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If Roman leaves, who would you want at OC?

If Roman leaves, who would you want at OC?

Roman barely has his feet wet as an NFL coordinator. How in the hell can anyone seriously consider him for head coach? I don't understand it but don't really care. The system will remain in place and that is what is important I guess. Hopefully if he leaves he takes the pistol formation with him. Having said that I really wish he would stay a couple more years. If we can't get more than two years out of an offensive coodinator, its going to be tough to remain somewhat consistent even with the system still in place. If his replacement does well then hes going to be out in one to two years too. Not good enough. We've been burning through OC's like bums do crack and it must stop.
If Chryst is calling the Red Zone Offense then I don't want him as OC.
  • sfout
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Originally posted by PhillyNiner:
Agreed Phoenix.... you guys have think about this logically, how would that even work. First of all someone would have to decide if it was a run or a pass when outside the redzone, then the coach assigned the run or pass would have to make a call, then it would have to go to Harbaugh who would say yes/no. If no then it would have to back etc...then if its in the redzone its a different coach all together who gets to choose run or pass but call his own play? No way...it would be too chaotic, you would never get the play in. They may all draw up plays during the week, but Roman is the guy who gets to pick those plays once live bullets are being fired.

That is exactly what happens even if Roman is calling a string of plays and Chryst and Morton aren't calling any, Roman picks the play and sends it down to Harbaugh who OKs or vetoes it.

The media has already written about it several times in the past 2 years. It was somewhat of a problem with Alex but because of his experience and ability to pick up the system it seemed as if he was able to call his own audible or always defaulted to a much simpler play rather then trying to change to the "perfect" play. The issue only got highlighted further by the change to Kaepernick and his lack of experience compounded the issue. It also seemed as if Kaepernick for some strange reason had more complex audible calls like one a seriously heard "Black Bear Oil" compared to Alex who always said "kill" or "roll" and I believe how many times he said kill or if he said let it roll changed the call even more.

You guys either dont read the articles linked from this website or aren't paying attention to it because that is exactly how Harbaugh runs the system. Greg Roman is the primary play caller on game day but any given point Morton could be calling plays and when the team is in the red zone Chryst calls the plays -- every play and its primary audible is sent to Harbaugh and OKs it or picks the audible and gives the QB the right to pick the 2 or switch to different play.
[ Edited by sfout on Jan 9, 2013 at 8:16 AM ]
Originally posted by sfout:
That is exactly what happens even if Roman is calling a string of plays and Chryst and Morton aren't calling any, Roman picks the play and sends it down to Harbaugh who OKs or vetoes it.

The media has already written about it several times in the past 2 years. It was somewhat of a problem with Alex but because of his experience and ability to pick up the system it seemed as if he was able to call his own audible or always defaulted to a much simpler play rather then trying to change to the "perfect" play. The issue only got highlighted further by the change to Kaepernick and his lack of experience compounded the issue. It also seemed as if Kaepernick for some strange reason had more complex audible calls like one a seriously heard "Black Bear Oil" compared to Alex who always said "kill" or "roll" and I believe how many times he said kill or if he said let it roll changed the call even more.

You guys either dont read the articles linked from this website or aren't paying attention to it because that is exactly how Harbaugh runs the system. Greg Roman is the primary play caller on game day but any given point Morton could be calling plays and when the team is in the red zone Chryst calls the plays -- every play and its primary audible is sent to Harbaugh and OKs it or picks the audible and gives the QB the right to pick the 2 or switch to different play.

This is simply NOT true, seriously, where the heck are you getting this from? There is nothing to support your conclusions. Roman is the playcaller, whether its running the ball, passing the ball, or in the red zone. Harbaugh can "veto" supposedly, but how often that actually happens is unknown, mostly he simply relays the playcall to the quarterback.

I think the issue is that you're simply not understanding what has been reported, nobody would run a system like that in the NFL with up to 4 different people calling the plays, that's just insanity. Chryst and Morton help with designing the gameplan, that is it.
[ Edited by Phoenix49ers on Jan 9, 2013 at 8:19 AM ]
I think it will be Chryst but one possibility to be OC or maybe even qb coach is Jeff Tedford
  • sfout
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Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by sfout:
That is exactly what happens even if Roman is calling a string of plays and Chryst and Morton aren't calling any, Roman picks the play and sends it down to Harbaugh who OKs or vetoes it.

The media has already written about it several times in the past 2 years. It was somewhat of a problem with Alex but because of his experience and ability to pick up the system it seemed as if he was able to call his own audible or always defaulted to a much simpler play rather then trying to change to the "perfect" play. The issue only got highlighted further by the change to Kaepernick and his lack of experience compounded the issue. It also seemed as if Kaepernick for some strange reason had more complex audible calls like one a seriously heard "Black Bear Oil" compared to Alex who always said "kill" or "roll" and I believe how many times he said kill or if he said let it roll changed the call even more.

You guys either dont read the articles linked from this website or aren't paying attention to it because that is exactly how Harbaugh runs the system. Greg Roman is the primary play caller on game day but any given point Morton could be calling plays and when the team is in the red zone Chryst calls the plays -- every play and its primary audible is sent to Harbaugh and OKs it or picks the audible and gives the QB the right to pick the 2 or switch to different play.

This is simply NOT true, seriously, where the heck are you getting this from? There is nothing to support your conclusions. Roman is the playcaller, whether its running the ball, passing the ball, or in the red zone. Harbaugh can "veto" supposedly, but how often that actually happens is unknown, mostly he simply relays the playcall to the quarterback.

I think the issue is that you're simply not understanding what has been reported, nobody would run a system like that in the NFL with up to 4 different people calling the plays, that's just insanity. Chryst and Morton help with designing the gameplan, that is it.

I'm not going to go back and look for it but go back to the news articles right after the Saints Divisional game and they talk about it a lot. Go back to the Smith to Kaepernick switch and they talk about it more.

Look man I dont know why you're disagreeing with me on it but the media has reported on it 10s of times over the past 2 years. if you dont believe me then fine but I've read it from MM, Barrows, Branch, pretty much every beat writer for the 9ers.

Yes they each design their aspect of the game plan but I've read that they've had Morton and Chryst call plays at certain points of the game or at a bare minimum they chirp in about which play would work best based on the coverage they are watching the defense play in.

Go tweet them about it if you feel the need to prove me wrong, I couldn't care less if I'm "wrong" or only partially correct - my entire point is I've read it countless times and its the entire reason why we take so long getting plays in.
[ Edited by sfout on Jan 9, 2013 at 9:17 AM ]
Originally posted by sfout:
I'm not going to go back and look for it but go back to the news articles right after the Saints Divisional game and they talk about it a lot. Go back to the Smith to Kaepernick switch and they talk about it more.

Look man I dont know why you're disagreeing with me on it but the media has reported on it 10s of times over the past 2 years. if you dont believe me then fine but I've read it from MM, Barrows, Branch, pretty much every beat writer for the 9ers.

Yes they each design their aspect of the game plan but I've read that they've had Morton and Chryst call plays at certain points of the game or at a bare minimum they chirp in about which play would work best based on the coverage they are watching the defense play in.

Go tweet them about it if you feel the need to prove me wrong, I couldn't care less if I'm "wrong" or only partially correct - my entire point is I've read it countless times and its the entire reason why we take so long getting plays in.

Yes, I read those same exact articles, and yes, several other people misunderstood them in the same fashion that you have.

http://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/2012/12/inside-the-49ers/harbaugh-greg-roman-is-the-play-caller/

SANTA CLARA – Thursday, the Santa Rosa Press Democrat learned the 49ers divvy up the offensive game planning. Today, I asked Jim Harbaugh if they divvy up the play calling, too.

ME: Does Greg Roman call all of the offensive plays during the game, or does John Morton call the pass plays, and Geep Chryst the red zone plays?

HARBAUGH: I think we've gone over this multiple times. Greg Roman is the play caller.


The original article that got everyone up in arms discussed Chryst and Morton handling gameplanning duties, but said NOTHING about gamecalling and yet many made the same, and incorrect, inference from that article.

Perhaps the original article, where all of the following articles seemed to have been linked to, was poorly written, but the 49ers don't do anything that other teams don't do. Most teams have various assistants heavily involved in gameplanning, however when the game is actually going on, the respective coordinators or head coach are the ones making the call and choosing what plays to utilize or not utilize.


So no, neither Chryst nor Morton are calling plays whatsoever, the playcalling comes down to Roman during the game, and potentially Harbaugh if he decides to change up something for whatever reason.
[ Edited by Phoenix49ers on Jan 9, 2013 at 9:33 AM ]
Originally posted by RollinWith21n52:
I'll take Chris Ault to install the pistol full-time, and finally bring it to the NFL. Time to start innovating in SF once again.


Ditto... And Chris Ault just stepped down as HC of Nevada... Coincidence?? Hmmmmm
Originally posted by A9R4Life:
Ditto... And Chris Ault just stepped down as HC of Nevada... Coincidence?? Hmmmmm

Yes, a college coach with no professional gamecalling experience running a gimmick offense that just resulted in one of the NFL's top young stars being put out of commission. Sounds like a recipe for success.
  • sfout
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Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by sfout:
I'm not going to go back and look for it but go back to the news articles right after the Saints Divisional game and they talk about it a lot. Go back to the Smith to Kaepernick switch and they talk about it more.

Look man I dont know why you're disagreeing with me on it but the media has reported on it 10s of times over the past 2 years. if you dont believe me then fine but I've read it from MM, Barrows, Branch, pretty much every beat writer for the 9ers.

Yes they each design their aspect of the game plan but I've read that they've had Morton and Chryst call plays at certain points of the game or at a bare minimum they chirp in about which play would work best based on the coverage they are watching the defense play in.

Go tweet them about it if you feel the need to prove me wrong, I couldn't care less if I'm "wrong" or only partially correct - my entire point is I've read it countless times and its the entire reason why we take so long getting plays in.

Yes, I read those same exact articles, and yes, several other people misunderstood them in the same fashion that you have.

http://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/2012/12/inside-the-49ers/harbaugh-greg-roman-is-the-play-caller/

SANTA CLARA – Thursday, the Santa Rosa Press Democrat learned the 49ers divvy up the offensive game planning. Today, I asked Jim Harbaugh if they divvy up the play calling, too.

ME: Does Greg Roman call all of the offensive plays during the game, or does John Morton call the pass plays, and Geep Chryst the red zone plays?

HARBAUGH: I think we've gone over this multiple times. Greg Roman is the play caller.


The original article that got everyone up in arms discussed Chryst and Morton handling gameplanning duties, but said NOTHING about gamecalling and yet many made the same, and incorrect, inference from that article.

Perhaps the original article, where all of the following articles seemed to have been linked to, was poorly written, but the 49ers don't do anything that other teams don't do. Most teams have various assistants heavily involved in gameplanning, however when the game is actually going on, the respective coordinators or head coach are the ones making the call and choosing what plays to utilize or not utilize.


So no, neither Chryst nor Morton are calling plays whatsoever, the playcalling comes down to Roman during the game, and potentially Harbaugh if he decides to change up something for whatever reason.

Like I said I couldn't care less. but you neglected to post the 2nd half of the article

ME: When you're on the sideline, are you only hearing one voice in the headset?

HARBAUGH: I don't really feel the need to dissect it.

Harbaugh didn't quite answer my question. I think he's suggesting that Greg Roman is the one person calling the plays through the headset during the games, although he never actually said it.

If my interpretation is correct, that means while John Morton puts together the game plan for the pass game, and Geep Chryst puts together the game plan for the red zone, Greg Roman calls all the plays during the game – not just the run plays.

Is this how you interpret it? Do you think it makes a difference if there is one voice in Harbaugh's headset or if there are three voices?

Harbaugh is a man of mystery and does everything outside of the box and he will say whatever it is you want to hear.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/matt-maiocco/chryst-controls-49ers-two-minute-offense

SANTA CLARA -- Quarterback Alex Smithhad his play call for a crucial third-and-3 play with 2:18 remaining against the New Orleans Saints.Smith began to give the call to his 11 teammates in the huddle . . . and that's when tight endJustin Peelle noticed there was one extra 49ers player listening to Smith in the huddle. Peelle gave Bruce Miller a shove to get him off the field.But it was too late. The 49ers were called for 12 men in the huddle to change it from third-and-3 to third-and-8.After the 49ers called a timeout, Smith said the play call was "totally different." He would not reveal what the 49ers were prepared to call on third-and-3, but everyone knows that Smith took off around left end for 28 yards and a touchdown on a quarterback keeper on third-and-8.Offensive coordinator Greg Roman "suggested" that call, 49ers coach Jim Harbaugh said. But it was quarterbacks coach Geep Chryst who made all the calls on the next drive, during the final two-minute drill."And Geep called the Vernon Davis touchdown and that whole two-minute drive there at the end," Harbaugh said. "That was coming from Geep."This is the first time that Harbaugh has pinpointed to someone other than Roman calling offensive plays. And it also might provide a clue to those who wondering which assistant would be next in line for offensive coordinator."We all work together, pretty much suffice it to say," Harbaugh said. "Press box (Roman), field, me, Geep, (receivers coach) Johnnie Morton, everybody in the offense is connected."Harbaugh continues to be the coach on the sideline who relays the play calls via radio transmitter to Smith.

Seriously is it so weird that Harbaugh does something different or is this the straw that breaks the camel's back and Harbaugh would just be stupid to do it????

He flat out states that Roman "suggested" the call -- a phrase I used in my early post and that Geep Chryst PHYSICALLY called the 2 minute drill at the end of the game.

He even states that while Roman is calling down from the booth to Morton, Chryst, and Harbaugh that Harbaugh is the one who relays the plays to Smith via the ear piece inside the helmet. I don't like it but it is what is and this is our coaching philosophy and it wont change.

My entire damn point is that the is a point A. Roman + point B. sideline personel/Harbaugh + point C. Alex/Kaepernick and that if we cut out Roman and replace him with someone the entire system will stay the same.

and clearly based on the in-game situation sometimes the order of those 3 points gets changed around.

If we bring in Turner we're not magically switching to the digit system, same with Shurmur, same with any other OC who could be brought in from the outside, they will add their 2 cents in the same manner that Roman, Chryst, and Morton do, which is why if we replace Roman it will be coach with running background.

Harbaugh is the end all be all of this scheme, it does not matter who the OC is. Now let it go, I don't care if I'm completely wrong, partially right, or 100% right but the fact of the matter is that Harbaugh knows the strengths of his personel and will allow them to use their abilities as the in-game situation dictates.

Now for Christ's sake let this go and we can agree to disagree.
[ Edited by sfout on Jan 9, 2013 at 9:53 AM ]
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Yes, a college coach with no professional gamecalling experience running a gimmick offense that just resulted in one of the NFL's top young stars being put out of commission. Sounds like a recipe for success.

Ha ha. So cynical.
Originally posted by sfout:
Like I said I couldn't care less. but you neglected to post the 2nd half of the article

ME: When you're on the sideline, are you only hearing one voice in the headset?

HARBAUGH: I don't really feel the need to dissect it.

Harbaugh didn't quite answer my question. I think he's suggesting that Greg Roman is the one person calling the plays through the headset during the games, although he never actually said it.

If my interpretation is correct, that means while John Morton puts together the game plan for the pass game, and Geep Chryst puts together the game plan for the red zone, Greg Roman calls all the plays during the game – not just the run plays.

Is this how you interpret it? Do you think it makes a difference if there is one voice in Harbaugh's headset or if there are three voices?

Harbaugh is a man of mystery and does everything outside of the box and he will say whatever it is you want to hear.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/matt-maiocco/chryst-controls-49ers-two-minute-offense

SANTA CLARA -- Quarterback Alex Smithhad his play call for a crucial third-and-3 play with 2:18 remaining against the New Orleans Saints.Smith began to give the call to his 11 teammates in the huddle . . . and that's when tight endJustin Peelle noticed there was one extra 49ers player listening to Smith in the huddle. Peelle gave Bruce Miller a shove to get him off the field.But it was too late. The 49ers were called for 12 men in the huddle to change it from third-and-3 to third-and-8.After the 49ers called a timeout, Smith said the play call was "totally different." He would not reveal what the 49ers were prepared to call on third-and-3, but everyone knows that Smith took off around left end for 28 yards and a touchdown on a quarterback keeper on third-and-8.Offensive coordinator Greg Roman "suggested" that call, 49ers coach Jim Harbaugh said. But it was quarterbacks coach Geep Chryst who made all the calls on the next drive, during the final two-minute drill."And Geep called the Vernon Davis touchdown and that whole two-minute drive there at the end," Harbaugh said. "That was coming from Geep."This is the first time that Harbaugh has pinpointed to someone other than Roman calling offensive plays. And it also might provide a clue to those who wondering which assistant would be next in line for offensive coordinator."We all work together, pretty much suffice it to say," Harbaugh said. "Press box (Roman), field, me, Geep, (receivers coach) Johnnie Morton, everybody in the offense is connected."Harbaugh continues to be the coach on the sideline who relays the play calls via radio transmitter to Smith.

Seriously is it so weird that Harbaugh does something different or is this the straw that breaks the camel's back and Harbaugh would just be stupid to do it????

He flat out states that Roman "suggested" the call -- a phrase I used in my early post and that Geep Chryst PHYSICALLY called the 2 minute drill at the end of the game.

He even states that while Roman is calling down from the booth to Morton, Chryst, and Harbaugh that Harbaugh is the one who relays the plays to Smith via the ear piece inside the helmet. I don't like it but it is what is and this is our coaching philosophy and it wont change.

My entire damn point is that the is a point A. Roman + point B. sideline personel/Harbaugh + point C. Alex/Kaepernick and that if we cut out Roman and replace him with someone the entire system will stay the same.

and clearly based on the in-game situation sometimes the order of those 3 points gets changed around.

If we bring in Turner we're not magically switching to the digit system, same with Shurmur, same with any other OC who could be brought in from the outside, they will add their 2 cents in the same manner that Roman, Chryst, and Morton do, which is why if we replace Roman it will be coach with running background.

Harbaugh is the end all be all of this scheme, it does not matter who the OC is. Now let it go, I don't care if I'm completely wrong, partially right, or 100% right but the fact of the matter is that Harbaugh knows the strengths of his personel and will allow them to use their abilities as the in-game situation dictates.

Now for Christ's sake let this go and we can agree to disagree.

Just curious, how do other teams handle playcalling? Is it either coach/OC directly to QB most of the time? Or is there a specialized approach where essentially different personnel have authority depending on game situation regardless of whether there is only one individual who relays the play to QB?

The answer to the thread question is Mike Shanahan, after he gets fired from Washington for playing a one legged gimp for 8 quarters before the obvious disaster that was going to happen happened.
[ Edited by brodiebluebanaszak on Jan 9, 2013 at 10:07 AM ]
  • sfout
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Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
Just curious, how do other teams handle playcalling? Is it either coach/OC directly to QB most of the time? Or is there a specialized approach where essentially different personnel have authority depending on game situation regardless of whether there is only one individual who relays the play to QB?

The answer to the thread question is Mike Shanahan, after he gets fired from Washington for playing a one legged gimp for 8 quarters before the obvious disaster that was going to happen happened.

Every team is different. Some OCs are directly connected to the QB via headset - either in the booth or on the field. Some OCs do it our way and relay it to the HC who relays it to the QB like us, if the HC is also the OC then that obviously simplifies the situation.

Others are also like us as you say who have particular position coaches and their OC responsible for the play calls dependent upon the in-game situations.
[ Edited by sfout on Jan 9, 2013 at 10:14 AM ]
Originally posted by NinerG94:
Roman barely has his feet wet as an NFL coordinator. How in the hell can anyone seriously consider him for head coach? I don't understand it but don't really care. The system will remain in place and that is what is important I guess. Hopefully if he leaves he takes the pistol formation with him. Having said that I really wish he would stay a couple more years. If we can't get more than two years out of an offensive coodinator, its going to be tough to remain somewhat consistent even with the system still in place. If his replacement does well then hes going to be out in one to two years too. Not good enough. We've been burning through OC's like bums do crack and it must stop.

Can't remember his name but the guy from ATL that is being considered for the GM job in Jacksonville was Roman's college roommate and they are long time friends. It was rumored that he would hire Roman or Mike Nolan as head coach and they would fire Murlarkey.
Originally posted by sfout:
Every team is different. Some OCs are directly connected to the QB via headset - either in the booth or on the field. Some OCs do it our way and relay it to the HC who relays it to the QB like us, if the HC is also the OC then that obviously simplifies the situation.

Others are also like us as you say who have particular position coaches and their OC responsible for the play calls dependent upon the in-game situations.

That's interesting. We've suffered horribly most of the season with delay of game penalties / play clock run downs. I wonder if other teams who have a "relay" methodology also suffer from a disproportionate number of late snaps. JH promised to "fix" this. I didn't see the Cardinal game (Live in east coast). Was he true to his word? We only had 3 penalties / 25 yards.