BPA

1.Myles
2.Allen
3.Trubisky
4.Fournett
5.Barnett
6.Foster
7.Williams
8.Ross
9.Robinson
10.Peppers

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

Originally posted by Sims19849ers:

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

Absolutely not. If Allen is clearly the best player available after Garnett is taken, we should trade down with a team that wants Allen. Probably won't get a ton in return, but it's better than drafting a player you don't need at all (3-4 DE) or taking a player you could have had 2-3 picks later for less money along with getting the extra pick.

Do you think Armstead prevents us from taking an elite talent like Allen? The logic wouldn't be good because of where we foolishly took Armstead two years ago but Allen is BY FAR a better player than AA and it isn't close. I would have zero issues taking Allen and running out Allen, NT (Hopefully Poe or Brandon Williams), and Buckner with AA the first off the bench if Garrett is gone. We need run stopping and pass rushing help on defense in the worst way imaginable and both Allen and Garrett provide that.

Yes I do. Allen is way better than Armstead, but we have too many holes on our roster to start replacing one of our few promising players. If Allen is far and away the BPA, then I vote we trade down to a team that needs him.

I'd be fine with trading down but Id be perfectly fine staying put and taking the best defensive player on the board. A versatile guy who can stop the run and rush the passer from a 3-4 or inside on a 4-man front. Allen is a game changer and we need those. Garrett or Allen would be a home run for our defense.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by midrdan:

Yeah, I think you take the best player. It is our historic insistence on relying on Baalke's mistakes for too long and one of those mistakes is sticking with a base 3-4. I'd love to take Allen (who can play inside and outside) and convert to a 4-3. I think a front four of Buckner, Armstead, Allen, and Lynch would be a good start.

So if a safety is the 2nd rated player and the qb is the 4th rated you take the safety?? I wouldn't

I wouldn't. But if the S is the 2nd rated player and the best QB on your big board is in the 15-20 range, I think you take the S.

QB is essential. But reaching for one can set you back. You gotta trust your board especially with QBs. Look at how many have been overdrafted given the premium of the position: Ponder, Gabbert, Tebow, Locker to name a few

Then look at the guys drafted immediately after those players. Watt, Tyron Smith, Robert Quinn ...

Teams are desperate for QBs but if you pass on a guy that you think will be a 10 year starter, with All Pro potential to grab a QB that is lower on your big board you not only lose that anchor type player you also tie your team to a 2-3 year window to a QB that comparatively carries more risk.

Originally posted by TheNef77:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

If we didn't have as many issues at more important positions I'd think about it....at this point I'd be surprised and pissed if we went that route.

Myles and if he's gone I'd go qb unless someone offered the farm to move up and we still were looking at a top 5 pick.

We have so many holes on our team that BPA will take care of drafting for need. Unless we strike gold in this draft with a new front office or actually spend to get decent free agents, we're about 2 drafts away from fielding a decent team.

NT
ILB
QB
WR
LG
C
DE
OLB
FS
TE

Jee bud you never heard of free agency? Lol.

Originally posted by midrdan:

Yeah, I think you take the best player. It is our historic insistence on relying on Baalke's mistakes for too long and one of those mistakes is sticking with a base 3-4. I'd love to take Allen (who can play inside and outside) and convert to a 4-3. I think a front four of Buckner, Armstead, Allen, and Lynch would be a good start.

I mentioned the same thing IF whispers are Garrett goes number one AND if QB ISNT what you want(the ones the ones that you believe will go top 5-10-15). That DL smells trouble to me in a good way. With current roster Harold&Tank are backup DE, Dial as backup DT, and Blair witch who I believe can play both. I do believe Buck should be inside next to Allen, AA should slim a few for maximum explosion and be the DE IF this occurs

Originally posted by midrdan:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by midrdan:

Yeah, I think you take the best player. It is our historic insistence on relying on Baalke's mistakes for too long and one of those mistakes is sticking with a base 3-4. I'd love to take Allen (who can play inside and outside) and convert to a 4-3. I think a front four of Buckner, Armstead, Allen, and Lynch would be a good start.

So if a safety is the 2nd rated player and the qb is the 4th rated you take the safety?? I wouldn't

I wouldn't. But if the S is the 2nd rated player and the best QB on your big board is in the 15-20 range, I think you take the S.

QB is essential. But reaching for one can set you back. You gotta trust your board especially with QBs. Look at how many have been overdrafted given the premium of the position: Ponder, Gabbert, Tebow, Locker to name a few

Then look at the guys drafted immediately after those players. Watt, Tyron Smith, Robert Quinn ...

Teams are desperate for QBs but if you pass on a guy that you think will be a 10 year starter, with All Pro potential to grab a QB that is lower on your big board you not only lose that anchor type player you also tie your team to a 2-3 year window to a QB that comparatively carries more risk.

This

The whole draft process is a crap shoot, but I do feel that most other positions can be filled on the backend of the draft. Every sport has its premium positions that are over drafted. Basketball, they're centers, baseball they're pitchers, etc. In football, its the QB. Given the state of the 49ers..I say BPA is a rather reasonable argument. If you think of Garrett as Reggie White (might be over comparing, but just for conversations sake), and Watson as Cam Newton or Kaep at his peak, who would you rather have?

Originally posted by midrdan:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by midrdan:
Yeah, I think you take the best player. It is our historic insistence on relying on Baalke's mistakes for too long and one of those mistakes is sticking with a base 3-4. I'd love to take Allen (who can play inside and outside) and convert to a 4-3. I think a front four of Buckner, Armstead, Allen, and Lynch would be a good start.

So if a safety is the 2nd rated player and the qb is the 4th rated you take the safety?? I wouldn't

I wouldn't. But if the S is the 2nd rated player and the best QB on your big board is in the 15-20 range, I think you take the S.

QB is essential. But reaching for one can set you back. You gotta trust your board especially with QBs. Look at how many have been overdrafted given the premium of the position: Ponder, Gabbert, Tebow, Locker to name a few

Then look at the guys drafted immediately after those players. Watt, Tyron Smith, Robert Quinn ...

Teams are desperate for QBs but if you pass on a guy that you think will be a 10 year starter, with All Pro potential to grab a QB that is lower on your big board you not only lose that anchor type player you also tie your team to a 2-3 year window to a QB that comparatively carries more risk.

I understand...JJ Watt wasn't regarded as the top prospect in that draft not even top 5.

Marcell Dareus was looked at as a top 3 pick (which he went 3rd) He's been good, but not better than Watt or Smith who were ranked lower on most draft boards?

It can work both ways...look at the 2009 draft the "safest" pick in that draft supposedly was Aaron Curry & Jason Smith how they doing? 2004 the Raiders took the safer pick in Robert Gallery and the Lions took Roy Williams instead of Big Ben

I see nothing wrong with taking some risk...we've drafted 1 QB inside the first 5 rds since 2010, that's unacceptable and a HUGE reason we are where we are.

Currently Turbisky is the 4th overall prospect on CBS draft big boards...I wouldn't consider it a "reach" to draft him at 2

Originally posted by Sims19849ers:
This

How about the Raiders and Lions who passed on Big Ben for players regarded as higher end prospects? works both ways

Originally posted by kentc1978:
The whole draft process is a crap shoot, but I do feel that most other positions can be filled on the backend of the draft. Every sport has its premium positions that are over drafted. Basketball, they're centers, baseball they're pitchers, etc. In football, its the QB. Given the state of the 49ers..I say BPA is a rather reasonable argument. If you think of Garrett as Reggie White (might be over comparing, but just for conversations sake), and Watson as Cam Newton or Kaep at his peak, who would you rather have?

This issue isn't Garrett vs a QB because I think everyone is in agreement that Myles should be the pick if there...most likely he's gone then who do you draft and please don't give me the trade down scenario because that takes another team with fair compensation.

BPA is so overblown at the top of a draft... I think it's something that should be applied more as the further down you go in the draft.

To me, if Garrett is gone, our braintrust needs to decide between Trubinski and Watson. If they are sold on one of them, take him. Braintrust...sheesh.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Sims19849ers:
This

How about the Raiders and Lions who passed on Big Ben for players regarded as higher end prospects? works both ways

Hindsight 20/20 always works. Fact is, Raiders were looking for OL help and the Lions were WR crazy for a few years. Had Ben gone to the Raiders, he probably wouldn't be who he is today. They were a horrible organization with a crappy defense and did not have the ability to draft and develop solid WRs like the Steelers do. The Lions are the Lions and have always been crap. The Raiders and Lions didn't pass on Ben for guys who were arguably the best players in the draft. They may have overdrafted those guys but neither of them were in the discussion for the best player in the draft. Allen is. Garrett is the consensus but Allen is an absolute game changer in the areas we need significant help. We can't stop the run and we can't rush the passer. Allen can do both and is the closest thing to a guarantee next to Garrett. Trubisky has one year of playing. I love him but be real, he has 1 season playing in an offense that throws a ton of WR screen passes Watson has been solid these past two years but suffers from similar issues that Kap does regarding progressions and seeing the field and he plays with exceptional talent on offense so I expect him to put up great numbers. I'm looking forward to his playoff performance this year but I think #2 is too early for Watson. The fact that we have glaring holes to fill on both sides of the ball and pass rush is just as much of a priority as QB is, Allen is significantly better than any QB prospect in this draft and is elite vs the run and vs the pass. I'd rather take Allen at 2 and Mahomes in the 2nd than to draft Watson at #2. Trubisky I'd be fine with but wouldn't be upset at all if the pick is Allen, is all I'm saying.

Trubisky's numbers aren't much different from Marquise Williams last year in that same system. Trubisky has a slightly better completion %, a couple more TDs and less INTs but Williams also had damn near 1,000 yards rushing with 13 TDs. Is it the system? Again, I like Trubisky a lot but putting things into perspective, he has 1 year of football in a system that is clearly very favorable to a QB and he hasn't looked significantly better than Williams, a guy who went undrafted

Originally posted by Murphys1:
To me, if Garrett is gone, our braintrust needs to decide between Trubinski and Watson. If they are sold on one of them, take him. Braintrust...sheesh.

That potentially could set the franchise back another 4 to 5 years. If Garrett is gone you either trade back for a boat load or you draft Jonathon Allen.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
This issue isn't Garrett vs a QB because I think everyone is in agreement that Myles should be the pick if there...most likely he's gone then who do you draft and please don't give me the trade down scenario because that takes another team with fair compensation.

BPA is so overblown at the top of a draft... I think it's something that should be applied more as the further down you go in the draft.

Maybe its just me, but I've always seen it as riskier to reach at the top of the draft for need vs the later parts of the draft. You're 1,2,3rd round picks shape your team and the later parts fill your team. I think there really is no right answer on this, its just all philosophy

Originally posted by SmokeCrabtrees:

Originally posted by TheNef77:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
If we didn't have as many issues at more important positions I'd think about it....at this point I'd be surprised and pissed if we went that route.

Myles and if he's gone I'd go qb unless someone offered the farm to move up and we still were looking at a top 5 pick.

We have so many holes on our team that BPA will take care of drafting for need. Unless we strike gold in this draft with a new front office or actually spend to get decent free agents, we're about 2 drafts away from fielding a decent team.

NT
ILB
QB
WR
LG
C
DE
OLB
FS
TE

Jee bud you never heard of free agency? Lol.

lol guess your head was in the clouds for the last 2 years huh? Cheap pickups from sub par talent or an average vet with a bs prove it contract. You ever heard of Trent Baalke bud?

Originally posted by Sims19849ers:

Hindsight 20/20 always works. Fact is, Raiders were looking for OL help and the Lions were WR crazy for a few years. Had Ben gone to the Raiders, he probably wouldn't be who he is today. They were a horrible organization with a crappy defense and did not have the ability to draft and develop solid WRs like the Steelers do. The Lions are the Lions and have always been crap. The Raiders and Lions didn't pass on Ben for guys who were arguably the best players in the draft. They may have overdrafted those guys but neither of them were in the discussion for the best player in the draft. Allen is. Garrett is the consensus but Allen is an absolute game changer in the areas we need significant help. We can't stop the run and we can't rush the passer. Allen can do both and is the closest thing to a guarantee next to Garrett. Trubisky has one year of playing. I love him but be real, he has 1 season playing in an offense that throws a ton of WR screen passes Watson has been solid these past two years but suffers from similar issues that Kap does regarding progressions and seeing the field and he plays with exceptional talent on offense so I expect him to put up great numbers. I'm looking forward to his playoff performance this year but I think #2 is too early for Watson. The fact that we have glaring holes to fill on both sides of the ball and pass rush is just as much of a priority as QB is, Allen is significantly better than any QB prospect in this draft and is elite vs the run and vs the pass. I'd rather take Allen at 2 and Mahomes in the 2nd than to draft Watson at #2. Trubisky I'd be fine with but wouldn't be upset at all if the pick is Allen, is all I'm saying.

Trubisky's numbers aren't much different from Marquise Williams last year in that same system. Trubisky has a slightly better completion %, a couple more TDs and less INTs but Williams also had damn near 1,000 yards rushing with 13 TDs. Is it the system? Again, I like Trubisky a lot but putting things into perspective, he has 1 year of football in a system that is clearly very favorable to a QB and he hasn't looked significantly better than Williams, a guy who went undrafted

Your right hindsight is 20/20...the other poster brought up locker, Blaine, EJ as reasons to not draft a qb but I could easily say if they went to different teams things could have been different just as you did with Big Ben

Williams was a run first qb turbisky isn't...you can look at film and see the differences between the two.

You say draft Allen yet we have youth there and it's not really a glaring hole compared to much more important positons...mahomes has all but said he's staying. When your in a position to draft the top qb and you literally have no qb on the roster you do it.

Get a coaching staff that can develop a qb and put some weapons around him...we've drafted defense 4 yrs in a row. Drafting a qb changes a franchise drafting your third DE in three yrs IMO sets the team back more than help it.

If you really hate our DE situation then get a solid vet to help the young guns out we have money to spend.