There are 61 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

Smith, Tolzien thread. Yet again

Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Furlow:
You Smith haters are the ones that need to get over it. Just because we don't blindly believe Kaepernick is Jesus in cleats, and that Harbaugh can do no wrong, does not mean that we are "resentful" or "hating on" Kaep. It also does not mean we think Smith "should be starting" or any of the other crap that you guys are saying. The bottom line is that every single time someone says something remotely critical of Kaepernick, the come back is "well Alex couldn't do this or that." As if that is some type of valid excuse for Kaepernick's mistakes or shortcomings.

Well I guess it will be hard for you to follow this team for years to come. There isn't a single person here who thinks Kaep is perfect. I've seen many fair criticisms about him. My problem is with the people who make silly claims like Alex could have done better or Kaep's playing style is why the D has been terrible or questioning if Alex will win the QB battle next year. That kind of crap is pathetic. You are free to critique Kaep but there's really not much to critique him on. He has started 10 games and has done some amazing things. The only time I hear negativity about him is on here by fans who are so caught up in their adulation for Smith they can't appreciate how great Kaep has been in the grand scheme of things.

Smith can win one way and unfortunately, we don't have the D or special teams to rely on that kind of play from our QB. Best of luck to him on his new team.

considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Well, one experienced veteran guy had the #1 rated defense, kicker and return team and got as far as the NFCCG.

The other guy making only his 10th start didn't have any of those luxuries and still almost pulled off a Superbowl win.

This is futile though, I wish Alex Smith all the best in his next stop and hope all his supporters here will support the 49ers with Kaepernick. Because neither he or Harbaugh are going anywhere anytime soon.
Originally posted by diegosydney:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Furlow:
You Smith haters are the ones that need to get over it. Just because we don't blindly believe Kaepernick is Jesus in cleats, and that Harbaugh can do no wrong, does not mean that we are "resentful" or "hating on" Kaep. It also does not mean we think Smith "should be starting" or any of the other crap that you guys are saying. The bottom line is that every single time someone says something remotely critical of Kaepernick, the come back is "well Alex couldn't do this or that." As if that is some type of valid excuse for Kaepernick's mistakes or shortcomings.

Well I guess it will be hard for you to follow this team for years to come. There isn't a single person here who thinks Kaep is perfect. I've seen many fair criticisms about him. My problem is with the people who make silly claims like Alex could have done better or Kaep's playing style is why the D has been terrible or questioning if Alex will win the QB battle next year. That kind of crap is pathetic. You are free to critique Kaep but there's really not much to critique him on. He has started 10 games and has done some amazing things. The only time I hear negativity about him is on here by fans who are so caught up in their adulation for Smith they can't appreciate how great Kaep has been in the grand scheme of things.

Smith can win one way and unfortunately, we don't have the D or special teams to rely on that kind of play from our QB. Best of luck to him on his new team.

considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Well, one experienced veteran guy had the #1 rated defense, kicker and return team and got as far as the NFCCG.

The other guy making only his 10th start didn't have any of those luxuries and still almost pulled off a Superbowl win.

This is futile though, I wish Alex Smith all the best in his next stop and hope all his supporters here will support the 49ers with Kaepernick. Because neither he or Harbaugh are going anywhere anytime soon.

It has to do with principle, if one fails the other is going to struggle.

We failed to advance last year because of ST.

What I dont get is how some are labeled Alex supporters....shouldn't everybody support the player?
Originally posted by diegosydney:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Furlow:
You Smith haters are the ones that need to get over it. Just because we don't blindly believe Kaepernick is Jesus in cleats, and that Harbaugh can do no wrong, does not mean that we are "resentful" or "hating on" Kaep. It also does not mean we think Smith "should be starting" or any of the other crap that you guys are saying. The bottom line is that every single time someone says something remotely critical of Kaepernick, the come back is "well Alex couldn't do this or that." As if that is some type of valid excuse for Kaepernick's mistakes or shortcomings.

Well I guess it will be hard for you to follow this team for years to come. There isn't a single person here who thinks Kaep is perfect. I've seen many fair criticisms about him. My problem is with the people who make silly claims like Alex could have done better or Kaep's playing style is why the D has been terrible or questioning if Alex will win the QB battle next year. That kind of crap is pathetic. You are free to critique Kaep but there's really not much to critique him on. He has started 10 games and has done some amazing things. The only time I hear negativity about him is on here by fans who are so caught up in their adulation for Smith they can't appreciate how great Kaep has been in the grand scheme of things.

Smith can win one way and unfortunately, we don't have the D or special teams to rely on that kind of play from our QB. Best of luck to him on his new team.

considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Well, one experienced veteran guy had the #1 rated defense, kicker and return team and got as far as the NFCCG.

The other guy making only his 10th start didn't have any of those luxuries and still almost pulled off a Superbowl win.

This is futile though, I wish Alex Smith all the best in his next stop and hope all his supporters here will support the 49ers with Kaepernick. Because neither he or Harbaugh are going anywhere anytime soon.

I believe that label is used when the "support of the player" is in the context of claiming that somehow he would have overcome all the issues the team experienced Sunday (no pass rush, poor secondary play, bad calls, crap ST coverage, LMJ fumble, mysterious playcalling, 1 INT) when in fact the empirical evidence of his body of work would suggest the opposite.

That's a bit cumbersome though !
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by diegosydney:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Furlow:
You Smith haters are the ones that need to get over it. Just because we don't blindly believe Kaepernick is Jesus in cleats, and that Harbaugh can do no wrong, does not mean that we are "resentful" or "hating on" Kaep. It also does not mean we think Smith "should be starting" or any of the other crap that you guys are saying. The bottom line is that every single time someone says something remotely critical of Kaepernick, the come back is "well Alex couldn't do this or that." As if that is some type of valid excuse for Kaepernick's mistakes or shortcomings.

Well I guess it will be hard for you to follow this team for years to come. There isn't a single person here who thinks Kaep is perfect. I've seen many fair criticisms about him. My problem is with the people who make silly claims like Alex could have done better or Kaep's playing style is why the D has been terrible or questioning if Alex will win the QB battle next year. That kind of crap is pathetic. You are free to critique Kaep but there's really not much to critique him on. He has started 10 games and has done some amazing things. The only time I hear negativity about him is on here by fans who are so caught up in their adulation for Smith they can't appreciate how great Kaep has been in the grand scheme of things.

Smith can win one way and unfortunately, we don't have the D or special teams to rely on that kind of play from our QB. Best of luck to him on his new team.

considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Well, one experienced veteran guy had the #1 rated defense, kicker and return team and got as far as the NFCCG.

The other guy making only his 10th start didn't have any of those luxuries and still almost pulled off a Superbowl win.

This is futile though, I wish Alex Smith all the best in his next stop and hope all his supporters here will support the 49ers with Kaepernick. Because neither he or Harbaugh are going anywhere anytime soon.

It has to do with principle, if one fails the other is going to struggle.

We failed to advance last year because of ST.

What I dont get is how some are labeled Alex supporters....shouldn't everybody support the player?


I think the problem is that some people saw the same fans repeatedly defend Alex Smith whenever he was criticized and refuse to accept any criticism of his play who are now turning around and criticizing Kap in a manner that implies that Alex Smith should have remained the starter. Hey I'm just as guilty of having always defended Alex Smith, but now I recognize that Kap has superior talents. And I know that also some of the same people who criticized Alex now refuse to criticize Kap in the same manner, but to be honest, I don't think it's fair to compare criticism of an 8 year vet to criticism of a 10 game starter.
Originally posted by hofer36:
im not advocating this, as i think niners and smith are ready to part ways, but if as some think harbaugh suggested today that niners will keep smith, for whatever reason such as insurance in case kaepernick gets hurt, reasonable contract, unable to swing right trade, is there open competition for the qb position when camp opens? given harbaugh's past comments re how every position is open for competition, how could there not be

if not, what happens if smith outplays kaepernick in camp....

i see a real potential for the ir to be a divide among the team, and that is another reason to part ways

is this real life
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.
Originally posted by real9erfan:
I think the problem is that some people saw the same fans repeatedly defend Alex Smith whenever he was criticized and refuse to accept any criticism of his play who are now turning around and criticizing Kap in a manner that implies that Alex Smith should have remained the starter. Hey I'm just as guilty of having always defended Alex Smith, but now I recognize that Kap has superior talents. And I know that also some of the same people who criticized Alex now refuse to criticize Kap in the same manner, but to be honest, I don't think it's fair to compare criticism of an 8 year vet to criticism of a 10 game starter.

The bolded is the biggest thing. If in year 8, Kaep can't throw a fade then he will get criticized big time. If he's missing open receivers and making rookie mistakes he will get blamed. I doubt even the biggest Kaep supporter will give him 8 years of leeway.

That's what bothers me about the Kaep criticism. It seems to be harshest from those who were supporting Smith. Criticism will always be harsher on an 8 year vet over a guy starting for the 1st time. Kaep will get more leeway because it's probably his 1st time experiencing most things. Smith has had almost a decade of experience so when he makes mistakes that he really shouldn't make he will get criticized heavily for it. It is what it is.
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.

The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.

The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?

That was the season ranks.

After J. Smith went down, we were noticeably crappy on Defense, yet were able to beat high scoring teams like the Pats on the road, GB and ATL. Four TDs in one game? Was that likely for a guy who never accomplished that feat?

This Sunday, 300 yards for a 28-6 potential comeback. Is that likely with Smith, who had accomplished that feat twice in his career? How bout the 67 yards rushing and the rushing TD? How often do we have two 100 yard receivers?

We were pretty much swiss cheese defense, especially the secondary, the second Justin's pocket collapsing ability went away. We just fell short but again the secondary make mistake after mistake after mistake. Whitner and Culliver brought their F game and we still almost won.

We were down and unleashed explosive play making, we were about to get blown out with a lessor QB.
[ Edited by Young2Rice on Feb 5, 2013 at 8:03 PM ]
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.

The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?


In all honesty, who do you think is the better QB?
Originally posted by real9erfan:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.

The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?


In all honesty, who do you think is the better QB?

physically Keap, mentally Alex...in 2 years Keap will be on the same mental level as Alex
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.

The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?

That was the season ranks.

After J. Smith went down, we were noticeably crappy on Defense, yet were able to beat high scoring teams like the Pats on the road, GB and ATL. Four TDs in one game? Was that likely for a guy who never accomplished that feat?

This Sunday, 300 yards for a 28-6 potential comeback. Is that likely with Smith, who had accomplished that feat twice in his career? How bout the 67 yards rushing and the rushing TD? How often do we have two 100 yard receivers?

We were pretty much swiss cheese defense, especially the secondary, the second Justin's pocket collapsing ability went away. We just fell short but again the secondary make mistake after mistake after mistake. Whitner and Culliver brought their F game and we still almost won.

We were down and unleashed explosive play making, we were about to get blown out with a lessor QB.
Yes the D played worse but a bad 9er D is still better than most D's on a good day. Being that we have been very slow on O to start games the past few weeks....the blame falls on both sides of the ball. If the O was playing the first half like they have played the 2nd half the score would be much different.
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by real9erfan:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by jreff22:
considering many are blaming the D it looks like neither can win without a strong performance from the D

Kaep has proven that he can win consistently with a poor performing D. He's the only QB on this roster who has.

The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?


In all honesty, who do you think is the better QB?

physically Keap, mentally Alex...in 2 years Keap will be on the same mental level as Alex


Ok, fair enough.
Originally posted by jreff22:
The D was ranked in the top 5 in almost every category this year.....far from poor.

How many comebacks did Alex have last year?

How was the D in the last 5 games of the season?

The D gave up 34, 42, 31, 24, 34 points in 5 of the last 6 games (there was a pick 6 and a KR in there somwhere). Is that top 5 to you, sir?

Our D took advantage of weaker offensive teams. Good offensive teams did quite well.

As far as Smith's comebacks... where were they this year? Still, Colin's have been far more impressive since he had to come back from larger scores under tougher circumstances against better defenses and actually had to push the ball downfield and use his legs whereas Smith was able to use the running game and a record breaking kicker to help him.

There is no one on this planet besides the few that live on this board that think Alex could come back against Atlanta or Baltimore...those games would have been blowouts IMO just like the Giants game this year. Smith has not done well against good defenses.
Originally posted by jreff22:
physically Keap, mentally Alex...in 2 years Keap will be on the same mental level as Alex

I'm not even sure about that.
Search Podcast Draft Forum Commentary News Shop Home