Thoughts on the State of the Team: 2017 Outlook & Why Baalke is Responsible

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

I truly wonder if anyone here remembers exactly how this FA went down. It had nothing to do wiht Baalke not being involved. It had everything to do with NOBODY wanting to come to a third world team. And if you are looking for reasons, I'll give you three. Owner...had just gotten thru the joke of the decade, tomsul. And then all the fallout that that entails. Then we had the fantastic QB situation which I never will forgive Kap for. He obviously ddint' want to be here and had tweeted or stated at various times he wanted to be a Jet...Brown...
Bill...and lastly a Bronco. And then when he tested the market , found out he was valued a less than half of what he was getting here. Suddenly he shows up in camp. Anybody that doesn't think kap's actions helped screw us over in FA is kidding themselves. Our own QB didn't want to be here....until I he found out his actual worth. In any event, his dissing the organization by saying he wanted to be elsewhere...and it literally seemed like anywhere....you really think that didn't send up a warning flare to FAs...don't come here? It did and Kap was a good part of the reason. Jed's tomsul hire was so laughed at by the NFL, that it was embarrassing. No one will ever forget that. And no FAs wanted any part of it either.

Lastly, any FA could look at or team and see:
No OL...NONE...there goes the O FAs.
No DL...well we had Ian and AA, but one was learning and the other had some nicks.
No DBs....True we had them, but only 1 true starter(maybe 2). But we drafted 3 DBs, which tells you....we were talent shy.
WRs...we had only Torrey and our crappy QB play kept him from making plays.
QB...Kap wanted out.
HC...just fired.....new HC had a "rep" and it wasn't universally good.
LBs...ummm, Bow and that was it.
In fact, top to bottom this team had REBUILD written all over it.

When FA started, NOBODY wanted to come here, despite TRent's try to get them. ILB Trevathan wanted to go elsewhere. Hardly anyone else would even talk to us. Result? We had tons of money and NO ONE wanted to play here.

And that, not Trent , was why no FAs were even interested in talking to us. Later we got Zane.

What a frigging mess....but it all started at the top with Jed's colossal screw up hire in 2015. Then it rolled downhill from there. Kap was just part of it.

What a terrific post doc. Well said. And I've got one more for you...agents. Agents go down the pros and cons of each location for their clients and they too have their recommendations (see also, Kaepernick, Colin). In fact, an agent was the one reason we DID sign a quality starting LG...Zane Beadles and his friendship with Joe Staley via their mutual agent.

As to the bold. This is why I maintain Baalke isn't going anywhere. He'll get another year from Jed to pick up his pieces and maybe more because they are now forced to build solely through the draft.

But then again, who knows what goes through Jed's mind.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

I truly wonder if anyone here remembers exactly how this FA went down. It had nothing to do wiht Baalke not being involved. It had everything to do with NOBODY wanting to come to a third world team. And if you are looking for reasons, I'll give you three. Owner...had just gotten thru the joke of the decade, tomsul. And then all the fallout that that entails. Then we had the fantastic QB situation which I never will forgive Kap for. He obviously ddint' want to be here and had tweeted or stated at various times he wanted to be a Jet...Brown...
Bill...and lastly a Bronco. And then when he tested the market , found out he was valued a less than half of what he was getting here. Suddenly he shows up in camp. Anybody that doesn't think kap's actions helped screw us over in FA is kidding themselves. Our own QB didn't want to be here....until I he found out his actual worth. In any event, his dissing the organization by saying he wanted to be elsewhere...and it literally seemed like anywhere....you really think that didn't send up a warning flare to FAs...don't come here? It did and Kap was a good part of the reason. Jed's tomsul hire was so laughed at by the NFL, that it was embarrassing. No one will ever forget that. And no FAs wanted any part of it either.

Lastly, any FA could look at or team and see:
No OL...NONE...there goes the O FAs.
No DL...well we had Ian and AA, but one was learning and the other had some nicks.
No DBs....True we had them, but only 1 true starter(maybe 2). But we drafted 3 DBs, which tells you....we were talent shy.
WRs...we had only Torrey and our crappy QB play kept him from making plays.
QB...Kap wanted out.
HC...just fired.....new HC had a "rep" and it wasn't universally good.
LBs...ummm, Bow and that was it.
In fact, top to bottom this team had REBUILD written all over it.

When FA started, NOBODY wanted to come here, despite TRent's try to get them. ILB Trevathan wanted to go elsewhere. Hardly anyone else would even talk to us. Result? We had tons of money and NO ONE wanted to play here.

And that, not Trent , was why no FAs were even interested in talking to us. Later we got Zane.

What a frigging mess....but it all started at the top with Jed's colossal screw up hire in 2015. Then it rolled downhill from there. Kap was just part of it.

What a terrific post doc. Well said. And I've got one more for you...agents. Agents go down the pros and cons of each location for their clients and they too have their recommendations (see also, Kaepernick, Colin). In fact, an agent was the one reason we DID sign a quality starting LG...Zane Beadles and his friendship with Joe Staley via their mutual agent.

As to the bold. This is why I maintain Baalke isn't going anywhere. He'll get another year from Jed to pick up his pieces and maybe more because they are now forced to build solely through the draft.

But then again, who knows what goes through Jed's mind.

This is why I'm praying that Kaepernick can do well enough to put us on the rise. People will see that the system works. I know it's very unlikely Kaepernick stays, but if he does well, I hope we can somehow find a way to keep him. That will do even more to help with players willingness to come here, I'd think.

Not much, NCommand, not much.

Can't help but think back to that day when Eddie D got caught wth $400,000 in his briefcase, that was buy in money for a riverboat casino in New Orleans. When the penalty finally came down it literally took my breath away. Who knew that Eddie being banned from the NFL, our/his penalty, would be a 25-yr penalty against the 49ers. Hasn't been that long yet, but we aren't out of the outhouse yet either.

Owners, what a weird strange thing. Look at the Cubs. They were last in the World Series in '08....1908 that is....108 yrs ago. I don't think it will take that long here, but short term, I am getting less and less certain how that plays out. We are desperately in need of a FR QB, WRs, ILB, OLB...and if you want to put FRanchise in front of all 3 of them, fine by me. The only short term fix I see is bringing a guy (that I completely hate) like Bellichek here, who I believe in spite of Jed , could turn this franchise around...oh, and it wouldn't hurt to bring his QB with him. Say offer him 3% ownership of the team. 3% of $3 Billion....I could see him interested in that. That isn't realistic, however, but is the only other way I can envision fixing the ownership problem. Somehow, I think Trent was hired to bring Jed along. ie, he has friends in high places, and that means Jed's parents. He was in scouting, and does have an eye for D talent. O talent...not so much....BUT , his hire of Chip, a guy who DOES have an eye for O talent, shows what having an offensive guy around can do.

Talk about Jed being schid canned is just talk. It ISN"T going to happen. How then to right this ship? OTC nailed it with FR QB, WR, and ILB. Frankly, I think chip can help us find the FR QB we need for now and into the future. Still as teams like Cleve have shown, even picking in top 1 or 2, FR QB. Is still a crapshoot. So I would keep Chip on as a talent scout, but as HC? Way too early to make any comment on that, other than the inescapable fact that he is hard headed in his play calling. But with talent lacking, literally everywhere , with the exception of OL, it isn't possible to grade Chip. He just hasn't had the horses. This yr, for first time in ages,, we DO have an OL.that is special. But folks, that is it. Everywhere else we got bupkis, altho a lot of injured talent on D, that MIGHT work out.

As Mayo says, I expect Kap to be every bit as good as Blaine....but no better. Also, getting rid of the most important player on the team, who for the entire off season advertised that he wanted to go elsewhere...is paramount. As in the sooner he is cut, the better. I hope he plays better than gab, but just don't see it. Even so, we will have THE guy, the guy who leads our team, around until we cut him. He is just poison on the team, and no one will convince me otherwise. Players have to have the attitude that they will do anything for their QB....but we have a young, athletic QB, who fails in the QB skills department, plus he has advertised to the rest of the league, he doesn't want to be here. And just how many guys will give their all to the highest paid player on the team...and everyone knows he wants out of here? How can the rest of the team give it all when they know their #1 guy wants out of here.? That is why we don't get better until Kap is gone. But compared to Jed, Kap is way down the list as far as problems go. Jed started at the bottom from an experience standpoint, He has learned, but his learning curve has hurt this team worse than any other one thing. He needs a mentor, and just guessing but my bet is that is Trent's main job...bringing Jed up to speed as being an owner. Right now Jed is radioactively toxic...and the rest of the league , and certainly the agents and players ...know it. And that just kills us in bringing in the top flite FAs we desperately need...,FR QB being at the top of that list.

So how do you make your owner into an Eddie D? Answer: you don't . It took some yrs , even with the GOAT HC/GM of all time, to get Eddie D in line. Thinking winning, not $$. Now the league has removed that incentive, and everyone works under the same umbrella dollarwise. So our savior, if there is to be one, is going to have to come from the HC...and he is going to have to teach Jed about winning. And there is another conundrum. How is Trent going to convince another HC to come here, especially a great one, knowing his boss is Jed? So for the time being, and into the near future, I think Trent stays. Not because he has done so well for us, but to help bring Jed along, slow as it is, into the upper echelon of owners. Forget firing Jed. He is the owner...or at least the owner's son. And no matter what, Jed stays. Trent's seemingly impossible job is going to be to get another GOAT HC. Bellichek is the closest thing to that, he has a fantastic owner in Kraft, and hence he is going nowhere. But that is the kind of thing that brings us back from the dark ages. Having a top five pick, in some yrs top 3, and one yr top pick...that will help. But we went down that path for 9 long yrs, and our HC, Harbaw, was a good organizer. He was not the QB whisperer he was made out to be. He just organized all that pent up high round talent but when it came to calling games, his OC was a FAIL...and obviously he wasn't much better. He did nothing to improve his hand picked QB, did nothing with player development, and in the end caused horrid team dissension. He did not deserve to be our HC. But that is fixed...and we have had no improvement on that to date...and last yr , of course, we got worse....way worse.

Chip gets no grade, as first off, we are only 5 games into his first season. Second, chip has an OL and nothing else. If all healthy, maybe we had a decent D, but we got nobody healthy at present. So no way to grade chip. I don't see him having any kind of positive learning experience for Jed, tho, so maybe in a yr...or two...we need someone else. The best idea advanced on these pages is to have a real football guy in charge of football ops, and a triumvirate under him of GM, HC, Wth Jed that isn't happening any time soon, but some day, maybe he will want to win moreso than be the chief of football ops, making all the football decisions. That probably is the way out of this mess, but is not in the near future....at least I don't think so, anyway.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
I truly wonder if anyone here remembers exactly how this FA went down. It had nothing to do wiht Baalke not being involved. It had everything to do with NOBODY wanting to come to a third world team. And if you are looking for reasons, I'll give you three. Owner...had just gotten thru the joke of the decade, tomsul. And then all the fallout that that entails. Then we had the fantastic QB situation which I never will forgive Kap for. He obviously ddint' want to be here and had tweeted or stated at various times he wanted to be a Jet...Brown...
Bill...and lastly a Bronco. And then when he tested the market , found out he was valued a less than half of what he was getting here. Suddenly he shows up in camp. Anybody that doesn't think kap's actions helped screw us over in FA is kidding themselves. Our own QB didn't want to be here....until I he found out his actual worth. In any event, his dissing the organization by saying he wanted to be elsewhere...and it literally seemed like anywhere....you really think that didn't send up a warning flare to FAs...don't come here? It did and Kap was a good part of the reason. Jed's tomsul hire was so laughed at by the NFL, that it was embarrassing. No one will ever forget that. And no FAs wanted any part of it either.

Lastly, any FA could look at or team and see:
No OL...NONE...there goes the O FAs.
No DL...well we had Ian and AA, but one was learning and the other had some nicks.
No DBs....True we had them, but only 1 true starter(maybe 2). But we drafted 3 DBs, which tells you....we were talent shy.
WRs...we had only Torrey and our crappy QB play kept him from making plays.
QB...Kap wanted out.
HC...just fired.....new HC had a "rep" and it wasn't universally good.
LBs...ummm, Bow and that was it.
In fact, top to bottom this team had REBUILD written all over it.

When FA started, NOBODY wanted to come here, despite TRent's try to get them. ILB Trevathan wanted to go elsewhere. Hardly anyone else would even talk to us. Result? We had tons of money and NO ONE wanted to play here.

And that, not Trent , was why no FAs were even interested in talking to us. Later we got Zane.

What a frigging mess....but it all started at the top with Jed's colossal screw up hire in 2015. Then it rolled downhill from there. Kap was just part of it.

What a terrific post doc. Well said. And I've got one more for you...agents. Agents go down the pros and cons of each location for their clients and they too have their recommendations (see also, Kaepernick, Colin). In fact, an agent was the one reason we DID sign a quality starting LG...Zane Beadles and his friendship with Joe Staley via their mutual agent.

As to the bold. This is why I maintain Baalke isn't going anywhere. He'll get another year from Jed to pick up his pieces and maybe more because they are now forced to build solely through the draft.

But then again, who knows what goes through Jed's mind.

This is why I'm praying that Kaepernick can do well enough to put us on the rise. People will see that the system works. I know it's very unlikely Kaepernick stays, but if he does well, I hope we can somehow find a way to keep him. That will do even more to help with players willingness to come here, I'd think.

100% agree. Doc's point about NOT becoming the FQB he was paid to be screwed us as much as any dumbass FO move we made from a players perspective especially as it relates to free agents. I'm with you OTC, I want Kaepernick to become that leader and he and Kelly just absolutely kick ass and start turning our perception around across the league. Then if Kaepernick is having fun and wants to stay, we'll finally have a chance to attract some offensive FA's. We'll still draft a high QB to be smart/FA as Kelly is big on having two competent QB's d/t the injury risk.

As to defense, we're eff'd. With all the critical injuries and the affect the offense has on them, it's going to be ugly; really ugly and more injuries will come. I'd be shocked if we could buy ONE FA next year for defense. IMHO, we're going to have to rely on the draft for defense and development (with good health, which has been our achilles tendon; sorry Bow ). There's just no way around it.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

I truly wonder if anyone here remembers exactly how this FA went down. It had nothing to do wiht Baalke not being involved. It had everything to do with NOBODY wanting to come to a third world team. And if you are looking for reasons, I'll give you three. Owner...had just gotten thru the joke of the decade, tomsul. And then all the fallout that that entails. Then we had the fantastic QB situation which I never will forgive Kap for. He obviously ddint' want to be here and had tweeted or stated at various times he wanted to be a Jet...Brown...
Bill...and lastly a Bronco. And then when he tested the market , found out he was valued a less than half of what he was getting here. Suddenly he shows up in camp. Anybody that doesn't think kap's actions helped screw us over in FA is kidding themselves. Our own QB didn't want to be here....until I he found out his actual worth. In any event, his dissing the organization by saying he wanted to be elsewhere...and it literally seemed like anywhere....you really think that didn't send up a warning flare to FAs...don't come here? It did and Kap was a good part of the reason. Jed's tomsul hire was so laughed at by the NFL, that it was embarrassing. No one will ever forget that. And no FAs wanted any part of it either.

Lastly, any FA could look at or team and see:
No OL...NONE...there goes the O FAs.
No DL...well we had Ian and AA, but one was learning and the other had some nicks.
No DBs....True we had them, but only 1 true starter(maybe 2). But we drafted 3 DBs, which tells you....we were talent shy.
WRs...we had only Torrey and our crappy QB play kept him from making plays.
QB...Kap wanted out.
HC...just fired.....new HC had a "rep" and it wasn't universally good.
LBs...ummm, Bow and that was it.
In fact, top to bottom this team had REBUILD written all over it.

When FA started, NOBODY wanted to come here, despite TRent's try to get them. ILB Trevathan wanted to go elsewhere. Hardly anyone else would even talk to us. Result? We had tons of money and NO ONE wanted to play here.

And that, not Trent , was why no FAs were even interested in talking to us. Later we got Zane.

What a frigging mess....but it all started at the top with Jed's colossal screw up hire in 2015. Then it rolled downhill from there. Kap was just part of it.

What a terrific post doc. Well said. And I've got one more for you...agents. Agents go down the pros and cons of each location for their clients and they too have their recommendations (see also, Kaepernick, Colin). In fact, an agent was the one reason we DID sign a quality starting LG...Zane Beadles and his friendship with Joe Staley via their mutual agent.

As to the bold. This is why I maintain Baalke isn't going anywhere. He'll get another year from Jed to pick up his pieces and maybe more because they are now forced to build solely through the draft.

But then again, who knows what goes through Jed's mind.

This is why I'm praying that Kaepernick can do well enough to put us on the rise. People will see that the system works. I know it's very unlikely Kaepernick stays, but if he does well, I hope we can somehow find a way to keep him. That will do even more to help with players willingness to come here, I'd think.

100% agree. Doc's point about NOT becoming the FQB he was paid to be screwed us as much as any dumbass FO move we made from a players perspective especially as it relates to free agents. I'm with you OTC, I want Kaepernick to become that leader and he and Kelly just absolutely kick ass and start turning our perception around across the league. Then if Kaepernick is having fun and wants to stay, we'll finally have a chance to attract some offensive FA's. We'll still draft a high QB to be smart/FA as Kelly is big on having two competent QB's d/t the injury risk.

As to defense, we're eff'd. With all the critical injuries and the affect the offense has on them, it's going to be ugly; really ugly and more injuries will come. I'd be shocked if we could buy ONE FA next year for defense. IMHO, we're going to have to rely on the draft for defense and development (with good health, which has been our achilles tendon; sorry Bow ). There's just no way around it.

I'm trying not to think about it... It's just so painful being a 49ers fan these days. We're begging for the team to be consistently good again. We sucked for so long before Harbaugh because we fired another coach who was a winner -- one who probably wins the SB if Hearst doesn't get hurt. Again, a garbage GM won the power struggle there too. Just tired of this happening. If Kelly starts to win games, we can't just oust him at the first blip or bump in the road in the future.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Not much, NCommand, not much.

Can't help but think back to that day when Eddie D got caught wth $400,000 in his briefcase, that was buy in money for a riverboat casino in New Orleans. When the penalty finally came down it literally took my breath away. Who knew that Eddie being banned from the NFL, our/his penalty, would be a 25-yr penalty against the 49ers. Hasn't been that long yet, but we aren't out of the outhouse yet either.

Owners, what a weird strange thing. Look at the Cubs. They were last in the World Series in '08....1908 that is....108 yrs ago. I don't think it will take that long here, but short term, I am getting less and less certain how that plays out. We are desperately in need of a FR QB, WRs, ILB, OLB...and if you want to put FRanchise in front of all 3 of them, fine by me. The only short term fix I see is bringing a guy (that I completely hate) like Bellichek here, who I believe in spite of Jed , could turn this franchise around...oh, and it wouldn't hurt to bring his QB with him. Say offer him 3% ownership of the team. 3% of $3 Billion....I could see him interested in that. That isn't realistic, however, but is the only other way I can envision fixing the ownership problem. Somehow, I think Trent was hired to bring Jed along. ie, he has friends in high places, and that means Jed's parents. He was in scouting, and does have an eye for D talent. O talent...not so much....BUT , his hire of Chip, a guy who DOES have an eye for O talent, shows what having an offensive guy around can do.

Talk about Jed being schid canned is just talk. It ISN"T going to happen. How then to right this ship? OTC nailed it with FR QB, WR, and ILB. Frankly, I think chip can help us find the FR QB we need for now and into the future. Still as teams like Cleve have shown, even picking in top 1 or 2, FR QB. Is still a crapshoot. So I would keep Chip on as a talent scout, but as HC? Way too early to make any comment on that, other than the inescapable fact that he is hard headed in his play calling. But with talent lacking, literally everywhere , with the exception of OL, it isn't possible to grade Chip. He just hasn't had the horses. This yr, for first time in ages,, we DO have an OL.that is special. But folks, that is it. Everywhere else we got bupkis, altho a lot of injured talent on D, that MIGHT work out.

As Mayo says, I expect Kap to be every bit as good as Blaine....but no better. Also, getting rid of the most important player on the team, who for the entire off season advertised that he wanted to go elsewhere...is paramount. As in the sooner he is cut, the better. I hope he plays better than gab, but just don't see it. Even so, we will have THE guy, the guy who leads our team, around until we cut him. He is just poison on the team, and no one will convince me otherwise. Players have to have the attitude that they will do anything for their QB....but we have a young, athletic QB, who fails in the QB skills department, plus he has advertised to the rest of the league, he doesn't want to be here. And just how many guys will give their all to the highest paid player on the team...and everyone knows he wants out of here? How can the rest of the team give it all when they know their #1 guy wants out of here.? That is why we don't get better until Kap is gone. But compared to Jed, Kap is way down the list as far as problems go. Jed started at the bottom from an experience standpoint, He has learned, but his learning curve has hurt this team worse than any other one thing. He needs a mentor, and just guessing but my bet is that is Trent's main job...bringing Jed up to speed as being an owner. Right now Jed is radioactively toxic...and the rest of the league , and certainly the agents and players ...know it. And that just kills us in bringing in the top flite FAs we desperately need...,FR QB being at the top of that list.

So how do you make your owner into an Eddie D? Answer: you don't . It took some yrs , even with the GOAT HC/GM of all time, to get Eddie D in line. Thinking winning, not $$. Now the league has removed that incentive, and everyone works under the same umbrella dollarwise. So our savior, if there is to be one, is going to have to come from the HC...and he is going to have to teach Jed about winning. And there is another conundrum. How is Trent going to convince another HC to come here, especially a great one, knowing his boss is Jed? So for the time being, and into the near future, I think Trent stays. Not because he has done so well for us, but to help bring Jed along, slow as it is, into the upper echelon of owners. Forget firing Jed. He is the owner...or at least the owner's son. And no matter what, Jed stays. Trent's seemingly impossible job is going to be to get another GOAT HC. Bellichek is the closest thing to that, he has a fantastic owner in Kraft, and hence he is going nowhere. But that is the kind of thing that brings us back from the dark ages. Having a top five pick, in some yrs top 3, and one yr top pick...that will help. But we went down that path for 9 long yrs, and our HC, Harbaw, was a good organizer. He was not the QB whisperer he was made out to be. He just organized all that pent up high round talent but when it came to calling games, his OC was a FAIL...and obviously he wasn't much better. He did nothing to improve his hand picked QB, did nothing with player development, and in the end caused horrid team dissension. He did not deserve to be our HC. But that is fixed...and we have had no improvement on that to date...and last yr , of course, we got worse....way worse.

Chip gets no grade, as first off, we are only 5 games into his first season. Second, chip has an OL and nothing else. If all healthy, maybe we had a decent D, but we got nobody healthy at present. So no way to grade chip. I don't see him having any kind of positive learning experience for Jed, tho, so maybe in a yr...or two...we need someone else. The best idea advanced on these pages is to have a real football guy in charge of football ops, and a triumvirate under him of GM, HC, Wth Jed that isn't happening any time soon, but some day, maybe he will want to win moreso than be the chief of football ops, making all the football decisions. That probably is the way out of this mess, but is not in the near future....at least I don't think so, anyway.

can we get an applause please. probably the most accurate and correct post iv read on here in awhile. and what you said in your previous post is one of the huge KEY things people seem to not see. didnt matter how much money we had....it was clear that players were not coming here in free agency because they simply did not want to. theres NO WAY with almost 50$ million in extra money that baalke did not make at least one overpaying offer to a FA just to keep the fan base sane an save face. no way he didnt at least make one try.

with whats happend since 2014 were just the bonfire of the NFL right now.....the browns are more attractive than us right now. so i think we can get Free agents but only AFTER, we either start winning or get a new GM. players are waiting an watching to see what happens here before coming here, until then they dont wanna be involved in this mess and i dont blame them. they want to see us head in the right direction or at least something happen that gets us pointed in the right direction before they come here. because as of right now its made clear by the media were headed in the wrong direction. we can also thank the media for this downfall.....them overexposing and twisting an turning all these stories have only f**ked us even more.

i like the dream idea of bringing belichik in but realistically who knows. how long has he been in NE now? i wonder if he wants to retire there....i could see Jed bringing him in to give him total HC and GM power but isnt that already what he has in NE. what i think is more likely is them dumping brady in the next year or 2. belichek is notorious for letting GREAT players go a year or 2 right before they decline cause hes obviously football smarter than everyone else....an brady is from north bay hed be a great vet to bring in for a few years until we draft a QB an even better vet to develop a new QB for a few years. but if chips still our HC i dont see it....i consider brady the bext QB in the league but he is definitely not mobile enough for chip kelly an its not like hel get more mobile at 40. but we can dream.

idk if chips the answer.....i wanted hue jackson and then i wanted shanahan. chip was my last choice an i have a feeling our HC search went somethin like our FA search....we cudnt get anyone so we had to go with whoever would come. i REALLY wanted hue, he could turn this teeam around lets hope the cleveland curse gets him outta there in a couple years

Yes, OTC, that is the sad but only way to look at this. Once again , with all the injuries, we are going to sail thru the yr and once again not know what we have....mainly because half our potential starters are out . So next yr we start again where we should have been 2 months ago. This yr is going into our ever expanding column of "lost years". To not have the talent, actually be totally bereft of talent and then to get everyone injured...it is just more than one can fathom. I couldn't even watch the rest of the game last week. I am jsut heartsick about a team from Owner on down to last guy on the bench, and include all coaches, the GM in this....that just can't:

---Get it right

---Get healthy

---Get a FR QB, WR, ILB, OLB.(all of which need to be Franchise players)

---Get an owner who agrees to put all football matters into the hands of a triumvirate of Head of football ops, GM, and HC. We have been doing this piecemeal, and absent the 2nd coming of Bill Walsh, we are going to stagnate here until the very most important part...the top...is functioning as a unit. Jed continuing to be involved in choosing HCs, GMs, etc, is not going to get appreciably better until that is fixed.

Question: how do you separate an owner from his toy? Figure that one out and our biggest hurdle will be overcome. Also, we need to do some thinning out at the top. Having Paraag in charge of cap issues and contracts is one thing. If he is involved in anything else....well, I suggest he shouldn't be. And he isn't the only one. We got work to do, and we need a huge break way up high. Will it come to pass? Man I hope so, but think that as bad as things are now, we have to get way worse for that kind of change to take place. And THAT is depressing....truly and really.

Originally posted by Big_Daddy:

Originally posted by Blindfury:

Originally posted by Big_Daddy:
Please, anyone who brings up the word harbaugh is an idiot.

This was discussed ad naseum for years and I thought we finally got over the hump.

Just cause people want baalke gone, and I've finally converted to one of them, doesn't mean we need to bring back harbaugh.

Yea, a coach with the most all pros on his team than any other team didn't win a super bowl. Am I missing something??

f**k Jed and Fire baalke. I think he's ok but I don't trust him to draft offensive playmakers and that's what we need especially QB

The fact that you think Baalke is OK but think even lesser of Harbaugh is a little strange.

Saying things like "most all pros on his team than any other team didn't win a super bowl" is a ridiculous statment because once again it is void with context.

Harbaugh won many games when he was with us and this without a QB. Meanwhile Baalke has done nothing without Harbaugh. He isn't OK. He is a terrible GM and the Yorks are going to be laughed at for years picking a failure of GM over a guy who went to 3 straight championship games without a QB.

Always question people who make comments about having a terrible QB, then blame Harbaugh for not winning a superbowl with the terrible QB. But let Baalke off the hook for not being able to put a stacked team over the hump.

We play in a division with some of the best defenses in the league and the guy failed miserably at getting a #1 wr and/or playmakers. Fail on all accounts.

Harbaugh's got Michigan poised for National Championship. yea, Jed made an excellent move.

Harbaugh had more pro bowlers than anyone and failed to win a ring. What more context do you need?

Oh that's right he failed because he runs a simplistic college offense. That's why he's back in college the fact that he's doing well has nothing to do with his abilities in the pros. Guy couldn't even figure out how to snap it on time.

There are many reasons why our team sucks. Baalke is one of them. To bring up our other coach from years ago who also didn't win a super bowl is ridiculous towards the present conversation.

JH did NOT make those players Pro Bowlers at all!

They made themselves Pro Bowlers.

Justin and Aldon earned their status.

Aldon went in the toilet on his own.

Baalke is toast - we all know it.

What we don't know is, will he be replaced by another Parcell's clone or ????????

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Not much, NCommand, not much.

Can't help but think back to that day when Eddie D got caught wth $400,000 in his briefcase, that was buy in money for a riverboat casino in New Orleans. When the penalty finally came down it literally took my breath away. Who knew that Eddie being banned from the NFL, our/his penalty, would be a 25-yr penalty against the 49ers. Hasn't been that long yet, but we aren't out of the outhouse yet either.

Owners, what a weird strange thing. Look at the Cubs. They were last in the World Series in '08....1908 that is....108 yrs ago. I don't think it will take that long here, but short term, I am getting less and less certain how that plays out. We are desperately in need of a FR QB, WRs, ILB, OLB...and if you want to put FRanchise in front of all 3 of them, fine by me. The only short term fix I see is bringing a guy (that I completely hate) like Bellichek here, who I believe in spite of Jed , could turn this franchise around...oh, and it wouldn't hurt to bring his QB with him. Say offer him 3% ownership of the team. 3% of $3 Billion....I could see him interested in that. That isn't realistic, however, but is the only other way I can envision fixing the ownership problem. Somehow, I think Trent was hired to bring Jed along. ie, he has friends in high places, and that means Jed's parents. He was in scouting, and does have an eye for D talent. O talent...not so much....BUT , his hire of Chip, a guy who DOES have an eye for O talent, shows what having an offensive guy around can do.

Talk about Jed being schid canned is just talk. It ISN"T going to happen. How then to right this ship? OTC nailed it with FR QB, WR, and ILB. Frankly, I think chip can help us find the FR QB we need for now and into the future. Still as teams like Cleve have shown, even picking in top 1 or 2, FR QB. Is still a crapshoot. So I would keep Chip on as a talent scout, but as HC? Way too early to make any comment on that, other than the inescapable fact that he is hard headed in his play calling. But with talent lacking, literally everywhere , with the exception of OL, it isn't possible to grade Chip. He just hasn't had the horses. This yr, for first time in ages,, we DO have an OL.that is special. But folks, that is it. Everywhere else we got bupkis, altho a lot of injured talent on D, that MIGHT work out.

As Mayo says, I expect Kap to be every bit as good as Blaine....but no better. Also, getting rid of the most important player on the team, who for the entire off season advertised that he wanted to go elsewhere...is paramount. As in the sooner he is cut, the better. I hope he plays better than gab, but just don't see it. Even so, we will have THE guy, the guy who leads our team, around until we cut him. He is just poison on the team, and no one will convince me otherwise. Players have to have the attitude that they will do anything for their QB....but we have a young, athletic QB, who fails in the QB skills department, plus he has advertised to the rest of the league, he doesn't want to be here. And just how many guys will give their all to the highest paid player on the team...and everyone knows he wants out of here? How can the rest of the team give it all when they know their #1 guy wants out of here.? That is why we don't get better until Kap is gone. But compared to Jed, Kap is way down the list as far as problems go. Jed started at the bottom from an experience standpoint, He has learned, but his learning curve has hurt this team worse than any other one thing. He needs a mentor, and just guessing but my bet is that is Trent's main job...bringing Jed up to speed as being an owner. Right now Jed is radioactively toxic...and the rest of the league , and certainly the agents and players ...know it. And that just kills us in bringing in the top flite FAs we desperately need...,FR QB being at the top of that list.

So how do you make your owner into an Eddie D? Answer: you don't . It took some yrs , even with the GOAT HC/GM of all time, to get Eddie D in line. Thinking winning, not $$. Now the league has removed that incentive, and everyone works under the same umbrella dollarwise. So our savior, if there is to be one, is going to have to come from the HC...and he is going to have to teach Jed about winning. And there is another conundrum. How is Trent going to convince another HC to come here, especially a great one, knowing his boss is Jed? So for the time being, and into the near future, I think Trent stays. Not because he has done so well for us, but to help bring Jed along, slow as it is, into the upper echelon of owners. Forget firing Jed. He is the owner...or at least the owner's son. And no matter what, Jed stays. Trent's seemingly impossible job is going to be to get another GOAT HC. Bellichek is the closest thing to that, he has a fantastic owner in Kraft, and hence he is going nowhere. But that is the kind of thing that brings us back from the dark ages. Having a top five pick, in some yrs top 3, and one yr top pick...that will help. But we went down that path for 9 long yrs, and our HC, Harbaw, was a good organizer. He was not the QB whisperer he was made out to be. He just organized all that pent up high round talent but when it came to calling games, his OC was a FAIL...and obviously he wasn't much better. He did nothing to improve his hand picked QB, did nothing with player development, and in the end caused horrid team dissension. He did not deserve to be our HC. But that is fixed...and we have had no improvement on that to date...and last yr , of course, we got worse....way worse.

Chip gets no grade, as first off, we are only 5 games into his first season. Second, chip has an OL and nothing else. If all healthy, maybe we had a decent D, but we got nobody healthy at present. So no way to grade chip. I don't see him having any kind of positive learning experience for Jed, tho, so maybe in a yr...or two...we need someone else. The best idea advanced on these pages is to have a real football guy in charge of football ops, and a triumvirate under him of GM, HC, Wth Jed that isn't happening any time soon, but some day, maybe he will want to win moreso than be the chief of football ops, making all the football decisions. That probably is the way out of this mess, but is not in the near future....at least I don't think so, anyway.

I'm only going to disagree with you on one thing and that's Kaepernick's actions and your sense of hate. That one you should be pinning right back on Baalke and Jed - constant leaks and undermining of your QB is not how you run a franchise, and it's no wonder he wants out. Front office spends no money on talent, undermines you and blames you for the performance of Tomsula and then drops you after you play injured and you should stay??

You think free agents don't look at that behaviour and think f**k that?

Another week, another glaring reminder that Baalke has helped put us in this position. Front seven should be a priority, yet Trent has seemingly applied the backwards ideology of ranking DBs above all else on defense. When we go 3-13, I will continue to believe he needs to be fired.

Draft heavy on defense and still no positive results, wtf man

Originally posted by Buchy:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

Not much, NCommand, not much.

Can't help but think back to that day when Eddie D got caught wth $400,000 in his briefcase, that was buy in money for a riverboat casino in New Orleans. When the penalty finally came down it literally took my breath away. Who knew that Eddie being banned from the NFL, our/his penalty, would be a 25-yr penalty against the 49ers. Hasn't been that long yet, but we aren't out of the outhouse yet either.

Owners, what a weird strange thing. Look at the Cubs. They were last in the World Series in '08....1908 that is....108 yrs ago. I don't think it will take that long here, but short term, I am getting less and less certain how that plays out. We are desperately in need of a FR QB, WRs, ILB, OLB...and if you want to put FRanchise in front of all 3 of them, fine by me. The only short term fix I see is bringing a guy (that I completely hate) like Bellichek here, who I believe in spite of Jed , could turn this franchise around...oh, and it wouldn't hurt to bring his QB with him. Say offer him 3% ownership of the team. 3% of $3 Billion....I could see him interested in that. That isn't realistic, however, but is the only other way I can envision fixing the ownership problem. Somehow, I think Trent was hired to bring Jed along. ie, he has friends in high places, and that means Jed's parents. He was in scouting, and does have an eye for D talent. O talent...not so much....BUT , his hire of Chip, a guy who DOES have an eye for O talent, shows what having an offensive guy around can do.

Talk about Jed being schid canned is just talk. It ISN"T going to happen. How then to right this ship? OTC nailed it with FR QB, WR, and ILB. Frankly, I think chip can help us find the FR QB we need for now and into the future. Still as teams like Cleve have shown, even picking in top 1 or 2, FR QB. Is still a crapshoot. So I would keep Chip on as a talent scout, but as HC? Way too early to make any comment on that, other than the inescapable fact that he is hard headed in his play calling. But with talent lacking, literally everywhere , with the exception of OL, it isn't possible to grade Chip. He just hasn't had the horses. This yr, for first time in ages,, we DO have an OL.that is special. But folks, that is it. Everywhere else we got bupkis, altho a lot of injured talent on D, that MIGHT work out.

As Mayo says, I expect Kap to be every bit as good as Blaine....but no better. Also, getting rid of the most important player on the team, who for the entire off season advertised that he wanted to go elsewhere...is paramount. As in the sooner he is cut, the better. I hope he plays better than gab, but just don't see it. Even so, we will have THE guy, the guy who leads our team, around until we cut him. He is just poison on the team, and no one will convince me otherwise. Players have to have the attitude that they will do anything for their QB....but we have a young, athletic QB, who fails in the QB skills department, plus he has advertised to the rest of the league, he doesn't want to be here. And just how many guys will give their all to the highest paid player on the team...and everyone knows he wants out of here? How can the rest of the team give it all when they know their #1 guy wants out of here.? That is why we don't get better until Kap is gone. But compared to Jed, Kap is way down the list as far as problems go. Jed started at the bottom from an experience standpoint, He has learned, but his learning curve has hurt this team worse than any other one thing. He needs a mentor, and just guessing but my bet is that is Trent's main job...bringing Jed up to speed as being an owner. Right now Jed is radioactively toxic...and the rest of the league , and certainly the agents and players ...know it. And that just kills us in bringing in the top flite FAs we desperately need...,FR QB being at the top of that list.

So how do you make your owner into an Eddie D? Answer: you don't . It took some yrs , even with the GOAT HC/GM of all time, to get Eddie D in line. Thinking winning, not $$. Now the league has removed that incentive, and everyone works under the same umbrella dollarwise. So our savior, if there is to be one, is going to have to come from the HC...and he is going to have to teach Jed about winning. And there is another conundrum. How is Trent going to convince another HC to come here, especially a great one, knowing his boss is Jed? So for the time being, and into the near future, I think Trent stays. Not because he has done so well for us, but to help bring Jed along, slow as it is, into the upper echelon of owners. Forget firing Jed. He is the owner...or at least the owner's son. And no matter what, Jed stays. Trent's seemingly impossible job is going to be to get another GOAT HC. Bellichek is the closest thing to that, he has a fantastic owner in Kraft, and hence he is going nowhere. But that is the kind of thing that brings us back from the dark ages. Having a top five pick, in some yrs top 3, and one yr top pick...that will help. But we went down that path for 9 long yrs, and our HC, Harbaw, was a good organizer. He was not the QB whisperer he was made out to be. He just organized all that pent up high round talent but when it came to calling games, his OC was a FAIL...and obviously he wasn't much better. He did nothing to improve his hand picked QB, did nothing with player development, and in the end caused horrid team dissension. He did not deserve to be our HC. But that is fixed...and we have had no improvement on that to date...and last yr , of course, we got worse....way worse.

Chip gets no grade, as first off, we are only 5 games into his first season. Second, chip has an OL and nothing else. If all healthy, maybe we had a decent D, but we got nobody healthy at present. So no way to grade chip. I don't see him having any kind of positive learning experience for Jed, tho, so maybe in a yr...or two...we need someone else. The best idea advanced on these pages is to have a real football guy in charge of football ops, and a triumvirate under him of GM, HC, Wth Jed that isn't happening any time soon, but some day, maybe he will want to win moreso than be the chief of football ops, making all the football decisions. That probably is the way out of this mess, but is not in the near future....at least I don't think so, anyway.

I'm only going to disagree with you on one thing and that's Kaepernick's actions and your sense of hate. That one you should be pinning right back on Baalke and Jed - constant leaks and undermining of your QB is not how you run a franchise, and it's no wonder he wants out. Front office spends no money on talent, undermines you and blames you for the performance of Tomsula and then drops you after you play injured and you should stay??

You think free agents don't look at that behaviour and think f**k that?

I don't hate anybody, buchy, and I don't appreciate being accused of that. I don't care for Kap and cannot imagine him being on this team next yr. You have your opinion and I have mine. But I never said I hated anybody, and Kap in particular. That I think he is not a good player to have on a team which he very openly trashed, wishing instead to play for 4 other teams during his rehab period post op...did him no favors with 49er fans...most of them, anyway. Can you even remotely imagine Joe, or Steve doing that, no matter what happened here? Yeah, I can't either. That just isn't something a football player does. It's inexcusable, and adequate reason to wish him gone. I don't hate anybody, tho bubba, so keep that comment off here.

As for FO not spending money on FAs....you do realize that NO FAs wanted to come here because our QB, Kap , had been trashing our team. York's were ok with spending money, we were in the race for TRevathan, who ended up going to a team with a coach he had before. But main reason FAs didn't come here was our QB didn't want to be here either. And THAT, not the F.O was the reason we spent no money in FA. Trent was trying to land guys who with their agents knew that if our QB was trashing us, this place was toxic. That is what I hold against Kap. THAT! Yeah, his skills are not great, other than running, but the problem is that he advertised he didn't want to come back here....returning only when he finds out he is worth about 1/3 of what he was earning here. You cannot have that kind of guy leading your team. Not in my eyes, anyway.

Bye bye bye

This is painful to watch week after weak

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

This is painful to watch week after weak

Agreed. There is not an easy fix or much positive to look at to build upon either