MadDog49er's FInal Draft Review and Niners' Draft Grade

Originally posted by stonecold590:
I wanted Jordy Tripp also. I know him personally. Great character and would have been a great pick up. Can play inside or out at LB and would have been a very good STs guy.

Really interested to follow his career. I think he has the chops to play inside and outside, and his cone and shuttle numbers show a three down backer quality at the next level.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
What I don't get: Sam comes out as gay to stand up for the proposition that he should be considered as a football player, and not judged b/c he's gay.

Then the media, and everyone else, apparently, spends all their time focused on the fact that he's gay.

Seems contradictory.

And a waste of time discussing.

Agreed that this consumes too much time. I don't care what happens inside his bedroom, and neither should anyone else. Until football has a number of guys running around naked on the field chasing after those of the same or opposite sex, and that is the objective of scoring, it is none of our business.

Originally posted by crake49:
Thanks to the above two posters. That's exactly what I'm talking about with Lynch. The guy's physical measureables are unbelievable. And, if being around disciplined, hard-working pros and a supportive coaching staff turn out to be what he needs, the Niners front office are going to look like geniuses. This guy could be an elite pass rusher in the NFL. Alex Boone and Ahmed Brooks are perfect examples, especially Alex Boone. Look at Boone - in college, he's just a boozing screw-up; now, he's a disciplined, hard-working pro. Let's hope the same thing happens with Lynch.

Note: I mean the two posters above the ongoing B.S. about Sams. Grow up, guys.He's just a gay man. Nothing to get worked up about.

Worst case, he's a late round pick at a position that is not a huge need (if Aldon keeps his head straight) and we cut him. Brooks, Boone and even T.Brown all had legal issues in college and ended up being good character guys while with the 49ers. The guys making headlines like Cully and Smith did not getting any legal incidents in college to the best of my knowledge. We don't take that many kids with character concerns in college and the ones we have taken, either through the draft (Brown), waivers (Brooks) or as a UDFA (Boone), have worked out. Even Brock flunked out after one year at Minnesota, some FOs would probably have seen that as cause for concern too.

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by NickSh49:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Finally, and most controversially, the Rams selection of Michael Sam reeks of a PR stunt. While I salute Sam coming forward, and hope he finds success in life...I cannot believe I am about to say what I am about to say...here was a guy who was drafted because he was gay. Breaking the barrier in any sports league should be legit, and I feel that the NFL knew there would be a significant blowback if he was not selected...hence making some wink-wink deal with a team to make the pick. An orchestrated breaking of the barrier only does damage to the cause in the end. Michael Sam jumped a vertical of 25 inches at the combine. That is the level of am morbidly overweight, out of shape RT. That number would be dead last amongst the QBs at the combine. His shuttle time was dead last amongst DEs, and by a substantial margin. He was second to last in the bench press. Taking the combo stats of speed, strength, explosiveness into account, and the struggle of the Senior Bowl week, he should not have been drafted.

Sadly, I agree with you.

Here's a rhetorical question for ya... who is head of the NFL Competition Committee and has close ties to Roger Goodell and the league office?

Why that'd be St. Louis Rams head coach Jeff Fisher.

Not to mention how NFL.com writer Michael Silver was granted access to the Rams war room so he could write a detailed piece of what went down when the pick was made, as well as interview Jeff Fisher on the spot. Of all the teams to assign him to.... what a coincidence.

Exactly.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Bottom line though.. you did want to pick 4 guys that went undrafted. All 32 teams disagreed with you on these players worth. Because of that I have to downgrade your grade drastically. Sorry Maddog. And you started off so well too.

Just for fun, let's play with the last two undrafted. Let's say that the Niners selected 253 and 254, and neither of my two picks were drafted in the last two slots (255 and 256), you would downgrade?

This whole "four guys you wanted went undrafted" is a little extreme anyway. In the later stages of the draft, all the GMs are just throwing darts. Some of the barely-drafted guys could have easily gone undrafted, and vice versa. Heck, maybe some GMs literally flip a coin.

Would it really be that surprising to see some of MadDog's four players having better NFL careers that dozens of guys drafted in the 6th and 7th? Obviously, it could go either way.

I stopped reading the OP after this: "OK, let's get the Niners' grade: A-"

After all the time/effort/passion/convinction MD puts into this every single year, this is all I need to know!

Originally posted by znk916:
Can I do takebacks? lol

I think I was too inspired by MadDog's harsh grading when I trashed Ramsey. The guy clearly does have some physical talent and DL typically can play into their mid-30s without dropping off a cliff. I just find it hard to believe he will somehow stay healthy enough to be a long-term contributor. Playing in the trenches is not for the fragile.

I gave Lynch a D, but honestly I think he was worth the risk in the 5th round even if I doubt he will ever get his head on straight. At that point, go big or go home, right?

Ramsey was never injured seriously, iirc. But, it could happen with higher probability.

Let's say it in general:
a player with a lot of talent and with a good character is gone in round 1 usually.
a player who seems to have a lot of talent but still has some character concerns, is falling deep or completely out.
That is the realworld. Just because a guy has some personal issues, some teams won't take him off their board, if he possesses tremendous talent. But they will downgrade him. I mean, there is always a chance that he starts to "grow" mentalwise.
The problem with UDFAs is that they can be picked by anyone.

Originally posted by communist:
Ramsey was never injured seriously, iirc. But, it could happen with higher probability.

Let's say it in general:
a player with a lot of talent and with a good character is gone in round 1 usually.
a player who seems to have a lot of talent but still has some character concerns, is falling deep or completely out.
That is the realworld. Just because a guy has some personal issues, some teams won't take him off their board, if he possesses tremendous talent. But they will downgrade him. I mean, there is always a chance that he starts to "grow" mentalwise.
The problem with UDFAs is that they can be picked by anyone.

I think this is going to happen. A lot of teams passed on this guy because of his character issues. Harbs said that Lynch's coach is like family to him and he trusts him completely. Which is why I believe we drafted him,

Not to mention Lynch JUST TURNED 21 2 MONTHS AGO
Can any of you say you were the same person you are mentally when you turned 21?

Originally posted by SanFranFanfrmVa:
Lynch hasn't been in legal trouble but his reputation dropped him way down on some draft boards and completely off others.Go look at the measurables between the #9 pick in the draft Anthony Barr and Aaron Lynch. Lynch is taller,bigger hands,longer arms,lifted better and the 40 time is real close. His burst in the first 10 yards is really good. This kid has first round talent. Take him and get him around veteran leadership and he could turn the corner and be one heck of a steal. In time he could be a 6'5" 270 pound beast off of the edge on 3rd downs.As others have stated Baalke/Harbugh put alot of work/interview time in with this kid. I could see Harbaugh taking this kid under his wing and being a real mentor to him.

This is going way too far. There are valid concerns that he has the athleticism to stand up and play linebacker in the NFL. Lynch is barely taller than Barr and his arms are only 1/2" longer. The 49ers aren't drafting him for his coverage skills and he will probably never be a 3 down linebacker, so his hand size doesn't really matter. Lynch ran a 4.69 40 at his pro day. Barr ran a 4.41 at his pro day according to this:
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=105122&draftyear=2014&genpos=OLB

Barr also out-jumped him in the broad jump by 8" at their respective pro days and is 6 pounds heavier. I like the pick, but Lynch is nowhere near Barr as an athlete. He may have had first round talent 2 years ago, but it's more likely he was overhyped because he played for Notre Dame and had some lucky sacks as a freshman. He never impressed me the way Tuitt did and he's a different prospect at 249 than he was as a freshman at 275. At 249, he is not a first round talent, but he has good upside for a 5th round pick.

Originally posted by eastcoast49ersfan:

Originally posted by SanFranFanfrmVa:
Lynch hasn't been in legal trouble but his reputation dropped him way down on some draft boards and completely off others.Go look at the measurables between the #9 pick in the draft Anthony Barr and Aaron Lynch. Lynch is taller,bigger hands,longer arms,lifted better and the 40 time is real close. His burst in the first 10 yards is really good. This kid has first round talent. Take him and get him around veteran leadership and he could turn the corner and be one heck of a steal. In time he could be a 6'5" 270 pound beast off of the edge on 3rd downs.As others have stated Baalke/Harbugh put alot of work/interview time in with this kid. I could see Harbaugh taking this kid under his wing and being a real mentor to him.

This is going way too far. There are valid concerns that he has the athleticism to stand up and play linebacker in the NFL. Lynch is barely taller than Barr and his arms are only 1/2" longer. The 49ers aren't drafting him for his coverage skills and he will probably never be a 3 down linebacker, so his hand size doesn't really matter. Lynch ran a 4.69 40 at his pro day. Barr ran a 4.41 at his pro day according to this:
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=105122&draftyear=2014&genpos=OLB

Barr also out-jumped him in the broad jump by 8" at their respective pro days and is 6 pounds heavier. I like the pick, but Lynch is nowhere near Barr as an athlete. He may have had first round talent 2 years ago, but it's more likely he was overhyped because he played for Notre Dame and had some lucky sacks as a freshman. He never impressed me the way Tuitt did and he's a different prospect at 249 than he was as a freshman at 275. At 249, he is not a first round talent, but he has good upside for a 5th round pick.

I heard he went up to 275 to play DE and lost way too weight (Adderall) to get down to 249 and suffered. Is this correct? If so, that means his natural weight is somehwre around 260 (he'll get proper nutrition/diet here) so that would make him an ideal developing OLB either at WILL or SAM, correct?

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
What I don't get: Sam comes out as gay to stand up for the proposition that he should be considered as a football player, and not judged b/c he's gay.

Then the media, and everyone else, apparently, spends all their time focused on the fact that he's gay.

Seems contradictory.

And a waste of time discussing.

Like "black QBs" back in the day, he's stated that he wants to be seen as a football player and not as a "gay" football player, but he has no control over what the media or anyone else says or does. So it's not really a contradiction per se, it's the media doing what they do best...jumping on stories that have the broadest possible audience (ad/revenue generation) and running it into the ground until the next shiny thing comes along.

Originally posted by NCommand:
I heard he went up to 275 to play DE and lost way too weight (Adderall) to get down to 249 and suffered. Is this correct? If so, that means his natural weight is somehwre around 260 (he'll get proper nutrition/diet here) so that would make him an ideal developing OLB either at WILL or SAM, correct?

Yeah, he came out of high school at about 250 and clearly put on weight freshman year. If a team drafted Lynch after freshman year, it would have been to play DE. I thought he was a better fit in a 4-3 scheme where he could bulk back up to play DE and he said in interviews he was open to doing either one. I think we may be viewing him as strictly a pass rusher and he will usually have his hand down when on the field probably in nickle and dime packages. I think he is a developmental SAM linebacker and defensive end in sub packages.

Originally posted by NCommand:

I heard he went up to 275 to play DE and lost way too weight (Adderall) to get down to 249 and suffered. Is this correct? If so, that means his natural weight is somehwre around 260 (he'll get proper nutrition/diet here) so that would make him an ideal developing OLB either at WILL or SAM, correct?

According to his post draft media interview, he says he feels and plays his best at 260 and is presently at 255.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by cciowa:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Could be right on Sam. I just think the league wanted to do something to not appear homophobic. I could be entirely wrong. I just don't buy that he was a legit prospect since this offseason.

of course he was taken because he was gay. the head coach of the rams is very astute when it comes to politics. with that front four they have, it was not a need. now the bigger question comes later. do they keep him because he is gay because you know the firestorm that will come from certain quarters of society if he gets cut. cutting a better player to keep one just because he is gay is beyond PC in my opinion. he sucked vs good teams and while he has a nice motor and in limited play could give a blow to one of the lineman from time to time,, he is not worthy of being a nfl player in my opinion.

Pun intended?

i do not have the slightest clue what you mean. i was just trying to make a point

Originally posted by cciowa:

i do not have the slightest clue what you mean. i was just trying to make a point

Fair enough. No offense intended, and I hope none taken.