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Who Needs to Win More on Saturday? Ques from NFL AM

Who Needs to Win More on Saturday? Ques from NFL AM

This morning on NFL AM, they posted a great question for debate. And it was who needs the win more on Saturday?

I'm trying to remember what they all said, so please dont quote me exactly, but it's almost verbatum.

M. Kriegal--- "Definitely Harbaugh, 70 % completion rate, top 5 QB, helped get your team to the playoffs, I just think it's an unprecedented move. If this little experiment doesnt work, and they lose this game, people will question Harbaugh, and his players will, and fan base as well. Some like to act like it wont be a big deal but he'll have a lot of answering to do, for what he thought was gonna work. You do know that even tho he made the change, he could be wrong as well right. Lets not take that out of the realm just because he's the HC."

S.Wyche--- "Kaepernick definitely, he was put in prematurely, and has done some good thing. And dont get me wrong the kid has skills, but I still cant see making this QB change when it didnt have to be made. I understand that Harbs feels that Kaep may be the one to take them over the top. I just think he should of waited, and this Saturday, it's part of the reason why I think that Rodgers and Co. will win this Saturday.

E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."

Then it became Davis vs. Wyche and Kriegal. IN which the jist of what they said was this, Davis, continued in regards to there was no guarantee that they would of won with Smith, and they said yeah your right, but you dont bench a guy that just got u almost a game within the SB, he starts 6-2, top 5 QB, 70% completion, And has proved he could win a playoff game the first time he got in one.

Was a pretty heated debate I have to say. What do u guys think?
[ Edited by Jersey9er on Jan 9, 2013 at 9:31 AM ]
as unfair as it may seem on the surface, this team needs a win saturday to get back to the nfc title game to justify the qb switch. i know its 2 different seasons but getting further the year prior with the qb you benched is not a good look.
I'm really tired of rehashing this issue from every possible angle over and over and over again. The 49ers need to win, period.
.
[ Edited by crabman82 on Jan 9, 2013 at 9:35 AM ]
Originally posted by real9erfan:
I'm really tired of rehashing this issue from every possible angle over and over and over again. The 49ers need to win, period.

not about rehashing, just a matter of NFL analysts discussing a real issue. I mean we could all just shut up, go with status quo, not debate, not worry, but i mean the whole point of the zone is to do just those things. Even with things in life, everything is not always black and white, and neither is this topic. which is why it was discussed.

And it's pretty cool, whenever we are talked about in the media. And even tho some of us may not like the questioning, the statement, to talk about it, doesnt mean it isnt reality in today's NFL. just the nature of the beast thats all.
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by real9erfan:
I'm really tired of rehashing this issue from every possible angle over and over and over again. The 49ers need to win, period.

not about rehashing, just a matter of NFL analysts discussing a real issue. I mean we could all just shut up, go with status quo, not debate, not worry, but i mean the whole point of the zone is to do just those things. Even with things in life, everything is not always black and white, and neither is this topic. which is why it was discussed.

And it's pretty cool, whenever we are talked about in the media. And even tho some of us may not like the questioning, the statement, to talk about it, doesnt mean it isnt reality in today's NFL. just the nature of the beast thats all.


No I understand, I'm not trying to criticize you for starting the thread. I just feel like I want the game to start already and personally I can't take anymore analysis of every angle of every issue surrounding this game. Maybe I'm just getting increasingly anxious as the week progresses. Also, I really don't think this issue will be as big as everyone is making it out to be. Would we feel better if the 49ers lose with Alex Smith as QB? A loss is a loss. Sure the whole QB change adds a little drama to the whole thing, but what's really going to happen if they lose? Harbaugh will answer some questions and we'll move on to the offseason, with the hope that we will come back better next year.
eric davis......lol


It is a given that we will be in the superbowl.
E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."



bingo
Originally posted by susweel:
E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."



bingo

classic argument technique is to restate other sides position to something more than it is, then argue from it...
i have seen no one say niners were guaranteed to get to or win super bowl with Smith
the argument has instead been that many feel niners chances of doing so were better with Smith as the QB
those supporting the change dont want to argue that point, so they restate the argument of those opposing the move to the Niners were guaranteed to do so with Smith

if the argument for the switch is so compelling why do those supporting it have to go to such lengths to distort the other side?
[ Edited by hofer36 on Jan 9, 2013 at 10:24 AM ]
Originally posted by real9erfan:
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by real9erfan:
I'm really tired of rehashing this issue from every possible angle over and over and over again. The 49ers need to win, period.

not about rehashing, just a matter of NFL analysts discussing a real issue. I mean we could all just shut up, go with status quo, not debate, not worry, but i mean the whole point of the zone is to do just those things. Even with things in life, everything is not always black and white, and neither is this topic. which is why it was discussed.

And it's pretty cool, whenever we are talked about in the media. And even tho some of us may not like the questioning, the statement, to talk about it, doesnt mean it isnt reality in today's NFL. just the nature of the beast thats all.


No I understand, I'm not trying to criticize you for starting the thread. I just feel like I want the game to start already and personally I can't take anymore analysis of every angle of every issue surrounding this game. Maybe I'm just getting increasingly anxious as the week progresses. Also, I really don't think this issue will be as big as everyone is making it out to be. Would we feel better if the 49ers lose with Alex Smith as QB? A loss is a loss. Sure the whole QB change adds a little drama to the whole thing, but what's really going to happen if they lose? Harbaugh will answer some questions and we'll move on to the offseason, with the hope that we will come back better next year.

Thanks for explaining, and i felt the same way. i wasnt talking directly to ya, just speaking in generalities. Yeah, I have to say I too cant wait till Saturday. The only thing with your reply is the last line. Thats why I think it's a big deal. As you know, we dont even know whats gonna happen next game. Let alone next year. As Justin Smith said, "You cant worry about next year, if you have the chance to win, then you win now, you dont know if your gonna have the same success next year".

Just in my personal opinion, it's been almost what 8 years since we made it to the playoffs. Then we made it last year, then we made it again this year. And trying to go even farther. With the rise of the Hawks, the cards finding a new QB, and better oline, and maybe even the rams too. will all be better next year. This is the last year, we'll get this kind of situation where tons of things fell our way. For example, look at the defense. +28 TO differential. Unheard of. But u see how we all knew that there was no way in hell they could produce that again. Some of us wanted to think they could, but with the changing NFL, it was almost impossible.

I personally cant think about next year, because if we dont make it this year. For me it will be much harder to swallow. Ok lemme stop talking now, cuz just thinking of not making it to the championship game or the SB this year, just turns my stomach.

Go niners!
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by susweel:
E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."


bingo

classic argument technique is to restate other sides position to something more than it is, then argue from it...
i have seen no one say niners were guaranteed to get to or win super bowl with Smith
the argument has instead been that many feel niners chances of doing so were better with Smith as the QB
those supporting the change dont want to argue that point, so they restate the argument of those opposing the move to the Niners were guaranteed to do so with Smith

if the argument for the switch is so compelling why do those supporting it have to go to such lengths to distort the other side?

Because it's surprising that people are so confident in Smith's ability despite evidence to the contrary against NYG and MIN. Furthermore, CK7 passes the eye test, in that he adds two dimensions to the attack that Alex Smith did not. People defending the decision assume detractors are starting from the basis that the end result was going to be a Super Bowl with Alex BECAUSE there is no other logical reason for thinking Alex was the better choice.

The decision was not fair. Plain and simple. That's really tough for people to come to grips with. It's not about fair. I have confidence in CK7 in pretty much any setting but @ Seattle. Fortunately, we don't have to deal with that.

If we get down quick in any game, I'm not as confident in Alex. I don't think anyone can tie stats to it or true logical reasoning. It's just a gut feel.
Originally posted by susweel:
E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."


bingo
c/s. Nationally folks didn't stop s**tting on Smith til he was benched. Before that he was just meh. Now magically his play would guarantee a SB victory.
[ Edited by lamontb on Jan 9, 2013 at 10:48 AM ]
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by susweel:
E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."


bingo

classic argument technique is to restate other sides position to something more than it is, then argue from it...
i have seen no one say niners were guaranteed to get to or win super bowl with Smith
the argument has instead been that many feel niners chances of doing so were better with Smith as the QB
those supporting the change dont want to argue that point, so they restate the argument of those opposing the move to the Niners were guaranteed to do so with Smith

if the argument for the switch is so compelling why do those supporting it have to go to such lengths to distort the other side?

Right. It's not clear and Harbaugh said so. He only said he felt Kap gave them a better chance at winning. His belief is so strong that he is willing to bench a good QB in Smith. The argument is really whether this belief is worth breaking the unsaid rule of not being benched due to injury. Frankly, that's the coaches call. Always has been.

But the original question is who needs the win more. I have to agree with E.Davis, it's team, and it's always been true. The 49ers are significantly bringing up ticket prices in 2014 and are trying to sell SBL licenses. Winning teams draw larger fan base and more demand for tickets and SBLs. If team does not win, then demand wane, which leads to less revenue, and less to spend on the roster leads to lower talent level. A spiraling effect we've witnessed in recent years.
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by susweel:
E. Davis----"Ok, how can you ask who needs it more. It's a loaded question. The team needs it more. I mean I understand what your saying. Harbs made the change because he felt that Kaep would take them farther this year. Simple as that, now if it doesnt pan out then so be it, and Harbs will have to answer some questions. But i mean you guys act like they were guarenteed to win a SB with A. Smith. He made a decision, and if it was the wrong one, then he'll have to atone for that. But it was his decision."


bingo
c/s. Nationally folks didn't stop s**tting on Smith til he was benched. Before that he was just meh. Now magically his play would guarantee a SB victory.

This.
[ Edited by horsecore on Jan 9, 2013 at 10:54 AM ]
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by real9erfan:
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by real9erfan:
I'm really tired of rehashing this issue from every possible angle over and over and over again. The 49ers need to win, period.

not about rehashing, just a matter of NFL analysts discussing a real issue. I mean we could all just shut up, go with status quo, not debate, not worry, but i mean the whole point of the zone is to do just those things. Even with things in life, everything is not always black and white, and neither is this topic. which is why it was discussed.

And it's pretty cool, whenever we are talked about in the media. And even tho some of us may not like the questioning, the statement, to talk about it, doesnt mean it isnt reality in today's NFL. just the nature of the beast thats all.


No I understand, I'm not trying to criticize you for starting the thread. I just feel like I want the game to start already and personally I can't take anymore analysis of every angle of every issue surrounding this game. Maybe I'm just getting increasingly anxious as the week progresses. Also, I really don't think this issue will be as big as everyone is making it out to be. Would we feel better if the 49ers lose with Alex Smith as QB? A loss is a loss. Sure the whole QB change adds a little drama to the whole thing, but what's really going to happen if they lose? Harbaugh will answer some questions and we'll move on to the offseason, with the hope that we will come back better next year.

Thanks for explaining, and i felt the same way. i wasnt talking directly to ya, just speaking in generalities. Yeah, I have to say I too cant wait till Saturday. The only thing with your reply is the last line. Thats why I think it's a big deal. As you know, we dont even know whats gonna happen next game. Let alone next year. As Justin Smith said, "You cant worry about next year, if you have the chance to win, then you win now, you dont know if your gonna have the same success next year".

Just in my personal opinion, it's been almost what 8 years since we made it to the playoffs. Then we made it last year, then we made it again this year. And trying to go even farther. With the rise of the Hawks, the cards finding a new QB, and better oline, and maybe even the rams too. will all be better next year. This is the last year, we'll get this kind of situation where tons of things fell our way. For example, look at the defense. +28 TO differential. Unheard of. But u see how we all knew that there was no way in hell they could produce that again. Some of us wanted to think they could, but with the changing NFL, it was almost impossible.

I personally cant think about next year, because if we dont make it this year. For me it will be much harder to swallow. Ok lemme stop talking now, cuz just thinking of not making it to the championship game or the SB this year, just turns my stomach.

Go niners!


Oh don't get me wrong; I'm not thinking about next year right now. I'm saying that IF they lose, all we can do is move on and HOPE for the best next year. Right now I'm not expecting the Niners to lose (I think they SHOULD beat the Packers) and I agree that when you get there you need to get the job done, because you never know what you will be facing the next year. Heck, we don't even know all the players we will have on the roster. In any case, let's WIN THIS YEAR!!!

GO NINERS!!! GO KAP!!!