DeJean becomes the new high paid defensive "eraser."

Originally posted by NYniner85:
I get Jimmie Ward vibes from him. I don't think he's as versatile as Jimmie was (he's not playing CB on the outside ever) but I think he can play FS/nickel for SF. I like that in a DB. Also read how his teammates love him and would run through a wall for this kid. That s**t matters.

Exactly the same comp I have for him and I loved some Jimmie Ward. Defended that guy so many times here; people didn't truly appreciate him until later. Like I always said to them, you HAVE to watch the All-22 for DB evaluation.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
By the end of his 5 year rookie deal, Fred Warner is gone

I expect Fred to play deep into his 30s.

Originally posted by Heroism:

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
By the end of his 5 year rookie deal, Fred Warner is gone

I expect Fred to play deep into his 30s.

Possibly, but if he's a niner lifer, I wouldn't expect the team to allocate a large % of the cap to a 33+ year old line backer.

Basically, what I'm getting at is, if I'm GM, I am not of the opinion that we are currently in a position to set the market at safety; sorry Hufanga. In 5 years, we might be. I want a game wrecker at all levels of the defense...1 game wrecker at DE, 1 game wrecker at DT, 1 shut down CB and 1 defensive eraser (like an offensive weapon, but on defense) at either linebacker OR safety. That's 4 top contracts. Rest of the pieces are filled with affordable key veterans or productive rookie contracts.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
Possibly, but if he's a niner lifer, I wouldn't expect the team to allocate a large % of the cap to a 33+ year old line backer.

Basically, what I'm getting at is, if I'm GM, I am not of the opinion that we are currently in a position to set the market at safety; sorry Hufanga. In 5 years, we might be. I want a game wrecker at all levels of the defense...1 game wrecker at DE, 1 game wrecker at DT, 1 shut down CB and 1 defensive eraser (like an offensive weapon, but on defense) at either linebacker OR safety. That's 4 top contracts. Rest of the pieces are filled with affordable key veterans or productive rookie contracts.

Wait you think Cooper is some defensive eraser? I don't get the Warner stuff either. Cooper isn't LBer at all. I can see a S in his future, which imo is not something you're using a 1st on.

go get a DTD in the mid rds to be that FS guy that you can use as a nickel.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
Possibly, but if he's a niner lifer, I wouldn't expect the team to allocate a large % of the cap to a 33+ year old line backer.

Basically, what I'm getting at is, if I'm GM, I am not of the opinion that we are currently in a position to set the market at safety; sorry Hufanga. In 5 years, we might be. I want a game wrecker at all levels of the defense...1 game wrecker at DE, 1 game wrecker at DT, 1 shut down CB and 1 defensive eraser (like an offensive weapon, but on defense) at either linebacker OR safety. That's 4 top contracts. Rest of the pieces are filled with affordable key veterans or productive rookie contracts.

Wait you think Cooper is some defensive eraser? I don't get the Warner stuff either. Cooper isn't LBer at all. I can see a S in his future, which imo is not something you're using a 1st on.

go get a DTD in the mid rds to be that FS guy that you can use as a nickel.

I personally am high on Cooper DeJean, but I was originally responding to Scooter's reply to me. I was responding to you about Dadrion, and expressed my desire to draft him to be ready to move on from Hufanga (if the safety market is revived) because I wouldn't want to spend big money on a safety. He responded what about if we drafted Cooper DeJean, would I draft him with no intention of ever extending him, and I responded that by the time his rookie contract is up, if he was special enough to warrant an extension, the cap situation would be different.

I am not as steadfast on positional value as you are, though i think it is a tie breaker. In most instances, the less valuable position would need to be a whole tier higher as a prospect, ie I'd take a high tier 2 OT over a low tier 1 OG, but a low tier 1 OG over a low tier 2/high tier 3 OT. This will vary depending on context from year to year.

From a team building perspective, I think a team should aim to have at least one defensive eraser, warranting of a sizeable cap hit. This defensive eraser can be at safety OR linebacker. I want more than one, but the other better be on a rookie deal. A shutdown CB, gamewrecking DE and game wrecking DT are the other large cap hits on defense. I'm not advocating to remove Fred Warner. Only suggesting that by the time he is 33, he is unlikely to be using up such a large percentage of our cap, prohibiting a position resetting salary for a different player.

DTD is someone I hope is available in the 3rd or 4th.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
I personally am high on Cooper DeJean, but I was originally responding to Scooter's reply to me. I was responding to you about Dadrion, and expressed my desire to draft him to be ready to move on from Hufanga (if the safety market is revived) because I wouldn't want to spend big money on a safety. He responded what about if we drafted Cooper DeJean, would I draft him with no intention of ever extending him, and I responded that by the time his rookie contract is up, if he was special enough to warrant an extension, the cap situation would be different.

I am not as steadfast on positional value as you are, though i think it is a tie breaker. In most instances, the less valuable position would need to be a whole tier higher as a prospect, ie I'd take a high tier 2 OT over a low tier 1 OG, but a low tier 1 OG over a low tier 2/high tier 3 OT. This will vary depending on context from year to year.

From a team building perspective, I think a team should aim to have at least one defensive eraser, warranting of a sizeable cap hit. This defensive eraser can be at safety OR linebacker. I want more than one, but the other better be on a rookie deal. A shutdown CB, gamewrecking DE and game wrecking DT are the other large cap hits on defense. I'm not advocating to remove Fred Warner. Only suggesting that by the time he is 33, he is unlikely to be using up such a large percentage of our cap, prohibiting a position resetting salary for a different player.

DTD is someone I hope is available in the 3rd or 4th.

That's fair. We all got opinions. Having a plan of converting a guy (who didn't play it in college) to something vastly less important and using a 1st rd pick. Yucky. Too each their own, I'm not gonna argue with every single person about it over & over lol

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
I personally am high on Cooper DeJean

What's your take on him fitting the 49ers?

Based solely on his highlights....
I will say the guy seems to process movement at a pretty high level, and that goes hand in hand with his short yardage movement. He makes a ton of plays, in traffic...10 or so yards around himself. The dude has really good start/stop timing. He seems to take great angles and arrive when the balll does.

I don't think you can teach what he does.

Dude would be a pretty bad ass Tampa 2 CB prospect maybe..... I really don't know if that is an ideal candidate to say...hey dude...go take 1/3rd of the field and defend it at depth.

Seems the majority of his value is to keep the play infront of him, with the QB and ball in his sight line, to use his start and stop ability. I think the minute you have him turn his back to chase a play...you loose most of the stuff he appears great at.

I would be curious to get your take on him as a guy that is high on him...I have only seen a few highlight reels...dude looks promising...I dont think he fits the 49ers really well...but dude seems talented. .

Wow, somebody thinks that a defensive Eraser is only a LB……..

I won't even get into this one

Originally posted by Dshearn:
What's your take on him fitting the 49ers?

Based solely on his highlights....
I will say the guy seems to process movement at a pretty high level, and that goes hand in hand with his short yardage movement. He makes a ton of plays, in traffic...10 or so yards around himself. The dude has really good start/stop timing. He seems to take great angles and arrive when the balll does.

I don't think you can teach what he does.

Dude would be a pretty bad ass Tampa 2 CB prospect maybe..... I really don't know if that is an ideal candidate to say...hey dude...go take 1/3rd of the field and defend it at depth.

Seems the majority of his value is to keep the play infront of him, with the QB and ball in his sight line, to use his start and stop ability. I think the minute you have him turn his back to chase a play...you loose most of the stuff he appears great at.

I would be curious to get your take on him as a guy that is high on him...I have only seen a few highlight reels...dude looks promising...I dont think he fits the 49ers really well...but dude seems talented. .

I think he can handle bump and run coverage, but that wouldnt accentuate his skill set. I'd use him like a Minkah Fitzpatrick. The same way we talk about offensive prospects like Malachi Corley or Brock Bowers needing a specific OC willing to be less rigid and maximize their skill set, the same should be said for DeJean and DC. His responsibility may be different from game to game.

Originally posted by 49ers808:
Wow, somebody thinks that a defensive Eraser is only a LB……..

I won't even get into this one

Well well well I'm apparently not the only one

Great 49ers gift ideas ⇨
Defensive eraser 😂 sounds like a position someone made up because they don't want to just call him a safety.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by 49ers808:
Wow, somebody thinks that a defensive Eraser is only a LB……..

I won't even get into this one

Well well well I'm apparently not the only one

"I think a lot of teams see him as a safety…he's a little stiff…he struggles a bit…"@GregCosell has concerns about Iowa CB Cooper DeJean: pic.twitter.com/B4WNnHGrPF

— Ross Tucker Podcast (@RossTuckerPod) April 14, 2024

Defensive eraser 😂 sounds like a position someone made up because they don't want to just call him a safety.

The term defensive eraser is just used to describe a player on defense who can be asked to do many different things. Fred Warner qualifies. Minkah Fitzpatrick qualifies. It's no different then calling Deebo or Juszczyk an offensive weapon. If a vanilla play caller just lined up Deebo out wide or Juice as a lead blocker all game long, they'd be doing their teams a major disservice.

If DeJean is allowed the freedom to roam around the field his eyes toward the QB, offenses have to account for his location on every play.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
The term defensive eraser is just used to describe a player on defense who can be asked to do many different things. Fred Warner qualifies. Minkah Fitzpatrick qualifies. It's no different then calling Deebo or Juszczyk an offensive weapon. If a vanilla play caller just lined up Deebo out wide or Juice as a lead blocker all game long, they'd be doing their teams a major disservice.

If DeJean is allowed the freedom to roam around the field his eyes toward the QB, offenses have to account for his location on every play.

How about Isaiah Simmons? I remember folks calling him a defensive weapon all the same…cooper will more than likely have to transition to S to see his best play. That's what he is and your last comment basically backs that up. Doesn't mean that he's bad or whatever, just call him a safety.

dude is not as twitchy as Minkah.

My kid brain wants Kool-Aid so bad

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:
The term defensive eraser is just used to describe a player on defense who can be asked to do many different things. Fred Warner qualifies. Minkah Fitzpatrick qualifies. It's no different then calling Deebo or Juszczyk an offensive weapon. If a vanilla play caller just lined up Deebo out wide or Juice as a lead blocker all game long, they'd be doing their teams a major disservice.

If DeJean is allowed the freedom to roam around the field his eyes toward the QB, offenses have to account for his location on every play.

How about Isaiah Simmons? I remember folks calling him a defensive weapon all the same…cooper will more than likely have to transition to S to see his best play. That's what he is and your last comment basically backs that up. Doesn't mean that he's bad or whatever, just call him a safety.

dude is not as twitchy as Minkah.

Oh, I thought it was clear that, in the original context of the discussion - which again, actually centered around hufanga's / safety contracts and not Cooper DeJean specifically - that DeJean was being regarded as a safety.

Isaiah Simmons was a miss, it happens. But he was more elite athlete that you were trying to find a position for. I view DeJean more as a high end football player that you are taking advantage of his athleticism and tools. DeJean is far superior as a prospect in football IQ, run support and ball production than Simmons was. I get the comparison with regards of "think of all the mismatches these players can create," but the comparison ends there, for me.