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Poll for NBA fans (crosses fingers.........)

Poll for NBA fans (crosses fingers.........)

Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

LeBron is FAR from being their whole team. Their whole team plays superb defense, (which is one thing that the post-Shaq Lakers did not do at all) and they have two guys that were all stars last year. They've been a Top 5-6 defensive team for the last several years.

But nobody cares about defense, and since LeBron has the ball in his hands the entire shot block, everyone else must suck.
[ Edited by LA9erFan on Jan 24, 2010 at 11:04 PM ]
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

This statement is so ludicrous on so many levels. Do you have any idea who was on that team?

Im not going to argue with you on this. agree to disagree

Lets get back on the topic, sorry stoney.

Lebron single handedly takes Cavs to NBA Finals. Kobe struggles to make it out of the 1st Round with a team that had more talent than Lebron did......


gg

your so right dude.

King James
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

This statement is so ludicrous on so many levels. Do you have any idea who was on that team?

Im not going to argue with you on this. agree to disagree

Lets get back on the topic, sorry stoney.

Lebron single handedly takes Cavs to NBA Finals. Kobe struggles to make it out of the 1st Round with a team that had more talent than Lebron did......


gg


Wait, WTF are you talking about ace?
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

This statement is so ludicrous on so many levels. Do you have any idea who was on that team?

Im not going to argue with you on this. agree to disagree

Lets get back on the topic, sorry stoney.

Lebron single handedly takes Cavs to NBA Finals. Kobe struggles to make it out of the 1st Round with a team that had more talent than Lebron did......


gg

your so right dude.

King James

He was 9 when the Lakers won the title in 2000.
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

This statement is so ludicrous on so many levels. Do you have any idea who was on that team?

Im not going to argue with you on this. agree to disagree

Lets get back on the topic, sorry stoney.

Lebron single handedly takes Cavs to NBA Finals. Kobe struggles to make it out of the 1st Round with a team that had more talent than Lebron did......


gg

your so right dude.

King James

He was 9 when the Lakers won the title in 2000.

I was 12, but i remember it like it was yesterday. No one who watched those finals in 2000 as passionately for the Lakers as I did is a Warriors fan right now. Enough said.
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

This statement is so ludicrous on so many levels. Do you have any idea who was on that team?

Im not going to argue with you on this. agree to disagree

Lets get back on the topic, sorry stoney.

Lebron single handedly takes Cavs to NBA Finals. Kobe struggles to make it out of the 1st Round with a team that had more talent than Lebron did......


gg

your so right dude.

King James

He was 9 when the Lakers won the title in 2000.

I was 12, but i remember it like it was yesterday. No one who watched those finals in 2000 as passionately for the Lakers as I did is a Warriors fan right now. Enough said.

What does this mean?
Originally posted by StOnEy333:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Originally posted by DynastyChile:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan) and Lebron is on another level than Kobe and has been for years now. Just give the Cavs Shaq like Kobe had early in the decade and Lebron could win a championship easily. Wait...... let me rephrase that. Give the Cavs Shaq IN HIS PRIIIIME and Lebron would have many rings to match Kobe's.

People that say things like this clearly didn't watch the playoffs when the Lakers had their three peat. Anyone with any knowledge of the game knew how much Kobe brought to the table, and how he wasn't just the "sidekick".

I did and I used to be a Lakers fan until the the Fantastic 4 broke up (Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton). You can't dismiss Shaq's presence on the court, he was a force to be reckoned with. Their triangle offense was built around both players and each had a huge part. Lebron is basically the whole Cavs team. If he were to leave, their team would definitely be a top 5 pick. When Shaq left the Lakers, weren't they the 8th seed and lost in the 1st Round ?

This statement is so ludicrous on so many levels. Do you have any idea who was on that team?

Im not going to argue with you on this. agree to disagree

Lets get back on the topic, sorry stoney.

Lebron single handedly takes Cavs to NBA Finals. Kobe struggles to make it out of the 1st Round with a team that had more talent than Lebron did......


gg

your so right dude.

King James

He was 9 when the Lakers won the title in 2000.

I was 12, but i remember it like it was yesterday. No one who watched those finals in 2000 as passionately for the Lakers as I did is a Warriors fan right now. Enough said.

What does this mean?

Means that neither you or I would give up being Lakers fans if any player left, and that he was never a real fan, especially at nine. and to call Kobe out like that when you clearly dont know what you're talking about is pretty lame, about as lame as going from a Laker to a Warrior fan
[ Edited by DynastyChile on Jan 24, 2010 at 11:23 PM ]
  • TX9R
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,153
Well this was a dumb idea. As always it just turns in to fanboys defending their guy, regardless of logic or objectivity. I'm not a fan of either guy or either team. I do think it's not really a comparison team-wise when one guy walks in to a perennial contender and plays with HOFers most of his career and another plays with a bunch of 3rd tier players and over the hill ex all stars. I keep hearing about Kobe and his ability to hit clutch shots at the end of games, but he didn't just start out like that. I can remember some air balls in the playoffs early in his career. Is it safe to assume the maybe LeBron will develop that like Kobe did after several years? Wouldn't a better comparison be the first 5 years of their careers? Even tossing out the rookie years there isn't one area that LeBron doesn't lead in. What's really amazing is that LeBron has been putting up such numbers since he was 19, and is still improving. He's shot around 48% in that time, Kobe has never shot that well at any point in his career. Do we not think LeBron will get even better? Again his success, like anyone, is dependant on the help he gets/ doesn't get. But individually? He's been a better all around player sicne about his second year in the league.
  • Oscar
  • Hall of Fame
  • Posts: 10,232
Originally posted by StOnEy333:
Originally posted by Oscar:
Kobe's last 10 vs. Lebron's next 10, huh?


Who's do you think will go down as better?

I think it's a matter of a simple definition. What do you mean by "better"? I totally dig the argument that the number of rings isn't the end all, be all. But at the same time, It's not like Kobe was a bench warmer for those 4 title runs.

In my own personal opinion, I think both are going to have brilliant careers. I'm not really a fan of basketball so I don't have any allegiances one way or the other.

However, I think that it will be very, VERY hard for Lebron to match the 4 titles that Kobe has. And for that reason alone, people will put Lebron behind Kobe. I don't think that's right, but that's reality.

All that "Tom Brady is better that Joe Montana" talk certainly died down when Brady didn't get that 4th ring. Championships matter, even if sometimes they shouldn't.
  • crzy
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 39,280
I don't think Peyton Manning has to win 4 rings to be considered better than Joe Montana.
  • crzy
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 39,280
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
Kobe's my favorite player in the NBA (I'm a Warriors fan)

  • titan
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,568
When it's all said and done! Kobe Bryant will be a LEGEND and Lebron James will be a bitter old man with amazing showboat dancing skillz with outstanding numbers.
Originally posted by TX9R:
Well this was a dumb idea. As always it just turns in to fanboys defending their guy, regardless of logic or objectivity. I'm not a fan of either guy or either team. I do think it's not really a comparison team-wise when one guy walks in to a perennial contender and plays with HOFers most of his career and another plays with a bunch of 3rd tier players and over the hill ex all stars. I keep hearing about Kobe and his ability to hit clutch shots at the end of games, but he didn't just start out like that. I can remember some air balls in the playoffs early in his career. Is it safe to assume the maybe LeBron will develop that like Kobe did after several years? Wouldn't a better comparison be the first 5 years of their careers? Even tossing out the rookie years there isn't one area that LeBron doesn't lead in. What's really amazing is that LeBron has been putting up such numbers since he was 19, and is still improving. He's shot around 48% in that time, Kobe has never shot that well at any point in his career. Do we not think LeBron will get even better? Again his success, like anyone, is dependant on the help he gets/ doesn't get. But individually? He's been a better all around player sicne about his second year in the league.

And I sincerely disagree with this assessment.

It doesn't strike you as odd that fans & columnists, as a general rule, pick LeBron...but NBA talent evaluators and fellow players consistently choose Kobe? As I "fanboyed" about earlier, LeBron's skill set dictates that his team has to play a certain way in order to be successful. And that style isn't conducive to other players thriving.

The whole "fanboy" thing irritates me, to be honest. It might be a relevant criticism if the opinion that LeBron was that much better than Kobe was shared by those who know the most about basketball, but it isn't. This opinion is usually gleaned by fans and columnists that love pretty box scores. But when NBA players, coaches, and talent evaluators were asked who the best player in the game was (at the beginning of this season), what were the results? Kobe 61, LeBron 34, IIRC. Are they fanboys too?

If people think that LeBron's better than Kobe at this point, I don't have a problem with that. It isn't an unreasonable position at all. But to act like it's been that way for years and it's not even close ABSOLUTELY is.
[ Edited by LA9erFan on Jan 25, 2010 at 10:41 AM ]
  • TX9R
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,153
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by TX9R:
Well this was a dumb idea. As always it just turns in to fanboys defending their guy, regardless of logic or objectivity. I'm not a fan of either guy or either team. I do think it's not really a comparison team-wise when one guy walks in to a perennial contender and plays with HOFers most of his career and another plays with a bunch of 3rd tier players and over the hill ex all stars. I keep hearing about Kobe and his ability to hit clutch shots at the end of games, but he didn't just start out like that. I can remember some air balls in the playoffs early in his career. Is it safe to assume the maybe LeBron will develop that like Kobe did after several years? Wouldn't a better comparison be the first 5 years of their careers? Even tossing out the rookie years there isn't one area that LeBron doesn't lead in. What's really amazing is that LeBron has been putting up such numbers since he was 19, and is still improving. He's shot around 48% in that time, Kobe has never shot that well at any point in his career. Do we not think LeBron will get even better? Again his success, like anyone, is dependant on the help he gets/ doesn't get. But individually? He's been a better all around player sicne about his second year in the league.

And I sincerely disagree with this assessment.

It doesn't strike you as odd that fans & columnists, as a general rule, pick LeBron...but NBA talent evaluators and fellow players consistently choose Kobe? As I "fanboyed" about earlier, LeBron's skill set dictates that his team has to play a certain way in order to be successful. And that style isn't conducive to other players thriving.

The whole "fanboy" thing irritates me, to be honest. It might be a relevant criticism if the opinion that LeBron was that much better than Kobe was shared by those who know the most about basketball, but it isn't. This opinion is usually gleaned by fans and columnists that love pretty box scores. But when NBA players, coaches, and talent evaluators were asked who the best player in the game was (at the beginning of this season), what were the results? Kobe 61, LeBron 34, IIRC. Are they fanboys too?

If people think that LeBron's better than Kobe at this point, I don't have a problem with that. It isn't an unreasonable position at all. But to act like it's been that way for years and it's not even close ABSOLUTELY is.

The fanboy comment wasn't directed at you or anyone else who had good analysis. The opinion I've always heard and agree with is that LeBron is a better all around player, Kobe is the better closer. That comes with experience. I never said nor do I think that it's not close, it is very close. The only time there was an undisputed best player in basketball was when Jordan played.
Originally posted by TX9R:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by TX9R:
Well this was a dumb idea. As always it just turns in to fanboys defending their guy, regardless of logic or objectivity. I'm not a fan of either guy or either team. I do think it's not really a comparison team-wise when one guy walks in to a perennial contender and plays with HOFers most of his career and another plays with a bunch of 3rd tier players and over the hill ex all stars. I keep hearing about Kobe and his ability to hit clutch shots at the end of games, but he didn't just start out like that. I can remember some air balls in the playoffs early in his career. Is it safe to assume the maybe LeBron will develop that like Kobe did after several years? Wouldn't a better comparison be the first 5 years of their careers? Even tossing out the rookie years there isn't one area that LeBron doesn't lead in. What's really amazing is that LeBron has been putting up such numbers since he was 19, and is still improving. He's shot around 48% in that time, Kobe has never shot that well at any point in his career. Do we not think LeBron will get even better? Again his success, like anyone, is dependant on the help he gets/ doesn't get. But individually? He's been a better all around player sicne about his second year in the league.

And I sincerely disagree with this assessment.

It doesn't strike you as odd that fans & columnists, as a general rule, pick LeBron...but NBA talent evaluators and fellow players consistently choose Kobe? As I "fanboyed" about earlier, LeBron's skill set dictates that his team has to play a certain way in order to be successful. And that style isn't conducive to other players thriving.

The whole "fanboy" thing irritates me, to be honest. It might be a relevant criticism if the opinion that LeBron was that much better than Kobe was shared by those who know the most about basketball, but it isn't. This opinion is usually gleaned by fans and columnists that love pretty box scores. But when NBA players, coaches, and talent evaluators were asked who the best player in the game was (at the beginning of this season), what were the results? Kobe 61, LeBron 34, IIRC. Are they fanboys too?

If people think that LeBron's better than Kobe at this point, I don't have a problem with that. It isn't an unreasonable position at all. But to act like it's been that way for years and it's not even close ABSOLUTELY is.

The fanboy comment wasn't directed at you or anyone else who had good analysis. The opinion I've always heard and agree with is that LeBron is a better all around player, Kobe is the better closer. That comes with experience. I never said nor do I think that it's not close, it is very close. The only time there was an undisputed best player in basketball was when Jordan played.

Fair enough.

I have to on this conversation. I see hours of my life melting away if I don't.