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MadDog49er 2019 NFLDraft Niners Review

  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 18,570
Originally posted by zonkers:
Fair point.
Scouts and coaches watch the same tape fans watch, so the production (or lack thereof) is transparent.
But, they do get some more face time with the players and have more control over how they are used.

I don't think that's correct. I've read around and in order to get access to all22 college tape, you have to be connected within circles to get all the games.
Matt Maiocco interviewed an old scout on his most recent podcast. He's been in the game for 35 years and has hundreds of scout connections over the years...polls them all on 500 players a year and gets details.

Bobb McGinn

He went through our picks and the poll results and added feedback thoughts.

Overall, he said "I guess it's an OK draft."
[ Edited by NCommand on May 2, 2019 at 3:48 PM ]
Though I didn't agree with the draft in its entirety, I've yet to see a bad draft grade for it and most high marks from draft insiders.
Well, for a guy who is amazed at every draft i still have a 100% record of having no idea what is coming.. A large "well done" to JL for not doing the Reuben thing and trading down to get that extra player, in round 1, because the magnetic draw to do that must have been substantial. But back to basics, when you got the one blue chipper of the draft, or 1 of the 2 or 3, then you MAKE that pick. Surely there was a lot of talk about turning Bosa into two picks. AGain, well done, John.

That pick alone , a true Buckner like pick, makes this draft at least a B draft. Maybe a B- but none the less, a B draft. So scorched by last yrs no 2nd rd pick, i correctly guessed we would trade up into rd 2 ....and dam if we didn't. I could see that OG or OG/C being right there. Right in the middle of the OL protecting our FRANCHISE. And then... up pops Pettis. Welp, no OL in the 2nd in 2018. I kinda lost my focus after that not believing we wouldn't be getting an OL in rd 2...adn our next pick at #66 was after all OL starters were gone. Couldn't tell you much of what happened after that. /

So 2019, 1st rd, our guys did the right thing....and it wasn't easy....to take Bosa, BANG. We did. Now for the OG , Risner, that our OL had to have...still after last yrs. el foldo. Deebo? DEEEBBBOOOO? You gotta be kiddding me. No S, no OG, starter and we take dEEEEBO? Like last yr, after that I lost my focus and interest, not believing they would leave a $137 mil man out there at Qb, unprotected. 126 hits. 115 hits on our QBs the yr before. Could this really be happening? Shucks, still got an early 3rd and Sonof....Hurd...WHAT? After that i put the sound off and took a hike. Couldn't bring myself to see anymore and preferred to read about it.

Looks to me like we got 3 starters with Whisnoswhatshisname, altho technically we didn't have need for another #2 and #3 WR. That is doubles. I get it, we need someone who can get open before 2 seconds, the max this line can give to JImmyG. Certainly we could do better with starting OGs, and we have neither. But once again, we get aced out...or i did and i think the team did. Not my team tho so kyle makes the moves. I sure hope this works because if not, we are back in 2017...not 2018 but 2 yrs ago on pass pro.

so we get a punter in rd 4...surprise but iif as good as stated, fine... a starter is a starter. And we got Bosa. So a B- draft. I hope the WRs work out because if not, we don't have near enough QBs to make it thru the season. And i learned that guessing what kyle is going to do is pointless. He marches to his own drum. Dang i hope he is right and Deebo and Hurd are open every play. If not, I won't be a spoil sport and continue to remind everyone about it. I'll pull for them all.

But MD, how on earth you can do this massive amount of work yr in yr out, just amazes me. I must be triply troubling to someone like you who has such a great feel for this. Me? I'm just a shclocker who doesn't know beans about the intricacies of drafting. Great job man. I admire good, well thot out work.
[ Edited by pasodoc9er on May 2, 2019 at 11:49 PM ]
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Well, for a guy who is amazed at every draft i still have a 100% record of having no idea what is coming.. A large "well done" to JL for not doing the Reuben thing and trading down to get that extra player, in round 1, because the magnetic draw to do that must have been substantial. But back to basics, when you got the one blue chipper of the draft, or 1 of the 2 or 3, then you MAKE that pick. Surely there was a lot of talk about turning Bosa into two picks. AGain, well done, John.

That pick alone , a true Buckner like pick, makes this draft at least a B draft. Maybe a B- but none the less, a B draft. So scorched by last yrs no 2nd rd pick, i correctly guessed we would trade up into rd 2 ....and dam if we didn't. I could see that OG or OG/C being right there. Right in the middle of the OL protecting our FRANCHISE. And then... up pops Pettis. Welp, no OL in the 2nd in 2018. I kinda lost my focus after that not believing we wouldn't be getting an OL in rd 2...adn our next pick at #66 was after all OL starters were gone. Couldn't tell you much of what happened after that. /

So 2019, 1st rd, our guys did the right thing....and it wasn't easy....to take Bosa, BANG. We did. Now for the OG , Risner, that our OL had to have...still after last yrs. el foldo. Deebo? DEEEBBBOOOO? You gotta be kiddding me. No S, no OG, starter and we take dEEEEBO? Like last yr, after that I lost my focus and interest, not believing they would leave a $137 mil man out there at Qb, unprotected. 126 hits. 115 hits on our QBs the yr before. Could this really be happening? Shucks, still got an early 3rd and Sonof....Hurd...WHAT? After that i put the sound off and took a hike. Couldn't bring myself to see anymore and preferred to read about it.

Looks to me like we got 3 starters with Whisnoswhatshisname, altho technically we didn't have need for another #2 and #3 WR. That is doubles. I get it, we need someone who can get open before 2 seconds, the max this line can give to JImmyG. Certainly we could do better with starting OGs, and we have neither. But once again, we get aced out...or i did and i think the team did. Not my team tho so kyle makes the moves. I sure hope this works because if not, we are back in 2017...not 2018 but 2 yrs ago on pass pro.

so we get a punter in rd 4...surprise but iif as good as stated, fine... a starter is a starter. And we got Bosa. So a B- draft. I hope the WRs work out because if not, we don't have near enough QBs to make it thru the season. And i learned that guessing what kyle is going to do is pointless. He marches to his own drum. Dang i hope he is right and Deebo and Hurd are open every play. If not, I won't be a spoil sport and continue to remind everyone about it. I'll pull for them all.

But MD, how on earth you can do this massive amount of work yr in yr out, just amazes me. I must be triply troubling to someone like you who has such a great feel for this. Me? I'm just a shclocker who doesn't know beans about the intricacies of drafting. Great job man. I admire good, well thot out work.

Good to hear from you, brother. I think you hit it right with three starter (Bosa, Samuel, and Wishnowsky).

It is quite a journey each year. Lots of 4AM mornings or late, late nights. I try to make an honest evaluation of 400 players each year by watching at least 6 games each (for the top players I want to watch at least 9-12 games). I think a lot of "experts" shortcut the process, or attach themselves to groupthink (Ex: most experts thought Mack Wilson was a top 5 graded LB, and I had him as 5th round value...he just isn't that good).

I am really excited about this next year's group. Should be some really good DL again and the Secondary should be strong. Fun group of WRs to follow.

And, people are delusional if they think Tua is going number one. His arm strength is a huge question mark at the next level. There simply is not enough juice on the ball. Herbert is the guy to watch. The ball comes off their hands radically different.
Originally posted by Scottie15:
Many other teams may not have needed a wide receiver. Fact is, only 2 other receivers were taken ahead of Deebo, when most projections had Deebo somewhere near #7 ranked.

And you completely missed the point. AJ Brown was a much more productive receiver in college than Deebo was. And it's not even close.


There are a lot of factors that go into drafting (or not drafting) a guy. Collegiate production is one. However, for a WR, one has to take into account the quality of the QB play, the overall offense and offensive system around the player, and the quality of the coaching, and the conference the player played in, just to name a few.
Look at Kittle. He hardly caught any passes in college and then he comes to the pros and become an absolute stud while running after the catch. The sheer number of factors that go into success or failure in the pros is why the draft is such an inexact science and why it is so difficult to assess how a college player is going to do professionally. To me, one of the biggest factors is mental toughness, which of course, has nothing to do with physical talent, but often separates the pro bowlers from the guys that get cut. That, and a player's love for the game are two factors that the Niners value very highly and that is why to us, their draft choices don't seem to make sense.

Cheers!
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Well, for a guy who is amazed at every draft i still have a 100% record of having no idea what is coming.. A large "well done" to JL for not doing the Reuben thing and trading down to get that extra player, in round 1, because the magnetic draw to do that must have been substantial. But back to basics, when you got the one blue chipper of the draft, or 1 of the 2 or 3, then you MAKE that pick. Surely there was a lot of talk about turning Bosa into two picks. AGain, well done, John.

That pick alone , a true Buckner like pick, makes this draft at least a B draft. Maybe a B- but none the less, a B draft. So scorched by last yrs no 2nd rd pick, i correctly guessed we would trade up into rd 2 ....and dam if we didn't. I could see that OG or OG/C being right there. Right in the middle of the OL protecting our FRANCHISE. And then... up pops Pettis. Welp, no OL in the 2nd in 2018. I kinda lost my focus after that not believing we wouldn't be getting an OL in rd 2...adn our next pick at #66 was after all OL starters were gone. Couldn't tell you much of what happened after that. /

So 2019, 1st rd, our guys did the right thing....and it wasn't easy....to take Bosa, BANG. We did. Now for the OG , Risner, that our OL had to have...still after last yrs. el foldo. Deebo? DEEEBBBOOOO? You gotta be kiddding me. No S, no OG, starter and we take dEEEEBO? Like last yr, after that I lost my focus and interest, not believing they would leave a $137 mil man out there at Qb, unprotected. 126 hits. 115 hits on our QBs the yr before. Could this really be happening? Shucks, still got an early 3rd and Sonof....Hurd...WHAT? After that i put the sound off and took a hike. Couldn't bring myself to see anymore and preferred to read about it.

Looks to me like we got 3 starters with Whisnoswhatshisname, altho technically we didn't have need for another #2 and #3 WR. That is doubles. I get it, we need someone who can get open before 2 seconds, the max this line can give to JImmyG. Certainly we could do better with starting OGs, and we have neither. But once again, we get aced out...or i did and i think the team did. Not my team tho so kyle makes the moves. I sure hope this works because if not, we are back in 2017...not 2018 but 2 yrs ago on pass pro.

so we get a punter in rd 4...surprise but iif as good as stated, fine... a starter is a starter. And we got Bosa. So a B- draft. I hope the WRs work out because if not, we don't have near enough QBs to make it thru the season. And i learned that guessing what kyle is going to do is pointless. He marches to his own drum. Dang i hope he is right and Deebo and Hurd are open every play. If not, I won't be a spoil sport and continue to remind everyone about it. I'll pull for them all.

But MD, how on earth you can do this massive amount of work yr in yr out, just amazes me. I must be triply troubling to someone like you who has such a great feel for this. Me? I'm just a shclocker who doesn't know beans about the intricacies of drafting. Great job man. I admire good, well thot out work.

Good to hear from you, brother. I think you hit it right with three starter (Bosa, Samuel, and Wishnowsky).

It is quite a journey each year. Lots of 4AM mornings or late, late nights. I try to make an honest evaluation of 400 players each year by watching at least 6 games each (for the top players I want to watch at least 9-12 games). I think a lot of "experts" shortcut the process, or attach themselves to groupthink (Ex: most experts thought Mack Wilson was a top 5 graded LB, and I had him as 5th round value...he just isn't that good).

I am really excited about this next year's group. Should be some really good DL again and the Secondary should be strong. Fun group of WRs to follow.

And, people are delusional if they think Tua is going number one. His arm strength is a huge question mark at the next level. There simply is not enough juice on the ball. Herbert is the guy to watch. The ball comes off their hands radically different.
I agree. I am sure I will get ripped for saying this but he kind of reminds me of Matt Leinart. Great college QB surrounded by tremendous athletes but with a lack of arm strength could struggle in the NFL. He is a better athlete though.
  • jimrat
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 20,352
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Well, for a guy who is amazed at every draft i still have a 100% record of having no idea what is coming.. A large "well done" to JL for not doing the Reuben thing and trading down to get that extra player, in round 1, because the magnetic draw to do that must have been substantial. But back to basics, when you got the one blue chipper of the draft, or 1 of the 2 or 3, then you MAKE that pick. Surely there was a lot of talk about turning Bosa into two picks. AGain, well done, John.

That pick alone , a true Buckner like pick, makes this draft at least a B draft. Maybe a B- but none the less, a B draft. So scorched by last yrs no 2nd rd pick, i correctly guessed we would trade up into rd 2 ....and dam if we didn't. I could see that OG or OG/C being right there. Right in the middle of the OL protecting our FRANCHISE. And then... up pops Pettis. Welp, no OL in the 2nd in 2018. I kinda lost my focus after that not believing we wouldn't be getting an OL in rd 2...adn our next pick at #66 was after all OL starters were gone. Couldn't tell you much of what happened after that. /

So 2019, 1st rd, our guys did the right thing....and it wasn't easy....to take Bosa, BANG. We did. Now for the OG , Risner, that our OL had to have...still after last yrs. el foldo. Deebo? DEEEBBBOOOO? You gotta be kiddding me. No S, no OG, starter and we take dEEEEBO? Like last yr, after that I lost my focus and interest, not believing they would leave a $137 mil man out there at Qb, unprotected. 126 hits. 115 hits on our QBs the yr before. Could this really be happening? Shucks, still got an early 3rd and Sonof....Hurd...WHAT? After that i put the sound off and took a hike. Couldn't bring myself to see anymore and preferred to read about it.

Looks to me like we got 3 starters with Whisnoswhatshisname, altho technically we didn't have need for another #2 and #3 WR. That is doubles. I get it, we need someone who can get open before 2 seconds, the max this line can give to JImmyG. Certainly we could do better with starting OGs, and we have neither. But once again, we get aced out...or i did and i think the team did. Not my team tho so kyle makes the moves. I sure hope this works because if not, we are back in 2017...not 2018 but 2 yrs ago on pass pro.

so we get a punter in rd 4...surprise but iif as good as stated, fine... a starter is a starter. And we got Bosa. So a B- draft. I hope the WRs work out because if not, we don't have near enough QBs to make it thru the season. And i learned that guessing what kyle is going to do is pointless. He marches to his own drum. Dang i hope he is right and Deebo and Hurd are open every play. If not, I won't be a spoil sport and continue to remind everyone about it. I'll pull for them all.

But MD, how on earth you can do this massive amount of work yr in yr out, just amazes me. I must be triply troubling to someone like you who has such a great feel for this. Me? I'm just a shclocker who doesn't know beans about the intricacies of drafting. Great job man. I admire good, well thot out work.

Good to hear from you, brother. I think you hit it right with three starter (Bosa, Samuel, and Wishnowsky).

It is quite a journey each year. Lots of 4AM mornings or late, late nights. I try to make an honest evaluation of 400 players each year by watching at least 6 games each (for the top players I want to watch at least 9-12 games). I think a lot of "experts" shortcut the process, or attach themselves to groupthink (Ex: most experts thought Mack Wilson was a top 5 graded LB, and I had him as 5th round value...he just isn't that good).

I am really excited about this next year's group. Should be some really good DL again and the Secondary should be strong. Fun group of WRs to follow.

And, people are delusional if they think Tua is going number one. His arm strength is a huge question mark at the next level. There simply is not enough juice on the ball. Herbert is the guy to watch. The ball comes off their hands radically different.
I agree. I am sure I will get ripped for saying this but he kind of reminds me of Matt Leinart. Great college QB surrounded by tremendous athletes but with a lack of arm strength could struggle in the NFL. He is a better athlete though.

Spot on Matt Leinart lol
Originally posted by jimrat:
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Well, for a guy who is amazed at every draft i still have a 100% record of having no idea what is coming.. A large "well done" to JL for not doing the Reuben thing and trading down to get that extra player, in round 1, because the magnetic draw to do that must have been substantial. But back to basics, when you got the one blue chipper of the draft, or 1 of the 2 or 3, then you MAKE that pick. Surely there was a lot of talk about turning Bosa into two picks. AGain, well done, John.

That pick alone , a true Buckner like pick, makes this draft at least a B draft. Maybe a B- but none the less, a B draft. So scorched by last yrs no 2nd rd pick, i correctly guessed we would trade up into rd 2 ....and dam if we didn't. I could see that OG or OG/C being right there. Right in the middle of the OL protecting our FRANCHISE. And then... up pops Pettis. Welp, no OL in the 2nd in 2018. I kinda lost my focus after that not believing we wouldn't be getting an OL in rd 2...adn our next pick at #66 was after all OL starters were gone. Couldn't tell you much of what happened after that. /

So 2019, 1st rd, our guys did the right thing....and it wasn't easy....to take Bosa, BANG. We did. Now for the OG , Risner, that our OL had to have...still after last yrs. el foldo. Deebo? DEEEBBBOOOO? You gotta be kiddding me. No S, no OG, starter and we take dEEEEBO? Like last yr, after that I lost my focus and interest, not believing they would leave a $137 mil man out there at Qb, unprotected. 126 hits. 115 hits on our QBs the yr before. Could this really be happening? Shucks, still got an early 3rd and Sonof....Hurd...WHAT? After that i put the sound off and took a hike. Couldn't bring myself to see anymore and preferred to read about it.

Looks to me like we got 3 starters with Whisnoswhatshisname, altho technically we didn't have need for another #2 and #3 WR. That is doubles. I get it, we need someone who can get open before 2 seconds, the max this line can give to JImmyG. Certainly we could do better with starting OGs, and we have neither. But once again, we get aced out...or i did and i think the team did. Not my team tho so kyle makes the moves. I sure hope this works because if not, we are back in 2017...not 2018 but 2 yrs ago on pass pro.

so we get a punter in rd 4...surprise but iif as good as stated, fine... a starter is a starter. And we got Bosa. So a B- draft. I hope the WRs work out because if not, we don't have near enough QBs to make it thru the season. And i learned that guessing what kyle is going to do is pointless. He marches to his own drum. Dang i hope he is right and Deebo and Hurd are open every play. If not, I won't be a spoil sport and continue to remind everyone about it. I'll pull for them all.

But MD, how on earth you can do this massive amount of work yr in yr out, just amazes me. I must be triply troubling to someone like you who has such a great feel for this. Me? I'm just a shclocker who doesn't know beans about the intricacies of drafting. Great job man. I admire good, well thot out work.

Good to hear from you, brother. I think you hit it right with three starter (Bosa, Samuel, and Wishnowsky).

It is quite a journey each year. Lots of 4AM mornings or late, late nights. I try to make an honest evaluation of 400 players each year by watching at least 6 games each (for the top players I want to watch at least 9-12 games). I think a lot of "experts" shortcut the process, or attach themselves to groupthink (Ex: most experts thought Mack Wilson was a top 5 graded LB, and I had him as 5th round value...he just isn't that good).

I am really excited about this next year's group. Should be some really good DL again and the Secondary should be strong. Fun group of WRs to follow.

And, people are delusional if they think Tua is going number one. His arm strength is a huge question mark at the next level. There simply is not enough juice on the ball. Herbert is the guy to watch. The ball comes off their hands radically different.
I agree. I am sure I will get ripped for saying this but he kind of reminds me of Matt Leinart. Great college QB surrounded by tremendous athletes but with a lack of arm strength could struggle in the NFL. He is a better athlete though.

Spot on Matt Leinart lol

Agreed about Tua... Trevor Lawrence tho... that's another story. He's worth tanking for.
Originally posted by Scottie15:
Originally posted by Sourball:
Since all fans obviously know more than NFL front office and scouts, we should petition to have the draft run like American Idol. This way fans have the teams 15 minutes on the clock to call/text in and vote to make their teams draft selection.
Solved
(Not a knock on MadDogs review at all, I look forward to his stuff)

I had about as much NFL front office experience as Lynch when he got hired

This is a discussion forum. People are allowed to have discussions regarding these topics. Besides, there's a reason most analysts, scouts, etc. had these players ranked and projected where they were. These weren't just subjective lists put together with no logic behind them.

"Since all fans obviously know more than NFL front office and scouts..."

This has to be the most annoying line ever. The draft process is an art with a bit of science and luck injected into it. If you walk out of ANY mock or real draft with 3 starters esp. if one is in the upper echelon of his class in NFL talent, you've done a terrific job.

Fans ALL the time end up making better choices than these alleged pro scouts and front offices for this very reason...it's an art.

Anybody with an objective bone in their body could look back at our last three drafts and see, at best, it's been a pretty mediocre job on talent acquisition and poor on value.
[ Edited by NCommand on May 4, 2019 at 7:18 AM ]

Originally posted by KamLeon:
Though I didn't agree with the draft in its entirety, I've yet to see a bad draft grade for it and most high marks from draft insiders.

What's a bad grade when 99% of the grades are between A+ and C?
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by KamLeon:
Though I didn't agree with the draft in its entirety, I've yet to see a bad draft grade for it and most high marks from draft insiders.

What's a bad grade when 99% of the grades are between A+ and C?

Agreed. Grade inflation on steroids with draft grades. Almost everyone gets an A or B. Makes sense. Who wants to anger a huge part of their base?
Originally posted by Waterbear:
Originally posted by jimrat:
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Well, for a guy who is amazed at every draft i still have a 100% record of having no idea what is coming.. A large "well done" to JL for not doing the Reuben thing and trading down to get that extra player, in round 1, because the magnetic draw to do that must have been substantial. But back to basics, when you got the one blue chipper of the draft, or 1 of the 2 or 3, then you MAKE that pick. Surely there was a lot of talk about turning Bosa into two picks. AGain, well done, John.

That pick alone , a true Buckner like pick, makes this draft at least a B draft. Maybe a B- but none the less, a B draft. So scorched by last yrs no 2nd rd pick, i correctly guessed we would trade up into rd 2 ....and dam if we didn't. I could see that OG or OG/C being right there. Right in the middle of the OL protecting our FRANCHISE. And then... up pops Pettis. Welp, no OL in the 2nd in 2018. I kinda lost my focus after that not believing we wouldn't be getting an OL in rd 2...adn our next pick at #66 was after all OL starters were gone. Couldn't tell you much of what happened after that. /

So 2019, 1st rd, our guys did the right thing....and it wasn't easy....to take Bosa, BANG. We did. Now for the OG , Risner, that our OL had to have...still after last yrs. el foldo. Deebo? DEEEBBBOOOO? You gotta be kiddding me. No S, no OG, starter and we take dEEEEBO? Like last yr, after that I lost my focus and interest, not believing they would leave a $137 mil man out there at Qb, unprotected. 126 hits. 115 hits on our QBs the yr before. Could this really be happening? Shucks, still got an early 3rd and Sonof....Hurd...WHAT? After that i put the sound off and took a hike. Couldn't bring myself to see anymore and preferred to read about it.

Looks to me like we got 3 starters with Whisnoswhatshisname, altho technically we didn't have need for another #2 and #3 WR. That is doubles. I get it, we need someone who can get open before 2 seconds, the max this line can give to JImmyG. Certainly we could do better with starting OGs, and we have neither. But once again, we get aced out...or i did and i think the team did. Not my team tho so kyle makes the moves. I sure hope this works because if not, we are back in 2017...not 2018 but 2 yrs ago on pass pro.

so we get a punter in rd 4...surprise but iif as good as stated, fine... a starter is a starter. And we got Bosa. So a B- draft. I hope the WRs work out because if not, we don't have near enough QBs to make it thru the season. And i learned that guessing what kyle is going to do is pointless. He marches to his own drum. Dang i hope he is right and Deebo and Hurd are open every play. If not, I won't be a spoil sport and continue to remind everyone about it. I'll pull for them all.

But MD, how on earth you can do this massive amount of work yr in yr out, just amazes me. I must be triply troubling to someone like you who has such a great feel for this. Me? I'm just a shclocker who doesn't know beans about the intricacies of drafting. Great job man. I admire good, well thot out work.

Good to hear from you, brother. I think you hit it right with three starter (Bosa, Samuel, and Wishnowsky).

It is quite a journey each year. Lots of 4AM mornings or late, late nights. I try to make an honest evaluation of 400 players each year by watching at least 6 games each (for the top players I want to watch at least 9-12 games). I think a lot of "experts" shortcut the process, or attach themselves to groupthink (Ex: most experts thought Mack Wilson was a top 5 graded LB, and I had him as 5th round value...he just isn't that good).

I am really excited about this next year's group. Should be some really good DL again and the Secondary should be strong. Fun group of WRs to follow.

And, people are delusional if they think Tua is going number one. His arm strength is a huge question mark at the next level. There simply is not enough juice on the ball. Herbert is the guy to watch. The ball comes off their hands radically different.
I agree. I am sure I will get ripped for saying this but he kind of reminds me of Matt Leinart. Great college QB surrounded by tremendous athletes but with a lack of arm strength could struggle in the NFL. He is a better athlete though.

Spot on Matt Leinart lol

Agreed about Tua... Trevor Lawrence tho... that's another story. He's worth tanking for.

LOL. You guys s**tting on Tua and yet everyone that does this professionally is saying the exact opposite and saying Miami may be tanking for Tua. Matt Leinart comparison is laughable and lazy. Must be because they both left handed. I heard all this before with all the Zone experts saying Kyler Murray was impossible to go in the 1st, let alone 1st overall. Let's do this again. If Tua is healthy and enters the draft, he's going in the 1st with a high chance of 1st overall.
Originally posted by 49ers808:
LOL. You guys s**tting on Tua and yet everyone that does this professionally is saying the exact opposite and saying Miami may be tanking for Tua. Matt Leinart comparison is laughable and lazy. Must be because they both left handed. I heard all this before with all the Zone experts saying Kyler Murray was impossible to go in the 1st, let alone 1st overall. Let's do this again. If Tua is healthy and enters the draft, he's going in the 1st with a high chance of 1st overall.
Leinart was a top pick and we see how that turned out. Tua simply doesnt have great arm strength. If you think he does you are sadly mistaken. That is what is similar to Leinart. The fact that he is left handed, surrounded by great athletes at big time programs, and over hyped helps with the comparison. Also, no one said he wont go in the 1st round. There are 3 or 4 qbs that go in the first every year. Several of us just dont think he goes 1st and I agree with Maddog that Herbert will go before him.

By the way, you arent from Hawaii are you? You just seem pretty upset about the comments on Tua.
[ Edited by Ninerjohn on May 4, 2019 at 1:12 PM ]
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by 49ers808:
LOL. You guys s**tting on Tua and yet everyone that does this professionally is saying the exact opposite and saying Miami may be tanking for Tua. Matt Leinart comparison is laughable and lazy. Must be because they both left handed. I heard all this before with all the Zone experts saying Kyler Murray was impossible to go in the 1st, let alone 1st overall. Let's do this again. If Tua is healthy and enters the draft, he's going in the 1st with a high chance of 1st overall.
Leinart was a top pick and we see how that turned out. Tua simply doesnt have great arm strength. If you think he does you are sadly mistaken. That is what is similar to Leinart. The fact that he is left handed, surrounded by great athletes at big time programs, and over hyped helps with the comparison. Also, no one said he wont go in the 1st round. There are 3 or 4 qbs that go in the first every year. Several of us just dont think he goes 1st and I agree with Maddog that Herbert will go before him.

By the way, you arent from Hawaii are you? You just seem pretty upset about the comments on Tua.

Lol I am and I can't help the homerism. I root for all the boys from the islands. I just think the arm strength issue is unjustified because anyone who watched Bama play would be hard pressed to prove that when he seemingly dropped 50 yard bombs every game. No denying that he's surrounded by talent, but what has Herbert done to be better? He's the definition of potential based evaluation. Tua came in and won a National Championship as a true freshman and was a frontrunner for the Heisman the majority of this year. He has unique poise for his age and pin point accuracy, 2 traits I'd put above arm strength all day.
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